Omega Owners Forum

Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Webby the Bear on 12 July 2015, 20:46:21

Title: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Webby the Bear on 12 July 2015, 20:46:21
As per my pics in the meets/gatherings section I think I may have fallen for one of the above.

Do these come up for sale very often? A quick search of the trader doesn't provide anything.

I noticed that behind one of the Velox's laid a small metal box. 'What's that'? My mum asked. 'I get closer. 'It looks like a differential' I say. Just as I'm explaining roughly what a diff is for I noticed a gear stick coming out of it  :o I never knew gearboxes went that small.

So anyway. . . I appreciate looking after the body of an old classic would be hard work. But I'm presuming that from a mechanical work point it's stupidly easy, especially with gearboxes the size of a tin of beans lol however I presume that getting parts is a pain?

Finally one thing I did notice (bear in mind I wasn't around in the fifties or sixties) was how the crestas had a definite american fifties caddy look. Is this because of the American GM links? Anyone got any interesting history trivia?
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 12 July 2015, 21:25:36
As per my pics in the meets/gatherings section I think I may have fallen for one of the above.

Do these come up for sale very often? A quick search of the trader doesn't provide anything.

I noticed that behind one of the Velox's laid a small metal box. 'What's that'? My mum asked. 'I get closer. 'It looks like a differential' I say. Just as I'm explaining roughly what a diff is for I noticed a gear stick coming out of it  :o I never knew gearboxes went that small.

So anyway. . . I appreciate looking after the body of an old classic would be hard work. But I'm presuming that from a mechanical work point it's stupidly easy, especially with gearboxes the size of a tin of beans lol however I presume that getting parts is a pain?

Finally one thing I did notice (bear in mind I wasn't around in the fifties or sixties) was how the crestas had a definite american fifties caddy look. Is this because of the American GM links? Anyone got any interesting history trivia?

Invest in a set of feeler gauges, Mr Bear. :y
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 12 July 2015, 21:27:14
.....just what you need for  your points. :y
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: amazonian on 12 July 2015, 21:44:29
Webby, I had a Velox. a Cresta and a Wyvern in the 60s and they are about as complicated to work on as a bicycle.

If you have never been close to a car of that period prepare to be amazed at the simplicity of DIY on them, and the extreme lack of 'stuff ' under the bonnet compared to todays cars.
Good luck with whatever you buy.

 :) :)
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Webby the Bear on 12 July 2015, 21:54:23
Thanks boys.

I have a set of feeler gauges but rarely use them. What particularly would I need them for. . . Valve clearances presumably?

Amazonian. . . Great stuff . I like simplicity
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: EMD on 12 July 2015, 22:01:20
 :y



  http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C604039
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: amazonian on 12 July 2015, 22:02:21
I still have the feeler gauges that I used then, you need them mostly for setting the gap in the spark plugs and the points in the distributor.

 :) :)
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Broomies Mate on 12 July 2015, 22:05:40
Most people believe spark plugs come 'ready' to plonk in.  Always worth setting the gap with a feeler gauge.  You'd be surprised how many plugs are .5mm out!  :y
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Diamond Black Geezer on 13 July 2015, 08:42:47
Oooh, bleeding ell, I once suggested that it's good form to check the plug gaps, in spite of all plugs these days being 'gapped' from factory (you can't guarantee a box hasn't been dropped, after all) and effectively got called an idiot for it  ??? Anyway, I agree with you, Mr Broomies mate, agree always worth checking the gaps, and older type plugs do need gapping  :)



As for Mr The Bear's post, I'm with you there, brother!  Adore the older Vauxhalls, and yes, thanks to the ties with GM, basically what would happen is Vauxhall would send over their prototype models in clay form for an 'ok' from the Detroit bosses. In the case of the F series Victor it was damaged in transit, whereupon they 'improved' its looks, sent it back with the note 'yeah, just like this' the F Victor was stylistically over the top, and didn't sell too well in the UK (but an export success) the PA Cresta/Velox (the contemporary of the F Victor) was by far the cleaner, 'more right' design.

That process of the final say-so from GM continued right until, well present day, basically. But obviously these days a USB stick or decent broadband connection can carry a full 3D CAD model wherever you like for scrutiny.

Often when you look at a 60s-70s Vauxhall, somewhere there's another GM car that looks very similar. Check out the FD Victor and the 63 Buick Riviera for one example.  :)


Hoping to get an HB or maybe an FD Victor myself over the next few years.  :y

Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 13 July 2015, 11:40:05
No 'nancy boy' fuel injection systems for you then, Mr Bear.

Just good old-fashioned carbs. :y

Add a colourtune your your list of must have products. My old Triumph 2500S managed 13 MPG once I had set up it's twin SU's with one of these johnnies. :y

Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Nick W on 13 July 2015, 12:06:39
No 'nancy boy' fuel injection systems for you then, Mr Bear.

Just good old-fashioned carbs. :y

Add a colourtune your your list of must have products. My old Triumph 2500S managed 13 MPG once I had set up it's twin SU's with one of these johnnies. :y

13mpg!  Why did you need a Colourtune to get it that bad?

Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 13 July 2015, 12:42:48
No 'nancy boy' fuel injection systems for you then, Mr Bear.

Just good old-fashioned carbs. :y

Add a colourtune your your list of must have products. My old Triumph 2500S managed 13 MPG once I had set up it's twin SU's with one of these johnnies. :y

13mpg!  Why did you need a Colourtune to get it that bad?

I could only get it too run smoothly when it was running 'super rich'.....bright orange flame.

With the right mixture (blue flame) it wouldn't pull. :-\

I imagine that just about every component in the carbs was worn out.
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 13 July 2015, 12:47:58
:y



  http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C604039

£12995..... :o :o :o
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Diamond Black Geezer on 13 July 2015, 13:08:31
Yup, the PAs are the most desirable. No-one cares about the PB, though (and admittedly, it's not comparable in the style stakes) the FB, the FC. Thanksfully, the PCs, FDs and HBs are still pretty affordable, and absolutely dripping with style, the like of which we'll never see again. The PC, though, is easily rarer than a Lotus Carlton, and almost makes Carlton Diamond Estates looks commmonplace.  :)
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: EMD on 13 July 2015, 13:09:03
:y



  http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C604039

£12995..... :o :o :o

Yeah i was shocked also , was quite a few of them at Billing  :)
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Webby the Bear on 13 July 2015, 16:18:00
On the same page there's the red one if like at 8995. I'm about 8994 short of the mark but I can save that up in around a thousand years. Lol

On a serious note tho they're gorgeous. I love the cover over the rear wheels.

Anything dodgy to note on them? I trust that tiny gearbox is a two speed thing?
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Diamond Black Geezer on 13 July 2015, 16:35:47
Oooh, well, Mr The Bear, If memory serves on the Crestas if you opted for the Auto, it was indeed a two-speed 'Hydramatic'. Paltry by even late 1960s standards, but it was an auto gearbox option, and most car companies didn't offer such a futuristic thing as a self-gearchanging car. Later Crestas/Veloxes got the three-speed 'Powerglide' which wasn't so bad.


The red one you covet so much (as do I) is the E-Series, very much the Omega of the 1950s, (but outsold the Zephy/Zodiac, so very much a Mk II Cavalier in that respect)

Some simple badge-engineering going on. Often these get all called 'Crestas' but there was the Wyvern, Velox and Cresta.

Wyvern
smallest engine (1.5 4 cyl) - think 2.0 Omega Select, GLS

Velox
Nice straight six, 2 1/4 litre, soem extra chromey bits - think 2.5 V6 Omega CD/CDX

Cresta
Same engine but get leather, a bit more chrome and kit - think Omega Elite

Really nice range structure, to be honest, they sold in numbers the Omega could only dream of, and that was in the days when there were rivals like the whole of BMC, the whole of Rootes Group, Dagenham too.

Also the Cresta of 1957 has the honour of being the first Vauxhall to feature a 'V grille' - later seen on the Viva, then a 20 year gap until this German thing came over in 1994 to replace the Carlton...  :y
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 13 July 2015, 17:13:00
I always fancied a Viva GT from the period 1968/70.

2 litre lump in a small light car means that acceleration is probably less pedestrian than an old Cresta.
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 13 July 2015, 17:14:41
Oooh, well, Mr The Bear, If memory serves on the Crestas if you opted for the Auto, it was indeed a two-speed 'Hydramatic'. Paltry by even late 1960s standards, but it was an auto gearbox option, and most car companies didn't offer such a futuristic thing as a self-gearchanging car. Later Crestas/Veloxes got the three-speed 'Powerglide' which wasn't so bad.


The red one you covet so much (as do I) is the E-Series, very much the Omega of the 1950s, (but outsold the Zephy/Zodiac, so very much a Mk II Cavalier in that respect)

Some simple badge-engineering going on. Often these get all called 'Crestas' but there was the Wyvern, Velox and Cresta.

Wyvern
smallest engine (1.5 4 cyl) - think 2.0 Omega Select, GLS

Velox
Nice straight six, 2 1/4 litre, soem extra chromey bits - think 2.5 V6 Omega CD/CDX

Cresta
Same engine but get leather, a bit more chrome and kit - think Omega Elite

Really nice range structure, to be honest, they sold in numbers the Omega could only dream of, and that was in the days when there were rivals like the whole of BMC, the whole of Rootes Group, Dagenham too.

Also the Cresta of 1957 has the honour of being the first Vauxhall to feature a 'V grille' - later seen on the Viva, then a 20 year gap until this German thing came over in 1994 to replace the Carlton...  :y

I believe the Viscount was closer to Elite spec.
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: henryd on 13 July 2015, 18:22:01
Oooh, well, Mr The Bear, If memory serves on the Crestas if you opted for the Auto, it was indeed a two-speed 'Hydramatic'. Paltry by even late 1960s standards, but it was an auto gearbox option, and most car companies didn't offer such a futuristic thing as a self-gearchanging car. Later Crestas/Veloxes got the three-speed 'Powerglide' which wasn't so bad.


The red one you covet so much (as do I) is the E-Series, very much the Omega of the 1950s, (but outsold the Zephy/Zodiac, so very much a Mk II Cavalier in that respect)

Some simple badge-engineering going on. Often these get all called 'Crestas' but there was the Wyvern, Velox and Cresta.

Wyvern
smallest engine (1.5 4 cyl) - think 2.0 Omega Select, GLS

Velox
Nice straight six, 2 1/4 litre, soem extra chromey bits - think 2.5 V6 Omega CD/CDX

Cresta
Same engine but get leather, a bit more chrome and kit - think Omega Elite

Really nice range structure, to be honest, they sold in numbers the Omega could only dream of, and that was in the days when there were rivals like the whole of BMC, the whole of Rootes Group, Dagenham too.

Also the Cresta of 1957 has the honour of being the first Vauxhall to feature a 'V grille' - later seen on the Viva, then a 20 year gap until this German thing came over in 1994 to replace the Carlton...  :y

I believe the Viscount was closer to Elite spec.

I think the Viscount got the 3.3 lump as well complete with powerglide transmission :-X
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Andy H on 13 July 2015, 19:48:10
On the same page there's the red one if like at 8995. I'm about 8994 short of the mark but I can save that up in around a thousand years. Lol

On a serious note tho they're gorgeous. I love the cover over the rear wheels.

Anything dodgy to note on them? I trust that tiny gearbox is a two speed thing?
Rust.

I grew up in walking distance of the Vauxhall factory. They were everywhere when I was a child & then they were gone  :'(

Mechanically they were built to be endlessly refurbished - it was the bodywork that wasn't worth patching up.
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Webby the Bear on 13 July 2015, 19:50:50
Oooh, well, Mr The Bear, If memory serves on the Crestas if you opted for the Auto, it was indeed a two-speed 'Hydramatic'. Paltry by even late 1960s standards, but it was an auto gearbox option, and most car companies didn't offer such a futuristic thing as a self-gearchanging car. Later Crestas/Veloxes got the three-speed 'Powerglide' which wasn't so bad.


The red one you covet so much (as do I) is the E-Series, very much the Omega of the 1950s, (but outsold the Zephy/Zodiac, so very much a Mk II Cavalier in that respect)

Some simple badge-engineering going on. Often these get all called 'Crestas' but there was the Wyvern, Velox and Cresta.

Wyvern
smallest engine (1.5 4 cyl) - think 2.0 Omega Select, GLS

Velox
Nice straight six, 2 1/4 litre, soem extra chromey bits - think 2.5 V6 Omega CD/CDX

Cresta
Same engine but get leather, a bit more chrome and kit - think Omega Elite

Really nice range structure, to be honest, they sold in numbers the Omega could only dream of, and that was in the days when there were rivals like the whole of BMC, the whole of Rootes Group, Dagenham too.

Also the Cresta of 1957 has the honour of being the first Vauxhall to feature a 'V grille' - later seen on the Viva, then a 20 year gap until this German thing came over in 1994 to replace the Carlton...  :y

'Kin 'ell DBG. . . . you clearly know your onions  :y

And bang on about the hydamatic. . . They all had that. . . Didn't see any manual ones!

I still can't get over the size of the gear tin box lol

 I certainly can't afford it at the mo. But in the future Id love something like that
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Webby the Bear on 13 July 2015, 19:51:36
What's the performance like? This would be driven very slow as its all about preservation and the body .but out of interest
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: amazonian on 13 July 2015, 21:21:35
What's the performance like? This would be driven very slow as its all about preservation and the body .but out of interest

It certainly would Webby !

 :)  :)
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: BazaJT on 13 July 2015, 21:54:01
A Viscount would answer very nicely for me! :y
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: aaronjb on 13 July 2015, 22:28:45
What's the performance like? This would be driven very slow as its all about preservation and the body .but out of interest

It's not exactly going to set your world on fire..

Quote
A PA tested by the British magazine The Motor in 1958 had a top speed of 89.8 mph (144.5 km/h) and could accelerate from 0-60 mph (97 km/h) in 16.8 seconds

FWIW I reckon you'll find some of the mechanicals might look a bit alien - you're going back to the days of things like live rear axles and brake discs* mounted the 'wrong' side of the hubs.. But very, very basic.

(*I know, the Cresta was drums all round)
Title: Re: Vx Cresta, VIva, Velox etc.
Post by: Diamond Black Geezer on 14 July 2015, 10:45:18
Doc Opti is correct, in that the Viscount (the later PC models) is closer to Elite, in that repsect, I even think you got electric windows and power steering, not bad for the late 60s. However in that instance I was referring to the E-series range structure.  :)

Fast forward a few years to the early 60s, and the Wyvern has gone, replaced by the Victor, which inherited its 1.5 engine... the Victor in turn starts to move upmarket, toward the late 60s, as does the PC (hence the super-specced Viscount, as the good Mr Opti notes) where, upon the axing of the PC in '72 the now larger Victor then tries to fill the gap left with a 3.3 litre Ventora (which is more badge engineering, basically sticking the 3.3 straight six in the Victor, quad headlamps and some nice spec gives you a 'lazy fireball' in modern day equivalent think Vectra Elite/Signum 3.2

And to aaronjb you're right, though the Cresta managed to get front discs by 1961, not too many years after Jaguar had pioneered them at Le Mans.  :)

And thanks Mr The Bear, much appreciated. I've had my head in every Classic Vauxhall book since I were a nipper!  :y