Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: powerslinky on 20 June 2014, 21:09:32
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Hi All,
several problems on the new 3.2 heres another . No coolant loss as yet . Temp gauge runs at 100 /105 :o :o :o :o
gets to 105 & 1 fan kicks in & brings it down to 95 until it creeps up to 105 again & fan operates again . This is stationary.
when driving it is a steady 100. Difficult to know if its running hotter than normal as car is new to me . However cabin
heating will not heat up ,even turning right up to HI does nothing . Other end of the scale to LO the A/C compressor
does not kick in & is not spinning.
Maybe just wants a gas up . . . but wont do that until I can get the hot side working first .
Going for a complete coolant system flush including heater matrix & see what occurs :-\
Lastly . . . under the header tank there are 2 "heater " pipes going to some sort of electric pump . . whats is this & should
you be able to feel it is running? any advice & heads up greatfully received TIA Al :y
EDIT: forgot to mention one heater pipe is hot as far as the bulkhead the other seems much cooler almost cold even :-\
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Sounds like the matrix is blocked. :-\ give it a good flush try taking the pipes off the matrix and pushing hose directly into it and see if any crud comes out, as for the compressor have you got the eco button on.
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Sounds like the matrix is blocked. :-\ give it a good flush try taking the pipes off the matrix and pushing hose directly into it and see if any crud comes out, as for the compressor have you got the eco button on.
As 1 pipe is hot & other cold . . . matrix blockage seems favorite :y ECO button is off when trying :-\
not sure the matrix blockage would cause a reading of 100 + on the temp gauge though :-\ :-\ :-\
Won't be able to get on it until next weekend though . . . working this weekend :'( :'( :'(
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As 1 pipe is hot & other cold . . . matrix blockage seems favoUrite :y .....
:( :( :(
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As 1 pipe is hot & other cold . . . matrix blockage seems favoUrite :y .....
:( :( :(
Spalling is not my best subject ;D ;D ;D ;D
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If the matrix is blocked to that extent it's a good bet the radiator is probably pretty gummed up too, and the thermostat could easily be stuck half closed..
Worth flushing the whole system with something extreme, maybe, if the temperatures don't come under control? Filling the rad (not attached to the engine) with something like Fernox has been mentioned before I believe, then leaving it overnight and back flushing..
Sounds a lot like mine when the radiator and heater was full of oily goop, though, so if you're lucky a thorough flushing might cure it.
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Any sign of oil or a stop leek agent in the heeder tank? :)
;)
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Hi All,
several problems on the new 3.2 heres another . No coolant loss as yet . Temp gauge runs at 100 /105 :o :o :o :o
gets to 105 & 1 fan kicks in & brings it down to 95 until it creeps up to 105 again & fan operates again . This is stationary.
when driving it is a steady 100. Difficult to know if its running hotter than normal as car is new to me . However cabin
heating will not heat up ,even turning right up to HI does nothing . Other end of the scale to LO the A/C compressor
does not kick in & is not spinning.
Maybe just wants a gas up . . . but wont do that until I can get the hot side working first .
Going for a complete coolant system flush including heater matrix & see what occurs :-\
Lastly . . . under the header tank there are 2 "heater " pipes going to some sort of electric pump . . whats is this & should
you be able to feel it is running? any advice & heads up greatfully received TIA Al :y
EDIT: forgot to mention one heater pipe is hot as far as the bulkhead the other seems much cooler almost cold even :-\
if your doing a flush why not change the thermostat aswell,best doing it in the summer than in winter.
the little pump under the expansion tank is the aux water pump, it pumps warm water into the matrix when stopped if you press the off button,runs for about 5 mins. (winter pack)
aircon.. eco button off dials to LO engine running, if compressor no spinny, then not worky. :( would need regas and pressure check :y
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also check vac pipe to hbv.
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Mine started overheating a few years ago, but was fine after I flushed the matrix which was clogged solid with crud! :y
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Any sign of oil or a stop leek agent in the heeder tank? :)
;)
Was thinking the same?, previous Oil Cooler failure. :-\
Give it a good flush, I would do this this with the Engine running, lower Rad Tap half open so it dribbles out rather than pissing out, hose pipe feed into the Header Tank, when you have the flow balanced rev the Engine to around 2000 rpm now and then with heater on hot and fans blowing untill the (or if) the heater kicks in while flushing, but keep a good eye on the Temp Guage, not too hot as we all know Cold water and over Hot engines dont mix. ;)
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Any sign of oil or a stop leek agent in the heeder tank? :)
;)
no Nothing Chris, checked all that before I brought it. Car does not seem to be excessivley hot . . . just showing 100 on the gauge . coolant looks a weak mix though only slightly pink :-\ :-\.
Will do a complete coolant flush & maybe disconnect rad & try to get a flushing agent into it overnight. Car is not required to be in use so no worries about time it takes. ::)
Can anyone tell me what the small electrical pump "thingy" with 2 heater size hoses going to it , does? and should you be able to feel it running at all?
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Any sign of oil or a stop leek agent in the heeder tank? :)
;)
no Nothing Chris, checked all that before I brought it. Car does not seem to be excessivley hot . . . just showing 100 on the gauge . coolant looks a weak mix though only slightly pink :-\ :-\.
Will do a complete coolant flush & maybe disconnect rad & try to get a flushing agent into it overnight. Car is not required to be in use so no worries about time it takes. ::)
Can anyone tell me what the small electrical pump "thingy" with 2 heater size hoses going to it , does? and should you be able to feel it running at all?
Sorry forgot to say this is directly below the header tank :-[
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Hi Al.
Welcome to the world of 3.2 and hope you enjoy ownership as much as I am with my new Elite.
The small electrical pump under the coolant reservoir id for the "winter pack" and is designed to push the warming coolant through the matrix quicker on start up allowing for a quicker warmer cabin.It also allows coolant to be pumped around matrix when and after stopping engine so again cabin stay/keeps warm.Not too sure how efficient it is as havent needed to use mine in the winter months much yet.
When I first got mine the temp gauge would barely move off the bottom stop so first job was the thermostat which has cured mine.In your position I would ,as advised by others ,give the entire system a very thorough flush,even remove radiator and fill with descaler,as its not much of a job taking the radiator out.It will also give you a good chance to clean out the fins of both the main radiator and a/c rad too as they get blocked with flies/debris etc.
If you are in no hurry to get car mobile I would also replace the thermostat/housing and give the fan thermoswitches a good test to ensure they are functioning correctly as there is lots that can cause hot running /or the inability to bring temp down correctly.
Once I had done a thorough refurb on mine the temp gauge now sits dead center and has never gone higher even on the hottest days this year so far.From cold she gets up to temp in just a few miles ,so mine was cured just with a simple process of elimination.
Good luck with it :y
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Hi Al.
Welcome to the world of 3.2 and hope you enjoy ownership as much as I am with my new Elite.
The small electrical pump under the coolant reservoir id for the "winter pack" and is designed to push the warming coolant through the matrix quicker on start up allowing for a quicker warmer cabin.It also allows coolant to be pumped around matrix when and after stopping engine so again cabin stay/keeps warm.Not too sure how efficient it is as havent needed to use mine in the winter months much yet.
When I first got mine the temp gauge would barely move off the bottom stop so first job was the thermostat which has cured mine.In your position I would ,as advised by others ,give the entire system a very thorough flush,even remove radiator and fill with descaler,as its not much of a job taking the radiator out.It will also give you a good chance to clean out the fins of both the main radiator and a/c rad too as they get blocked with flies/debris etc.
If you are in no hurry to get car mobile I would also replace the thermostat/housing and give the fan thermoswitches a good test to ensure they are functioning correctly as there is lots that can cause hot running /or the inability to bring temp down correctly.
Once I had done a thorough refurb on mine the temp gauge now sits dead center and has never gone higher even on the hottest days this year so far.From cold she gets up to temp in just a few miles ,so mine was cured just with a simple process of elimination.
Good luck with it :y
thanks Andrew, advice noted :y :y
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Check the main rad that its getting hot all over , any cold spots means partially blocked rad :y
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Need to work at it systematically
First is the coolant bring pushed around so check flow:water pump
Is all areas getting coolant .flush system and check for cold spots or air locks blockages
Is thermostat operating as designed and opening
Is system running at pressure and no leaks etc
Are all electrical aides working as designed and us gauge registering the temp of coolant
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Re the aux pump... That isn't entirely accurate... that pump only works when the engine is OFF to pump hot coolant through the heater matrix so you might use the heater when sitting in the car, say waiting at a level crossing, or when picking the kids up from school etc. It then only runs as long as there is sufficient heat to maintain the set temp. :y
It's possible the pump on the radiator is dead, so consider swapping those two pumps over. They are the same, and being never used, the one under the heater tank is pretty much guaranteed to work :y
Before getting stuck into the engine side of things, check the following:
1.Do all three fans run?
2.Is the HBV plumbed in correctly with vacuum hose attached?
3.When flushing, ensure the temperature is set to HI on both sides.
4.Are the arms to the blend valves attached/do they move when you adjust the temps on the climate panel?
If 2 and 4 don't work, you could replace the heater matrix, radiator, thermostat, water pump, aux pump on the radiator only to find no difference.
1,2 and 4 are all covered in the guides :y 4 being summat like ' Heater only working one side, how I fixed it'
HTH, Al :y
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Pulled vac pipe from HBV there is no vac at this pipe with heat on or off. Presume that there should be at one or other .
Can anyone advise as too when vacumn should be felt at the HBV ?
Have flushed heater matrix . . . little bit of brownish water at first but clear & flowing really good :-\ so thats ok :y
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Should be vac when set to LO :-\
Disconnect the other end of the vac line and suck on it, you should hear the valve moving :y
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Re the aux pump... That isn't entirely accurate... that pump only works when the engine is OFF to pump hot coolant through the heater matrix so you might use the heater when sitting in the car, say waiting at a level crossing, or when picking the kids up from school etc. It then only runs as long as there is sufficient heat to maintain the set temp. :y
It's possible the pump on the radiator is dead, so consider swapping those two pumps over. They are the same, and being never used, the one under the heater tank is pretty much guaranteed to work :y
Before getting stuck into the engine side of things, check the following:
1.Do all three fans run?
2.Is the HBV plumbed in correctly with vacuum hose attached?
3.When flushing, ensure the temperature is set to HI on both sides.
4.Are the arms to the blend valves attached/do they move when you adjust the temps on the climate panel?
If 2 and 4 don't work, you could replace the heater matrix, radiator, thermostat, water pump, aux pump on the radiator only to find no difference.
1,2 and 4 are all covered in the guides :y 4 being summat like ' Heater only working one side, how I fixed it'
HTH, Al :y
OK Al . . . 1. only 2 fans running . . main one engine side of rad & N/S front one (battery side) other front fan not working
2. HBV seems correct as in maintenance guide diagram but no vac at any setting ( could the cabin side of one of the pipes have come off ? )
3. Where do I find the blend arms :-[ . . . any pics available :-\
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Re the aux pump... That isn't entirely accurate... that pump only works when the engine is OFF to pump hot coolant through the heater matrix so you might use the heater when sitting in the car, say waiting at a level crossing, or when picking the kids up from school etc. It then only runs as long as there is sufficient heat to maintain the set temp. :y
It's possible the pump on the radiator is dead, so consider swapping those two pumps over. They are the same, and being never used, the one under the heater tank is pretty much guaranteed to work :y
Before getting stuck into the engine side of things, check the following:
1.Do all three fans run?
2.Is the HBV plumbed in correctly with vacuum hose attached?
3.When flushing, ensure the temperature is set to HI on both sides.
4.Are the arms to the blend valves attached/do they move when you adjust the temps on the climate panel?
If 2 and 4 don't work, you could replace the heater matrix, radiator, thermostat, water pump, aux pump on the radiator only to find no difference.
1,2 and 4 are all covered in the guides :y 4 being summat like ' Heater only working one side, how I fixed it'
HTH, Al :y
OK Al . . . 1. only 2 fans running . . main one engine side of rad & N/S front one (battery side) other front fan not working
2. HBV seems correct as in maintenance guide diagram but no vac at any setting ( could the cabin side of one of the pipes have come off ? )
3. Where do I find the blend arms :-[ . . . any pics available :-\
Air Con on?
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Re the aux pump... That isn't entirely accurate... that pump only works when the engine is OFF to pump hot coolant through the heater matrix so you might use the heater when sitting in the car, say waiting at a level crossing, or when picking the kids up from school etc. It then only runs as long as there is sufficient heat to maintain the set temp. :y
It's possible the pump on the radiator is dead, so consider swapping those two pumps over. They are the same, and being never used, the one under the heater tank is pretty much guaranteed to work :y
Before getting stuck into the engine side of things, check the following:
1.Do all three fans run?
2.Is the HBV plumbed in correctly with vacuum hose attached?
3.When flushing, ensure the temperature is set to HI on both sides.
4.Are the arms to the blend valves attached/do they move when you adjust the temps on the climate panel?
If 2 and 4 don't work, you could replace the heater matrix, radiator, thermostat, water pump, aux pump on the radiator only to find no difference.
1,2 and 4 are all covered in the guides :y 4 being summat like ' Heater only working one side, how I fixed it'
HTH, Al :y
OK Al . . . 1. only 2 fans running . . main one engine side of rad & N/S front one (battery side) other front fan not working
2. HBV seems correct as in maintenance guide diagram but no vac at any setting ( could the cabin side of one of the pipes have come off ? )
3. Where do I find the blend arms :-[ . . . any pics available :-\
1. might be a relkay issue, or dependent on aircon working, won't help temp though.
2. might be a duff vacuum switch, possibly caused by a stuck hbv, or a faulty climate panel (ecu).
3. http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90575.0
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Re the aux pump... That isn't entirely accurate... that pump only works when the engine is OFF to pump hot coolant through the heater matrix so you might use the heater when sitting in the car, say waiting at a level crossing, or when picking the kids up from school etc. It then only runs as long as there is sufficient heat to maintain the set temp. :y
It's possible the pump on the radiator is dead, so consider swapping those two pumps over. They are the same, and being never used, the one under the heater tank is pretty much guaranteed to work :y
Before getting stuck into the engine side of things, check the following:
1.Do all three fans run?
2.Is the HBV plumbed in correctly with vacuum hose attached?
3.When flushing, ensure the temperature is set to HI on both sides.
4.Are the arms to the blend valves attached/do they move when you adjust the temps on the climate panel?
If 2 and 4 don't work, you could replace the heater matrix, radiator, thermostat, water pump, aux pump on the radiator only to find no difference.
1,2 and 4 are all covered in the guides :y 4 being summat like ' Heater only working one side, how I fixed it'
HTH, Al :y
OK Al . . . 1. only 2 fans running . . main one engine side of rad & N/S front one (battery side) other front fan not working
2. HBV seems correct as in maintenance guide diagram but no vac at any setting ( could the cabin side of one of the pipes have come off ? )
3. Where do I find the blend arms :-[ . . . any pics available :-\
1. might be a relkay issue, or dependent on aircon working, won't help temp though.
2. might be a duff vacuum switch, possibly caused by a stuck hbv, or a faulty climate panel (ecu).
3. http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90575.0
Thanks Al . . . . lots going on here . . . . will get going on it . . . but working again tomorrow , so next week more likely :(
RE: the aux pumps . . . can I just test by pulling each electrical connector off & putting 12 volts to the 2 pins ? :-\
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Yup re aux pumps :y
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Re the aux pump... That isn't entirely accurate... that pump only works when the engine is OFF to pump hot coolant through the heater matrix so you might use the heater when sitting in the car, say waiting at a level crossing, or when picking the kids up from school etc. It then only runs as long as there is sufficient heat to maintain the set temp. :y
It's possible the pump on the radiator is dead, so consider swapping those two pumps over. They are the same, and being never used, the one under the heater tank is pretty much guaranteed to work :y
Before getting stuck into the engine side of things, check the following:
1.Do all three fans run?
2.Is the HBV plumbed in correctly with vacuum hose attached?
3.When flushing, ensure the temperature is set to HI on both sides.
4.Are the arms to the blend valves attached/do they move when you adjust the temps on the climate panel?
If 2 and 4 don't work, you could replace the heater matrix, radiator, thermostat, water pump, aux pump on the radiator only to find no difference.
1,2 and 4 are all covered in the guides :y 4 being summat like ' Heater only working one side, how I fixed it'
HTH, Al :y
OK Al . . . 1. only 2 fans running . . main one engine side of rad & N/S front one (battery side) other front fan not working
2. HBV seems correct as in maintenance guide diagram but no vac at any setting ( could the cabin side of one of the pipes have come off ? )
3. Where do I find the blend arms :-[ . . . any pics available :-\
1. might be a relkay issue, or dependent on aircon working, won't help temp though.
2. might be a duff vacuum switch, possibly caused by a stuck hbv, or a faulty climate panel (ecu).
3. http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90575.0
Thanks Al . . . . lots going on here . . . . will get going on it . . . but working again tomorrow , so next week more likely :(
RE: the aux pumps . . . can I just test by pulling each electrical connector off & putting 12 volts to the 2 pins ? :-\
If you know which Pin is + and -, sometimes easier to pull the relay cover off and make the contact by hand.
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Happy days ;D ;D ;D ;D :y :y :y
Ok guys . . . have changed the HBV ( had one anyway ;) ) now all working really good .
When on HI the heat is excellent & on LO blows cool . . . not really cold as am having to run it on ECO as the A/C needs looking at . Compressor not kicking in , hoping thats just a re gas :-\.
Running temp is also sorted max temp on gauge is 90 fans kick in bring it back to 85 . :y :y :y
Tested aux pumps . . . both work but when should the one by the Rad switch in ? as it does not seem to . is there a fuse to check for this ?
But delighted with progress so far & thanks to all who advised etc. :y :y :y
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Nice one :y
Re the aircon... test the high pressure valve prior to doing anything else. If it still holds pressure, get it regassed first. No pressure then renew the valves and condenser prior to regassing :y not much else to go wrong with it after those three things, so might as well start off right :y
Think the rad pump is as a final helping hand when the fans are struggling :-\ if the pump itself works, then I wouldn't fret it... it may even be triggered by the aircon :-\ so if that doesn't work then the pump may not...
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Nice one :y
Re the aircon... test the high pressure valve prior to doing anything else. If it still holds pressure, get it regassed first. No pressure then renew the valves and condenser prior to regassing :y not much else to go wrong with it after those three things, so might as well start off right :y
Think the rad pump is as a final helping hand when the fans are struggling :-\ if the pump itself works, then I wouldn't fret it... it may even be triggered by the aircon :-\ so if that doesn't work then the pump may not...
Al , I'm thinking this test would be done by garage / aircon specialist ? . . or can I do it ? :-\ :-\
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Unscrew the plastic cap on the aircon pipe to the bulkhead, then simply press the tip of a small screwdriver onto the valve.
If it hisses, then the system is relatively sealed so a regas should see it working again... no hiss = no gas pressure, so most likely condenser is shot, but prudent to change the valves as well whilst the system is empty :y
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Unscrew the plastic cap on the aircon pipe to the bulkhead, then simply press the tip of a small screwdriver onto the valve.
If it hisses, then the system is relatively sealed so a regas should see it working again... no hiss = no gas pressure, so most likely condenser is shot, but prudent to change the valves as well whilst the system is empty :y
Oh dear . . :'( :'( :'( no hiss . . . . another job added to the list ::) ::)
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Valves are a couple of quid each and the condenser can be had for £50ish,and you can pretty much guarantee the condenser is the problem :y
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Valves are a couple of quid each and the condenser can be had for £50ish,and you can pretty much guarantee the condenser is the problem :y
Plus the rest
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Valves are a couple of quid each and the condenser can be had for £50ish,and you can pretty much guarantee the condenser is the problem :y
Plus the rest
Been a while since I looked tbh :-\
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Had mine changed about 3 months ago along with the drier.
From memory parts were around £150 and that was trade,just paid for the fitting and re-gas afterwards
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Had mine changed about 3 months ago along with the drier.
From memory parts were around £150 and that was trade,just paid for the fitting and re-gas afterwards
A/C will have to be relegated to the foot of the " jobs to be done" list then ;D ;D ;D
The windows & sunroof open fine ;D ;D ;D More important items first I think ;) ;)
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Good luck with it Al..will be nice when all done..bought mine last June and spent next 6-7 months doing jobs as and when I had time.
Managed to accumulate parts cheap,mostly genuine , as I went along so wasnt too huge a cost when all things considered and I know it is done properly and great learning curve.
Still few things to sort and get working but nearly done.