Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Mr Gav on 02 July 2017, 10:49:27
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Do these things only read the speed of oncoming traffic or do they also read the speeds of traffic heading away, i.e. on the other carriageway of a dual carriageway :-X
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Unless they have changed the rules, I thought that they were only allowed to photograph the rear of vehicles, so going away from the greed cameras - EU privacy/civil liberty laws.
Ron.
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Unless they have changed the rules, I thought that they were only allowed to photograph the rear of vehicles, so going away from the greed cameras - EU privacy/civil liberty laws.
Ron.
I've only ever seen the Kent&Medway Safety Partnership vans with cameras pointing out the back, photographing the oncoming traffic.
They've recently bought some new ones with different livery, which has probably caught out a lot of people.
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Since when were they allowed to do that, Nick? The issue with frontal photos was that someone might not be where he (or she?) was supposed to be, hence the privacy breach and potential for embarrassment! :-[
Ron.
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Just as NickW says I too have only seen camera vans round here firing out the back.Possibly the idea is that they also get a picture of the driver so you can't say it was my missus was driving and dodge a ban or points on your licence?Whether they have forward facing cameras too I've no idea.
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Since when were they allowed to do that, Nick? The issue with frontal photos was that someone might not be where he (or she?) was supposed to be, hence the privacy breach and potential for embarrassment! :-[
Ron.
They've always mounted them in the back of vans. Which are usually parked in laybys just past a speed limit change to make the roads safer.
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Since when were they allowed to do that, Nick? The issue with frontal photos was that someone might not be where he (or she?) was supposed to be, hence the privacy breach and potential for embarrassment! :-[
Ron.
Rubbish... Front views are better for identifying the driver, which is rather the point...
Besides most Traffic units are fitted with anpr HD video front and rear and it doesn't take a nuclear physicist to work out the speed differential :D
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Yep I've only ever seen camera vans that photograph oncoming traffic from the back of the van. Whether they also take photos of traffic on the opposite carriageway heading away I couldn't say. :-\
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Also unless the tech has changed they can only measure one car at a time
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I was coming back from Leeds on the M1 Friday night, travelling on the variable speed limit bit. All of a sudden, one of the gantries flashed 50mph, with an explanation of pedestrians on the mway. I was being dozy, so had to slow down sharpish before I passed under the gantry. A BMW outside of me was similarly caught out. Just after we passed, the dreaded camera flash.
So...was it me...or him? I'll let you know within fourteen days. ;D
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If you were legal until the moment that they suddenly reduced the speed limit, you surely must have a valid excuse?
Ron.
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As far as these vans are concerned they need to be smashed up as soon as they're seen.
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As far as these vans are concerned they need to be smashed up as soon as they're seen.
Why?
That's the sort of mentality that costs everybody money...
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Do you believe that they are there for purely safety reasons? If so, you must also believe in the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus and the utterings of politicians! ::)
Ron.
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Do you believe that they are there for purely safety reasons? If so, you must also believe in the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus and the utterings of politicians! ::)
Ron.
Not at all Ron but it seems that those who take issue with them are not prepared to accept the responsibility that comes with laws and their enforcement.
If such people were prepared to accept that their behaviour has consequences, then such means of enforcement would not be necessary...
;)
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I was coming back from Leeds on the M1 Friday night, travelling on the variable speed limit bit. All of a sudden, one of the gantries flashed 50mph, with an explanation of pedestrians on the mway. I was being dozy, so had to slow down sharpish before I passed under the gantry. A BMW outside of me was similarly caught out. Just after we passed, the dreaded camera flash.
So...was it me...or him? I'll let you know within fourteen days. ;D
I think you are safe Steve, IIRC When the speed limit changes on overhead gantries, they give you 5mins to comply with the new speed limit.... I got flashed by one on the m25 once shortly after a speed limit change.....never got a ticket for it :y
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The road safety vans around Swindon used to point the camera out of a side window....catching the rear number plate...
Having said that I think there must be a yard somewhere full of road safety vans going rusty.....haven't seen one around Swindon in years.
Actually probably about the same time that the gov decided that the money collected from the fines all went to the gov....and nothing to the local authority...
Around the same time all the fixed speed cameras in the Swindon area got ripped out, shortly followed by the red light cameras....
Make you own mind up why .... ::) ;D
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Mobile van that parks near where I live has a camera facing out of the rear windows plus a screen mounted camera facing out of the front
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I think we have just one van for the whole of Barnsley. There are about 10 different sites where they operate as speed cameras, and one to enforce a bus lane. As I only see it occasionally at different sites and for only a couple of hours, I think he is probably razzing round the town in his van to make us think we're surrounded. ;D
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Most of the vans, like the majority of the Police with Rayguns at the side of the road, are pointing towards oncoming traffic.
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Mobile van that parks near where I live has a camera facing out of the rear windows plus a screen mounted camera facing out of the front
That would be interesting if challenged in the appeals court. The speed cameras are secondary corroborituve evidence of the opinion of the police officer that the vehicle was speeding. So the officer is looking out the front and back simultaneously to form that opinion? ;D
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Mobile van that parks near where I live has a camera facing out of the rear windows plus a screen mounted camera facing out of the front
That would be interesting if challenged in the appeals court. The speed cameras are secondary corroborituve evidence of the opinion of the police officer that the vehicle was speeding. So the officer is looking out the front and back simultaneously to form that opinion? ;D
Interesting thought... Speed partnership vans around here aren't manned by police officers ::)
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Mobile van that parks near where I live has a camera facing out of the rear windows plus a screen mounted camera facing out of the front
That would be interesting if challenged in the appeals court. The speed cameras are secondary corroborituve evidence of the opinion of the police officer that the vehicle was speeding. So the officer is looking out the front and back simultaneously to form that opinion? ;D
Interesting thought... Speed partnership vans around here aren't manned by police officers ::)
nor here. The driver is only needed to move the van to the next location and press the start button.
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Mobile van that parks near where I live has a camera facing out of the rear windows plus a screen mounted camera facing out of the front
That would be interesting if challenged in the appeals court. The speed cameras are secondary corroborituve evidence of the opinion of the police officer that the vehicle was speeding. So the officer is looking out the front and back simultaneously to form that opinion? ;D
Interesting thought... Speed partnership vans around here aren't manned by police officers ::)
nor here. The driver is only needed to move the van to the next location and press the start button.
Some types of camera are approved by the home office/home secretary for unattended operation - Gatso, Specs etc. Unless the device being used has such an approval then it can only be used as secondary evidence - to back up the expert opinion of a police officer that you were speeding.
If it goes to court, then the evidence from the officer invariably reads "I formed the opinion that the vehicle was speeding, and this was verified by the subsequent reading from the camera device." the Primary evidence is the opinion of the officer who is an expert witness being a highly trained as a traffic officer, and this is backed up by the secondary evidence from the camera device.
What they're not supposed to do is just point the laser/radar out the window and ping every car as it comes into view. Where is the expert opinion in that? And if the radar/laser isn't on the home office stand alone list approved then it can't be used as primary evidence.
Trouble is you won't get to know about any of this until/unless you plead not guilty and go to court. If you just plead guilty to the £100/3 points fixed penalty notice then you will never know if they actually had any admissible evidence against you.
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Mobile van that parks near where I live has a camera facing out of the rear windows plus a screen mounted camera facing out of the front
That would be interesting if challenged in the appeals court. The speed cameras are secondary corroborituve evidence of the opinion of the police officer that the vehicle was speeding. So the officer is looking out the front and back simultaneously to form that opinion? ;D
Interesting thought... Speed partnership vans around here aren't manned by police officers ::)
nor here. The driver is only needed to move the van to the next location and press the start button.
Some types of camera are approved by the home office/home secretary for unattended operation - Gatso, Specs etc. Unless the device being used has such an approval then it can only be used as secondary evidence - to back up the expert opinion of a police officer that you were speeding.
If it goes to court, then the evidence from the officer invariably reads "I formed the opinion that the vehicle was speeding, and this was verified by the subsequent reading from the camera device." the Primary evidence is the opinion of the officer who is an expert witness being a highly trained as a traffic officer, and this is backed up by the secondary evidence from the camera device.
What they're not supposed to do is just point the laser/radar out the window and ping every car as it comes into view. Where is the expert opinion in that? And if the radar/laser isn't on the home office stand alone list approved then it can't be used as primary evidence.
Trouble is you won't get to know about any of this until/unless you plead not guilty and go to court. If you just plead guilty to the £100/3 points fixed penalty notice then you will never know if they actually had any admissible evidence against you.
"with my certified and calibrated eyeballs....." :P
Ron.
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Mobile van that parks near where I live has a camera facing out of the rear windows plus a screen mounted camera facing out of the front
That would be interesting if challenged in the appeals court. The speed cameras are secondary corroborituve evidence of the opinion of the police officer that the vehicle was speeding. So the officer is looking out the front and back simultaneously to form that opinion? ;D
Interesting thought... Speed partnership vans around here aren't manned by police officers ::)
nor here. The driver is only needed to move the van to the next location and press the start button.
Some types of camera are approved by the home office/home secretary for unattended operation - Gatso, Specs etc. Unless the device being used has such an approval then it can only be used as secondary evidence - to back up the expert opinion of a police officer that you were speeding.
If it goes to court, then the evidence from the officer invariably reads "I formed the opinion that the vehicle was speeding, and this was verified by the subsequent reading from the camera device." the Primary evidence is the opinion of the officer who is an expert witness being a highly trained as a traffic officer, and this is backed up by the secondary evidence from the camera device.
What they're not supposed to do is just point the laser/radar out the window and ping every car as it comes into view. Where is the expert opinion in that? And if the radar/laser isn't on the home office stand alone list approved then it can't be used as primary evidence.
Trouble is you won't get to know about any of this until/unless you plead not guilty and go to court. If you just plead guilty to the £100/3 points fixed penalty notice then you will never know if they actually had any admissible evidence against you.
Well, I know how mine went when I went to court and it wasn't a police officer manning the camera ::)
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Agreed. I belive they are manned by operatives from the speed camera partnership.
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Agreed. I belive they are manned by operatives from the speed camera partnership.
Casualty reduction partnership round here.
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Most of the vans, like the majority of the Police with Rayguns at the side of the road, are pointing towards oncoming traffic.
This what I thought.
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Only today..driving home and came to a blind bend in a 30mph limit,,,,the rear of a camera van with cameras aimed out of the rear windows aimed at me as I approached them...they have been around for a few years now,,,,
:y
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And out of the side windows then they sit on the bridges above motorways and fast A roads. Or when they hide behind the hedges that look like they have been purposely cut to disguise/hide the van just off the M40 ::)
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Some types of camera are approved by the home office/home secretary for unattended operation - Gatso, Specs etc. Unless the device being used has such an approval then it can only be used as secondary evidence - to back up the expert opinion of a police officer that you were speeding.
If it goes to court, then the evidence from the officer invariably reads "I formed the opinion that the vehicle was speeding, and this was verified by the subsequent reading from the camera device." the Primary evidence is the opinion of the officer who is an expert witness being a highly trained as a traffic officer, and this is backed up by the secondary evidence from the camera device.
What they're not supposed to do is just point the laser/radar out the window and ping every car as it comes into view. Where is the expert opinion in that? And if the radar/laser isn't on the home office stand alone list approved then it can't be used as primary evidence.
Trouble is you won't get to know about any of this until/unless you plead not guilty and go to court. If you just plead guilty to the £100/3 points fixed penalty notice then you will never know if they actually had any admissible evidence against you.
"with my certified and calibrated eyeballs....." :P
Ron.
Yup. Case law states that the required level of proof on most normal roads is the expert opinion of two police officers, or one officer and a calibrated measurement device. On a motorway (aka Special Road)the law only requires the expert opinion of one officer.
You have to remember that most/all the speeding laws were first drafted long before there were any portable speed measuring devices so the only way of enforcing them was with expert opinion. So yes calibrated eyeballs.