Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: SalahJ on 14 July 2012, 23:06:09
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Got the cambelt changed by a garage today. But the engine management light is on since I picked it up from the garage. Also it's vibration is a bit noticeable when idle. However, the drive seems alright as I drove 20 miles back home. I'm sure that they messed up something. Now the question is - how serious it is?
It's a 2001 2.6 Petrol Elite.
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Pedal trick for codes http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90581.0
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It makes me shiver when garages do cambelts on these things and they then develop running problems.
Where in the country are you?
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Simple answer is that it needs to go back... They haven't done it right ::)
I'll hazard a guess that they may not have used the correct locking kit :-X
As suggested, check the codes but I wouldn't advise driving it at all until you have spoken to them. If they tell you to bring it back you need confirmation that they will take responsibility for any potential damage
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I'm with LD.. this thread is bringing back memories of someone who had it done at a garage, and it failed on the way home!!
Engine light is probably knock sensor wire trapped between aux belt tensioner and cylinder head... or multirams not plugged back in, etc.
Many of us are proficient in these cambelt setups and have the right setting up gear... and in your position, would undoubtedly check FOC for you.
We need your location :y
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I'll do the pedal trick tomorrow morning and post it here.
I can't take it back to garage until next Saturday. However, when I drove back home it drove fine, apart from the fact that the car's vibration was pretty noticeable when idle.
I live in Bedford and the garage is in Luton.
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Do you need to use the car through the week, or can you afford to keep it laid up until next weekend when you can get it back to garage? I just hope the vibration isn't mis-timing, for your sake!
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I can walk to the work until next week, although it'll be an hours walk each way.
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I can walk to the work until next week, although it'll be an hours walk each way.
If the garage have mis-timed it, you'll be walking for a lot longer than a week if it lets go while you are driving it.
LD has nailed it......the garage have f**ked something up so it's down to them to put it right.
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My concern is that if it's not fitted correctly, it could slip and cause major engine damage. It may of course just be a minor issue like a connector plugged in, but there's still a risk.
I had a job to do tomorrow, but I sense it's non urgent as the car is SORN and just being prepped ready for the road ... I may ask the chap if he'd be happy to postpone a few days if you're in need of prompty help.. :-\
Maybe a code read is best place to start...
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If it's been mis-timed would it be driving OK? They also changed the front suspension and bushes. I reckon that doesn't have anything to do with engine light. My car is not SORN and I park it on the road and I'll do the pedal trick tomorrow morning and post it in here.
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If it's been mis-timed would it be driving OK? They also changed the front suspension and bushes. I reckon that doesn't have anything to do with engine light. My car is not SORN and I park it on the road and I'll do the pedal trick tomorrow morning and post it in here.
You mis understand.. ;)
I was implying that the car I am working on tomorrow is SORN and therefore not on the road.... and therfore if you were stuck, I may be able to re arrange my commitment to help you, at the discretion of the chap in question...
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James, as soon as you touch the car the OP loses any rights with reference to the shoddy work carried out by the garage. Whilst your sentiment is top notch, if you do any work it will give the garage an excuse to get away with what they've done wrong >:(
Inconvenient as it is, the OP needs to get in touch with them first thing Monday AM and tell them they have to collect the car and put it right. He could probably push them to deliver it back too ???
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James, as soon as you touch the car the OP loses any rights with reference to the shoddy work carried out by the garage. Whilst your sentiment is top notch, if you do any work it will give the garage an excuse to get away with what they've done wrong >:(
Inconvenient as it is, the OP needs to get in touch with them first thing Monday AM and tell them they have to collect the car and put it right. He could probably push them to deliver it back too ???
Oh I see where you're coming from LD :y
I considered it myself before posting. But, the thing is... no matter how much the person goes back to the garage, or how much it is technicaly their responsibility to sort... if they haven't actually got the competence / kit for this engine, the OP will be chasing his tail until Kingdom come.... with no guarantee it will ever be right, and at best, probably "close enough".. :-\ :'(
I hate garages. ;D
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If it's been mis-timed would it be driving OK? They also changed the front suspension and bushes. I reckon that doesn't have anything to do with engine light. My car is not SORN and I park it on the road and I'll do the pedal trick tomorrow morning and post it in here.
You mis understand.. ;)
I was implying that the car I am working on tomorrow is SORN and therefore not on the road.... and therfore if you were stuck, I may be able to re arrange my commitment to help you, at the discretion of the chap in question...
Oh sorry mate, my bad. But I reckon you are Gloucestershire, aren't you? I'm in Bedford (MK42). LD's point very valid and I'm going to have a chat with the garage guy tomorrow and lest see what he says.
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True, but he can demand his money back if they can't put it right ;) Trading standards if needs be ::) As soon as you touch it they get a free escape pass ::)
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If it's been mis-timed would it be driving OK? They also changed the front suspension and bushes. I reckon that doesn't have anything to do with engine light. My car is not SORN and I park it on the road and I'll do the pedal trick tomorrow morning and post it in here.
You mis understand.. ;)
I was implying that the car I am working on tomorrow is SORN and therefore not on the road.... and therfore if you were stuck, I may be able to re arrange my commitment to help you, at the discretion of the chap in question...
Oh sorry mate, my bad. But I reckon you are Gloucestershire, aren't you? I'm in Bedford (MK42). LD's point very valid and I'm going to have a chat with the garage guy tomorrow and lest see what he says.
No worries mate... but when you speak to them, actually make sure they have the correct locking and setting kit for this engine.
Don't let them fob you off that they have a generic cam lock set.. it's not enough for this engine, a specific kit is needed... you could even probe a few questions to see if they know how to use it..
Good luck, you know where we are :y :y
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I'm in Bedford today,can chuck my car tools in the car and have a look to see if anything isn't connected up properly,drop me a pm if you want me to have a look :y
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Much as the offers of help are noble, in the OP's boots, I would let the garage sort out their own problem at this stage. We could be taking about a weekend's work and significant expense taking the heads off and replacing bent valves. If I were the OP I wouldn't be giving the garage an opportunity to shirk this.
If there's concern, the car can always be given a once-over once the garage have sorted out the mistake they have made.
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Cant be a bad idea for a local member to have a quick look,just to check wire isnt trapped under camcover or multi rams have been plugged in. ;)
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Cant be a bad idea for a local member to have a quick look,just to check wire isnt trapped under camcover or multi rams have been plugged in. ;)
At least if a problem is spotted it can be pointed out to op,and then he can advise garage as to a possible cause,without anyone else actually repairing possible error :y
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Thanks a lot everybody for being so helpful. I also dropped a PM to Martin. Now I'm going out to get the error codes.
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Error codes -
10 1 1 10 = 11
10 1 10 = 1
10 3 10 = 3
That's what I found from the car.
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Miss fire on 3 and 5 ,showing fault for maf,took it for a run and seems fine,but whilst sitting on idle you can feel the missfire :y
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Thanks a lot to Martin for his time. I'm gonna take it back to garage hopefully on Tuesday.
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The garage will probably not want to know. They will probably say it was fine when it left them >:(
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just check to see if the MAF has been plugged in properly. if that's not plugged in then air metering will not be right and cause be helping to cause a misfire
was the garage VX or indep?
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already checked maf was connected properly and it was :y
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The garage will probably not want to know. They will probably say it was fine when it left them >:(
Especially if the OP lets on that someone else has looked at it now >:( ::)
I hope I'm wrong but the cynic in me thinks they have just been handed a "Get out of jail free" card by someone else looking at it ::)
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never took anything apart.just looked to make sure all vac hoses were connected and made sure connector was pushed firmly in place on the maf,and took it for a test drive,checked fault codes,nothing was else WAS TOUCHED only looked at :y
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The garage will probably not want to know. They will probably say it was fine when it left them >:(
Especially if the OP lets on that someone else has looked at it now >:( ::)
I hope I'm wrong but the cynic in me thinks they have just been handed a "Get out of jail free" card by someone else looking at it ::)
I already talked to the garage guy and I didnt tell them that I had someone else looked at it. They agreed to take a look at it on Tuesday, and they are an indep garage.
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The garage will probably not want to know. They will probably say it was fine when it left them >:(
Especially if the OP lets on that someone else has looked at it now >:( ::)
I hope I'm wrong but the cynic in me thinks they have just been handed a "Get out of jail free" card by someone else looking at it ::)
I already talked to the garage guy and I didnt tell them that I had someone else looked at it. They agreed to take a look at it on Tuesday, and they are an indep garage.
Have they confirmed they will take responsibility for any damage caused by driving back to them? ???
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I'm with LD.. this thread is bringing back memories of someone who had it done at a garage, and it failed on the way home!!
Engine light is probably knock sensor wire trapped between aux belt tensioner and cylinder head... or multirams not plugged back in, etc.
Many of us are proficient in these cambelt setups and have the right setting up gear... and in your position, would undoubtedly check FOC for you.
We need your location :y
Yes that was me - October 2008 - cam belt slipped and light on within 4 minutes of leaving dealer. Engine wrecked - new engine fitted courtesy of joint effort between VX Luton and Drive Vauxhall.
Snapped tensioner bolt was issue - dealer blamed flaw in bolt as it has been correctly torqued.
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The garage will probably not want to know. They will probably say it was fine when it left them >:(
Especially if the OP lets on that someone else has looked at it now >:( ::)
I hope I'm wrong but the cynic in me thinks they have just been handed a "Get out of jail free" card by someone else looking at it ::)
I already talked to the garage guy and I didnt tell them that I had someone else looked at it. They agreed to take a look at it on Tuesday, and they are an indep garage.
Have they confirmed they will take responsibility for any damage caused by driving back to them? ???
It's gonna sound daft I know - I and Martin drove it around the town for a while yesterday, so I reckon it'll survive another 20 miles drive. The garage guy also told me to bring the car, so if it breaks down on the way, all I can do is blame him. I don't really have much choice I reckon. Also taking a day off work tomorrow which I really can't afford as the project delivery will be late.
Anyway, I'm keeping all my fingers crossed for tomorrow.
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I'm in the garage now they detected misfire in 1, 3 and 5. They took out the coil pack and they look really rusty. They gonna order new coil pack now.
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I'm in the garage now they detected misfire in 1, 3 and 5. They took out the coil pack and they look really rusty. They gonna order new coil pack now.
how many pound notes they want for that
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..... They gonna order new coil pack now.
Beware of generic/pattern coil packs. They don't have a good reputation for longevity! ;)
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Seems quite a coincidence for the coil pack to have gone. I hope they timed the cams correctly on that bank. ???
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I'm in the garage now they detected misfire in 1, 3 and 5. They took out the coil pack and they look really rusty. They gonna order new coil pack now.
how many pound notes they want for that
He told me they are 80quid for each bank.
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Seems quite a coincidence for the coil pack to have gone. I hope they timed the cams correctly on that bank. ???
He insisted that they did the timing belt correctly. Today they didnt open the timing belt cover at all. They plugged in the cmputer straightaway and got the fault codes for misfire. They took out the coil packs and they are rusty. I told them many times that the car was driving fine untill they done the belt.
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If it still missfires after new pack fitted,tell them to check the timing,as I said it seems as if they havnt timed that bank up correctly :y
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If it still missfires after new pack fitted,tell them to check the timing,as I said it seems as if they havnt timed that bank up correctly :y
I sure will mate.
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whoooaaaaahh.
Are you seriously telling me they are condemning the coil pack (which would not have been touched during a cambelt change)?
Seems like an extrodinary co incidence to me. Cough cough.
My pressing question is, HOW have they arrived at the decision the CP is not firing?
Have they tested it with test plugs?
Have they compression tested the pots reported as misfiring??
Based on yours posts only of course, they come across as totally incompetent, and are willy nilly changing parts without a proper investigation.
The CP may look like its seen better days, but straight after a cambelt change?
Have they perhaps done something as simple as dislodge the 1 3 5 plug upon plenum removal? Or have they bent valves?
Based on your posts they appear to be muppets and in honesty i think youre gonna struggle to get a good outcome...
No surprise they are wanting to charge for new parts, unrelated to CBelt change..
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I'm still learning but I got to agree with James. Definitely do not give this garage any more money. If I were you I would cut my losses with this garage and ask James to check the timing!!!!
The garage insisted they've timed it correctly. B*llox!!!! i insist i'm an olympic champ. do you believe me? ::)
Think about it. car was running fine. went in to garage for a service item. then you get a check engine light. they've 'dangle berries'ed something. and if you want to ensure your car's engine doesn't lunch itself get someone on here to do it.
oh and please name and shame these b......s
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at least I can bet the tensioner is not set up correctly which means the set will fail soon :-\
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I think people are maybe being a little harsh with the garage here. It is entirely possible that the coil pack may have gone - coincidences do happen. And it may well have been removed when they did the cambelt change as they may have removed the plugs to make turning the engine easier.
We'll soon know if the new coil pack doesn't help. In that case, the OP doesn't need to pay them for it and they need to reinvestigate. I think, until then, we should keep from making assumptions. After all, that seems to be what the garage is accused of doing... :)
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they shouldnt remove plugs to turn engine. Cambelt needs to be fitted with engine under compression.
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Im willing to be corrected,but I dont think a duff coilpack will cause the engine light to come on.
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Im willing to be corrected,but I dont think a duff coilpack will cause the engine light to come on.
It didn't with my single DIS pack on a 3.0 :-\ :-\
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A coil pack will cause a misfire, which will generate misfire codes on the DBW ECUs. It doesn't follow that a misfire code means that a coil pack has failed, though. ;)
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I would be asking to se their locking/setting kit for a start. ;)
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A coil pack will cause a misfire, which will generate misfire codes on the DBW ECUs. It doesn't follow that a misfire code means that a coil pack has failed, though. ;)
Don't I know it ::)
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That reminds me. I've still got a datalog off your car to look at. :-[
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I think people are maybe being a little harsh with the garage here. It is entirely possible that the coil pack may have gone - coincidences do happen. And it may well have been removed when they did the cambelt change as they may have removed the plugs to make turning the engine easier.
We'll soon know if the new coil pack doesn't help. In that case, the OP doesn't need to pay them for it and they need to reinvestigate. I think, until then, we should keep from making assumptions. After all, that seems to be what the garage is accused of doing... :)
So you'd accept taking a good car to a garage to then have it back with a check engine light on. ???
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So you'd accept taking a good car to a garage to then have it back with a check engine light on. ???
Precisely..
What are the odds? Coincidence that something unrelated failed at exactly the time the garage worked on it versus garage having ballsed up?
Our comments just relate to previous experience on which of those two odds normally come up. ;)
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So you'd accept taking a good car to a garage to then have it back with a check engine light on. ???
Precisely..
What are the odds? Coincidence that something unrelated failed at exactly the time the garage worked on it versus garage having ballsed up?
Our comments just relate to previous experience on which of those two odds normally come up. ;)
Exactly! :y
I haven't taken my car to a garage since joining this forum. I do the work myself with the guides or get supervised (incidentally meeting up with the jolly nice chap Martin42 for brake disc/pad supervision this sunday 8))
Anyway the reason I do it myself/enlist the services on here is cos I was sick of garages. I went to Vauxhall who are supposed to be EXPERTS ON THEIR OWN MAKE OF CARS (or so the radio advert says >:() >:( and got the car back worse than before. Took it to the Dazmeister in Stoke who showed me what Vauxhall had missed when I didn't know a car engine from Adam :
Oil in plug wells
Rocker ggasket covers needed replacing
Maybe you're thinking ''well it may just be a mistake'' but knowing what i know now they couldn't have missed it.... or if they did it was utter, utter incompetence. Either way it's NOT acceptable when they charged me £275 for not fixing a problem and then £65 for a second inspection to review the problem that they should have fixed in the workplace!!!!
Thankfully that particular branch of Vx has closed down and I hope those ''technicians'' have sought employment in a more appropriate field e.g. cleaning toilets!!! >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
Rant over.
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any update from the garage mate?
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I think people are maybe being a little harsh with the garage here. It is entirely possible that the coil pack may have gone - coincidences do happen. And it may well have been removed when they did the cambelt change as they may have removed the plugs to make turning the engine easier.
We'll soon know if the new coil pack doesn't help. In that case, the OP doesn't need to pay them for it and they need to reinvestigate. I think, until then, we should keep from making assumptions. After all, that seems to be what the garage is accused of doing... :)
So you'd accept taking a good car to a garage to then have it back with a check engine light on. ???
No, but I'd take it back for investigation (if I wasn't capable of investigating myself) and find out what the reason was before jumping to conclusions that the garage had done something wrong (although I doubt I would have even driven it away from the garage if the engine light was on and it was misfiring when I went to pick it up). It is coincidental that the warning light has come on since the work was done, but coincidences do happen (that's why we have a word for them :) ) and it is only fair that the garage has the opportunity to find out if it really was caused by them.
Many garages refuse to work on old cars (and bikes) for the very reason that if something goes wrong after they have worked on them they get the blame, when the real cause is down to worn out components or poor maintenance.
Will you still blame the garage if it turns out that the coil pack has failed, or will you eat humble pie and admit that you were a bit quick to castigate them?
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So you'd accept taking a good car to a garage to then have it back with a check engine light on. ???
Precisely..
What are the odds? Coincidence that something unrelated failed at exactly the time the garage worked on it versus garage having ballsed up?
Our comments just relate to previous experience on which of those two odds normally come up. ;)
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to make excuses for shoddy workmanship. I'm just saying, that before we "name and shame" anybody we should be certain that they have done something that warrants it. The garage is obviously trying to sort things out so we should wait and see what the outcome is. As I said, they may have removed the coil pack to remove the plugs (which would be a common thing to do on many engines when replacing a cam belt) and in doing so may have caused an already worn component to fail. I don't know, and nobody else does yet.
Mistakes do happen, and I would judge a garage (or any service provider) by how they handle the remedy.
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Am I the only one who is rather surprised that the garage released the car with the warning light on in the first place?
Surely if you work on a car and the light is on afterwards, the likelihood is that it's something you've done, and it warrants investigation to avoid giving the customer's car back in a faulty (perhaps, in some instances, dangerous) condition.
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Am I the only one who is rather surprised that the garage released the car with the warning light on in the first place?
Surely if you work on a car and the light is on afterwards, the likelihood is that it's something you've done, and it warrants investigation to avoid giving the customer's car back in a faulty (perhaps, in some instances, dangerous) condition.
No, I am too, especially if it was also misfiring on 2 or 3 cylinders. Would any garage really think they would get away with that? It does make me question whether it was like that when the car was picked up or happened later, which is why I said I wouldn't have actually driven away from the garage with it in that condition.
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ok, first of all... i've re-read my post.... sorry if it comes across as argumentative... didn't mean that at all... but you know how the written word can look sometimes ::) :y
ok i acknowledge that yes it is possible it could be a coincience. i think the thing that really gets me is this.... the OP takes it to the garage for a service item (which the cambelt is). and instead of trying to fix and rework back what they've worked on to see if it was their mistake...they're instead adament that they've timed it correctly and are looking to charge the OP for a part they suspect is faulty (as it's rusty... wtf! lol) without doing the proper diagnosis..
eric the car guy (on youtube) talks about this a lot..... chucking parts at a car until it's resolved. and who foots the bill :(
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not hijacking but i've just had a thought......
i had my cambelt done 20k miles ago by Vauxhall when i knew nowt about cars.
recently i've had a tapping from the engine... not loud but kinda noticeable. i have dumped a load of wynns lifter treatment in......
however, whats the likely hood the timings out slightly? i dont want to cause myself probs for the sake of it. car runs perfect. just this tapping. and it's an intermittent tap too. reckon its best to get the belt redone early?
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there is no harm is stripping off the belt cover and checking it is timed and tensioned correctly - no need to change the belt for that. you've got nothing to loose!
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ok, first of all... i've re-read my post.... sorry if it comes across as argumentative... didn't mean that at all... but you know how the written word can look sometimes ::) :y
ok i acknowledge that yes it is possible it could be a coincience. i think the thing that really gets me is this.... the OP takes it to the garage for a service item (which the cambelt is). and instead of trying to fix and rework back what they've worked on to see if it was their mistake...they're instead adament that they've timed it correctly and are looking to charge the OP for a part they suspect is faulty (as it's rusty... wtf! lol) without doing the proper diagnosis..
eric the car guy (on youtube) talks about this a lot..... chucking parts at a car until it's resolved. and who foots the bill :(
All I'm saying is let the garage look into it before making assumptions and jumping to conclusions. They have read the codes and found misfires on cylinders 1, 3 and 5. This would make many people suspect the coil pack on that side of the engine, so they took it out to look at it. It looks rusty so I guess they suspect that it may have suffered from water ingress (there may be a hairline crack, which is far from unknown) so a fairly easy solution would be to try a new coil pack. Nowhere have we seen that it is suggested that the customer pays for this if it doesn't fix the problem, although I would expect the customer to be charged if it does fix it. Conversely, if the garage had spent time rechecking the timing and cambelt fitment, and it turns out to be a faulty coil pack, the customer would be charged for even more unnecessary work.
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I am hoping the OP comes back to update us....
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not hijacking but i've just had a thought......
i had my cambelt done 20k miles ago by Vauxhall when i knew nowt about cars.
recently i've had a tapping from the engine... not loud but kinda noticeable. i have dumped a load of wynns lifter treatment in......
however, whats the likely hood the timings out slightly? i dont want to cause myself probs for the sake of it. car runs perfect. just this tapping. and it's an intermittent tap too. reckon its best to get the belt redone early?
Feel free to drop it round, I'll happily check it for you Webby. Or more accurately, show you how to check it :). Although I think you probably know how.
OP - same offer applies, but I would rather the garage fixed it, or refunded you completely first, as once touched by someone else, they can wash their hands of the problem.
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Hi everybody...hope you all had a nice sunny and warm weekend.... :)
I'm really sorry, couldn't post any update as I was completely bogged down at work.
Anyway, I went to the garage on Saturday, test drove it and it was driving perfectly without any misfire or engine light. The garage guy told me that they re-checked the cam-belt setup to fix it and they didn't have to fit in any new parts. He pretty much admitted (although indirectly) that the cam-belt wasn't done correctly the first time, also apologised for the trouble. And he didn't charge me anymore :).
Drove it around town yesterday and it's driving as before.
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so take it nothing wrong with coil pack :-X
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I'm really sorry, couldn't post any update as I was completely bogged down at work.
I can't see that you need to apologize and I'm also really glad that your car has been sorted without the need for you to pay anymore cash out...
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so take it nothing wrong with coil pack :-X
Nothing was wrong with the coil-pack.
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great news there is no serious damage. I would still be inclined to get the setup checked by someone who knows it well :y
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Hi everybody...hope you all had a nice sunny and warm weekend.... :)
I'm really sorry, couldn't post any update as I was completely bogged down at work.
Anyway, I went to the garage on Saturday, test drove it and it was driving perfectly without any misfire or engine light. The garage guy told me that they re-checked the cam-belt setup to fix it and they didn't have to fit in any new parts. He pretty much admitted (although indirectly) that the cam-belt wasn't done correctly the first time, also apologised for the trouble. And he didn't charge me anymore :) .
Drove it around town yesterday and it's driving as before.
I still doubt they could do it properly.. timings may be ok but not sure for tensioner..
I recommend it to be checked by an OOF member.. :-\
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great news there is no serious damage. I would still be inclined to get the setup checked by someone who knows it well :y
I didnt read your post ;D :y
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not hijacking but i've just had a thought......
i had my cambelt done 20k miles ago by Vauxhall when i knew nowt about cars.
recently i've had a tapping from the engine... not loud but kinda noticeable. i have dumped a load of wynns lifter treatment in......
however, whats the likely hood the timings out slightly? i dont want to cause myself probs for the sake of it. car runs perfect. just this tapping. and it's an intermittent tap too. reckon its best to get the belt redone early?
Feel free to drop it round, I'll happily check it for you Webby. Or more accurately, show you how to check it :). Although I think you probably know how.
OP - same offer applies, but I would rather the garage fixed it, or refunded you completely first, as once touched by someone else, they can wash their hands of the problem.
Thanks TB, I may just do that... i know how to check it as i borriwed your kit last time lol :y
good news OP..... defo get it checked by someone on here just to be sure. :y
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good news OP..... defo get it checked by someone on here just to be sure. :y
That's a good idea to get it checked by someone from the forum. If anyone can spare me some time, please give me a shout.
Thank you all for your feedback and help.
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good news OP..... defo get it checked by someone on here just to be sure. :y
That's a good idea to get it checked by someone from the forum. If anyone can spare me some time, please give me a shout.
Thank you all for your feedback and help.
If ever you get over to Brackley (Bucks/Northants/Oxon border), I'll happily check. For free, obviously.
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good news OP..... defo get it checked by someone on here just to be sure. :y
That's a good idea to get it checked by someone from the forum. If anyone can spare me some time, please give me a shout.
Thank you all for your feedback and help.
If ever you get over to Brackley (Bucks/Northants/Oxon border), I'll happily check. For free, obviously.
That's so nice of you mate :). I just dropped you a PM.