Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: deviator on 23 May 2015, 18:00:18
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Is there any reason I can't fit 308mm carriers and discs to the Omega? From a Vectra/Saab. My Omega needs new brakes and as I have the carriers laying around, is there any reason they won't fit? IE Offset?
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Probably....11 mm increased diameter will make cock all difference to the brake performance. So a pointless exercise anyway.
Fitting 18" sport stars will allow 360mm brakes discs from phaeton/Audi a8 with a little machining of the wheel bearing hub. Then q7/Tuareg/cayenne brembo 6pot calipers with brackets will give you proper stopping power with massive heat capacity for repeated high speed stopping power.
....Bah! Piffling 308mm discs indeed. ::)
;) ;D to be fair, it's not likely anyone has those lying around. Dunno tbh.
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I wasn't really after increased braking, that was a by-product.
I have the brackets, I need discs and pads regardless of size - so cost wise it's minimal. It was more a case of, 'Does it fit?'
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Why not just buy the correct ones in that case? Seeing new discs and pads are needed anyway?
What have I missed?
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Why not just buy the correct ones in that case? Seeing new discs and pads are needed anyway?
What have I missed?
Whilst 11mm may make so little difference, the fact I have the carriers, I could just buy larger discs and have done. It would be almost a free upgrade from 297 to 308.
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All you can do is try, but hardly worth the bother... Disc offset would be the only thing that will piss on the parade... And nowt you can do about it :-\
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Why not just buy the correct ones in that case? Seeing new discs and pads are needed anyway?
What have I missed?
Whilst 11mm may make so little difference, the fact I have the carriers, I could just buy larger discs and have done. It would be almost a free upgrade from 297 to 308.
It won't make ANY difference. So why risk them not accepting a refund of the offset doesn't allow.
Who's to say the hub carrier position will work in your favour anyway?
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Fair enough, I thought it was worth an ask as it's a few extra MM for next to nothing. I get the impression, no one has done it because they don't see the value. Even though my basic physics suggest better heat dispensation and greater leverage due to the distance to the fulcrum point increasing.
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It's 5.5mm further out than the old ones. 11mm diameter over all.
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Fair enough, I thought it was worth an ask as it's a few extra MM for next to nothing. I get the impression, no one has done it because they don't see the value. Even though my basic physics suggest better heat dissipation and greater leverage due to the distance to the fulcrum point increasing.
You're right, there ought to be an improvement. But it will be small, and the Omega brakes are hardly inadequate, so you probably won't notice it.
If you're going to mess about changing things like brakes, it's only really worth going for much bigger ones.
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Fair enough, I thought it was worth an ask as it's a few extra MM for next to nothing. I get the impression, no one has done it because they don't see the value. Even though my basic physics suggest better heat dissipation and greater leverage due to the distance to the fulcrum point increasing.
You're right, there ought to be an improvement. But it will be small, and the Omega brakes are hardly inadequate, so you probably won't notice it.
If you're going to mess about changing things like brakes, it's only really worth going for much bigger ones.
He's not wrong you know. MUCH bigger. :)
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Very early Monaro CV8 front calipers bolt straight on to Omega discs and instantly give much greater pad area using Corvette pads...
Fitting anything bigger will involve a degree of machining/fabrication... So if you want to go down that road then you might as well do it properly :y
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My Dear Al...... You beat me to it. Love my Monaro/GTO brake calipers. I've had them for years and, with the exception of losing the pad wear sensors, they are the best, cheapest way to improve the Omega's brakes. No mechanical leverage gain since they use the original discs but the bite of the bigger pads is immediately noticeable. Read more: http://cateraowners.forumotion.com/t5-gto-brake-swap
(http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n50/CateraMV6/MV6%20Brakes/GTOBrakes.jpg)
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I've been looking for some monaro/gto calipers and they rarely turn up on eBay :(
Chrisgixer do you have any pictures of these brackets for the brembo 6 pots??
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How does the piston area in those 2 pot calipers compare with the original single pot?
If the piston area is greater, then it will give you more braking effort for a given pedal pressure, so it's bound to feel like an upgrade.
The problem is, you'll have shifted the brake balance towards the front axle since you haven't also increased the piston area at the rear axle. This means the (standard) front disks are now getting more punishment than before, since they are doing a greater proportion of the braking, making brake fade more likely. It will also affect the car's handling under braking and perhaps worsen the overall stopping power. If the piston area is the same, then no problem of course.
Either way, all you've actually "upgraded" is the life of the pads, since the pad area is now greater.
The only way to cure brake fade is to upgrade the part of the system that dissipates the heat - the disk.
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Thank you for all the comments.
I just wanted to know if the larger brackets fitted, but I think it's just easier to get the standard size and sell the brackets on.
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
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....- the disk.
disC on this side of the Atlantic ::)
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....- the disk.
disC on this side of the Atlantic ::)
Who woke Andy P up? ::)
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
But of course he has a hat, Paddington always wears his hat and keeps a marmalade sandwich under it for emergencies... Don't you know anything?!
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Watched my MoT with interest as it was the first test since the Monaro VXR brakes were fitted...
Front brakes were a touch stronger than the previous test: 3.1 against 2.5 iirc, but rears were, obviously, unchanged at 2.5... both sides being identical :y
On a fast run to work: 23 miles and 23 roundabouts and all fast A roads (55% dual carriageway), the brakes aren't showing signs of fading until I get to the last roundabout, where as before they were fading halfway to Crawley from Horsham (7 miles) :o
So upgrades are well considered, but you want to be looking at 330x32 mm discs with decent pad area to make it worthwhile imho :-\
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So upgrades are well considered, but you want to be looking at 330x32 mm discs with decent pad area to make it worthwhile imho :-\
Although that would then require me to upgrade to 17" wheels, which I'd rather not do because I like the comfort. It really wasn't a question about upgrading performance at all, I only asked if they fitted. I know I can fit 308mm discs behind a wide range of 16" wheels (assuming there are no stick on weights just behind the alloy face), as I've tried and have the pictures.
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In which case, try the early Monaro CV8/Pontiac Gto calipers if you can find a set... typically $100 plus shipping :y
Otherwise buy the GM pads... the proper ones at around £80 a set rather than the not so great but perfectly fine TC pads which you get in the disc/pad set, and appreciate the difference these make to the standard brake performance :y
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In which case, try the early Monaro CV8/Pontiac Gto calipers if you can find a set... typically $100 plus shipping :y
Otherwise buy the GM pads... the proper ones at around £80 a set rather than the not so great but perfectly fine TC pads which you get in the disc/pad set, and appreciate the difference these make to the standard brake performance :y
Thanks, but like I said, I wasn't really after improving brakes, it was more a case of 'I have these brackets doing nothing, I might as well fit them'.
By the better pads, I presume you mean the police spec pads? I've had them before, they are good, but they kick out some dust.
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That they do... :D
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Although that would then require me to upgrade to 17" wheels, which I'd rather not do because I like the comfort. ....
I replaced my MFL Elite 16" rims for the later FL Elite 17" rims, though there was a difference between the two, the ride on the 17s was still quite acceptable :y
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I have some 17"'s at home, I may try them in the future, assuming I don't get bored and sell them first ::)
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Although that would then require me to upgrade to 17" wheels, which I'd rather not do because I like the comfort. ....
I replaced my MFL Elite 16" rims for the later FL Elite 17" rims, though there was a difference between the two, the ride on the 17s was still quite acceptable :y
and because the 17" tyres are a more popular size, they're usually cheaper :y
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Although that would then require me to upgrade to 17" wheels, which I'd rather not do because I like the comfort. ....
I replaced my MFL Elite 16" rims for the later FL Elite 17" rims, though there was a difference between the two, the ride on the 17s was still quite acceptable :y
and because the 17" tyres are a more popular size, they're usually cheaper :y
Oddly, I've already priced up tyres, Toyo T1S are £68 each in 16's and the last time I bought 17" Toyo T1R they were £75. Again not much in it really.
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Watched my MoT with interest as it was the first test since the Monaro VXR brakes were fitted...
Front brakes were a touch stronger than the previous test: 3.1 against 2.5 iirc, but rears were, obviously, unchanged at 2.5... both sides being identical :y
That only tells you the braking effort at lockup, though, nothing about the brake balance. For that you need to measure both axles simultaneously, or individually with an identical force on the brake pedal. IIRC, the latter is what I had to demonstrate at my kit car SVA test. They use a little gauge between your foot and the pedal to measure the force, then they measure braking effort at both axles, then they measure load on both axles before deciding if the balance is safe.
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
I have 19" as spare ;)
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
I have 19" as spare ;)
There's no way that fits in the spare wheel well?
Have you got any pictures of the brackets you had made? I'm thinking about copying you :)
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I've been looking for some monaro/gto calipers and they rarely turn up on eBay :(
Chrisgixer do you have any pictures of these brackets for the brembo 6 pots??
6 pot set up on omega
(http://img1.jpegbay.com/gallery/004416690/1_t.jpg)
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
I have 19" as spare ;)
There's no way that fits in the spare wheel well?
Have you got any pictures of the brackets you had made? I'm thinking about copying you :)
wheel from photo above was in place on spare wheel
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Chap on ABS is reconstructing a rusty Carlton, as the spare wheel location is rusted out he has fabricated a larger recessed panel in preparation for handling a larger and wider wheel. Very impressed, I wish I could weld and fabricate such things....
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Chap on ABS is reconstructing a rusty Carlton, as the spare wheel location is rusted out he has fabricated a larger recessed panel in preparation for handling a larger and wider wheel. Very impressed, I wish I could weld and fabricate such things....
I know its only a small reel you get with new welders, but I friggin ran out of welding wire yesterday. Mind you, I still can't weld for shite ;D
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I suppose my attempt could be classed as an artists impression of pigeon shat.
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I suppose my attempt could be classed as an artists impression of pigeon shat.
mig welding is not hard al all, if you have welder set up right and material prepared
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I suppose my attempt could be classed as an artists impression of pigeon shat.
mig welding is not hard al all, if you have welder set up right and material prepared
I think i'll stick to soldering wires and leave welding panels to yourself and Daz!!!
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
Yep, fits fine thanks :y
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
Yep, fits fine thanks :y
15" steelie, or something else?
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
Yep, fits fine thanks :y
15" steelie, or something else?
Another sport star. ???
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I think Mr Wood needs to drive Sereks 6pot upgrade. ....and if they over hear I'll eat my hat. And the Popes hat ....and the Bears hat if he has one. ;D ;)
Have you tried your spare wheel ::)
Yep, fits fine thanks :y
15" steelie, or something else?
Another sport star. ???
You can get that in the wheel well :o
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With a hammer and a welder, anything is possible ;D