Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: chrisgixer on 22 July 2015, 18:58:05
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...nooooo really? You think...? ;D
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-33622318
While clearly they do as I'm sure you all know to varying degrees. I have to question the wisdom of placing such a large, heavy and difficult vehicle to drive such as this, in the hands of such a retarded moron. HELLOOOO ! ? !
Having said that, does the bikes horn not work? Shock I suppose, and a feeling of complete helplessness took over. :o
(http://images.yuku.com/image/gif/a5126f21c888e21dd7b04899176dd385728b07af_r.gif)
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So the biker also failed to spot the fact that the lorry was turning left, and indicating, and made no allowance whatsoever for the amount of space that a vehicle that length needs. In that final position, the lorry driver couldn't possibly have seen the bike, not helped by the fact that he was probably watching the near side rear corner and the offside front corner to clear the kerbs.
Ironically, the one window that the bike might have been visible through is completely obscured by mirrors... which the law insists on being fitted to give the driver as much view along the blind side as possible. ::)
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agree with harris on this one :y :y
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Truck turning into street with indicators on, I would have stopped a fair distance before the biker did. Rather than ride into the truck's path as this chap did.
What is more interesting is the mother who leaves her child in a pushchair by the kerb and rushes to help the biker. In Peckham!
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I aggrer with Harris on this. And if the op wishes to argue the point I will gladly take him into the hell hole which is central London in a artic and 26plt fridge trailer and watch how well he does.
yes loaded and delivery's to do. :)
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Interestingly he didn't get a chance to stop sooner because he was doing his "Lifesaver" check... Slightly ironic ::)
A freak accident really... He was just in the blind spot the whole way
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An awful lot of two wheeled persons put themselves into dangerous/life threatening postions when near Lgv's, the common is up the inside,while lgv is waiting to turn left.
its getting to the point were you are having to think for everybody else before they do it.,
The worst offenders are the urban cyclists.
large off road type bike, dressed in black, go pro on their head, using the streets like an off road course. All called Nigel or woger.
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Noob biker maybe, no reaction whatsoever; I`ll just sit here & die :o
I don`t trust any HGV driver :P
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Interestingly he didn't get a chance to stop sooner because he was doing his "Lifesaver" check... Slightly ironic ::)
A freak accident really... He was just in the blind spot the whole way
SWMBO got swiped by a foreign HGV on the M25 a few years ago. She was in the middle lane passing it but level with the front axle, artic moved into middle lane and batted SWMBO onto the top of the grass bank.
It simply isn't good enough to blame the poor sod who wasn't big enough to be seen ('sorry mate I didn't see you'). If a vehicle has such poor visibility that it can't safely be used surrounded by children, cyclists, bikers & micras then it shouldn't be sharing the same road space. >:(
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Noob biker maybe, no reaction whatsoever; I`ll just sit here & die :o
I don`t trust any HGV driver :P
I rode a motorbike in the centre of London for 20 years. The safest approach seemed to be to assume that the other sod hadn't seen me but might try to kill me if they did see me. ::)
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Interestingly he didn't get a chance to stop sooner because he was doing his "Lifesaver" check... Slightly ironic ::)
A freak accident really... He was just in the blind spot the whole way
SWMBO got swiped by a foreign HGV on the M25 a few years ago. She was in the middle lane passing it but level with the front axle, artic moved into middle lane and batted SWMBO onto the top of the grass bank.
It simply isn't good enough to blame the poor sod who wasn't big enough to be seen ('sorry mate I didn't see you'). If a vehicle has such poor visibility that it can't safely be used surrounded by children, cyclists, bikers & micras then it shouldn't be sharing the same road space. >:(
TBH, if everyone had to pass a driving test to the higher standards required of professional drivers the roads would be a much better place ;)
In a lane change situation there is very little excuse for not spotting a car if the correct awareness and checks are done but it's when manoeuvring that it is easy to lose things in blind spots.
Edit: Just re-read that it was a foreign lorry... So she was in his blind spot. I don't believe anyone who says they have never been in a situation where something catches them out because it is in a blind spot, even in a car ;)
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I drive on th A12 south from Ipswich to London regularly and ive nothing against bikers(sold bike only 2 years ago). The traffic is usually heavy travelling both lanes 60-70mph ,bikers continually go down the middle over/undertaking incredibly close to vehicles ,their luck will eventually run out. My point is bikers must help themselves in todays busy roads and not take ridiculous risks,has anyone else experienced this?
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I drive on th A12 south from Ipswich to London regularly and ive nothing against bikers(sold bike only 2 years ago). The traffic is usually heavy travelling both lanes 60-70mph ,bikers continually go down the middle over/undertaking incredibly close to vehicles ,their luck will eventually run out. My point is bikers must help themselves in todays busy roads and not take ridiculous risks,has anyone else experienced this?
As do I... Only really notice it when speeds are below about 55 but I agree... Everyone needs to help themselves as well as each other :y
Having driven to Paddington and back today I've run the gauntlet of foreign drivers, bus drivers just pulling out, lorries trying to bully, motorcycles, my pet hate of cyclists who think the rules of the road don't apply to them and (worst of all) black cabs!! But we arrived home in one piece as always ;D
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My feeling is that the hgv should have known the blind spot was there and did not drive in a manner which took this in to account. He goes too wide for starters and too is going too fast.
The biker didnt know what the hgv was going to do before it was too late. most bikes can only reverse by pushing with the feet and going to the right hand side would have put him in an equally dangerous situation. Which brings me back to my point about position and speed.
Interestingly, there are other furums where even the hgv drivers and instructors are having a go at the hgv. But of course, if it was a cyclist then it would have obviously been his fault and he should be locked away for for life for having the audacity to film it ::)
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My feeling is that the hgv should have known the blind spot was there and did not drive in a manner which took this in to account. He goes too wide for starters and too is going too fast.
The biker didnt know what the hgv was going to do before it was too late. most bikes can only reverse by pushing with the feet and going to the right hand side would have put him in an equally dangerous situation. Which brings me back to my point about position and speed.
Interestingly, there are other furums where even the hgv drivers and instructors are having a go at the hgv. But of course, if it was a cyclist then it would have obviously been his fault and he should be locked away for for life for having the audacity to film it ::)
I am inclined to agree that he took a very bad line... Had I been driving I would have used more of the road he turned off of to get a better line into the side road.
It's a combination of errors really, by both parties, none major but they all add up to what could have been a very nasty accident!!
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HGV driver started with a mistake and then just kept making things worse. Apart from to much speed when turning he started to turn in too early. He may have thought about putting the rear of the truck on the path and then noticed a woman with pushchair in the vicinity and changed his line, or that may be a llift axle at the rear, which he suddenly remembered was down rather than up ? Whatever the reason, once he started to turn early he then seemd to decide not to put much lock on the steering which put him so wide that much of the offside path ended up covered by his cab.He then winds on the rest of the available lock, way too late.
He was then at an angle where the front of the truck is on the wrong side off the road (unavoidable to a degree), but he probably has no idea if anything is coming towards him. If he had any sense at all, he would have stopped to find out, so that he didn't drive blindly into someone, which is exactly what he did.
Cant see that the biker did anything wrong, apart from maybe could have pulled up to a stop a bit sooner ?
At least theres one less Ducati Monster on the roads, which is a good thing. I had one briefly, but didn't like to be seen on it, as they are a tarts handbag of a bike. ;D
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Rear lift axle Steers too, so lifting it would have been of limited use... In a perfect world the road from which he was turning would haave been wide and quiet enough for him to take a better swing... Looking at it neither was an option. That he didn't touch either kerb inspite of the course he took is no mean feat imho... Biker would have been better to pull up on the kerb at the start of the clip as that lorry is clearly at a funny angle...
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Interestingly he didn't get a chance to stop sooner because he was doing his "Lifesaver" check... Slightly ironic ::)
A freak accident really... He was just in the blind spot the whole way
Bollarx! He was looking at the crumpet walking along. (Nice arse).
OT: Wagon should have not performed that turn at that speed. Biker shouldn't have been travelling at that speed whilst approaching the junction, and shouldn't have been looking at the young lass wearing black.
Who's at fault? Obviously the biker, they are all idiots! ;D
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Interestingly he didn't get a chance to stop sooner because he was doing his "Lifesaver" check... Slightly ironic ::)
A freak accident really... He was just in the blind spot the whole way
Bollarx! He was looking at the crumpet walking along. (Nice arse).
OT: Wagon should have not performed that turn at that speed. Biker shouldn't have been travelling at that speed whilst approaching the junction, and shouldn't have been looking at the young lass wearing black.
Who's at fault? Obviously the biker, they are all idiots! ;D
I was trying to judge whether he was exceeding the 20mph speed limit too :-\
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It's interesting how the video has been cropped so that a lot of useful info isn't available!
For instance, a view of the road that the HGV is turning from would probably explain the unorthodox line it's taking.
And it might help explain why the motorcyclist didn't stop when he saw he was entering a closing gap, which is what any sensible driver who wasn't speeding would do.
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It's interesting how the video has been cropped so that a lot of useful info isn't available!
For instance, a view of the road that the HGV is turning from would probably explain the unorthodox line it's taking.
And it might help explain why the motorcyclist didn't stop when he saw he was entering a closing gap, which is what any sensible driver who wasn't speeding would do.
You can see that there is a small "reservation" on the road he turns off of. As for the biker... I'm still not sure on his speed :-\ But I stand by my earlier comment... Both made mistakes
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Here's a slightly longer version...
https://youtu.be/C1aSvoIpVss
There's a bus at the stop opposite the end of the road... A skip lorry pulls wide to pass the stationary bus, followed by another bus... Assuming all the traffic to be doing this, the lorry driver was forced to make a shallow turn.
It should also clarify whether the bike was originally speeding... I leave that judgement to others, but am confident of the answer ::)
Also worth noting that the bike was technically stopped when the lorry hit it, but he couldn't have stopped in a more invisible place ::) you can't see the lorry driver from the helmet cam throughout the whole episode. And if you can't see him he can't possibly see you :-X
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Here's a slightly longer version...
https://youtu.be/C1aSvoIpVss
There's a bus at the stop opposite the end of the road... A skip lorry pulls wide to pass the stationary bus, followed by another bus... Assuming all the traffic to be doing this, the lorry driver was forced to make a shallow turn.
It should also clarify whether the bike was originally speeding... I leave that judgement to others, but am confident of the answer ::)
Hmm... Explains the poor line by the have driver and the panic/inexperience by the rider... He could easily have escaped up the wrong side of the road ;)
I'm not making comment about speed :-X
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The look of disbelief on the drivers face makes me think he makes a habit of that manoeuvre (turning into a residential street, on the wrong side of the road with no vision) and hasn't had a problem before. ::)
Cannot see that the bikes speed is relevant, kids on BMXs travel faster than that - he stopped when it was apparent that the lorry across the end of the street was turning in to it (on his side of the road).
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The look of disbelief on the drivers face makes me think he makes a habit of that manoeuvre (turning into a residential street, on the wrong side of the road with no vision) and hasn't had a problem before. ::)
Cannot see that the bikes speed is relevant, kids on BMXs travel faster than that - he stopped when it was apparent that the lorry across the end of the street was turning in to it (on his side of the road).
To be fair, had he been travelling a bit faster he probably would have taken the massive escape route that was available.
As for the lorry driver... His line was appropriate for the situation as far as we can see... If you watch his rear wheel he is close to the kerb as he passes the "Apex" and it is, as I have said several times, just a combination of small mistakes on all sides.
And those who suggest the lorry driver should have stopped and gotten out to check should try driving in London... He'd soon get lynched for stopping as he turns a corner ::)
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having watched the full video i'm very surprised at people thinking the biker is to blame here or even that it's 50/50. can a poll be added here?
i'm pretty sure what the insurance companies would decide.
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having watched the full video i'm very surprised at people thinking the biker is to blame here or even that it's 50/50. can a poll be added here?
i'm pretty sure what the insurance companies would decide.
Everybody being the people who have actually driven a lorry ::)
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Bottom line is that the truck driver was a fault, harsh though it maybe, as he came round the corner, from not the best approach, he would have been concentrating on his left mirror, and not to his front. The biker could have avoided the situation, had he read the situation better, and moved over to the other side of the road.
Having said that I do have sympathy for the truck driver, the biker could have used his horn or moved, but ultimately the trucker was driving on the wrong side of the road.............
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In order to negotiate the junction without mounting the curb... Even if he had cut the corner he would have still hit the bike (from a position perspective rather than a blindness one... As he would then have hit the bike head on and would therefore have been able to see it) :-\
A few points that the motorbicyclist would do well to note:
Highway code sections 104a, 112, 170c, 220 and 221. ::)
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Knock for knock, IMHO.
Lorry driver could have negotiated the turning better, I'm sure, but there are times when a large vehicle has to take a bit more road to manoeuvre, so that's by the by.
He surely can't have failed to notice an approaching biker as he turned in? And the biker can't have failed to notice a lorry completely blocking his path from some distance back?
Why then did the biker proceed into a part of road that was clearly about to be occupied by lorry, and the lorry press forward without thinking "where did that biker disappear to?". :-\
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Knock for knock, IMHO.
Lorry driver could have negotiated the turning better, I'm sure, but there are times when a large vehicle has to take a bit more road to manoeuvre, so that's by the by.
He surely can't have failed to notice an approaching biker as he turned in? And the biker can't have failed to notice a lorry completely blocking his path from some distance back?
Why then did the biker proceed into a part of road that was clearly about to be occupied by lorry, and the lorry press forward without thinking "where did that biker disappear to?". :-\
Was it that obvious?
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There are a few comments from non drivers in this thread.
The truck driver started to turn left and took the wider turn to avoid the pushchair, ha should have stopped and allowed the pushchair to go were it wanted to go,then completed his turn.If he had been taught correctly,pedestrians,especially with and including children have right of way at all times.
The numbty on the bike could have stopped,
The worst manoeuvre in a hgv is a left turn into a smaller road,
His road position before turning left should have been,over to the right then turn left,
As Mr wood has said both at fault,
If police had attended, the truck driver could have been prosecuted for due care and attention,and the biker given a word about reading the road.
Now I be quite. :)
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For those who have never sat in the drivers seat of a truck...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9E1_1M-qhU
Pause it at 8 seconds and you'll get a fair idea of the view down the road that the truck was turning into, namely the quarterlight being almost fully obscured by the mirror assembly... ;)
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For those who have never sat in the drivers seat of a truck...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9E1_1M-qhU
Pause it at 8 seconds and you'll get a fair idea of the view down the road that the truck was turning into, namely the quarterlight being almost fully obscured by the mirror assembly... ;)
If the driver knows that then why is he not taking the corner at a safer speed?
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Fair point well made...
But... NWS https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqmM74VBltY ... :-X
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There are a few comments from non drivers in this thread.
The truck driver started to turn left and took the wider turn to avoid the pushchair, ha should have stopped and allowed the pushchair to go were it wanted to go,then completed his turn.If he had been taught correctly,pedestrians,especially with and including children have right of way at all times.
The numbty on the bike could have stopped,
The worst manoeuvre in a hgv is a left turn into a smaller road,
His road position before turning left should have been,over to the right then turn left,
As Mr wood has said both at fault,
If police had attended, the truck driver could have been prosecuted for due care and attention,and the biker given a word about reading the road.
Now I be quite. :)
Just a slight correction (because I agree with most of this)... He didn't take the wide line to avoid the pedestrian, he took the wide line to avoid the pavement, which is completely correct ;)
Definitely knock for knock... And if the motorcycle rider tries submitting the video as evidence it will strengthen the case of the other insurers ;)
BTW, my opinions are formed both as a HGV driver and as a Motor Bicyclist ;)