Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Shackeng on 11 February 2014, 17:41:43
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I have just completed this job on the TD Estate, using Mark's how-to, so I am extremely impressed that he enjoys doing it so much that he does it every two years according to this: http://www.vauxhallownersnetwork.co.uk/index.php?threads/how-to-service-the-rear-brakes-on-an-omega.95836/! :o
The 15 year old shoe linings are 1mm less than the new! My advice, always put it in for the MOT one month early, and only ever tackle this job if it fails on the handbrake, which mine never has in 15 years!
If anyone hears me suggesting that I am about to do this job again, kindly pop round and give me a poke in the eye with a sharp stick, which will be somewhat more enjoyable!!! >:( >:( >:(
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Some of us have to do it annually. Horrid job.
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Some of us have to do it annually. Horrid job.
Why's that then?
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Some of us have to do it annually. Horrid job.
Why's that then?
Because its a shit system ;D
And, yes, I use it every single time I park, in order to prevent it seizing... ...unsuccessfully.
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I have just completed this job on the TD Estate, using Mark's how-to, so I am extremely impressed that he enjoys doing it so much that he does it every two years according to this: http://www.vauxhallownersnetwork.co.uk/index.php?threads/how-to-service-the-rear-brakes-on-an-omega.95836/! :o
The 15 year old shoe linings are 1mm less than the new! My advice, always put it in for the MOT one month early, and only ever tackle this job if it fails on the handbrake, which mine never has in 15 years!
If anyone hears me suggesting that I am about to do this job again, kindly pop round and give me a poke in the eye with a sharp stick, which will be somewhat more enjoyable!!! >:( >:( >:(
;D ;D
Not one of your favourite jobs then. ;D
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Some of us have to do it annually. Horrid job.
Why's that then?
Because its a shit system ;D
And, yes, I use it every single time I park, in order to prevent it seizing... ...unsuccessfully.
But any hand brake/parking brake is/should only be used when the car is stopped. So how do you wear linings by squeezing them against a stationary drum? ??? ??? ::)
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I'm trying to wean myself off using the handbrake but force of habit is strong. ::)
Why? Oh, it doesn't always release. :-[
Don't worry - it's "on my list" but it has just passed the MOT, so... ::)
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Few handbrake turns free's it up :P
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Some of us have to do it annually. Horrid job.
Why's that then?
Because its a shit system ;D
And, yes, I use it every single time I park, in order to prevent it seizing... ...unsuccessfully.
But any hand brake/parking brake is/should only be used when the car is stopped. So how do you wear linings by squeezing them against a stationary drum? ??? ??? ::)
I have never worn it out.
And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
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I always put it on when I park, but rely on the park mode of box to hold it. As stated, 1mm wear in 15 years! And never failed an MOT. I rest my case m'lud. ::) ::)
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its not that difficult.
fifteen minutes per side or so.....
there are very many more difficult ones to do than that.
But, my record is having to remove the body from the chassis to change the EGR valves on a Discovery 3
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its not that difficult.
fifteen minutes per side or so.....
there are very many more difficult ones to do than that.
But, my record is having to remove the body from the chassis to change the EGR valves on a Discovery 3
Mine always needs everything cleaned up fully, so nearer 1hr per side.
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its not that difficult.
fifteen minutes per side or so.....
there are very many more difficult ones to do than that.
But, my record is having to remove the body from the chassis to change the EGR valves on a Discovery 3
Didn't take too long then :)
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
On my previous Omega I needed to change direction quickly so did a handbrake turn (it's the child in me,you never forget how to do them) ;D
The car was an auto and believe me, stopping auto transmission dead in its tracks did not sound pretty. ::) I did not select neutral as I was used to just dipping the clutch on a manual and then powering away again. ::)
Therefore I declare, ok for secondary braking on a manual but on an auto..........err no. ;D
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its not that difficult.
fifteen minutes per side or so.....
there are very many more difficult ones to do than that.
But, my record is having to remove the body from the chassis to change the EGR valves on a Discovery 3
Guessing about 20 nuts/bolts and a decent hoist :-\
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
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its not that difficult.
fifteen minutes per side or so.....
there are very many more difficult ones to do than that.
But, my record is having to remove the body from the chassis to change the EGR valves on a Discovery 3
Didn't take too long then :)
A good shove and it falls off it's rusty mounts, no? ;D
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
Exactly, a very easy job with two pairs of hands, but I found getting those shoe retaining springs in very tricky. ??? :y
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There is a nack to the reatining springs, once you get it it takes but seconds to fit them. :y
Its a job that I pretty much always do on my own, I did TBE pretty much on my own although it was on a ramp which makes the cable adjustment much easier.
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Exactly, a very easy job with two pairs of hands, but I found getting those shoe retaining springs in very tricky. ??? :y
Lost count of the number of times I dropped the little retaining cup between the boards into the pit last weekend.. grr! ;D
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Replacing and adjusting the shoes is just like any other car.
Adjusting the cables is a pain, particularly if you are doing it singlehandedly. That needs several goes at crawling under the car, adjusting the cable with several wobbly extensions, and checking the result. If the adjuster had been at either end of the cable, or directly on the lever like on a Mini, this would be an easy job.
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There is a nack to the reatining springs, once you get it it takes but seconds to fit them. :y
Its a job that I pretty much always do on my own, I did TBE pretty much on my own although it was on a ramp which makes the cable adjustment much easier.
I found that, personally I could not do it your way in the guide using the ring spanner.
I found just lining the pin up, so it would fit through the slot, then using long nose pliers to push back and then grab the pin and rotate.
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There is a nack to the reatining springs, once you get it it takes but seconds to fit them. :y
Its a job that I pretty much always do on my own, I did TBE pretty much on my own although it was on a ramp which makes the cable adjustment much easier.
I found that, personally I could not do it your way in the guide using the ring spanner.
I found just lining the pin up, so it would fit through the slot, then using long nose pliers to push back and then grab the pin and rotate.
That was how I did it, but even with ground down pliers I found it tricky. :y
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There is a nack to the reatining springs, once you get it it takes but seconds to fit them. :y
Its a job that I pretty much always do on my own, I did TBE pretty much on my own although it was on a ramp which makes the cable adjustment much easier.
I found that, personally I could not do it your way in the guide using the ring spanner.
I found just lining the pin up, so it would fit through the slot, then using long nose pliers to push back and then grab the pin and rotate.
That was how I did it, but even with ground down pliers I found it tricky. :y
Yeah not easy, shoes always slipping/moving. As Mark says there is a nack, once I'd done one side the other was far easier.
Removal was easy for me, as the previous shoe was in many bits :)
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
The MV6 is always more of a pain. Always needs the complete stripdown, mech as well, and all needs a thorough clean.
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
Exactly, a very easy job with two pairs of hands, but I found getting those shoe retaining springs in very tricky. ??? :y
You ain't kidding , i couldn't get the old pins out >:( Bought a replacement set and still in the shed after 2 yrs :-[
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
Exactly, a very easy job with two pairs of hands, but I found getting those shoe retaining springs in very tricky. ??? :y
No more difficult than any drum braked car or rear drums/front disc systems that were the norm not so many years ago. Use a pair of pliers - there is a knack - 10 secs per clip ;)
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No more difficult than any drum braked car or rear drums/front disc systems that were the norm not so many years ago. Use a pair of pliers - there is a knack - 10 secs per clip ;)
But the Omega adds the extra challenge of doing the job through a 3/4" hole ;)
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No more difficult than any drum braked car or rear drums/front disc systems that were the norm not so many years ago. Use a pair of pliers - there is a knack - 10 secs per clip ;)
But the Omega adds the extra challenge of doing the job through a 3/4" hole ;)
Only if you're trying to make it complicated ;D
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The Omega factor that makes fitting the pin clips tricky is that you can't push/hold the pin from the back while you attach the clip. So where the same job on a Capri (for example)isn't worth commenting on, here it's a pain.
If you're really struggling with pliers, then grinding a small groove across the jaws makes the much job easier. A Dremel cutting disc and some cheaply pliers is the way to do this.
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Capri you say? very easy to do especially if you had the Girling tool for the pin clip :)
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Mite be wrong but i thought the pins pushed through the back plate :-\ No way would they push through .. obv im wrong ;D >:(
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
Exactly, a very easy job with two pairs of hands, but I found getting those shoe retaining springs in very tricky. ??? :y
No more difficult than any drum braked car or rear drums/front disc systems that were the norm not so many years ago. Use a pair of pliers - there is a knack - 10 secs per clip ;)
You think? Every car I owned up to disc brakes were this type, and were very simple, including rivetting new linings to the shoes, and IIRC the facility to hold the pins in from the backplate. I've lost count of how many I have done since I started work on my own cars starting with a '53 Ford Consul, and I can assure you that none required the operation to be carried out through a hole about 10mm in diameter, and with no access to hold the pins in place. :y
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Mite be wrong but i thought the pins pushed through the back plate :-\ No way would they push through .. obv im wrong ;D >:(
They're pushed through the backplate, from the back before it's bolted to the trailing arm. But they are not a tight fit, and can move back through their hole by a few mm. Which is just enough to make compressing the spring and turning the clip awkward. Access to the back of the pin allows you to hold it in place while fitting the clip. And although I have the tool for that, I still find it easier with pliers. I would recommend the small T-handled hook that Sealey sell; it makes fitting brake springs so much easier. I paid less than a fiver for it, which was a bargain. I''ll dig out the part number if anyone is interested.
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Mite be wrong but i thought the pins pushed through the back plate :-\ No way would they push through .. obv im wrong ;D >:(
They're pushed through the backplate, from the back before it's bolted to the trailing arm. But they are not a tight fit, and can move back through their hole by a few mm. Which is just enough to make compressing the spring and turning the clip awkward. Access to the back of the pin allows you to hold it in place while fitting the clip. And although I have the tool for that, I still find it easier with pliers. I would recommend the small T-handled hook that Sealey sell; it makes fitting brake springs so much easier. I paid less than a fiver for it, which was a bargain. I''ll dig out the part number if anyone is interested.
Well i found the spring almost impossible to get back on :( Any link to the tool your on about .. mite invest in one as the rear brakes need a good overhaul especially a non existent hand brake :-[
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Only ever adjusted my hand brake once on this car. As it was so high it lifted the centre arm rest and wore through the gator, thanks to the previous owner.
Set it so it just binds a bit, aply hand brake while moving a few times as the manual describes to keep rust off the drum, perfect.
Now just leave the damn thing alone. ...unless parked on an incline that really needs it if course, which is rare for me.
I suspect the cables stretch when abused though.
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Oh, and it's no good claiming its easy when using a ramp. Try it on the drive with a bad back.
You need both hands, so can't neal as head hight is to high, or lean on an elbow on your side as your hands are needed, so are forced to bend forward while nealing to see through the hole which absolutly murders my lower back.
Then there's getting the screwdriver on the adjutor, and working out which way to adjust it on each side. It's a shit if a job.
But at least it works when done, on the superior model of course. ;)
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That about sums it up ::) ;D ;D
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The early cars[just p/f/l's?]the hold down pins went in from the brake shoe side and through a shaped hole in the backplate-at least they were like that on the 1995 Elite I once owned-I believe this system was a carry over from the Opel Monza/Senator?Trouble was the backplate rots out around the pin and then the brake shoes are free to "flop" about!!Again past experience with my early Elite!
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The early cars[just p/f/l's?]the hold down pins went in from the brake shoe side and through a shaped hole in the backplate-at least they were like that on the 1995 Elite I once owned-I believe this system was a carry over from the Opel Monza/Senator?Trouble was the backplate rots out around the pin and then the brake shoes are free to "flop" about!!Again past experience with my early Elite!
On my 94 saloon the pins went in from the brake shoe side as described. It was a bit of a faf getting the pins & springs in behind the wheel flange but once lined up it was easy to poke a Phillips screwdriver through the 10mm hole, push the pin into its slot & give it a 1/4 turn. Or it was easy until the backplate rusted and the keyholes disintegrated :(
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
Exactly, a very easy job with two pairs of hands, but I found getting those shoe retaining springs in very tricky. ??? :y
No more difficult than any drum braked car or rear drums/front disc systems that were the norm not so many years ago. Use a pair of pliers - there is a knack - 10 secs per clip ;)
You think? Every car I owned up to disc brakes were this type, and were very simple, including rivetting new linings to the shoes, and IIRC the facility to hold the pins in from the backplate. I've lost count of how many I have done since I started work on my own cars starting with a '53 Ford Consul, and I can assure you that none required the operation to be carried out through a hole about 10mm in diameter, and with no access to hold the pins in place. :y
No - I know ;)
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And technically, its also a secondary braking system, so needs to be able to shave off speed in an emergency
Is it? :-\ Sure it's more of a parking brake. ::) You'd be better off sticking your foot out of the door in my Merc than try to use the foot operated parking brake ;D ;D
Yeah, apparently. Some newer cars have get-out/loophole clauses to get around this.
They dont on the Astra J, press the handbrake button for a few seconds and it bongs at you followed by all hell breaking loose!
I dont mind doing the rear shoes at all, how long did it take us on TBE at Sereks?
Exactly, a very easy job with two pairs of hands, but I found getting those shoe retaining springs in very tricky. ??? :y
No more difficult than any drum braked car or rear drums/front disc systems that were the norm not so many years ago. Use a pair of pliers - there is a knack - 10 secs per clip ;)
You think? Every car I owned up to disc brakes were this type, and were very simple, including rivetting new linings to the shoes, and IIRC the facility to hold the pins in from the backplate. I've lost count of how many I have done since I started work on my own cars starting with a '53 Ford Consul, and I can assure you that none required the operation to be carried out through a hole about 10mm in diameter, and with no access to hold the pins in place. :y
No - I know everything ;)
He's not wrong you know. ;)
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Its always worth reading threads of this nature, as you get an idea of exactly who has the experience to offer the most useful comments. My own subjective experience is that it is far easier to replace this type of shoe without a great steel flange in the way :y :y :y
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Id like to do my handbrake refurb in about an hour but i think it will be more like 5-6 and mucho swearing ::) especially that bit where you try and poke through and loosen the shoe :(
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especially that bit where you try and poke through and loosen the shoe :(
I hate that bit.. it was even worse on the Jag as some plonker had put the disc on upside down leaving no hole to go through to get to the adjuster ::) Took a three leg puller wedged on the disc and a very loud bang before the disc came off .. taking the brake shoe material with it ;D
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especially that bit where you try and poke through and loosen the shoe :(
I hate that bit.. it was even worse on the Jag as some plonker had put the disc on upside down leaving no hole to go through to get to the adjuster ::) Took a three leg puller wedged on the disc and a very loud bang before the disc came off .. taking the brake shoe material with it ;D
Wot? no locating screw???
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especially that bit where you try and poke through and loosen the shoe :(
I hate that bit.. it was even worse on the Jag as some plonker had put the disc on upside down leaving no hole to go through to get to the adjuster ::) Took a three leg puller wedged on the disc and a very loud bang before the disc came off .. taking the brake shoe material with it ;D
Wot? no locating screw???
Nope, not on the XJ40 with outboard discs; the hub (with disc off and handbrake mech visible) is on the left here: http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/5454/x308e.jpg
There's two (extra) holes in the disc, one of which should line up with the hole in the hub.. but it's possible to put it on so that neither hole lines up. Which was annoying..
Although seeing as the hubs are still in bits in the garage, of no great concern besides the enormous bang it made coming off.. ;D
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;D ;D ;D