Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: Andy A on 10 October 2016, 11:28:02
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Over the last few months the A/C has been getting warmer and now there is no cold air at all.
I read somewhere that if the A/C compressors clutch engages then there is still refrigerant in the system. Is this correct?
The compressors clutch is engaging.
The condenser fins are all clear and the fan is working fine.
Can refrigerant degrade to the point of not cooling?
Thanks
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The compressor wil engage with quite low pressure and poor cooling. Eventually if the refrigerant is escaping the pressure will fall to a point where it won't engage at all.
Could be a fault with the internal mixer flaps etc - does the cold refrigerant pipe under the bonnet get really cold?
Best way to be sure is to get it vacuumed out and refilled - that will tell you how much was left and you will know it is full. Don't be surprised if it passes a vacuum test but them gradually escapes again though, you really need a pressure test to be sure.
Common escape point on the Omega are condenser, HP and LP valves and compressor - in that order in my experience. On one of mine I had all 3!
Steve
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The compressor wil engage with quite low pressure and poor cooling. Eventually if the refrigerant is escaping the pressure will fall to a point where it won't engage at all.
Could be a fault with the internal mixer flaps etc - does the cold refrigerant pipe under the bonnet get really cold?
Best way to be sure is to get it vacuumed out and refilled - that will tell you how much was left and you will know it is full. Don't be surprised if it passes a vacuum test but them gradually escapes again though, you really need a pressure test to be sure.
Common escape point on the Omega are condenser, HP and LP valves and compressor - in that order in my experience. On one of mine I had all 3!
Steve
Steve, checked the refrigerant pipe under the bonnet and both are the same temp and not cold. Is the one with the two valves in supposed to be the cold one (LP)?
Andy
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There is a guide :)
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The compressor wil engage with quite low pressure and poor cooling. Eventually if the refrigerant is escaping the pressure will fall to a point where it won't engage at all.
Could be a fault with the internal mixer flaps etc - does the cold refrigerant pipe under the bonnet get really cold?
Best way to be sure is to get it vacuumed out and refilled - that will tell you how much was left and you will know it is full. Don't be surprised if it passes a vacuum test but them gradually escapes again though, you really need a pressure test to be sure.
Common escape point on the Omega are condenser, HP and LP valves and compressor - in that order in my experience. On one of mine I had all 3!
Steve
Steve, checked the refrigerant pipe under the bonnet and both are the same temp and not cold. Is the one with the two valves in supposed to be the cold one (LP)?
Andy
I can't remember which is which, but if they are same temperature there is a problem with the system - one should be hot and one very cold.
I would see if you can get it vacuumed out, pressure tested etc
Steve
-
The compressor wil engage with quite low pressure and poor cooling. Eventually if the refrigerant is escaping the pressure will fall to a point where it won't engage at all.
Could be a fault with the internal mixer flaps etc - does the cold refrigerant pipe under the bonnet get really cold?
Best way to be sure is to get it vacuumed out and refilled - that will tell you how much was left and you will know it is full. Don't be surprised if it passes a vacuum test but them gradually escapes again though, you really need a pressure test to be sure.
Common escape point on the Omega are condenser, HP and LP valves and compressor - in that order in my experience. On one of mine I had all 3!
Steve
Steve, checked the refrigerant pipe under the bonnet and both are the same temp and not cold. Is the one with the two valves in supposed to be the cold one (LP)?
Andy
I can't remember which is which, but if they are same temperature there is a problem with the system - one should be hot and one very cold.
I would see if you can get it vacuumed out, pressure tested etc
Steve
Both pipes are the same temperature. Do you know if the machines that garages use put die in and are they also able to do the pressure test? Or do I have to find an air con specialist?
I have never had a cars air con re-gassed before so I don't know what to expect?
Thanks
-
The compressor wil engage with quite low pressure and poor cooling. Eventually if the refrigerant is escaping the pressure will fall to a point where it won't engage at all.
Could be a fault with the internal mixer flaps etc - does the cold refrigerant pipe under the bonnet get really cold?
Best way to be sure is to get it vacuumed out and refilled - that will tell you how much was left and you will know it is full. Don't be surprised if it passes a vacuum test but them gradually escapes again though, you really need a pressure test to be sure.
Common escape point on the Omega are condenser, HP and LP valves and compressor - in that order in my experience. On one of mine I had all 3!
Steve
Steve, checked the refrigerant pipe under the bonnet and both are the same temp and not cold. Is the one with the two valves in supposed to be the cold one (LP)?
Andy
I can't remember which is which, but if they are same temperature there is a problem with the system - one should be hot and one very cold.
I would see if you can get it vacuumed out, pressure tested etc
Steve
Both pipes are the same temperature. Do you know if the machines that garages use put die in and are they also able to do the pressure test? Or do I have to find an air con specialist?
I have never had a cars air con re-gassed before so I don't know what to expect?
Thanks
The simple plug in machines will do a vacuum test only which if you have a slow escape it will likely pass. You want it on the machine, vacuumed out, disconnect the machine, pressurise the system and monitor the pressure over a couple of hours to be sure. Then proceed with the refill.
Steve
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Mobile aircon specialist will be marginally more expensive than a fast fit place, but a) will come to you, and b) do a more thorough job :y
Expect to pay £50-70 :y
Be prudent to get new valves from Vauxhall, be less than a tenner for both...
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Is there any way I can add some dye into the system myself to see if there is a leak first?
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Good news my local garage that I trust has just started to offer a Free Air Conditioning Check to see if the air con is running efficiently. They also offer a free nitrogen pressure test to check for leaks in the system. They charge £49 for a re-gas.
I have a couple of questions.
If the system is opened to work on will the Dryer have to be replaced with new?
If yes does it have to be a genuine one or will a third party one be OK?
I will get two VX valves before I take the car up there.
Thanks
-
Good news my local garage that I trust has just started to offer a Free Air Conditioning Check to see if the air con is running efficiently. They also offer a free nitrogen pressure test to check for leaks in the system. They charge £49 for a re-gas.
I have a couple of questions.
If the system is opened to work on will the Dryer have to be replaced with new? - No, but I suspect you will end up with a new condenser and so dryer anyway.
If yes does it have to be a genuine one or will a third party one be OK? - comes with the condenser - GM don't make it plenty available for approx £100.
I will get two VX valves before I take the car up there.
Good idea - just change those while the system is empty.
Thanks
-
Good news my local garage that I trust has just started to offer a Free Air Conditioning Check to see if the air con is running efficiently. They also offer a free nitrogen pressure test to check for leaks in the system. They charge £49 for a re-gas.
I have a couple of questions.
If the system is opened to work on will the Dryer have to be replaced with new? - No, but I suspect you will end up with a new condenser and so dryer anyway.
If yes does it have to be a genuine one or will a third party one be OK? - comes with the condenser - GM don't make it plenty available for approx £100.
I will get two VX valves before I take the car up there.
Good idea - just change those while the system is empty.
Thanks
Thanks Steve.
-
Good news my local garage that I trust has just started to offer a Free Air Conditioning Check to see if the air con is running efficiently. They also offer a free nitrogen pressure test to check for leaks in the system. They charge £49 for a re-gas.
I have a couple of questions.
If the system is opened to work on will the Dryer have to be replaced with new?
If yes does it have to be a genuine one or will a third party one be OK?
I will get two VX valves before I take the car up there.
Thanks
I didn't replace the valves come the end because there was still gas in the system.
I took the car in for the free air con check and the next thing I new it came back to me already re-gassed. No printout and no nitrogen pressure test done.
I had to ask how much refrigerant was left in the system and it was about 100g. I'm sure he didn't do a pressure test because he had the same 2 pipes from one machine to the air con connected from start to Finnish.
I ask how much refrigerant did it take and he said 900g.
I've never had an air con re-gassed before. For what I have read I should have had a printout or does this depend on the garage?
Its running ice cold now.
Thanks
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But where has the 800g of gas gone?
When was it last checked and gassed?
-
Good news my local garage that I trust has just started to offer a Free Air Conditioning Check to see if the air con is running efficiently. They also offer a free nitrogen pressure test to check for leaks in the system. They charge £49 for a re-gas.
I have a couple of questions.
If the system is opened to work on will the Dryer have to be replaced with new?
If yes does it have to be a genuine one or will a third party one be OK?
I will get two VX valves before I take the car up there.
Thanks
I didn't replace the valves come the end because there was still gas in the system.
I took the car in for the free air con check and the next thing I new it came back to me already re-gassed. No printout and no nitrogen pressure test done.
I had to ask how much refrigerant was left in the system and it was about 100g. I'm sure he didn't do a pressure test because he had the same 2 pipes from one machine to the air con connected from start to Finnish.
I ask how much refrigerant did it take and he said 900g.
I've never had an air con re-gassed before. For what I have read I should have had a printout or does this depend on the garage?
Its running ice cold now.
Thanks
That's the standard 'fast fit machine' it may have done a vacuum test, but you wont know without the print out and you really needed a pressure test. With that much refrigerant gone it will almost certainly escape again - how long it takes will give you an idea of where its getting out.
Steve
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But where has the 800g of gas gone?
When was it last checked and gassed?
Last filled 4/8/10 according to a sticker. I've had the car for about 3 years and it was my sons friend who had it re-gassed in 20010.
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100g per year can be considered 'normal' if on the high side...
Don't forget most of the aircon system is made from aluminium, so not unreasonable for a 13 year old condenser to become slightly porous ;)
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Good news my local garage that I trust has just started to offer a Free Air Conditioning Check to see if the air con is running efficiently. They also offer a free nitrogen pressure test to check for leaks in the system. They charge £49 for a re-gas.
I have a couple of questions.
If the system is opened to work on will the Dryer have to be replaced with new?
If yes does it have to be a genuine one or will a third party one be OK?
I will get two VX valves before I take the car up there.
Thanks
I didn't replace the valves come the end because there was still gas in the system.
I took the car in for the free air con check and the next thing I new it came back to me already re-gassed. No printout and no nitrogen pressure test done.
I had to ask how much refrigerant was left in the system and it was about 100g. I'm sure he didn't do a pressure test because he had the same 2 pipes from one machine to the air con connected from start to Finnish.
I ask how much refrigerant did it take and he said 900g.
I've never had an air con re-gassed before. For what I have read I should have had a printout or does this depend on the garage?
Its running ice cold now.
Thanks
That's the standard 'fast fit machine' it may have done a vacuum test, but you wont know without the print out and you really needed a pressure test. With that much refrigerant gone it will almost certainly escape again - how long it takes will give you an idea of where its getting out.
Steve
They did put a UV dye in it and said being that I am concerned about it I could go back in a couple of weeks and they will put an UV light on it to see if it has leaked.
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100g per year can be considered 'normal' if on the high side...
Don't forget most of the aircon system is made from aluminium, so not unreasonable for a 13 year old condenser to become slightly porous ;)
Would that still show up with a UV light.
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Yes if there's dye in it ;)
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100g per year can be considered 'normal' if on the high side...
Don't forget most of the aircon system is made from aluminium, so not unreasonable for a 13 year old condenser to become slightly porous ;)
Would that still show up with a UV light.
No as the dye is generally to large a molecule to get through any porosity
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Yes if there's dye in it ;) Apparently not then :-\
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100g per year can be considered 'normal' if on the high side...
Don't forget most of the aircon system is made from aluminium, so not unreasonable for a 13 year old condenser to become slightly porous ;)
Would that still show up with a UV light.
No as the dye is generally to large a molecule to get through any porosity
Would they be able to find that type of leak with a sniffer device and or a pressure test?
Thanks