Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: horsecow on 18 October 2012, 22:40:41
-
So whats your view on brand new motors. The reason I ask is I've never had one as anytime I've spent a lot of money on a car I've had really bad luck with it so I just stick to tried and tested older/cheaper models. My mate changes his car every 3 yrs and always deals with the same renault dealer. He says that the warranty alone is worth the large payments etc but the warranty only stands if they service the car. So he told me this evening that he just got the car back from service and they charged him £400+ for fitting new brakes!!!! Its only a megane ffs. Does this sound really expensive to anyone else or just me.
My point being then that surely the dealers are more than making back the warranty with the extortionate service charges??
-
Few people here have, but personally I never would. Its ok on smaller cars, Astra/Fiesta/Corsa.
But on big luxo barges they fall in value so much, £60k Jag/Mercs/Audis can be had for £10k just a few years later....
-
The problem with buying brand new is the initial depreciation, buy a 6-12 month old one and you are almost getting the best of both worlds..... :y
-
There's one hell of an echo in here tonight ::)
Cars are mechanical things... you use them... stuff wears out or breaks... you fix them, or not...
A reliable Omega will always out perform any new grot box in all aspects with the possible exception of fuel/roadtax.
But that is a compromise too far in my book.
My last car, a brand new Seat Altea 1.9 tdi, lost £10k in two years and 135k miles :'(
By my reckoning it was costing:
13.5p for each mile in depreciation
15ppm for the finance
18ppm for fuel
2ppm for servicing
2ppm for tyres
So that's 50ppm for a good looking cheap Golf, which incidently had to be recovered more times in two years than my 235k ex plod cat C 3.2 Omega.
Which costs
0.0ppm for depreciation
0.0ppm for finance
30ppm max for fuel
1.1ppm for sevicing, including cambelt
2ppm for tyres.
So running the Omega costs 34ppm ::) is faster, carries more stuff, is more comfortable, has a proper engine, is rear wheel drive, is better equipped....
If that hasn't made my point, nothing will. ::)
-
Thats well worked out there al. I need to do something similar for my mate to show him the actual reality. He's always complaining about having no money as well lol
-
Assuming this new car;
Is the most reliable car ever made
Has non existent servicing
Lifetime warranty
Zero consumables
Best economy
Minimal road tax
I would still NEVER buy a new car.
Only reason, massive depreciation.
As said, buy a one or two year old car, if you must.
Depreciation on mine means nothing, as I will never sell it. It's worth more in bits.
-
Never buy new :).
-
I've had the Ibiza since it was 5 months old and had 4800 miles on it. I got a good deal on fixed rate servicing for two years and of course the balance of warranty from when it was new. Hasn't put a foot wrong since I've had it. Buying it this way I saved nearly 5k over the price of a new one. However it's just a daily driver, it's very cheap to run only 30 quid to tax, cheap as chips to insure which allows me to have the Mig road legal but if I'm going "driving" then I take a bigger car not saying it's not up to the job I just like big cruisers for those long journeys. I've even managed 76 MPG out of the Ibiza driving like a saint mind.
-
The youngest car I ever bought was 6 months old.It may have been the most unreliable,although in mitigation it was the late 70,s and not much was reliable then.Especially when its being redlined in every gear all day every day by a mechanically unsympathetic 19 year old.. ;D
The oldest car I have owned was probably my Senator,which was possibly the most reliable,although (touch wood) my current Omega has given very few problems in the two and a bit years Ive owned it.
-
The depreciation on that Altea would have been even worse, was bought pre registered fot £12.5k, retail should have been over £16k :o
So although it lost £10k, it could have been £13k...
-
There are, in difficult times, always some stunning deals on new cars, if you go in prepared.
A new car can, if negotiated correctly, cost less over the first couple of years than a 2yr old one.
The last new car I bought, I'd wittled down (purely on predicted costs over 3yrs) to the brand new Rover 25, a pre-reg 1.2 clit Sport, and a 3yr old Astra-G 1.7 TDS.
The 25 and the clit worked out cheaper due to better finance and servicing costs, and cheaper tax. The Astra diesel didn't make it up on being 3yrs old, or the (supposedly) better MPG.
So, you do need to look into it. I didn't consider new until my car designer Bro suggested I did...
-
I should add, finances 13 years ago ensured I was well and truely in 'shitbox' territory, and the only monthly money I could put aside for a car was the payrise for the new job, which meant handing back my company Fi-fi, and getting a car...
...yes, this is the same story as the infamous TheBoy-found-a-Nova-in-his-garage ::)
-
Never buy new :).
:y
-
My mate changes his car every 3 yrs and always deals with the same renault dealer. He says that the warranty alone is worth the large payments etc but the warranty only stands if they service the car.
If this is a manufacturer warranty on a new car the garage are telling lies. Any registered garage can service a car and the warranty will still be valid as long as genuine or pattern parts and liquids are used and service schedules are adhered to.
-
Only ever bought one new car and that was for cash (so no finance) and cost less than a six month old one of lower spec!
It pays to shop around
It also ment we got the lifetime warranty and for servicing, I pay the labour and supply the parts (with invoice)
-
I pay the labour and supply the parts (with invoice)
And probably do proper servicing afterwards :P
-
Is a demonstrator that has no miles on it still new if you have to wait 3 months to drive it way from dealer (3 months needed in order to qualify as demo model ???
-
If it has been registered then it it used. It's any interesting question, but as I understand it the 3
months thing is probably the bare minimum for specific tax breaks (for the dealer). If they have a target for registering and selling cars on for special offers, then pre registering happens, the car is still used because you aren't the first keeper, even though it may only have delivery mileage :y
-
Needs to be older than that IMO. Still too much to loose on depreciation, which doesnt seam to level out until 1 or 2 years passed.
-
Depends if you DIY service too, new cars should in theory mean far less work. Just drop to a dealer once a year, older cars need more.
If you buy an older car at far less than original, do the work yourself and get parts at trade its still much cheaper than shelling out say £15/20k on something brand spankers.
Also depends on what you are after, as some brands hold value better than others
-
Depends if you DIY service too, new cars should in theory mean far less work. Just drop to a dealer once a year, older cars need more.
If you buy an older car at far less than original, do the work yourself and get parts at trade its still much cheaper than shelling out say £15/20k on something brand spankers.
Also depends on what you are after, as some brands hold value better than others
Not everyone can get parts at trade....
-
Depends if you DIY service too, new cars should in theory mean far less work. Just drop to a dealer once a year, older cars need more.
If you buy an older car at far less than original, do the work yourself and get parts at trade its still much cheaper than shelling out say £15/20k on something brand spankers.
Also depends on what you are after, as some brands hold value better than others
Nice illusion ;D most repairs on the Omega are mileage based ie suspension components etc, even hbvs have a limited life span, ie mine has been replaced at 5yrs/110 k, and again at 7ish yrs/210k :-\
The rear shocks on the Altea only lasted 14months/80k, becuase it's a compromised design based on partsbin technology, an example of the effects of a single manufacturer multi branding their floorpans :-\
'Premium' brands don't depreciate any slower than the others, it's simply that they cost more to begin with...
Eg: Car 1, a £23k Insignia, after 2 years and 20k, will be worth 12k, a loss of £11k.
Car 2, a £30k Audi/BMW/Merc, after 2 years and 20k will be worth for £18k, a loss of £12k.
Car 3, a £12k Fiesta/Corsa, after 2 years and 20k will be worth for £8k, a loss of £4k.
Car 4, a £18k Golf/BMW 1 series/Audi A3, after 2 years and 20k will be worth £13k or so, a loss of at least £4k.
Above examples are clutched from thin air, but basically small cars lose less value than bigger cars, buying premium just costs more to start with.
A £5-600 Omega will always be worth £5-600 :y A very nice, well kept one probably won't drop below £1500 as a bare minimum 8) although, like most things they are only worth what someone is prepared to pay for them :y
-
I think that if I was to spend alot of money on a car I'd go for a nearly new Kia, keep it's service history up to date and you get that massive 7 year manufacturers warranty! :y
-
We have to hope that some people will buy new - if then don't then the supply of the used cars we like to purchase will dry up ...............
-
We have to hope that some people will buy new - if then don't then the supply of the used cars we like to purchase will dry up ...............
:y
I just hate the thought of that depreciation!! I think some people think more of the latest number plate and being able to say that they've a brand new motor than the actual quality of the motor they are getting or the cost. There are some cars I just wouldn't buy but my mate cant be turned away from renault, I wouldnt have one if it was free!!
-
There are some cars I just wouldn't buy but my mate cant be turned away from renault, I wouldnt have one if it was free!!
A fair few people are very loyal to a brand.
Our very own Mr DTM, cut him in half, you'd see a Vx Griffin run through him like a stick of rock. Many (deranged people) have an affection for Fords. Mrs TB's brother, its Audi's. My family, it seems to be BMWs.
If I'm honest, I have a soft spot for Rovers
Not just cars either. Look at all the recent discussion on mobile phones ;)
-
My father has always had vx as far back as i can remember but never new although the viva was nearly new , then 3 years ago he bought a toyota corolla to down size . Its been ultra reliable with just yearly servicing consumables which makes me think about having a toyota in the future . I would never buy ford again unless it was the american v8 type :P It would be interesting to find out WHO and how many actually buy a car brand new with cash from a showroom :-\
-
I've always been a toyota fan, they seem to be really reliable and the hold their value quite well from what I see. The missus has an avensis which she bought about 5-6 yrs ago, paid 3500 for it and the same model sells today for around 2500. Its never let her down and keeps plodding away, now its not much of a speed demon but its easy on fuel and reliable which is all she wants
-
I must admit I can't see the financial sense of changing for new every few years for precisely the depreciation aspect. I do think there is a sort of middle ground though where some people will set themselves out a budget and for a degree of confidence in warranty covered, fixed price servicing and even a few extras thrown in will go for the smell of a new car.
You're right though, as they get more expensive, you need to do the sums carefully and I think weigh up what sort of mileage you are likely to be doing. High mileage will crucify residuals especially in the medium exec market I reckon (Josh is probably the expert here though) - but would you want to do star trek miles in something only moderately more comfotable than a Cosy Coupe Car.
If however you buy new with no intention of selling it anytime soon - then i think you can start to rationalise the expense whether you only use it at the weekends or decide (assuming you've done the maths on servicing, tyres, insurance, new car tax etc. etc.) to hell with it - I'm going to jolly well use it and enjoy it at every opportunity.
I sort of sit in both camps.
I bought a brand new Volvo XC90 8 years ago :o with my own dosh - no finance, and I've averaged 20k miles a year in it since. True to say its current value makes the depreciation figure a bit eye watering to say the least - but I have no intention of selling it. It's now in the maintenance routine akin to my Omega. Most of the common problems were sorted under warranty, everything else has been maintenance you'd expect of a vehicle doing that sort of mileage so it's no more expensive now to run.
My Omega I bought for a tenth of the price 3 years ago, within a year I'd spent as much again on it getting all the things sorted the previous owner just managed to avoid and it's also doing 25k a year. It's worth probably a third of what I paid for it.
I love both cars to bits. The Volvo however for quite a few reasons is the best car I've ever had and if I had the money when this one falls to bits I'd have another one (but probably would try for a second hand one).
The Omega I wouldn't change either (except for Twiggy's Estate ::) )and apart from the obvious 4x4 shortfall - does everything I could ask for in similar comfort too.
SO would I but new - yes 'cos I did. But would I buy secondhand too - definitely cos' the feeling of saving all that money for 'something as good' is hard to beat too. :y