Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: the alarming man on 24 March 2012, 19:51:19
-
thing is when i was being to taught to drive by the L.A.S i was told by the instructor in an auto vehicle when in stationary traffic car should be taken from drive and placed in Neutral or Park...now i think the clue is in the title AUTOMATIC..hence i leave it in drive and either hold it on the foot/hand brake???....and also if you keep shifting from D to N / P does this not cause more wear on the gear box??
Question is??.....how do you drive yours?????? :y
-
Pop it in neutral neutral when stationary for "a long period" .
-
i put both the autos we own in nuetral to avoid overheating the oil and causing the torque converter or bands in gearbox fail, my 4x4 has been driven this way for past 6yrs with no problems, but it is a toyota lol
-
Pop it in neutral neutral when stationary for "a long period" .
i do this too but misses hates it dont know why it saves foot ache from holding break and saves on gearbox
-
Mark...I must have driven close on 500k miles in autos :o of many makes and I really don,t think I have EVER taken car out of drive when waiting at lights etc. :)
Tend to put it in Park when say waiting at a railway crossing as tend to be few minutes or maybe at road works but not under normal situations..unsure if it would wear anything out quicker..truth is just can,t be arsed ;D to move gearstick around thats part why I drive an auto :y
-
It is also far more considerate to those behind you NOT to sit with your foot on the brake blinding them with bright lights, especially at night.
It is also more beneficial to your brake discs not to overheat a single spot that is clamped by the pads whilst the rest cools down .. a prime source of later problems
It is also more beneficial to the gearbox not to be working against the "locked" powertrain it is trying to turn
It is also more beneficial to your handbrake to actually use the mechanism (use it or lose it as the Master says) .. you won't use any brake surface as you are stationary ...
So, when you come to a halt, handbrake on, pop it into neutral for a short stop, park for a longer one .. :y :y :y :y
-
At level lights I'll stick it in Neutral and pop the handbrake on (because, like Entwood, I abhor being blinded by someones brake lights.. BMW MINIs are particularly bad for this, they have brake lights like football stadium floodlights!).
If the lights are uphill I tend to leave it in D and pop the handbrake on - because otherwise I find myself sticking the handbrake on, putting it in Neutral then yanking the handbrake again because I'm rolling backward. Should probably fix that.. ;D
-
I was also taught by the LAS (1979-89) we used Bedfords for all of my service & they stood up very well to the hard use they got always left in D.
-
...although forgetting its in neutral and trying to pull away is a bit annoying. ;D
-
not if it becomes second nature, if when stopped into n then when clear into d all time you soon get used to it
-
...although forgetting its in neutral and trying to pull away is a bit annoying. ;D
Done that once or twice.. I've also (once!) gone from N to D while the revs were still (significantly) above idle. Doesn't have thump into gear! :-[ :-[ (Anyone for an AR35, one careful owner? ;D)
-
...although forgetting its in neutral and trying to pull away is a bit annoying. ;D
:-[ done this a few times :P
-
I was also taught by the LAS (1979-89) we used Bedfords for all of my service & they stood up very well to the hard use they got always left ]
where they V8'S??...mind you i was a bit after the old bedfords it was volvo 850 t5 and a couple of omegas as well.. :y
-
Normally when i know im only going to be stationary for a short time i just hold the brake, If not then in P...
-
It is also far more considerate to those behind you NOT to sit with your foot on the brake blinding them with bright lights, especially at night.It is also more beneficial to your brake discs not to overheat a single spot that is clamped by the pads whilst the rest cools down .. a prime source of later problems
It is also more beneficial to the gearbox not to be working against the "locked" powertrain it is trying to turn
It is also more beneficial to your handbrake to actually use the mechanism (use it or lose it as the Master says) .. you won't use any brake surface as you are stationary ...
So, when you come to a halt, handbrake on, pop it into neutral for a short stop, park for a longer one .. :y :y :y :y
Agree with all above...especially with the blinding people behind, this really p1sses me off. Mainly happens behind Mercs, BMWs, Jags etc which you know are autos! I find, like Aaron that Minis are bright - a bloody Penis Prius has got to be the worst!
-
Neutral and handbrake on.
From a safety point of view, if you are shunted up the arse, your foot will come off the brake (trust me on this), and that will leave you with an uncontrolled car in drive.
From a mechanical sympathy point of view, you are cooking the ATF, and compressing a small area of red hot disc with brake pads.
-
into neutral and handbrake for me, if im stationary in a manual im not about to hold the clutch pedal down with my foot, sod that so same applies in the auto :y
but like people have said, if brakes are hot then holding them on can warp discs :)
-
on a mk 4 astra auto if you stop for more than 2 seconds the box puts itself into neutral and back into drive when footbrake released thought my astra was faulty until i looked in the handbook and its supposed to do that
-
on a mk 4 astra auto if you stop for more than 2 seconds the box puts itself into neutral and back into drive when footbrake released thought my astra was faulty until i looked in the handbook and its supposed to do that
All the FWD VX auto's with an AW box do this, apparently it saves fuel by .00000000000001% or something!
-
on a mk 4 astra auto if you stop for more than 2 seconds the box puts itself into neutral and back into drive when footbrake released thought my astra was faulty until i looked in the handbook and its supposed to do that
All the FWD VX auto's with an AW box do this, apparently it saves fuel by .00000000000001% or something!
That makes it all worthwhile then lol :y :y
-
Useful article on auto gearbox driving.
http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/adviceandinformation/driving/automatic-gearboxes.aspx
Taken from the article:-
'When stationary in traffic, even for many minutes, it is not necessary to move the gear lever into neutral because the torque converter absorbs the engine’s propulsion force but does not transmit it all to the gearbox. No wear is taking place. In fact, more wear will take place if you engage neutral then engage a drive gear when it is possible to move off. Most gearboxes will automatically select first gear when the vehicle becomes stationary.'
-
on a mk 4 astra auto if you stop for more than 2 seconds the box puts itself into neutral and back into drive when footbrake released thought my astra was faulty until i looked in the handbook and its supposed to do that
I noticed that with the auto Asta SWMBO usd to have .......... never read the manual though ::) ::) I found that it would engage drive with a bit of a thump if you were a bit quick trying to pull away if you didn't give it a chance to get into drive first.
-
on a mk 4 astra auto if you stop for more than 2 seconds the box puts itself into neutral and back into drive when footbrake released thought my astra was faulty until i looked in the handbook and its supposed to do that
I noticed that with the auto Asta SWMBO usd to have .......... never read the manual though ::) ::) I found that it would engage drive with a bit of a thump if you were a bit quick trying to pull away if you didn't give it a chance to get into drive first.
Similar sort of thing to auto start. On a courtesy golf blumotion I had, there was a pause in take up on the throttle to allow for the driver engaging drive while the starter motor was engaged.... stupid idea.
-
on a mk 4 astra auto if you stop for more than 2 seconds the box puts itself into neutral and back into drive when footbrake released thought my astra was faulty until i looked in the handbook and its supposed to do that
I noticed that with the auto Asta SWMBO usd to have .......... never read the manual though ::) ::) I found that it would engage drive with a bit of a thump if you were a bit quick trying to pull away if you didn't give it a chance to get into drive first.
Similar sort of thing to auto start. On a courtesy golf blumotion I had, there was a pause in take up on the throttle to allow for the driver engaging drive while the starter motor was engaged.... stupid idea.
...and what's an Asta btw? ;D :P
-
....and what's an Asta btw? ;D :P
:P :P :P :P :P :P ;)
-
Useful article on auto gearbox driving.
http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/adviceandinformation/driving/automatic-gearboxes.aspx
Taken from the article:-
'When stationary in traffic, even for many minutes, it is not necessary to move the gear lever into neutral because the torque converter absorbs the engine’s propulsion force but does not transmit it all to the gearbox. No wear is taking place. In fact, more wear will take place if you engage neutral then engage a drive gear when it is possible to move off. Most gearboxes will automatically select first gear when the vehicle becomes stationary.'
see that as changed from when i first took my test,as i was marked down on putting it into neutral on a retest last year...
-
Useful article on auto gearbox driving.
http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/adviceandinformation/driving/automatic-gearboxes.aspx
Taken from the article:-
'When stationary in traffic, even for many minutes, it is not necessary to move the gear lever into neutral because the torque converter absorbs the engine’s propulsion force but does not transmit it all to the gearbox. No wear is taking place. In fact, more wear will take place if you engage neutral then engage a drive gear when it is possible to move off. Most gearboxes will automatically select first gear when the vehicle becomes stationary.'
see that as changed from when i first took my test,as i was marked down on putting it into neutral on a retest last year...
Not entirely convinced about leaving it in drive, because an Omega 'creeps'.
When you leave it in drive, put the handbrake on, take your foot off the foot brake, the back of the car dips slightly.
Although, in the Omega hand book, it says you can leave it in drive when stopped.
-
that why i posted this up??.
-
Useful article on auto gearbox driving.
http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/adviceandinformation/driving/automatic-gearboxes.aspx
Taken from the article:-
'When stationary in traffic, even for many minutes, it is not necessary to move the gear lever into neutral because the torque converter absorbs the engine’s propulsion force but does not transmit it all to the gearbox. No wear is taking place. In fact, more wear will take place if you engage neutral then engage a drive gear when it is possible to move off. Most gearboxes will automatically select first gear when the vehicle becomes stationary.'
Presumably with handbrake on ???
I think, once again, ROSPA are clearly wrong. All autoboxes have creep by design, thus you have the gearbox trying to push the car, and the brakes trying to hold it back. A recipe for accidents to occur.
-
......
All autoboxes have creep by design, .......
Have you read the above posts? ::) ::) Some 'switch off' when stationary as per the Astra G ;) ;) ;) ;) And SWMBO's Smart doesn't creep either (manual box with auto controls ;))
-
......
All autoboxes have creep by design, .......
Have you read the above posts? ::) ::) Some 'switch off' when stationary as per the Astra G ;) ;) ;) ;) And SWMBO's Smart doesn't creep either (manual box with auto controls ;))
SMART isn't a proper auto.
Astra auto is just gay. Mind you, so are the manuals ;D
By its nature, an auto needs creep for manuovering (as no manufacturer will recommend 2 foot driving)
-
......
SMART isn't a proper auto.
Astra auto is just gay. Mind you, so are the manuals ;D
By its nature, an auto needs creep for manuovering (as no manufacturer will recommend 2 foot driving)
Whether the Smart is a 'proper' auto or not, it only has 2 pedals but it doesn't creep .........
-
My old Passat with the DSG box had a auto hold feature. Was magic in traffic. I tend to drive a automatic using two arms and one leg while facing forward...................mostly :-[
-
My old Passat with the DSG box had a auto hold feature. Was magic in traffic. I tend to drive a automatic using two arms and one leg while facing forward...................mostly :-[
Wasn't struck on the all singing all dancing DSG g/box when we had one as a courtesy car, didn't live up to the hype IMHO.
I tend to drive a automatic using one arm/hand and two feet while mostly facing forward ....... ;) ;) ;)
-
My old Passat with the DSG box had a auto hold feature. Was magic in traffic. I tend to drive a automatic using two arms and one leg while facing forward...................mostly :-[
Wasn't struck on the all singing all dancing DSG g/box when we had one as a courtesy car, didn't live up to the hype IMHO.
I tend to drive a automatic using one arm/hand and two feet while mostly facing forward ....... ;) ;) ;)
Very dangerous :o
-
....
Very dangerous :o
Why???
Maybe time to get all one armed/handed drivers off the road then! I have the option of using both as & when or if the occasion arises.
-
....
Very dangerous :o
Why???
Maybe time to get all one armed/handed drivers off the road then! I have the option of using both as & when or if the occasion arises.
I am one armed but fully capable of driving my mig what wrong with it 8) :D
-
....
Very dangerous :o
Why???
Maybe time to get all one armed/handed drivers off the road then! I have the option of using both as & when or if the occasion arises.
I am one armed but fully capable of driving my mig what wrong with it 8) :D
Nothing at all, which was just my point to AA's 'very dangerous' comment re me driving with one arm/hand. :y :y
-
....
Very dangerous :o
Why???
Maybe time to get all one armed/handed drivers off the road then! I have the option of using both as & when or if the occasion arises.
I am one armed but fully capable of driving my mig what wrong with it 8) :D
I have a disability btw
-
.....
I have a disability btw
So I'd realised ;) ;) ;)
-
When i applied for my first private hire drivers license.....part of the application is that you are taken out by a driving examiner....to judge your driving skills.
Then i had my merc auto.
I asked the examiner about the correct procedure when stopping at junctions.
He told me .....leave it in drive and foot on the brake.....right or wrong....thats how learners get taught driving autos.....or they did 8 or 9 years ago.
I can see the point of clamping a hot disk with a pad and could cause warping over time.....but leaving the box in D is less likely to wear it out the keep selecting N or P ....thats just my opinion of course.
I also had a V6 2.5 Vectra auto many years ago and that kept putting itself in N while you stationary......imagine the stress on box when you took your foot of the brake and whacked the 'loud' pedal as it banged into gear.....
-
....
Very dangerous :o
Why???
Maybe time to get all one armed/handed drivers off the road then! I have the option of using both as & when or if the occasion arises.
I am one armed but fully capable of driving my mig what wrong with it 8) :D
Nothing at all, which was just my point to AA's 'very dangerous' comment re me driving with one arm/hand. :y :y
:y :y ;D :D sorry :-[
When i applied for my first private hire drivers license.....part of the application is that you are taken out by a driving examiner....to judge your driving skills.
Then i had my merc auto.
I asked the examiner about the correct procedure when stopping at junctions.
He told me .....leave it in drive and foot on the brake.....right or wrong....thats how learners get taught driving autos.....or they did 8 or 9 years ago.
I can see the point of clamping a hot disk with a pad and could cause warping over time.....but leaving the box in D is less likely to wear it out the keep selecting N or P ....thats just my opinion of course.
I also had a V6 2.5 Vectra auto many years ago and that kept putting itself in N while you stationary......imagine the stress on box when you took your foot of the brake and whacked the 'loud' pedal as it banged into gear.....
thats how i was taught last year i say its wrong though i put it in nutreal when stood for a couple of minutes
-
but leaving the box in D is less likely to wear it out the keep selecting N or P ....thats just my opinion of course.
Mine too ;) After all, if you think about it:
The brake bands are 'always' in use - but they only see significant wear when changing gear (when they have to brake one or more planetary gear sets). When you're sat in D they're not really being worn (unless they are already slipping, in which case you're on borrowed time anyway), but going D-N-D they'll see some wear - granted not much, really, because;
If you think about the torque convertor - especially with a loosely coupled convertor as in the Omega - how much energy do you think it's dissipating into the oil etc through slipping the torque of the engine at idle? Especially compared to how much torque it's having to (hydraulically) transmit when you've got your hoof welded to the shag pile!
So, that's my take on it :)
Though I stick the handbrake on as I said earlier, because I know I hate being blinded by the person in front of me..
I'll stick it in N or P if I'm going to be stopped more than a minute or so (a regular light change), however.
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
So was I ............. but it was that long ago I was taught to drive in a Mk I Escort! Right or wrong, I'll still use my manual Astra's gearbox to slow down. ::)
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
I was about to say "Yet you get through brake pads every 5k?" .. then remembered the Omega is automatic :-[ :-[ ;D
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
I was about to say "Yet you get through brake pads every 5k?" .. then remembered the Omega is automatic :-[ :-[ ;D
My old works Escort 1.8D van had fresh pads when they hit metal, every 3.5k. I did every other set, reducing the number of bollockings for 'misuse', and used to laugh when they bollocked me for 'only' getting 7k from pads (and tyres normally). If only they knew. That was a manual ;)
-
I should add, the Escort has woefully inadequate brakes, which certainly didn't help with pad longevity. Nor did the amount of weight I had in the back and on the roof. The only time it stopped quickly was when the front of a Capri coming the other way helped it slow down :-[.
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
I was about to say "Yet you get through brake pads every 5k?" .. then remembered the Omega is automatic :-[ :-[ ;D
My old works Escort 1.8D van had fresh pads when they hit metal, every 3.5k. I did every other set, reducing the number of bollockings for 'misuse', and used to laugh when they bollocked me for 'only' getting 7k from pads (and tyres normally). If only they knew. That was a manual ;)
Good lord.. I think I can safely say I don't ever want to get into a car with you ;D I can't even imagine how hard you must have to drive to get that kind of mileage out of brakes..
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
I was about to say "Yet you get through brake pads every 5k?" .. then remembered the Omega is automatic :-[ :-[ ;D
My old works Escort 1.8D van had fresh pads when they hit metal, every 3.5k. I did every other set, reducing the number of bollockings for 'misuse', and used to laugh when they bollocked me for 'only' getting 7k from pads (and tyres normally). If only they knew. That was a manual ;)
Good lord.. I think I can safely say I don't ever want to get into a car with you ;D I can't even imagine how hard you must have to drive to get that kind of mileage out of brakes..
Nah, it was just the shit Escorts. The Maestro I had previous easily managed 10k on the pads. Never crashed that either (but did another Maestro, clipped a tree on a track, escaping from somewhere that had freaked me out).
-
My old man had a Isuzu Trooper which he brought from new. In 100k miles he had three sets of front pads and two rears. My brother took the car on and he did that many in 20k miles!!! Just proves it's down to how you drive not the car.
-
Just proves it's down to how you drive not the car.
Its a combination. Some brakes are under specc'd, and this hurts how long they last.
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
I was about to say "Yet you get through brake pads every 5k?" .. then remembered the Omega is automatic :-[ :-[ ;D
My old works Escort 1.8D van had fresh pads when they hit metal, every 3.5k. I did every other set, reducing the number of bollockings for 'misuse', and used to laugh when they bollocked me for 'only' getting 7k from pads (and tyres normally). If only they knew. That was a manual ;)
Good lord.. I think I can safely say I don't ever want to get into a car with you ;D I can't even imagine how hard you must have to drive to get that kind of mileage out of brakes..
Nah, it was just the shit Escorts. The Maestro I had previous easily managed 10k on the pads. Never crashed that either (but did another Maestro, clipped a tree on a track, escaping from somewhere that had freaked me out).
From memory Maestros (esp. the diesels) didn't really go fast enough to need brakes ;D
Speaking of - changed a set of rears on a friends DTi the other day that had been in for 105,000! Only changed because they disintegrated, still life left on the bits of material that were still stuck to the back plates ;D
-
From memory Maestros (esp. the diesels) didn't really go fast enough to need brakes ;D
Speaking of - changed a set of rears on a friends DTi the other day that had been in for 105,000! Only changed because they disintegrated, still life left on the bits of material that were still stuck to the back plates ;D
Our Maestros were 1.3 A series. But still faster than the 1.8D Escorts they replaced them with ;D
Our old Rover was still on the original rear shoes at 116k. It had only had about 4 sets of front pads in its life.
-
Our Maestros were 1.3 A series. But still faster than the 1.8D Escorts they replaced them with ;D
Ah.. my dad and I (separately, some years apart) both had diseasel Maestros - at least I can use the excuse that mine was just a loaner from the garage - I can't imagine anything slower or more unpleasant to drive ;D
Even my 1.1 A series powered Allegro was quicker.. :)
-
Just proves it's down to how you drive not the car.
Its a combination. Some brakes are under specc'd, and this hurts how long they last.
it proves the need to buy brakes that match driving style. No point buying expensive brakes if the driver never uses that performance. Likewise, no point buying brakes that underperformance for that individual.
-
Just proves it's down to how you drive not the car.
Its a combination. Some brakes are under specc'd, and this hurts how long they last.
it proves the need to buy brakes that match driving style. No point buying expensive brakes if the driver never uses that performance. Likewise, no point buying brakes that underperformance for that individual.
i concur
-
Then again, I was taught to slow down on the gears. Thats all wrong now.
Not wrong, just out of date.
The system of driving taught in Britain was developed in the early thirties when brakes on car were inefficient at best. So, you needed to slow down using engine braking, which in lots of cases was more effective, reliable and often quicker than using the brakes on their own. This is not the case with modern cars! And what would you rather replace; clutches and gearboxes or brake linings?
As for the original question, if stationary for any length of time, then the handbrake should be on. Doesn't matter if it's an auto or manual. And being in neutral is probably a good idea; autos do creep so there's always some strain on the gearbox, and holding the clutch down on a manual doesn't do the release bearing, cable/hydraulics and the fingers in the clutch cover any good.
Also, if you're stopped to turn across any traffic, make sure the front wheels are straight!
-
This is not the case with modern cars! And what would you rather replace; clutches and gearboxes or brake linings?
I still use both in a manual. "Every little helps" ;D
Seriously, I like to change down, be it car or bike, and always be in the 'right' gear at any particular moment, in case anything happens. Although I know this is in conflict with how emergency response drivers are taught...
-
Funny you should say that. I went for a days training on the bike with the Cops. I kept getting bollicked for being in to high a gear in town or slow conditions. The Copper explained that it would hinder me if I need a squirt of speed to get out of trouble. It was one of the best days I've ever had. I learned so much I plan on doing it again this summer.
-
..... I went for a days training on the bike with the Cops. ....
that's what I need. I'm too timid on my bike. :-\
-
..... I went for a days training on the bike with the Cops. ....
that's what I need. I'm too timid on my bike. :-\
Yup, me too :-[
-
It was bloody excellent and the bollickin I saw him give the the tractor driver who had just spewed mud all over the road was worth the fee alone. ;D It really worked on hazard recognition and line of site. Made me a lot more fluid.
-
.... Made me a lot more fluid.
Not sure that's a good thing ::) ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D
Karachi made the whole ship's company quite very fluid! ??? ;) ;)
-
Seriously, I like to change down, be it car or bike, and always be in the 'right' gear at any particular moment, in case anything happens.
That's what annoys me about automatic gearboxes - they're never in the 'right' gear when you're driving around town..
-
Being in the right gear.. A joy I've just rediscovered... :D
The Omega has sat on the driveway for the 3 weeks that I've had my "driver involvement pack" back on the road (and it hasn't ssip'ed down).
-
Being in the right gear.. A joy I've just rediscovered... :D
The Omega has sat on the driveway for the 3 weeks that I've had my "driver involvement pack" back on the road (and it hasn't ssip'ed down).
;D
I really need to get the MR2 roadworthy again .. but there's either something awfully wrong with the back end (which requires constant steering input around constant radius corners), or I've forgotten how badly it drove on standard suspension :(
-
Tend to leave my foot on the brake, unless stopped for long periods of time, in which case it goes into park.
-
Always leave mine in drive with foot on brake...but then i am a lazy old git and never given a thought to those being blinded by my brake lights oopps :P
-
This is not the case with modern cars! And what would you rather replace; clutches and gearboxes or brake linings?
I still use both in a manual. "Every little helps" ;D
Seriously, I like to change down, be it car or bike, and always be in the 'right' gear at any particular moment, in case anything happens. Although I know this is in conflict with how emergency response drivers are taught...
1 Yup
2 Nope. Not when I had my 999 L plates up anyways...
-
Being in the right gear.. A joy I've just rediscovered... :D
The Omega has sat on the driveway for the 3 weeks that I've had my "driver involvement pack" back on the road (and it hasn't ssip'ed down).
I'm missing my manual fun. Last manual I drove was the Rover... ...nearly 2 months ago.
-
2 Nope. Not when I had my 999 L plates up anyways...
Ah, around these parts, they seem to be told to slow purely on the brakes, then find a suitable gear that will get then past the hazard - eg, 5th to 2nd.
Where as I'd probably go through 3rd and 2nd (probably not bother with the pointless 4th ;D)