Omega Owners Forum

Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: amigov6 on 01 May 2008, 20:42:53

Title: Wishbones.
Post by: amigov6 on 01 May 2008, 20:42:53
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VAUXHALL-OMEGA-FRONT-WISHBONE-SUSPENSION-ARMS-X-2_W0QQitemZ220230204087QQihZ012QQcategoryZ10404QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
 Been quoted £180 a side for Vx wishbones!!!! ::)
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Marks DTM Calib on 01 May 2008, 20:44:56
There not as good ax VX wishbones though.....

In all honesty, mine will get rebushed with genuine or better parts.
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: HerefordElite on 01 May 2008, 21:03:05
look at it this way, you should remember how to change them in 12 months time when you got to change them again!!!! :D
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Mr Skrunts on 01 May 2008, 21:12:24
Quote
There not as good ax VX wishbones though.....

In all honesty, mine will get rebushed with genuine or better parts.

Talking of bushes, are there any companies out there that do bushes similar to the link below for the Omega.

If they are available are they any good.  if they are not available would it be worth approaching a manufacturer to make them. (That is of course if they are worth having.)

http://www.performance-tuning.co.uk/powerflex_polyurethane_bushes.htm
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: amigov6 on 01 May 2008, 21:13:26
I do 4k a year, ca'nt afford to scrub tyres & finances are tight. In a years time i might be able to replace them again. I know VX parts are more than pattern but that's taking the pee.
     £180 a side + vat? I do'nt think so. >:(
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: prestigesec on 01 May 2008, 21:16:39
Silly price!!!
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Kevin Wood on 01 May 2008, 21:21:19
How much are just the bushes genuine? And do you know someone who could press them into the existing wishbones?

Kevin
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Mr Skrunts on 01 May 2008, 21:24:04
Ring round your local parts suppliers.

I had an issue with one shop in the fact that pads/disks supplied for my Carlton CDi were naff.  result is they faded, not good. my life is worth more than a few quid.

Last year my car passed the test but I was advised to change the disks due to pitted on the inside (lack of use, car stood for a few weeks at a time) but, they passed the brake test no probs at all.

I rang round local suppliers and one shop quoted me for 3 makes of front disks for the GLS.  I asked all the questions I could think of and the thing that won me over is that he said this particular brand wouldnt cause any issues under warranty conditons with car manufacturers.

This won me over, I bedded the heat cycles in slowly and must admit they are the best replacment brakes I have ever had.

The point I am making is that you get what you pay for, but you dont allways have to pay top dollar

Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Marks DTM Calib on 01 May 2008, 21:27:28
Quote
How much are just the bushes genuine? And do you know someone who could press them into the existing wishbones?

Kevin

About 50-60 quid.

We have also recently discovered an uprated front bush which would fit (they are the same as the 7 series and mid 90's 5 series BMW's) and a poly version from the states (but the seller does not respond to emails!).

I know a man with a home made press and the set of drifts required to change the wishbone bushes... ::)
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: HerefordElite on 01 May 2008, 21:29:42
Quote
How much are just the bushes genuine? And do you know someone who could press them into the existing wishbones?

Kevin

that was the plan when i changed mine; take the old ones off and get them rebushed to go back on in the future ;) - but they were shagged and went straight down the tip :(
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: markey mark on 01 May 2008, 21:54:35
i pay £25 a side and they have been in mine and me dads for over a year now and no problems at all !! :y
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: amigov6 on 01 May 2008, 22:16:58
Are they better than the ones i listed? If so where from? Happy to take you're advice.
   Cheers, Guy.
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: lpgelite on 02 June 2008, 15:09:31
Quote
Quote
How much are just the bushes genuine? And do you know someone who could press them into the existing wishbones?

Kevin

About 50-60 quid.

We have also recently discovered an uprated front bush which would fit (they are the same as the 7 series and mid 90's 5 series BMW's) and a poly version from the states (but the seller does not respond to emails!).

I know a man with a home made press and the set of drifts required to change the wishbone bushes... ::)


Hi Dudes,

Apologies for any unintended duplication...

Further to the above regarding a solution for the crap design of the Omega wishbone front pivot bush, a guy on one of the Cadillac forums posted a possible alternative BMW application that could fit the front of our wishbones.

According to http://www.Meyle.com (Germany), the standard replacement bush for the Omega measures 58.5mm outside diameter, however, the guy on the Cadillac forum reckons a heavy duty BMW E34 (5 series) control arm bush, which is shown as 58.0mm outside diameter, will fit successfully. There are some pics on the Catera forum

Looking through Meyle's excellent website, I found another very similar heavy duty bush for a BMW E24 (6 series) listed at 58.5mm outside diameter - identical to the Omega spec.

Before we all get too excited, I have not yet determined if the centre bore or overall length of either of these bushes is compatible, but from the Cadillac forum it looks very promising.

Potentially better news is that http://www.powerflex.co.uk list bushes for both BMW models in a solid polyurethane design incorporating a stainless steel crush tube around which the body of the bush can pivot. This should virtually eliminate lateral movement of the bush under braking conditions. It may even prolong the life expectancy of the standard vertical rear bush.

If anyone has a standard front wishbone pivot bush to hand from which they could provide exact measurements, please feel free to take up the baton with Meyle or Powerflex to determine viability.

In the meantime, I remain very optimistic with the Powerflex option, as it is likely only to need a minor alteration to a current product line. They're better at answering e-mails, too.

For anyone buying pattern replacement wishbones, I have found (IME) Veco branded items to be of satisfactory quality and readily available from numerous eBay sellers. I paid about £70 for a pair including postage sometime last year. Can't comment on longevity as gearbox expired just before following MoT was due, but it still felt OK up to then.

IMHO, I don't consider the significant extra outlay for "genuine" GM wishbones to be worth it for the marginal extra bush life.

Regards

Martyn H
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Andy B on 02 June 2008, 20:00:44
Quote
.....
I know a man with a home made press and the set of drifts required to change the wishbone bushes... ::)

Carefull you don't bend the arm when you press them though. I had to make rings to support the under side of my Senator's wishbone when I did the bushes. They're only pressed & spot welded.
I know you're no numpty but I just want to fore warn you.  :y   :y :y
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Marks DTM Calib on 02 June 2008, 21:27:08
Quote
Quote
.....
I know a man with a home made press and the set of drifts required to change the wishbone bushes... ::)

Carefull you don't bend the arm when you press them though. I had to make rings to support the under side of my Senator's wishbone when I did the bushes. They're only pressed & spot welded.
I know you're no numpty but I just want to fore warn you.  :y   :y :y


I have a set of the official tools  :y

As for the BMW alternatives, we (myself and Matchless) obtained a set of the M5 bushes last year from Eurocarparts (rip off) and the dimensions are the same but, the centre hole was off set!

As for the Meyle ones, I have also seen these but not tried any yet as there are no easy to contact Uk distibutors.  :-[

If you could get the drawings (dimensions) for the powerflex bushes it would be interesting.

There was also a US outfit making am ideal poly bush but, we never get an answer from them
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: amigov6 on 02 June 2008, 22:22:42
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270241076146&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=017
I'm awaiting these. They'll have to do for now.
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: rad cap on 02 June 2008, 23:00:04
id want gold platted ones for that price
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: lpgelite on 13 June 2008, 14:51:46
Grabbed a pair of E34 BMW bushes off evilBay today. For twenty quid it's worth a gamble to see if these fit properly and if there's any noticeable improvement.

Not sure of origin or quality yet, but can't be any worse than knackered Boge type.

I've decided to change just the bushes and touch nothing else (except for resetting the toe-in) so I can benchmark any differences.

I'll take some pics along the way.

Quietly optimistic for now...   :)
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: cem_devecioglu on 13 June 2008, 15:03:03
Quote
Silly price!!!

Agreed.. :(


ps : here I paid 285 £ (total)  for the originals 3 years ago..But next time I'll try cheap solution..
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Mr Skrunts on 13 June 2008, 15:11:03
Quote
Grabbed a pair of E34 BMW bushes off evilBay today. For twenty quid it's worth a gamble to see if these fit properly and if there's any noticeable improvement.

Not sure of origin or quality yet, but can't be any worse than knackered Boge type.

I've decided to change just the bushes and touch nothing else (except for resetting the toe-in) so I can benchmark any differences.

I'll take some pics along the way.

Quietly optimistic for now...   :)

Looking forward to reading your findings.   :y
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Matchless on 13 June 2008, 15:45:58
The problem with the BMW poly bushes is they are designed to be over-length and when the centre bolt is tightened this causes the end cap washers to compress the bush making it a tight fit in the outer sleeve.....if you want a stiffer bush you just make a longer one and compress it more.
On the Omega the bush has to be a fixed length because it fits into a defined gap in the front subframe, there is no way that I can see of compressing a poly bush to get it into the gap.
The ones we found in the states were a moulded poly bush and would fit but I cant get a reply from the makers.

BMW M5 and 750iL bushes will fit (mentioned on posts from someone in Taiwan or HK) BUT......the centre hole is not concentric with the outer diameter, this changes the front geometry too much. I tried them for 12 months and they really sharpened up the steering response but at the expense of a pair of tyres.
BMW E34 bushes also fit but these are the same as the latest genuine Vx bushes. (note I think some pattern wishbones use the earlier Vx bush which is softer).
If we find a source of better bushes we will post on here, may even be able to sell them through the shop or offer a re-bushing service.
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Matchless on 13 June 2008, 15:48:53
Quote
Grabbed a pair of E34 BMW bushes off evilBay today. For twenty quid it's worth a gamble to see if these fit properly and if there's any noticeable improvement.

Not sure of origin or quality yet, but can't be any worse than knackered Boge type.

I've decided to change just the bushes and touch nothing else (except for resetting the toe-in) so I can benchmark any differences.

I'll take some pics along the way.

Quietly optimistic for now...   :)

You need to get camber checked and set to 1deg 20 min.
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Guppy on 13 June 2008, 15:56:38
Quote
Quote
There not as good ax VX wishbones though.....

In all honesty, mine will get rebushed with genuine or better parts.

Talking of bushes, are there any companies out there that do bushes similar to the link below for the Omega.

If they are available are they any good.  if they are not available would it be worth approaching a manufacturer to make them. (That is of course if they are worth having.)

http://www.performance-tuning.co.uk/powerflex_polyurethane_bushes.htm
You could go down the DIY route as Razzo did and make up your own polyurethene bushes, they are a fantastic improvement to the cars performance, he is well pleased  :y :y :y
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Mr Skrunts on 13 June 2008, 16:07:18
Quote
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270241076146&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=017
I'm awaiting these. They'll have to do for now.

Were they aftermarket one or Vx ?
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: iggy21uk on 13 June 2008, 17:33:07
Quote
Quote
Quote
.....
I know a man with a home made press and the set of drifts required to change the wishbone bushes... ::)

Carefull you don't bend the arm when you press them though. I had to make rings to support the under side of my Senator's wishbone when I did the bushes. They're only pressed & spot welded.
I know you're no numpty but I just want to fore warn you.  :y   :y :y


I have a set of the official tools  :y

As for the BMW alternatives, we (myself and Matchless) obtained a set of the M5 bushes last year from Eurocarparts (rip off) and the dimensions are the same but, the centre hole was off set!

As for the Meyle ones, I have also seen these but not tried any yet as there are no easy to contact Uk distibutors.  :-[

If you could get the drawings (dimensions) for the powerflex bushes it would be interesting.

There was also a US outfit making am ideal poly bush but, we never get an answer from them

Jason at  www.allgermanparts .com can get Meyle bushes
quoted about £5.00 +vat for one of the Omega bushes. [614 035 0010]
he is in Leeds 0113 277 5245
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: iggy21uk on 13 June 2008, 23:08:36
Are Myrle bushes for wishbones any good?
If the price is right?
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: amigov6 on 13 June 2008, 23:30:07
I've read with interest. My P&J's covered 101k so would the old ones be original? Whatever they are & however long they last, the car feels miles better for them & the mintex front dics & pads (£76 delivered) so will have to do for now. 8-)
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: iggy21uk on 14 June 2008, 19:05:56
Quote
Are Myrle bushes for wishbones any good?
If the price is right?

?
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Marks DTM Calib on 14 June 2008, 19:13:24
Quote
Are Myrle bushes for wishbones any good?
If the price is right?

They are supposed to be very good but, they do a stronger bush for the M5 which will fit the front bush position on the MIG....
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: amigov6 on 14 June 2008, 21:10:39
I like a strong bush. :D
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: iggy21uk on 15 June 2008, 00:48:10
Quote
Quote
Are Myrle bushes for wishbones any good?
If the price is right?

They are supposed to be very good but, they do a stronger bush for the M5 which will fit the front bush position on the MIG....

Mark - Thank you for info.

I think the cheap ones on ebay come from China?

Myrle come with a  guarantee

pays your money take your choice!
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Andyb on 15 June 2008, 07:09:46
my ebay ones are :y made by fia at £17 each
made in the uk
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Marks DTM Calib on 15 June 2008, 10:05:22
Quote
Quote
Quote
Are Myrle bushes for wishbones any good?
If the price is right?

They are supposed to be very good but, they do a stronger bush for the M5 which will fit the front bush position on the MIG....

Mark - Thank you for info.

I think the cheap ones on ebay come from China?

Myrle come with a  guarantee

pays your money take your choice!

I will dig out some part numbers....
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: iggy21uk on 15 June 2008, 12:48:38
Found these ?

http://www.meyle.com/Home/application.asp?lan=us&images=off&ma=84&de=30713069069&mo=14201777488&ba=14201772640&
Title: Re: Wishbones.
Post by: Aeroman on 31 July 2008, 18:01:44
Quote
Found these ?

http://www.meyle.com/Home/application.asp?lan=us&images=off&ma=84&de=30713069069&mo=14201777488&ba=14201772640&
That MEYLE Part No. 614 035 0016 is common to almost the whole Omega B ranges front axle, left and right lower front bushes; it has an outer Ų 58,5 mm.

What I find strange is that the major road loading will only act laterally on the front bush but the cut outs in the rubber mean that is its weakest direction. Did someone at Opel screw up when the presses were set up and that error has been perpetuated ever since ?

I've been in contact with PowerFlex and they can only identify their items by specific car models. There isn't one that has been earmarked for the Omega B.

BTW the central retaining bolt is 14mm and the width between the chassis mounting ( = centre tube width) is 56mm. The Width of the outer casing on a standad bush is 48mm.