Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Scatmancraig on 13 December 2016, 08:09:24
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Morning All,
My tired Omega is coming to the end of its current MOT, and I'm thinking of getting a possible replacement. For reasons unknown, I seem to be drawn towards the Vauxhall Signum, particularly in 3.0 V6 CDTi flavour.
Does anyone have any experience of these cars? Not sure whether to go for manual or auto. There seems to be plenty about with varying prices. I'm also not sure whether to go for the 3.0 diesel, or the 1.9 or 2.2 diesels? The 3.0 seems to be a massive engine for what is effectively a Vectra hatchback, so I'm guessing it ought to go pretty well, but does that particulary engine have any vices that I should be aware of?
My other option is to try and find a really tidy 2.5TD Omega, as late a model as possible and this time manual not auto. Whilst I love the comfort and smoothness of the auto, the difference in economy between round town and the open road is ridiculous. I can get nearly 45mpg on a run, half that around town. I've never known a car with such a big difference, I used to get more out of a 3.0 Senator!!
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I personally find them extremely ugly! Most people think it's an astra because it looks just like a stretched hatchback. Because it is. Before I would buy a signum I would just buy the equivalent vectra estate. They are basically the same car. But the vectra just looks better.
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The good thing about the Signum is that nobody takes a blind bit of notice of them.
I find mine very roomy and comfortable. The rear seats fold completely flat so the car makes a pretty good 'load lugger'
As already said, the Signum is a Vectra in a different frock, and I personally think it is far better looking than the Vectra......and far more rare.
I would go for petrol every time. :y The engine and fuel from a canal boat should not be put in a car.
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It's definitely a personal matter. I think the signum looks like a fat golf. It seems a bit undecided in what it wants to be. A hatchback or an estate. It's one of those odd designs. But it's definitely more rare, and probably for the same reason.
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Ah, Craig, you've not had a smooth run in that Omega of yours, have you? I would imagine you'd never be able to stomach is, given front wheel drive, but as with anythign, have a drive, see how you like it.
The mpg will be a massive difference, I'm sure. The Omega approaching the end of its life, versus the Vectra/Signum's all-new platform it really is the next generation on... however, it's a totally different 'feel' of car.
To FL Omega owners, the interior is quite familar, but you and I stuck in the 90s it will feel like a car of the future!
As above, just have a play, see how you get on, Signums are rare, and getting rarer, but spares are plentiful. :)
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The SAAB 9-5 was also available with the Isuzu V6 Diesel.
There are reports, on the saab forums, of inadequate cooling (in the SAAB) leading to the liners dropping and causing head gasket failure. They also note that the engine seems to be OK in the Signum and surmise that the cooling is OK in the Signum.
My local VX dealer reckons that it is easier to get parts for an Omega than it is for a Signum, despite the Omega having been out of production for over 10 years
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The SAAB 9-5 was also available with the Isuzu V6 Diesel.
There are reports, on the saab forums, of inadequate cooling (in the SAAB) leading to the liners dropping and causing head gasket failure. They also note that the engine seems to be OK in the Signum and surmise that the cooling is OK in the Signum.
My local VX dealer reckons that it is easier to get parts for an Omega than it is for a Signum, despite the Omega having been out of production for over 10 years
That surely can only be relevant to body panels and trim as the rest of the running gear is common to loads of the Marque.
It is a more upmarket Vectra C estate at the end of the day
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The SAAB 9-5 was also available with the Isuzu V6 Diesel.
There are reports, on the saab forums, of inadequate cooling (in the SAAB) leading to the liners dropping and causing head gasket failure. They also note that the engine seems to be OK in the Signum and surmise that the cooling is OK in the Signum.
My local VX dealer reckons that it is easier to get parts for an Omega than it is for a Signum, despite the Omega having been out of production for over 10 years
That surely can only be relevant to body panels and trim as the rest of the running gear is common to loads of the Marque.
It is a more upmarket Vectra C estate at the end of the day
That is what I thought too :-\ but he didn't go into detail, maybe the Signum specific parts (fridge anybody?) are the bits that drop off first ::)
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It is a more upmarket Vectra C estate at the end of the day
I have heard this before and I know it was kind of opel's intention. But I just can't see it. You have to look very hard not to confuse it with an astra. Actually when they first came out and I started seeing the first ones on the streets, I thought they were one of the versions of the astra. I see nothing upmarket in it from the outside.
I think the Vectra C GTS looks much better if what you want is a big hatchback of sorts. And if you need the longer wheelbase, then the estate is much more practical.
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There is nothing nice to say about the Vectra-C/Signum. What were GM thinking :(
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There is nothing nice to say about the Vectra-C/Signum. What were GM thinking :(
I do know that a Signum Elite is to a lower specification than an Omega Elite. It has some but not all of the toys.
My car is also properly quick(ish) ::) ;)
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The SAAB 9-5 was also available with the Isuzu V6 Diesel.
There are reports, on the saab forums, of inadequate cooling (in the SAAB) leading to the liners dropping and causing head gasket failure. They also note that the engine seems to be OK in the Signum and surmise that the cooling is OK in the Signum.
My local VX dealer reckons that it is easier to get parts for an Omega than it is for a Signum, despite the Omega having been out of production for over 10 years
That surely can only be relevant to body panels and trim as the rest of the running gear is common to loads of the Marque.
It is a more upmarket Vectra C estate at the end of the day
it is BUT the signum drives a little better (if that is possible) stay away from the 2.2 direct petrol
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There is nothing nice to say about the Vectra-C/Signum. What were GM thinking :(
I do know that a Signum Elite is to a lower specification than an Omega Elite. It has some but not all of the toys.
My car is also properly quick(ish) ::) ;)
The earlier '53-'05 cars had much better options lists, including memory front seats and heated rears along with the same NCDC 2013/15 with Bose as the Omega ;)
But agree that if you don't need an Omega sized boot, then the Signed is the best Vectra, otherwise get the estate. And as far as engines go, the 1.8 petrol is a good all-rounder if you don't tear about.
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The SAAB 9-5 was also available with the Isuzu V6 Diesel.
There are reports, on the saab forums, of inadequate cooling (in the SAAB) leading to the liners dropping and causing head gasket failure. They also note that the engine seems to be OK in the Signum and surmise that the cooling is OK in the Signum.
My local VX dealer reckons that it is easier to get parts for an Omega than it is for a Signum, despite the Omega having been out of production for over 10 years
That surely can only be relevant to body panels and trim as the rest of the running gear is common to loads of the Marque.
It is a more upmarket Vectra C estate at the end of the day
it is BUT the signum drives a little better (if that is possible) stay away from the 2.2 direct petrol
:-X
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The SAAB 9-5 was also available with the Isuzu V6 Diesel.
There are reports, on the saab forums, of inadequate cooling (in the SAAB) leading to the liners dropping and causing head gasket failure. They also note that the engine seems to be OK in the Signum and surmise that the cooling is OK in the Signum.
My local VX dealer reckons that it is easier to get parts for an Omega than it is for a Signum, despite the Omega having been out of production for over 10 years
That surely can only be relevant to body panels and trim as the rest of the running gear is common to loads of the Marque.
It is a more upmarket Vectra C estate at the end of the day
it is BUT the signum drives a little better (if that is possible) stay away from the 2.2 direct petrol
:-X
Did they release one as the price of those fuel pumps could write a car off
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Some interest comments above, thank you!
I quite like the Signum styling, especially the V6 diesel with twin exhaust. Never driven one though.
To be honest, I just want a big diesel auto than does more to the gallon than the Omega does. My old Beemer 530d used to get approx 30mpg around town, the Omega struggles to do much more than 20! My budget is around £1200, seems to be a fair bit to choose from for that amount.
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My car is also properly quick(ish) ::) ;)
To be honest, the FWD negates any advantages the Signum may have over the Omega there. At least in my opinion.
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That fact that the Signum is FWD is probably the only thing that puts me off. I could also look at having another 530d, or equivelant Mercedes, but I'll probably end up with an older car. For one in my life I want to try and get something that is relatively (for me) modern. I think the oldest Signum's are on a 53 plate aren't they? It would certainly be a novelty in getting a car that has the 'new' registration layout (my previous newest cars have been W-plate).
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Whats soo bad with fwd??
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Whats soo bad with fwd??
This forum, like many other internet hangouts will tell you that FWD (or Wrong Wheel Drive (WWD)) is the worst thing to happen to the automotive world since the introduction of the speed limit.
Personally I don't have anything against WWD, prior to the Omega I ran a couple of Saab 9-5 aeros and found them to be excellent cars. I'm now running what is supposed to be one of the better handling every-day RWD cars on sale atm (BMW M140i). In all honesty, while I can definitely tell which wheels are the driven ones, I don't see any real advantage day-to-day.
I thought I'd get this in before the avalanche of posts talking about "corrupting the driving experience" "torque steer" turn up ;D
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Whats soo bad with fwd??
For everyday use? Nothing.
For the 14.5 minutes a year that you use 100% of the performance? It's unacceptable.
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:y
From a technical / chassis engineer perspective (which I am not :D ) a rather interesting 'case study' appeared 'tother week visually explaining the difference between FWD & RWD.
Sat in a sloped car park, with a gravel / 'loose surface' The Omega was parked pointing downhill. Upon attempting to reverse uphill Miss DBG put on a little too many revs and the back tyres let go momentarily.
In this instance the car was behaving as a FWD car would in forward travel.
In real terms, of course, we might as well make cars where only the left-hand front and rear wheel is driven, and most people wouldn't notice for most of the time. Nevertheless, the above is an (imperfect) example, you can see in the real world. :)
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Whats soo bad with fwd??
It's one of those things. If you have to ask, it means the answer FOR YOU would be nothing. ;)
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Good answer :y
Also, small point - the chap who posed that question (citroenguy) is presumably is a guy who likes citroens... and they pretty much invented FWD (certainly they used it 20 years before the Mini which 'pioneered' it) Joking aside, they've made some of the most important cars in history, design-wise...
actually when was citroen's last rear-wheel drive car?? Every Citroen that comes to mind is FWD, Traction Avant, DS19, SM, 2CV, GS, XM) same opinion that someone coming from the BLMC Mini/Maxi/1100 etc stable would be used to fwd cars. :)
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Sat in a sloped car park, with a gravel / 'loose surface' The Omega was parked pointing downhill. Upon attempting to reverse uphill Miss DBG put on a little too many revs and the back tyres let go momentarily.
In this instance the car was behaving as a FWD car would in forward travel.
The only difference being that the FWD car has the weight of the engine and box over the driven wheels which would aid traction. Unless of course in your example you had you done something to upset Ms DBG and she'd locked you in the boot :D. In which case the analogy is perfect! :y
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You guessed. Listen, our personal problem are are own, ok?!?!? :D ;)
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Whats soo bad with fwd??
To have anything with even modest power needs the suspension to be rock hard. That's my biggest gripe.
Then when you do press on a bit, you quickly learn that a lot of power through the same wheels used for turning is an awful compromise.
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Paddy Hopkirk made it work OK. ::)
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And Erik Carlsson-when he wasn't upside down that is :D ;D
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My Signum comes with 250 BHP and 260 lb ft of torque.
Unsurprisingly it can get a little wayward, especially in the wet.
I get around the problem by always driving with a large fat man strapped to the bonnet. :)
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My Signum comes with 250 BHP and 260 lb ft of torque.
Unsurprisingly it can get a little wayward, especially in the wet.
I get around the problem by always driving with a large fat man strapped to the bonnet. :)
With flattery like that it's no wonder you've become adept at dodging the odd thrown laptop! ;)
On a more serious note, genuinely how do you find it? I never found the 9-5's to be that bad (up to about 290bhp and 300ft lbs). But then again they were carrying enough weight to crease the tarmac! They were also very tyre dependent.
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My Signum comes with 250 BHP and 260 lb ft of torque.
Unsurprisingly it can get a little wayward, especially in the wet.
I get around the problem by always driving with a large fat man strapped to the bonnet. :)
With flattery like that it's no wonder you've become adept at dodging the odd thrown laptop! ;)
On a more serious note, genuinely how do you find it? I never found the 9-5's to be that bad (up to about 290bhp and 300ft lbs). But then again they were carrying enough weight to crease the tarmac! They were also very tyre dependent.
In give and take everyday driving it is fine.
The traction control and ESP can't be turned off........which I think it can on the Vectra 2.8 VXR.
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I had the 3.0cdti and loved it,bear in mind though that it has less torque than the manual version,apparenly the 5 speed auto couldn't cope with more,if it could tow my caravan(weight wise,not power) I would still have it :y
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I had the 3.0cdti and loved it,bear in mind though that it has less torque than the manual version,apparenly the 5 speed auto couldn't cope with more,if it could tow my caravan(weight wise,not power) I would still have it :y
Torque of the devil. :y :y :y But sadly a car that runs on Lucifers seminal fluid. :-\ :-\ :-\
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I had the 3.0cdti and loved it,bear in mind though that it has less torque than the manual version,apparenly the 5 speed auto couldn't cope with more,if it could tow my caravan(weight wise,not power) I would still have it :y
Torque of the devil. :y :y :y But sadly a car that runs on Lucifers seminal fluid. :-\ :-\ :-\
That maybe, but my 2.0 TDi has just as much torque as your 2.8 V6 Turbo :P
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I had the 3.0cdti and loved it,bear in mind though that it has less torque than the manual version,apparenly the 5 speed auto couldn't cope with more,if it could tow my caravan(weight wise,not power) I would still have it :y
Torque of the devil. :y :y :y But sadly a car that runs on Lucifers seminal fluid. :-\ :-\ :-\
That maybe, but my 2.0 TDi has just as much torque as your 2.8 V6 Turbo :P
I like your car. Good looking and well made. A good choice. :y
It's just the agricultural lump under the bonnet where it loses marks.
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I had the 3.0cdti and loved it,bear in mind though that it has less torque than the manual version,apparenly the 5 speed auto couldn't cope with more,if it could tow my caravan(weight wise,not power) I would still have it :y
Torque of the devil. :y :y :y But sadly a car that runs on Lucifers seminal fluid. :-\ :-\ :-\
That maybe, but my 2.0 TDi has just as much torque as your 2.8 V6 Turbo :P
I like your car. Good looking and well made. A good choice. :y
It's just the agricultural lump under the bonnet where it loses marks.
Thanks :)
Around town, perhaps, but on a run you really could not tell. Time and time again I'm surprised how quick it is from 40/50mph up to 70/80 mph.
Trouble is petrol examples are rare, for any car these days. The next phase is a new motor for MrsT, perhaps a Zafira Tourer or Ford S-Max. She wants an automatic, not manual. I know it must be petrol as it will only do town work 70% of the time, looking at AutoTrader you can go from over 1000+ Zafira Tourers available, but Petrol & Auto? About 30 in the entire country :(
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Before buying the XFR I 'toyed' with the idea of a Passat R36.
3.6 litres......300 BHP...4 wheel drive. A real Q-car :y....oh, and it runs on petrol. :y
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My wife had a Signum from 2007 to 2012 covering 80000 miles.
The problem with manuals was the dual mass flywheel and we had 3 under warranty. The other issue was the springs - a common fault on Signum/ Vectra. Other than that a really solid, spacious vehicle. We replaced it with an Insignia Tourer Elite which which has been a more robust vehicle but is only doing half the miles the Signum had to do
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Before buying the XFR I 'toyed' with the idea of a Passat R36.
3.6 litres......300 BHP...4 wheel drive. A real Q-car :y....oh, and it runs on petrol. :y
And sounds like a really rough diesel thanks to VWs emission cheating ultrahigh pressure injectors :D
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Before buying the XFR I 'toyed' with the idea of a Passat R36.
3.6 litres......300 BHP...4 wheel drive. A real Q-car :y....oh, and it runs on petrol. :y
But of a rare old beast are they not? I've seen a few Superbs pop up with that engine/box combo, don't think they made the same HBO as the Passat though. Probably the VAG pecking order at work :-\. I like them, but couldn't pay 5 figures for (that shape) superb. The interior is a bit cheap and nasty looking.
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Before buying the XFR I 'toyed' with the idea of a Passat R36.
3.6 litres......300 BHP...4 wheel drive. A real Q-car :y....oh, and it runs on petrol. :y
But of a rare old beast are they not? I've seen a few Superbs pop up with that engine/box combo, don't think they made the same HBO as the Passat though. Probably the VAG pecking order at work :-\. I like them, but couldn't pay 5 figures for (that shape) superb. The interior is a bit cheap and nasty looking.
But the latest generation Superb III seems to finally have caught with the VW counterparts. It seems VW is really interested in making Skoda a more upmarket brand.
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Couldn't agree more!
I've been hoping some mug buys an L&K 280 estate so that I can then buy it at 3yrs old once it's lost all its value ;).
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Before buying the XFR I 'toyed' with the idea of a Passat R36.
3.6 litres......300 BHP...4 wheel drive. A real Q-car :y....oh, and it runs on petrol. :y
But of a rare old beast are they not? I've seen a few Superbs pop up with that engine/box combo, don't think they made the same HBO as the Passat though. Probably the VAG pecking order at work :-\. I like them, but couldn't pay 5 figures for (that shape) superb. The interior is a bit cheap and nasty looking.
I certainly haven't seen many. :y
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Just going back to the Signum V6 CDTi...
Is the auto reliable? Or is it the same story as the AR25 in the Omega? I gather earlier Signum V6 diesels have a different autobox to the later ones.
And from the earlier comments, FWD is ok for me these days, after 3 driving bans I've steadied myself down a lot lately, can't remember even trying to drift the Omega in the 6 months I've had it. 5 years ago, every roundabout would have been an opportunity for fun!! Reliability and comfort, with a bit of poke for the odd occasions when I can go fast. I like 6 pot diesels as they sound so much nicer than 4-cylinder ones.
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Just going back to the Signum V6 CDTi...
Is the auto reliable? Or is it the same story as the AR25 in the Omega? I gather earlier Signum V6 diesels have a different autobox to the later ones.
And from the earlier comments, FWD is ok for me these days, after 3 driving bans I've steadied myself down a lot lately, can't remember even trying to drift the Omega in the 6 months I've had it. 5 years ago, every roundabout would have been an opportunity for fun!! Reliability and comfort, with a bit of poke for the odd occasions when I can go fast. I like 6 pot diesels as they sound so much nicer than 4-cylinder ones.
No problem with the auto on my car. still works as it should after 81000 miles. ZF 6 speed auto.
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Just going back to the Signum V6 CDTi...
Is the auto reliable? Or is it the same story as the AR25 in the Omega? I gather earlier Signum V6 diesels have a different autobox to the later ones.
And from the earlier comments, FWD is ok for me these days, after 3 driving bans I've steadied myself down a lot lately, can't remember even trying to drift the Omega in the 6 months I've had it. 5 years ago, every roundabout would have been an opportunity for fun!! Reliability and comfort, with a bit of poke for the odd occasions when I can go fast. I like 6 pot diesels as they sound so much nicer than 4-cylinder ones.
Should you actually be driving on public roads?
Even a 1.8 120 bhp Vectra C estate will lift off oversteer on demand...
And to quote Nick W, " I have had a drink and am being charitable... "
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After advice from various sources, it seems I might be better going for a 1.9 CDTi rather than the 3.0. Although I'm also liking the look of Volvos with 2.4 diesel.
I hate having so much choice!!
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Around town, perhaps, but on a run you really could not tell. Time and time again I'm surprised how quick it is from 40/50mph up to 70/80 mph.
Yes, you can tell by a country mile. Its not that its slow - though the VAG 2.0TDi is a troubled lump for power, constrained by emissions issues, hence most use adblu, many have poor power outputs (to avoid adblu), and that's even with cheating the emissions :P - its the power delivery. Even the flat torque of an Omega v6 is more exhilarating than sub 300bhp diesels, though not necessarily quicker.
I certainly ain't against diesels, and have had my fair share, but one thing they all lack is the excitement of a good petrol - to quote your good self, no drama when accelerating hard, even with the modern, overblown small engine variants. I fully accept Opti's views about diesel. And hell would freeze over before I next intend to drive within the M25, so I care not about rumours of bans/high fees, and I'm actually all for big city diesel bans. Clearly, that includes buses and diesel trains.
She wants an automatic, not manual.
I'm all for equality, unlike our Lincolnshire Doctor, but this is one instance where you really do need to put your foot down and give her a slap. If she needs an auto, go RWD. And a big engine. FWD autos don't work. Small engine autos don't work. And neither will give your current 3.2 much of a run for its money on MPG. FWD autos are compromised (and generally weak) due to space constraints, and small engines don't have the required grunt to make up for autobox loses around town.
To manage your expectations, the last small engined (1.6 petrol) auto I drove for any length of time averaged around 15mpg.
Added to that, both the naff Zafira and the even more naff S-Max are both heavy cars, most definitely unsuited to autos bolted onto their weak petrol engines.
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Even a 1.8 120 bhp Vectra C estate will lift off oversteer on demand...
That was the fun with the 3.2GSi, trying to get the perfect balance between the inevitable understeer inherent on it, and lifting off too hard partway through. Absolute hoot of a drive around where I work, simply due to its inability to do roundabouts quickly and in a behaved way :D
To quote Mr Gixer, "It's not my car tyres"
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I think the 2.8 VXR would have been more of a handful, as the 3.2 has a predictable, instant throttle response, not reliant on turbos spinning up.
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Had a small diesel auto Mundeo as a courtesy car a few years back... Was worse on fuel than the 3.2 Plod ;D diesel Vectra auto wasn't much better either ::)