Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Markjay on 06 December 2006, 17:47:39
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I know this subject has been done to death… but being a bit of a boffin I decided to do some proper research on this topic (that’s just a fancy name for googling…). I can’t guarantee that the info below is the gospels, it is what I found on the Internet, but having cross-referenced several sources it seems very likely that the information provided is indeed correct. So here goes:
1. Modern engines burn lean mixtures in order to improve economy and reduce emissions, which results in typically higher working temperatures. Under these conditions oil tends to break-up and this is why higher-quality oils are needed, i.e. semi or full synthetic, which have better resistance to higher temperatures.
Or this is the official version anyway… the real story behind high-performance oils is the drive by motor manufacturers to increase service intervals. This is a major issue for fleet buyers – and manufacturers sell cars on the back of low running costs. The fact is that if the manufacturer’s official oil change service schedule are ignores (for Omega, it’s 10,000 miles for the 2.5/3.0 and 20,000 miles for the 2.6/3.2) and the oil is changed at the traditional 3,000-5,000 miles interval, it does not really mater much which oil type you use… any modern good quality oil, be it mineral (yes, even mineral), semi, or full synthetic will perform well during this relatively short period.
There is no doubt that full-synthetic oil provides better protection than semi or mineral oil, but the point is that this is marginal under normal use and when the oil is new. Where the full synthetic really shines is if you actually keep the oil in the engine for the full duration of the official service schedule interval – but this is something that we here don’t recommend anyway….
2. Not all ‘synthetic’ oils actually synthetic… apparently enhanced mineral oil can also legally be called synthetic.
The paragraph below is from Honest John (he wouldn’t tell a lie, would he?):
‘The most stable products on the market and those which are being chosen by manufacturers for extended service are fully synthetic PAO (PolyAlphaOlefin). This includes Castrol SLX, Esso Ultron and Mobil 1. These products are extremely stable in extremes of performance….’
Note: Castrol SLX is not the same as Castrol Magantec. In fact Mobil sued Castrol claiming that Castrol call their Magnatec oil ‘synthetic’ were it is actually enhanced mineral oil, but sadly Mobil lost the case and the result is that enhanced mineral oil can now be legally marketed as synthetic…
But is it possible to know which oil is which? Yes, if we look at the Mercedes-Benz spec. MB have several oil specs: MB 229.1, then MB 229.3 (and its diesel subset MB 229.31), and the latest is MB 229.5. Only real fully synthetic PAO oils can meet MB 229.3 or higher.
Going back to point number one, as long as you buy good quality oil and change it frequently is shouldn’t matter much is the oil is ‘real’ synthetic or not. But even if using mislabelled oils may not actually damage the engine, you do want to know what you are buying and where your money goes….
3. As for Esso Ultron, it is made by ExxonMobil. My parts manager swears that it is the same oil as Mobil 1, coming off the same tanker, and that buying Esso Ultron is really just buying Mobil-1 for less. Whether this is actually the case it is difficult to say, but what seems to be clear is that they are both made from the same base oil (though potentially with different additives), so Esso Ultron is a very high quality full-synthetic oil and does cost less than Mobil-1.
What is even more interesting is that several sources on the Internet claim that Halfords’ own-brand full-synthetic oil is actually Esso Ultron – if this is true, then buying it from Halfords with Trade Card will be on par with buying Vauxhall own-branded oil on Vauxhall Trade Club.
4. This is all for boffins… I don’t know which oil Vauxhall use as own-brand, but again, it does not really matter - if you change oil frequently as you should then either Vauxhall semi or full-synth will be very good choices, especially on Vx Trade Club or when they are available on 4-for-3 special offers!
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What is even more interesting is that several sources on the Internet claim that Halfords’ own-brand full-synthetic oil is actually Esso Ultron – if this is true, then buying it from Halfords with Trade Card will be on par with buying Vauxhall own-branded oil on Vauxhall Trade Club.
Very interesting read MJ :y
However I bought 5 litres Halfrauds own brand semi a few months ago.....coz id run outa vx stuff and could be *rsed to goto vx dealer....got charged about £12 iirc with trade card .....vx semi is about £7 for 5l on buy 3 get 4 offer with TC card :y
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What is even more interesting is that several sources on the Internet claim that Halfords’ own-brand full-synthetic oil is actually Esso Ultron – if this is true, then buying it from Halfords with Trade Card will be on par with buying Vauxhall own-branded oil on Vauxhall Trade Club.
Very interesting read MJ :y
However I bought 5 litres Halfrauds own brand semi a few months ago.....coz id run outa vx stuff and could be *rsed to goto vx dealer....got charged about £12 iirc with trade card .....vx semi is about £7 for 5l on buy 3 get 4 offer with TC card :y
The point is that IF you want a very high quality oil (which, as mentioned, is not really needed...), and IF indeed Halfords' full-synth is Esso Ultron as some say, then at the moment this is the cheapest option I can see for getting very high quality oil - because I don't know what Vx use...
However if someone can confirm that Vx also use a very high quality oil for their full-syth, then Vx offer would be superior to Halfords as it is much cheaper.
... but this is all highly theoretical because I don't believe you really need such high-quality oil anyway. Hence point no. 4 - Vx on TC is the cheapset you can get good oil, full stop. If it turns-out that Vx oil is actually Mobil-1, all the better, but even if it is 'just' normal good oil, it is still the best buy... semi or full synth is a matter of personal preference, unless you really try to go for 20k oil changes neither oil will break up during it's service life.
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Interesting read
From BO BO 's recent post about wheels & tyres I found this
http://www.chris-longhurst.com/carbibles/engineoil_bible.html
did you find this for you info?
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Very interesting read MJ but was the post long enough ;) ;D
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Hi you guys
I have worked in the oil industry for 23years. Synth oil is made from the chemicals produced from oil.
So its chemicals from mineral oils. You have organic oils, mineral oils and Synth oils.
Organic and mineral oils degrade at high temps over a certain lenght of time or at very high temps in a very ,very short time!Re check you chip pan! Synths are temperature tolerant!
Where the problem arises with Synths is the addatives added to the oils. Dependent on supplier this can be Acid based( this being organic) zinc based ( metalic ) or calcium based.
You don't know what each companies criteria is or which part of the market they are aiming for.
This is just an insiders view of how the manufactuers work. Just a bit of usless info!!!!
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Think I'll stick to the VX semi-synth :y
Probably never does more than 3K before it's changed.
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Synthetic oils will last the life of your car, filtration is the problem. Fords and I presume Vauxhalls in the 1990's were working for the sealed engine.ie no oil change for the life of the engine. Champion Plugs perfected the eternal spark plug( called platinum plugs at £60 for 4) which you can transfer to your next car!!!! think about it!!
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Very interesting read MJ but was the post long enough ;) ;D
Wait for parts 2 and 3.....
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Very interesting read MJ but was the post long enough ;) ;D
Wait for parts 2 and 3.....
Just going to get my duvet because i might fall asleep (not cause i'm bored but because how long and interesting it is) ;) ;D
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Interesting read
From BO BO 's recent post about wheels & tyres I found this
http://www.chris-longhurst.com/carbibles/engineoil_bible.html
did you find this for you info?
Nope - didn't see that one - but it's now added to my bibliography list and after reading it carefully I will amend the post as needed. Thanks!
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splott, thanks for all the insider info :y
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Synthetic oils will last the life of your car, filtration is the problem.
Not strictly true. Even a synthetic oil will break down. It is down to a process known as "shearing" where the molecular structure breaks down.
This happens to all oils, just much more slowly to fully synthetic oils. On the downside, when fully synth breaks down it has similar lubricating properties to water!
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Boring tho'
Thats why Igave it up!!!
Do want to know about co polymers and tri polymers?
just say yes and I could bore you to death!!!!
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Organic and mineral oils degrade at high temps over a certain lenght of time or at very high temps in a very ,very short time! Re check you chip pan! Synths are temperature tolerant!
I do hope you're not suggesting I cook my chips in synth oil :D ;D
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Organic and mineral oils degrade at high temps over a certain lenght of time or at very high temps in a very ,very short time! Re check you chip pan! Synths are temperature tolerant!
I do hope you're not suggesting I cook my chips in synth oil :D ;D
taste better than lard!!! ;D
Healthier too!! ;D
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Synthetic oils will last the life of your car, filtration is the problem.
Not strictly true. Even a synthetic oil will break down. It is down to a process known as "shearing" where the molecular structure breaks down.
This happens to all oils, just much more slowly to fully synthetic oils. On the downside, when fully synth breaks down it has similar lubricating properties to water!
Yes, but also the additives break up much before the actual synth oil does, and their components are chemically reactive and produce acids and other harmful substances.
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Boring tho'
Thats why Igave it up!!!
Do want to know about co polymers and tri polymers?
just say yes and I could bore you to death!!!!
'yes'
:)
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In the immense text of the bible guide I noted he pulls off the HT lead and the fuel fuse to clear any air - anyone else do this? :-/