Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: Tommmm on 18 August 2015, 16:58:32
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Hi. I have a 2002 2.2 diesel estate, which I love. Done 142k but runs like new. However, I've got rust over the wheel arches on both sides. I've had two bodyshop quotes - one for £500; one for £700. Both say they can't offer any guarantees the rust won't come back. Given market value of the car isn't worth probably much more than £500, does anybody know of any cheaper ways of resolving the problem. Seems a great shame to have to say goodbye to the car for reasons of rust as in every other respect it's A1. Many thanks.
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Only real answer is to cut out the rusty metal and weld in new metal, then the whole primer, paint etc process. When you work out the material and labour costs for that you can see where the quotes come from. :'(
That is unless they are thinking of charging you the same money for a quick sand down and paint which will obviously starting rusting away again immediately ::)
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The arches on my blue estate are starting to bubble, so I will grind them down, cut out the rust area, backfill with zinc, then body filler and shape up and paint and blend in. Hopefully won't see the join.
Plenty of info on youtube or forums for the diy man to have a go. I certainly would not scrap a good car for the sake of a bit of bodywork :y
(Have to go the zinc route as I can't weld)
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Thanks - I feared as much. :'( I now need to decide whether it's worth the £500 - £700 or whether I cut my losses and hunt out a clean alternative Omega for a grand or so. Thanks again. :)
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Thanks Omega Baron - I'll have a go at that. I can't weld either! As you will have worked out, I really don't want to get rid of it. Love it..... :y
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There's no need to get rid of it because of rust. Chances of finding one without rust are slim now anyways
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I have one arch that needs attention. The metal is still there so no welding in new section needed but still needs grinding back and worked on.
been quoted £220 for the one arch... Guaranteed work too..
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I have one arch that needs attention. The metal is still there so no welding in new section needed but still needs grinding back and worked on.
been quoted £220 for the one arch... Guaranteed work too..
That sounds reasonable, but then for another £130 you could have it replaced :-\
iirc, Webby paid £350 for his :-\
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I have not welded for about 40 years, then I was only learning gas and arc welding. Otherwise as HT says, I would put in new arches. I can't afford to get someone else to do it, but if financial circumstances change, I may bite the bullet. Until then, its zinc and filler.
Go on Tommmm...gen up and have a go. Its not that difficult, even if it only lasts 12 months or so, it may give you time to save up for the pucker job. :y
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I have not welded for about 40 years, then I was only learning gas and arc welding. Otherwise as HT says, I would put in new arches. I can't afford to get someone else to do it, but if financial circumstances change, I may bite the bullet. Until then, its zinc and filler.
Go on Tommmm...gen up and have a go. Its not that difficult, even if it only lasts 12 months or so, it may give you time to save up for the pucker job. :y
Flog one of you cars :D :D
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I always used to repair my own for under £20 for both sides. If it's completely shot though you can't use this method.
1. Scrape away an old flaky paint/grime/rust/muck. If you use a screwdriver then be very careful!
2. Sand it.
3. Treat with Hammerite Kurust.
4. Fill with body filler.
5. Sand until smooth with increasingly fine wet/dry paper. Use plenty of water. Refill/sand until it's perfect.
6. Prime.
7. Paint.
I know this is classed as a bodge by many people but the results can be excellent and for £20 it's worth it.
Good luck. :y
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The rear wheel arches of my old black Omega were knackered.
This is the after picture.
(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/KATE-4C672F99CA/My%20Pictures/Omega4_zpsc5e983f8.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/KATE-4C672F99CA/My%20Pictures/Omega4_zpsc5e983f8.jpg.html)
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As a quick insight for a quick job without too much hassle....after grinding down the arch face, lets say you chop out a piece the shape of a thin banana, and you are back to good metal. Get a sheet of perforated zinc and cut a shape a bit bigger than the hole. Tap the surrounding edges to slightly lower them. Screw a couple of screws into the zinc and fiddle it in behind the hole. Ask someone to hold the screws whilst you fill with body filler. Soon as it starts to set you can let go. Once hard, remove the screws, fill the holes. Once all set sand to shape, using a block. Heavy grit wet or dry, working down to a fine grit, about 1500. Then sand an area larger than the repair with 2500 grit. This flattens the lacquer ( just flatten, don't rub through it.) Keep well within this area when priming, and colouring, and lacquering. When all thoroughly dry, sand down the whole area with 2500 or 3000 wet or dry. Then polish the whole area with some compound, clean off and then polish, and hopefully you should have a decent repair.
Wet or Dry should be used wet.
This is only a quick, brief info of the basic way to do it. I've had twenty years in this game, so do know other ways, but for a newbie to 'have a go' I hope this will help in some way. I did my Estate tailgate this way 12 months ago and it still looks good.
My amazement was not my job, but how exact was the aerosol spray supplied by Halfrauds !!!!!!! Nocturno blue. Surpassed themselves ;D
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Its not a bodge Kate if it works and looks as good as yours :y
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I have not welded for about 40 years, then I was only learning gas and arc welding. Otherwise as HT says, I would put in new arches. I can't afford to get someone else to do it, but if financial circumstances change, I may bite the bullet. Until then, its zinc and filler.
Go on Tommmm...gen up and have a go. Its not that difficult, even if it only lasts 12 months or so, it may give you time to save up for the pucker job. :y
Flog one of you cars :D :D
That my friend, will never happen, even if I end up driving Isopon on wheels ;D ;D ;D
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I practiced on my Austin A30.
(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Stage2019.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Stage2019.jpg.html)
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(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Stage2021.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Stage2021.jpg.html)
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(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Day9001.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Day9001.jpg.html)
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Strewth, Kate....I had one of those, my first car............
Anyhow tommmm....here is a pic of my estate rear gate....so as you can see by Kate's pic and mine, it can be done very cheaply......
(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f272/Terbert/Blue_zpsrhjrynkx.jpg) (http://s49.photobucket.com/user/Terbert/media/Blue_zpsrhjrynkx.jpg.html)
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(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Day9015.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Day9015.jpg.html)
(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Day9018.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Day9018.jpg.html)
(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Day9020.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Day9020.jpg.html)
(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Day9021.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Day9021.jpg.html)
(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Day9026.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Day9026.jpg.html)
(http://i375.photobucket.com/albums/oo200/maisyhoneybunny/Day4b009.jpg) (http://s375.photobucket.com/user/maisyhoneybunny/media/Day4b009.jpg.html)
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How do you cut your rusty bits out ? With a dremmel or something , angle grinder is too big for some jobs :-\
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How do you cut your rusty bits out ? With a dremmel or something , angle grinder is too big for some jobs :-\
Just book your car in with terbert :y
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Had the wheel arches done on the white MV6 and the 3.2 Elite,all replaced with steel repair panels which I sourced from a company in Worcester,I can't actually cost the repairs as they were included into the full resprays. Incidently I made a start today of cleaning out the rear of the wheel arches of usual build up of dirt which causes the problem we are talking about,after a few facefulls of crap I managed to get them clean and dry and then coated them with Dynax,I also got a liberal coating of the stuff on me.....man that stuff is messy.Also did some of the rust prone areas on the underside..especially in and around the jacking points, also along the brake pipes which are getting rusty and will have to be replaced in the near future. It's never ending with these cars ::) and by the way that was only one car.....got the two others to do,more crap waiting no, doubt ::)
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How do you cut your rusty bits out ? With a dremmel or something , angle grinder is too big for some jobs :-\
Spot on buddy. Angle ginder, dremel or similar, snips, nibblers, wire cutters, drill with a cutting wheel attached....basically anything that comes to hand, mate. No hard and fast rules. Remember, we are DIY and not lucky enough to have professional tools.
And I bet you...if you take your time, you will end up with a more longer lasting repair than some bodyshops turn out at extortionate prices :y
Oh, I wish I could weld, I would have no hesitation of helping anyone put new arches on. Come on Webby....go mobile...lol ;D
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Kate, you are a miracle worker! I had an A30 too, way back.....
Oh, I copied across your picture into PhotoShop and examined it in fine detail and I defiinitely could not see the join - great job!
Ron.
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Let's put it this way.....unsightly rusty arches or having a crack at them and giving them a makeover,the only thing I found is that you need to keep an eye on the reshaping of the contours of the arch into the body line....but my repair lasted two years and if I hadn't had plans to get the arches replaced I would have had another go at them,gotta try.....you might get a pleasant surprise and acquire a new found skill at the same time :y
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I agree Ron...she has done a great job...
Sorry, off topic a bit, but I had my A30 in 1964...it was a black one. I put racing mirrors on the wings, spinners on the wheels, go-faster stripe on the front wings, and mouse ear indicators on the roof. Did a de-coke and replaced head gasket, valves etc with Austin Healey Sprite parts....only 803cc, but went like stink ;D
And yes Ken...its worth a go :y
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I agree Ron...she has done a great job...
Sorry, off topic a bit, but I had my A30 in 1964...it was a black one. I put racing mirrors on the wings, spinners on the wheels, go-faster stripe on the front wings, and mouse ear indicators on the roof. Did a de-coke and replaced head gasket, valves etc with Austin Healey Sprite parts....only 803cc, but went like stink ;D
And yes Ken...its worth a go :y
Had to re read that but yes you did write mouse ears ??? ;D ;D
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I agree Ron...she has done a great job...
Sorry, off topic a bit, but I had my A30 in 1964...it was a black one. I put racing mirrors on the wings, spinners on the wheels, go-faster stripe on the front wings, and mouse ear indicators on the roof. Did a de-coke and replaced head gasket, valves etc with Austin Healey Sprite parts....only 803cc, but went like stink ;D
And yes Ken...its worth a go :y
Had to re read that but yes you did write mouse ears ??? ;D ;D
Yes, I did.......A30's came with trafficator arms, worked from a switch on the front of the dash, which can be clearly seen in one of Kate's pics.. Well, I modernised my A30 with a set of flashing indicators, which you mounted on the roof, midway along. They gave the appearance of 'mouse ears'
Austin A30 with trafficator extended
(http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f272/Terbert/Austin_A30_zpscnbldjsz.jpg) (http://s49.photobucket.com/user/Terbert/media/Austin_A30_zpscnbldjsz.jpg.html)
Sorry Tommmm to have hijacked the post a bit :-[
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I did actually THINK about writing "not a bad job for a woman", but then, even as a joke, I would have had to go and hide in the next cave to that hermit that lives in the cliffs at Swanage!
Ron.
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To which hermit do you refer....I'll look him up in a couple of weeks ;D
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IF he is still alive and kicking, he lives in a cave under ballard Down; the skippers of the Old Harry boat trips always wave to him, just to check that he is ok.
Ron.
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Knock me down with a feather. I have been going down there for 30 years, never knew that, or had any commentary on the boats about him. I'll make enquiries in September, and report back.
Once again...sorry Tommmm for off topic :-[
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And I thought you meant Sir Tigger... ::)
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Am I the only one thinking of this as the end reslit ?
(http://file008a.bebo.com/large/2006/05/31/01/748544939a963802170b826680941l.jpg)
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;D ;D ;D
The only snag sometimes is you take every step to make the prep perfect then a bloody
fly comes along and ruins the topcoat ::)
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Hi. I have a 2002 2.2 diesel estate, which I love. Done 142k but runs like new. However, I've got rust over the wheel arches on both sides. I've had two bodyshop quotes - one for £500; one for £700. Both say they can't offer any guarantees the rust won't come back. Given market value of the car isn't worth probably much more than £500, does anybody know of any cheaper ways of resolving the problem. Seems a great shame to have to say goodbye to the car for reasons of rust as in every other respect it's A1. Many thanks.
It's basic bangernomics.
Option 1). You've got a car which is a known quantity and is worth £500 that requires £1K worth of tarting up. After the tarting up, it'll be worth what? £1K tops?
Option 2) .You buy a new (pre-owned) car for £??? which is an unknown quantity and may require a full service immediately - oils, filters, plugs, hbv, timing belt, water pump etc, plus it'll have rust hiding somewhere as well.
I had that dilemma recently - Failed the MOT on sill rot - ended up spending £2K+ for 4 new doors, 2 complete sills, rear bumper and 2 rear wheel arches. That's 9 panels, so about £200 per panel seems the going rate. If I can get 5 years use out of the car then £400 per year for a large presentable daily driver seems reasonable to me. My tame bodyshop man recons the Omegas are much better rust wise than Carltons & Senators - the inner sills were perfect on my car, as were the inner wheel arches. Most Carltons and Senators are air holes held together by rust in comparison.
So - if you're otherwise happy with your current car - good engine and drive train, its a good colour (like graphite mica :D), then spending the money may be worth it.
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I didnt read through most of this thread as the spam was getting daft TBH so I shall skip the answers and hand you what I did to mine...
I cut out the rear arches that had rusted away and replaced with new metal cut to shape with a Dremel and heavy duty cutting discs.... replaced with metal cut to shape MIG welded, then blended with filler and repainted both arches.... one turned out OK the other turned out passable... so-far no rust is starting to poke out as yet, but only time will tell if it has been tackled or not...
I did enquire about replaceing both rear arches with repair panels but the cost of them was silly compared to how much the car is worth in real terms....
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Have to try that on mine rear arches bubbling by rear bumper have done my first car a Opel Manta B series with the galvanised wire and filler. MOT and the examiner said you filled those seals but could not prove it as his magnet stuck to the wire under the filler. Job lasted 2 years until I sold the car. Got a dremel what sort of discs for chopping out the bad metal?
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I will have to get mine sorted before winter sets in too :)
As a side note, mate was looking at the front, around the passenger side, chassis, and noticed it was rusty, from the over flow pipe from the scuttle, :(
sor
sory for the hijack
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Replacement wheel arches from http://carz2.co.uk/...........cant remember how much
Cost of fitting both and painting was just under £400 from a local Northampton place.
:y
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Classic Omega disease* - most of them get it, including both of mine. It's on the list to get done, once thee mechanical bits are up to scratch...
*a close relative of Dennis disease...
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What's the best filler to achieve a reasonable job?
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Not a cure for rusty arches, but if the decision is made to change a rusty car, and a mint low mileage one is found with no rust in the rear arches (not many of those about now, I admit, but...), then the following may be of help. I have done it on all my Omegas since I bought my first one in 2004, and not one of my current ones (I have five at present 😀) including the first one I bought in 2004 have rusty arches... I first did this experimenting with ways to stop the wheelarch rust on Vauxhall Cavaliers many years ago, as they suffered in the same way as the Omega.....
Remove all interior trim from the boot /tailgate area, including fuel cap motor, and the radio electric gubbins in the rear n/s corner on the Elite estate, so that you can gain as much access as possible to the inner arches. Rig up a small light so that it can pass through the upper holes around the wheelarch so you see where you are aiming. Use a thinish rust proofing compound such as Supertrol (very good at penetrating welded seams) or a Bilt Hamber product with a long flexible lance. Use a small hand held garden spray for the Supertrol product initially set on a jet rather than a fan spray (you will need the accuracy and distance of the jet to get right to the front of the wheelarch), but make sure you fully extract each rear seat belt before starting this and secure with a peg, or you will end up with the fluid all over the exposed part of the seat belt! Make sure the lance is correctly in the area around the lower wheelarch, and the start applying. Do it on a warm day, and you should see the fluid eventually start seeping from areas you never imagined, but at least you can see where it's gone and that it's going to protect your wheel arches from the dreaded tinworm. It won't stop rust that's already in there - it may slow it a little, but remember that if you plan on welding any already rusty areas, then the compound will ignite very easily! I would only recommend this for known immaculate arches, or ones that have been repaired properly with new metal.
I have no connection to these products; they are ones I've used and have liked. Waxoyl is ok, but you have to thin it right down with white spirit for it to seep and penetrate, otherwise it bridges seams.
Like I say, I have done it on all mine - they all stand out all year round, and none have got any rust whatsoever in the arches. Well worth half a days work one sunny afternoon, I would argue!
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Bilt Hamber is that the 50 compound?
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Yes, Dynax S-50.
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Forgot to include in the above......you can also gain access to the front areas of the rear inner wheelarch on a saloon by removing the small side bolster either side of the rear seat upright which reveals ideal holes to inject the rust proofing. With the bolster removed, you can also remove the seatbelt / reel and tie it up out of the way so that it doesn't get contaminated and it also provides another access hole.
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cheers :y