Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: feeutfo on 26 October 2009, 10:45:12
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my basic understanding of electrics is appalling frankly, i dont get it on the whole, as some of you may well have noticed. This is something i intend to change and have noticed other members have a similar problem/fear/issue/phobia or whatever with sparks as i do.
Main problem for me is experience, i dont have contact with it professionally, and i only really learn best when hands on. There is nout wrong with the car to try and fix and learn. So before it plays up i thought i should stock up on a meter at the very least and try and learn a bit. Would also be nice, on the side, to know why the lights in the kitchen go dim when i turn the kettle on...?
So, any recommendations ?
Seen talk of avo meters, amp meters and clamp meters, and of course have no idea on the differances and their applications. I wonder if their are any tutorials on line, or what ever, that may help.
Cheers
Chris. :-)
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Feel free to pop round and pick my brain sometime. I can furnish you with some junk to play with if you like. You've borne witness to the fact that I've got enough. ;)
As to multimeters, clamp meters are only really useful for measuring large currents without interrupting the conductor. Most only measure AC current in the clamp mode, and they are generally not that accurate, especially when the currents are small.
As such, they are a specialist item which you will probably not need for general experimentation and a bit of car diagnosis.
I would say get a cheap digital multimeter from the likes of Maplin or on Ebay for starters. You can get these for a fiver upwards and the main considerations are the maximum current range - if you need to measure up to 10 or 20 amps the cheap ones generally won't do the job. Other than that, pretty much anything will be adequate.
Failing that go to a few junk sale, car boots, etc. and look out for an old AVO.
Kevin
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Failing that go to a few junk sale, car boots, etc. and look out for an old AVO.
Kevin
And a trolly to carry it home on! ;) ;)
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And a trolly to carry it home on!
Don't you mean them?
How my mum used to cringe when I came home from school and promptly disappeared up the road with the wheelbarrow! Some more junk spotted. ;D
Anyway, here's a starter for ten. Seems a decent tutorial on circuits at first glance:
http://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/dccircuits/dcp_1.html
Kevin
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And a trolly to carry it home on!
Don't you mean them? .......
The (old moving coil :-/) AVO's I'm thinking of would need the trolly on its own.
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Would also be nice, on the side, to know why the lights in the kitchen go dim when i turn the kettle on...?
Having looked at that tutorial, you need to know that every voltage source in the real world, and every conductor of electricity, has resistance. The conductors that bring the mains into and around your house have a resistance.
When a current is forced to flow through a resistance, it develops a voltage drop across that resistance (see the page on Ohm's law). This voltage drop subtracts from the voltage available from the source, so you are left with less voltage.
So, let's say, for the sake of argument, that the substation at the end of your road is delivering a constant 230 Volts (it's not, but it's big enough that your kettle won't affect it too much). It's also an AC voltage, but for our purposes that doesn't matter.
There is a conductor between that substation and your house, a meter and a fuse where it enters your house, and then the circuits diverge at the consumer unit, with separate circuits (hopefully!) feeding your kettle socket and your kitchen light. There is therefore a resistance between you and the substation. A low one, nonetheless.
The more current your house draws, the more voltage is dropped in the resistance and therefore that constant 230 Volts is reduced by the time it gets to your house.
Your kettle is probably rated at around 2200 Watts. Power is related to volts and Amps as shown in the tutorial: P (Watts) = V (Volts) x I (Amps).
So, we know P = 2200 and V = 230.
Solving this equation for I we get I = P/V or about 9.6 Amps.
So, when you switch on your kettle, an extra 9.6 Amps flows through the resistance feeding your house. This results in an additional voltage drop meaning the voltage available to your kitchen light drops slightly too. The power equation above applies to your kitchen light too, so less power is consumed by it (due to the reduction in voltage) meaning less power is emitted as light and it dims.
Your household supply is probably rated for up to 100 Amps so an extra 9.6 shouldn't drop it by much (probably less than a Volt) but some lights are quite sensitive to voltage drops.
Watch the warning lights on the dash next time you start your car. They dim significantly when the starter motor is cranking the engine. Same principle but exaggerated a little. Starter motor takes a huge current from the battery (several hundred Amps), battery has a finite resistance, so its' voltage drops.
Kevin
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And a trolly to carry it home on!
Don't you mean them? .......
The (old moving coil :-/) AVO's I'm thinking of would need the trolly on its own.
This is what I meant:
(http://www.richardsradios.co.uk/Images/AVO.jpg)
Very portable. ;)
Kevin
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And a trolly to carry it home on!
Don't you mean them? .......
The (old moving coil :-/) AVO's I'm thinking of would need the trolly on its own.
This is what I meant:
(http://www.richardsradios.co.uk/Images/AVO.jpg)
Very portable. ;)
Kevin
That's the very one! :y :y
We used them at school ...... I'm not sure if digital had even been invented then! ;D ;D ;D
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That's the very one! :y :y
We used them at school ...... I'm not sure if digital had even been invented then! ;D ;D ;D
Yes it had. I can see them written all over the scale. :y
Kevin
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That's the very one! :y :y
We used them at school ...... I'm not sure if digital had even been invented then! ;D ;D ;D
Yes it had. I can see them written all over the scale. :y
Kevin
Nobody likes a smart 4r$e! ;D ;D ;D
We went to UMIST from school (1978-ish) and they were showing us some new developments in digital displays ie digital micrometers etc ....... it was all very new back then! ;) ;)
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You'll like my clock then.
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/kjwood/projects/IMGP1890.jpg)
Kevin
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I've just bought one of those via fleabay! Used them at Tech college in 1976.
You can get a decent digital multimeter that will do pretty much the same from Maplin for about £20 - £25.
The trick to using any type of meter is to double check the range setting on the meter before you use it. This especially true of measuring mains voltage or on a car battery. If you get it wrong then at best you might blow a fuse in the meter, through damaging the meter itself, to at worst, causing a "fault current" to flow. These are interesting and can cause sparks, melted wiring and smoke!
Just be careful and double check!
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You'll like my clock then.
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/kjwood/projects/IMGP1890.jpg)
Kevin
That's excellent!
Which reminds me, we had something in the Physics lab, which I've long since forgotten what it was, but that had a display something similar. Each digit was a hairline thickness and were stacked up behind each other, so as they counted up they also moved in depth too :-/ ..... if you see what I mean ;) ;)
Electrickery has moved on a little in the last 30 odd years :y :y
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That's excellent!
Which reminds me, we had something in the Physics lab, which I've long since forgotten what it was, but that had a display something similar. Each digit was a hairline thickness and were stacked up behind each other, so as they counted up they also moved in depth too :-/ ..... if you see what I mean ;) ;)
Electrickery has moved on a little in the last 30 odd years :y :y
Yep, that's what you're looking at. A Nixie tube.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixie_tube
I remember we had a counter/timer in the physics lab that used a dekatron spinner - a combined display and counter. 8-)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dekatron
Kevin
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Basic electrics (which is all a car/motorcycle consists of) is very easy (think "water" pipe analogy).
The difficult part for most is when you need to involve the math (that's when "water" pipe analogy isn't worth crap).
I'm more than happy to show you the world of electrickery, but you will need to be able to understand basic math before you start.
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whaa, need a bigger brain already.
I do have a meter of sorts tbh, but it really is cheap and doesnt seem to read the same as anything else that can measure leky. But i suppose i ought to stick with it in case i blow it up, can get a decent one, once i've learned. :-)
Trouble is i dont understand the numerous settings and the ones it shows seem to be layed out differantly to the more professional ones i've seen. See how it goes i suppose. Ill try and digest some of the link when i finish work, and no doubt ask some silly questions then. Ttfn and Cheers. :-)
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whaa, need a bigger brain already.
I do have a meter of sorts tbh, but it really is cheap and doesnt seem to read the same as anything else that can measure leky. But i suppose i ought to stick with it in case i blow it up, can get a decent one, once i've learned. :-)
Trouble is i dont understand the numerous settings and the ones it shows seem to be layed out differantly to the more professional ones i've seen. See how it goes i suppose. Ill try and digest some of the link when i finish work, and no doubt ask some silly questions then. Ttfn and Cheers. :-)
Stick a picture up Chris I'm sure we can explain how to use the meter then.
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Basic electrics (which is all a car/motorcycle consists of) is very easy (think "water" pipe analogy).
The difficult part for most is when you need to involve the math (that's when "water" pipe analogy isn't worth crap).
I'm more than happy to show you the world of electrickery, but you will need to be able to understand basic math before you start.
There's maths involved? Thats me breaked then ;D
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whaa, need a bigger brain already.
I do have a meter of sorts tbh, but it really is cheap and doesnt seem to read the same as anything else that can measure leky. But i suppose i ought to stick with it in case i blow it up, can get a decent one, once i've learned. :-)
Trouble is i dont understand the numerous settings and the ones it shows seem to be layed out differantly to the more professional ones i've seen. See how it goes i suppose. Ill try and digest some of the link when i finish work, and no doubt ask some silly questions then. Ttfn and Cheers. :-)
Stick a picture up Chris I'm sure we can explain how to use the meter then.
Ok, will do when i get home. Should give you a laugh if nothing else :-)
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Bring it round, Chris. We'll see if it is reading right.
Kevin
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Bring it round, Chris. We'll see if it is reading right.
Kevin
Yeah, lets play sparks. :-)
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Ahh, well, if it's sparks you want... [smiley=evil.gif]
Kevin
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Basic electrics (which is all a car/motorcycle consists of) is very easy (think "water" pipe analogy).
The difficult part for most is when you need to involve the math (that's when "water" pipe analogy isn't worth crap).
I'm more than happy to show you the world of electrickery, but you will need to be able to understand basic math before you start.
And if you want to know the world of advanced electronics then you will need mega maths!
Happy to show you that
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Basic electrics (which is all a car/motorcycle consists of) is very easy (think "water" pipe analogy).
The difficult part for most is when you need to involve the math (that's when "water" pipe analogy isn't worth crap).
I'm more than happy to show you the world of electrickery, but you will need to be able to understand basic math before you start.
And if you want to know the world of advanced electronics then you will need mega maths!
Happy to show you that
It will mean bog all to me in practical terms but would be interested in an example if you have one? Just to see how sacred i get.... :y
Re the meter pic, havent had a chance yet, will post soon as :-)
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Basic electrics (which is all a car/motorcycle consists of) is very easy (think "water" pipe analogy).
The difficult part for most is when you need to involve the math (that's when "water" pipe analogy isn't worth crap).
I'm more than happy to show you the world of electrickery, but you will need to be able to understand basic math before you start.
And if you want to know the world of advanced electronics then you will need mega maths!
Happy to show you that
It will mean bog all to me in practical terms but would be interested in an example if you have one? Just to see how sacred i get.... :y
Re the meter pic, havent had a chance yet, will post soon as :-)
Sod maths, just solder some wires up, big drill here and there, bit of sticky tape, job done. ;D
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It will mean bog all to me in practical terms but would be interested in an example if you have one? Just to see how sacred i get.... :y .....
It's not that bad, nobody has to give their life!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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You'll like my clock then.
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/kjwood/projects/IMGP1890.jpg)
Kevin
That's excellent!
Which reminds me, we had something in the Physics lab, which I've long since forgotten what it was, but that had a display something similar. Each digit was a hairline thickness and were stacked up behind each other, so as they counted up they also moved in depth too :-/ ..... if you see what I mean ;) ;)
Electrickery has moved on a little in the last 30 odd years :y :y
Actually it hasn't, its just that our ability to use and manufacture have as the laws of physis havn't changed. But in saying that I daresay the next bunch of really clever stuff is being invented in a lab in Oxford or Cambridge right now ,,,,,
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It will mean bog all to me in practical terms but would be interested in an example if you have one? Just to see how sacred i get.... :y .....
It's not that bad, nobody has to give their life!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Thinking back to engineering maths lectures at university (9 AM Monday morning, still hung over) it got very close once or twice. :-/
Kevin
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Actually it hasn't, its just that our ability to use and manufacture have as the laws of physis havn't changed. But in saying that I daresay the next bunch of really clever stuff is being invented in a lab in Oxford or Cambridge right now ,,,,,
True! But you knew what I meant. ;D ;D ;D
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Basic electrics (which is all a car/motorcycle consists of) is very easy (think "water" pipe analogy).
The difficult part for most is when you need to involve the math (that's when "water" pipe analogy isn't worth crap).
I'm more than happy to show you the world of electrickery, but you will need to be able to understand basic math before you start.
And if you want to know the world of advanced electronics then you will need mega maths!
Happy to show you that
You'll need to define the word "Advanced" for me.
I do hold the 224 (Parts 1 & 2), and that did include digital electronics before most people had even heard the word.
Still, I'm always up for learning...so if you think I could benefit from your knowledge then let's organise a beer/smoke/toot/whatever.
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It will mean bog all to me in practical terms but would be interested in an example if you have one? Just to see how sacred i get.... :y .....
It's not that bad, nobody has to give their life!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Its invisible. Cant see it, cant smell it, hear it,taste it, but touch it and you'll bloody know about it usually.
Add in my rather unique learning style, the fact i need to see how it works to sus it, and i'm struggling. The water flow thing seems to help sometimes but not always.
Having said that i aint that dim, and if others can do it then so can I, to a level at least.
Appreciate all your input so far. :-)
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Its invisible. Cant see it, cant smell it, hear it,taste it, but touch it and you'll bloody know about it usually.
Add in my rather unique learning style, the fact i need to see how it works to sus it, and i'm struggling. The water flow thing seems to help sometimes but not always.
Having said that i aint that dim, and if others can do it then so can I, to a level at least.
Appreciate all your input so far. :-)
Easily resolved.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_coil
;D
Actually, I think Debs said she'd made one of these...
Kevin
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Its invisible. Cant see it, cant smell it, hear it,taste it, but touch it and you'll bloody know about it usually.
Add in my rather unique learning style, the fact i need to see how it works to sus it, and i'm struggling. The water flow thing seems to help sometimes but not always.
Having said that i aint that dim, and if others can do it then so can I, to a level at least.
Appreciate all your input so far. :-)
Easily resolved.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_coil
;D
Actually, I think Debs said she'd made one of these...
Kevin
;D ;D ;D aaaah, dont let it out for god sake... ;D ;D ;D ;D
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pics as promised....... eventually :)
(http://i344.photobucket.com/albums/p326/chrisgixer/27102009829.jpg)
(http://i344.photobucket.com/albums/p326/chrisgixer/27102009834-1.jpg)
(http://i344.photobucket.com/albums/p326/chrisgixer/27102009833-1.jpg)
funny symbols and all....
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Looks like it'll do the job. :y
Kevin
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That will be ok for working on the car and very basic household electrics (eg, checking you have 230V at the socket), but don't consider using the ammeter part as it is quite restrictive in what it can measure.
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ah, so its not called an amp meter then? :-[
And has differant sections? As in the am meter part mentioned above.
Think i better read the guide at the start of this thread and go from there. Havent had time to scratch me arse this week.
Cheers all. :-)
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ah, so its not called an amp meter then? :-[
Never has been
And has differant sections? As in the am meter part mentioned above.
The sections are called ranges.
If you wanted to check house electrics (for voltage), you would select AC Volts (the V with the squiggly line above it), and have the other switch in position number 4.
For car electrics, you'd move the top switch to the middle position (V with one solid & one broken line), and the second switch would go to position 2.
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Lol....well get a grasp of Integration by parts to support fourier series and complex numbers to support full J notation calcs to work with inductors and capacitors.
Blast soem fourier transforms in to support analogue control and Z transforms for digital control.
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Lol....well get a grasp of Integration by parts to support fourier series and complex numbers to support full J notation calcs to work with inductors and capacitors.
Blast soem fourier transforms in to support analogue control and Z transforms for digital control.
Language Mark!!!! :-? ;) ;) ;)
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full J notation calcs to work with inductors and capacitors.
Working with imaginary numbers isn't that difficult TBH, but that crap doesn't count for what Chris wants to know.
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full J notation calcs to work with inductors and capacitors.
Working with imaginary numbers isn't that difficult TBH, but that crap doesn't count for what Chris wants to know.
He wanted help with electrical.....j notation is the basis of electrical.
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full J notation calcs to work with inductors and capacitors.
Working with imaginary numbers isn't that difficult TBH, but that crap doesn't count for what Chris wants to know.
He wanted help with electrical.....j notation is the basis of electrical.
If you want to talk basics of electrical, then we need to start with the atom.
However Chris doesn't need to know any of that crap, he just wants an easy lesson in understanding basic cuircuitry so he knows where to find 12V at any given point in his car.
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full J notation calcs to work with inductors and capacitors.
Working with imaginary numbers isn't that difficult TBH, but that crap doesn't count for what Chris wants to know.
He wanted help with electrical.....j notation is the basis of electrical.
If you want to talk basics of electrical, then we need to start with the atom.
And hence why a sparky is not a real engineer.
If you start with the atom and move onto the electron, then you really will confuse him ;D
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Lol....well get a grasp of Integration by parts to support fourier series and complex numbers to support full J notation calcs to work with inductors and capacitors.
Blast soem fourier transforms in to support analogue control and Z transforms for digital control.
Blimey, that takes me back.
Thought I'd finished with complex numbers and integration when I finished A levels. Then ended up covering a load more when I did 224 (Pts 1,2 and 3).
Hope I never have to deal with that stuff again ;D
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Lol, get your head round them and electrical becomes simple.....the maths does not get any easier mind!
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my basic understanding of electrics is appalling frankly, i dont get it on the whole, as some of you may well have noticed. This is something i intend to change and have noticed other members have a similar problem/fear/issue/phobia or whatever with sparks as i do.
Main problem for me is experience, i dont have contact with it professionally, and i only really learn best when hands on. There is nout wrong with the car to try and fix and learn. So before it plays up i thought i should stock up on a meter at the very least and try and learn a bit. Would also be nice, on the side, to know why the lights in the kitchen go dim when i turn the kettle on...?
So, any recommendations ?
Seen talk of avo meters, amp meters and clamp meters, and of course have no idea on the differances and their applications. I wonder if their are any tutorials on line, or what ever, that may help.
Cheers
Chris. :-)
im a sparky mate.
pm me and i will give you my mobile number so i can talk you through a few causes
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And hence why a sparky is not a real engineer.
If you start with the atom and move onto the electron, then you really will confuse him ;D
LOL....if you saw what it costs to keep local government happy, and what the penalty is if you screw up....I suspect you'd think twice about continuing to work ;)
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my basic understanding of electrics is appalling frankly, i dont get it on the whole, as some of you may well have noticed. This is something i intend to change and have noticed other members have a similar problem/fear/issue/phobia or whatever with sparks as i do.
Main problem for me is experience, i dont have contact with it professionally, and i only really learn best when hands on. There is nout wrong with the car to try and fix and learn. So before it plays up i thought i should stock up on a meter at the very least and try and learn a bit. Would also be nice, on the side, to know why the lights in the kitchen go dim when i turn the kettle on...?
So, any recommendations ?
Seen talk of avo meters, amp meters and clamp meters, and of course have no idea on the differances and their applications. I wonder if their are any tutorials on line, or what ever, that may help.
Cheers
Chris. :-)
im a sparky mate.
pm me and i will give you my mobile number so i can talk you through a few causes
Thats a very kind offer thankyou, i think its ok ish, depends what ring main i used when i wired up the kitchen lights....i think. They are under cupboard lights that shine on the work top, plus 2 more that back light the glass fronted units.
Iirc they are in an extension lead to a double 3pin socket, wire runs up the wall to the light switch. So they are on same ring main as the kettle, and dish washer.
Next double socket along is the 100wat outside light(again, wire runs up the wall to the light switch) and deck lights. Turn the kettle on when all or any of those lights are on and they go dim, led deck lights(yes, they have a blue option) dont appear affected and dishwasher on makes little odds. Its not correctly done but its all fused. What do you think?
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Nothing truely in-correct about the install.
The sort of issues you are seeing are due to source resistance being higher than it ideally should be.
Which points at the ring main the sockets are on......from my experience (which wont be as much as a sparky), most of the times I have see this (assuming the installation of the ring is correct) it has been a broken wire at the back of a socket.....easiest way to find is to disconnect the wiring at the consumer unit and measure the ring resistance and then work around checking sockets.
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Nothing truely in-correct about the install.
The sort of issues you are seeing are due to source resistance being higher than it ideally should be.
Which points at the ring main the sockets are on......from my experience (which wont be as much as a sparky), most of the times I have see this (assuming the installation of the ring is correct) it has been a broken wire at the back of a socket.....easiest way to find is to disconnect the wiring at the consumer unit and measure the ring resistance and then work around checking sockets.
By "correct" i was thinking it really should be wired to the lights ring main. But i didnt have the skills or know how to tap or cut into it, wouldn't know where to start, plus running wires up the wall and across the ceiling with joists in the way, looking for wires to cut into, bugger that....
If on the lights ring main then kettle couldn't affect it obviously, not that i knew it would dim at the time.
So you think there is a wirings issue and not just the extra draw from the kettle? Its not a massive drop in brightness, just noticeable
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Nothing truely in-correct about the install.
The sort of issues you are seeing are due to source resistance being higher than it ideally should be.
Which points at the ring main the sockets are on......from my experience (which wont be as much as a sparky), most of the times I have see this (assuming the installation of the ring is correct) it has been a broken wire at the back of a socket.....easiest way to find is to disconnect the wiring at the consumer unit and measure the ring resistance and then work around checking sockets.
By "correct" i was thinking it really should be wired to the lights ring main. But i didnt have the skills or know how to tap or cut into it, wouldn't know where to start, plus running wires up the wall and across the ceiling with joists in the way, looking for wires to cut into, bugger that....
If on the lights ring main then kettle couldn't affect it obviously, not that i knew it would dim at the time.
So you think there is a wirings issue and not just the extra draw from the kettle? Its not a massive drop in brightness, just noticeable
I suspect a ring main fault....which is more serious.
Do the simple loop check from the consumer unit for live and neutral.
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kin ell, you should never wire any lighting into a 30 amp ring main unless it is stepped down useing a fused spur with a 5 amp fuse in it !!
if you get a fault on your lights, the lighting wire will burn before the fuse goes :'( :'(
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kin ell, you should never wire any lighting into a 30 amp ring main unless it is stepped down useing a fused spur with a 5 amp fuse in it !!
if you get a fault on your lights, the lighting wire will burn before the fuse goes :'( :'(
ok, but if i buy a stand alone light, of any sort, with a plug, does it not plug into the 30amp ring main? Thats my thinking anyway?
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kin ell, you should never wire any lighting into a 30 amp ring main unless it is stepped down useing a fused spur with a 5 amp fuse in it !!
if you get a fault on your lights, the lighting wire will burn before the fuse goes :'( :'(
I read it as there is a lighting setup connected to a standard fused plug which is in turn plugged into a socket on the ring main.
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arhh that better ;D ;D
"note" learn to read the whole thred carefully :-[
as long as you have a 3 or 5 amp fuse in it then thats ok :y
are all the sockets on a ring main or are some of them spured off ?
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kin ell, you should never wire any lighting into a 30 amp ring main unless it is stepped down useing a fused spur with a 5 amp fuse in it !!
if you get a fault on your lights, the lighting wire will burn before the fuse goes :'( :'(
I read it as there is a lighting setup connected to a standard fused plug which is in turn plugged into a socket on the ring main.
Cant remember exactly but i'm sure there is a transformer involved somewhere with the light kits......
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arhh that better ;D ;D
"note" learn to read the whole thred carefully :-[
as long as you have a 3 or 5 amp fuse in it then thats ok :y
are all the sockets on a ring main or are some of them spured off ?
All sockets are as they where when we moved in, dont know what spurred off means?
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arhh that better ;D ;D
"note" learn to read the whole thred carefully :-[
as long as you have a 3 or 5 amp fuse in it then thats ok :y
are all the sockets on a ring main or are some of them spured off ?
Even if it was a spur, it should make little difference as the dimming lights will be due to the in-rush current on the kettle causing a volt drop on the supply somewhere due to I2R losses
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a ring main is where your live / neutral / earth starts at the fuse board and goes to the 1st socket.............. then from the 1st to the 2nd and so on till you reach your last socket then you go back to the fuse :y
a spur is where you take a 3rd wire ( live / neutral / earth and take it to another socket ( a max of 4 sockets can be spured off a ring ) :y
a radial is where you come out of the fuseboard ( like in a ring ) and go upto a max of 4 sockets then stop ! these are normally on a 15 or 20amp fuse :y
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check the conections at the back of the lighting plug and the socket that it is pluged into :y
if your getting a volts drop then my money would be on a bad neutral somewhere :y
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a ring main is where your live / neutral / earth starts at the fuse board and goes to the 1st socket.............. then from the 1st to the 2nd and so on till you reach your last socket then you go back to the fuse :y
a spur is where you take a 3rd wire ( live / neutral / earth and take it to another socket ( a max of 4 sockets can be spured off a ring ) :y
a radial is where you come out of the fuseboard ( like in a ring ) and go upto a max of 4 sockets then stop ! these are normally on a 15 or 20amp fuse :y
You really need to go slightly more in depth if you are going to start explaining what's what with the juice.
A very high percentage here don't have a clue, and your "generalisation" isn't going to help IMO.
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a ring main is where your live / neutral / earth starts at the fuse board and goes to the 1st socket.............. then from the 1st to the 2nd and so on till you reach your last socket then you go back to the fuse :y
a spur is where you take a 3rd wire ( live / neutral / earth and take it to another socket ( a max of 4 sockets can be spured off a ring ) :y
a radial is where you come out of the fuseboard ( like in a ring ) and go upto a max of 4 sockets then stop ! these are normally on a 15 or 20amp fuse :y
You really need to go slightly more in depth if you are going to start explaining what's what with the juice.
A very high percentage here don't have a clue, and your "generalisation" isn't going to help IMO.
Hmmm, better have a look behind there then, drag the dishwasher out and get behind the units. :-(
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a ring main is where your live / neutral / earth starts at the fuse board and goes to the 1st socket.............. then from the 1st to the 2nd and so on till you reach your last socket then you go back to the fuse :y
a spur is where you take a 3rd wire ( live / neutral / earth and take it to another socket ( a max of 4 sockets can be spured off a ring ) :y
a radial is where you come out of the fuseboard ( like in a ring ) and go upto a max of 4 sockets then stop ! these are normally on a 15 or 20amp fuse :y
You really need to go slightly more in depth if you are going to start explaining what's what with the juice.
A very high percentage here don't have a clue, and your "generalisation" isn't going to help IMO.
Hmmm, better have a look behind there then, drag the dishwasher out and get behind the units. :-(
You are less than 20 miles from me Chris.
My working hours are as follows:
Mon - Thur 9am - 3pm
Fri - 9am - 12 noon
Now ignoring the fact that I work according to pub opening hours, if you are seriously that worried about the lx in your home then I am more than happy to give it a full inspect/test while you ply me with lager for the duration (no more than 2 hours).
Full report at the end, and the only charge is a drink if you are REALLY that worried.
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a ring main is where your live / neutral / earth starts at the fuse board and goes to the 1st socket.............. then from the 1st to the 2nd and so on till you reach your last socket then you go back to the fuse :y
a spur is where you take a 3rd wire ( live / neutral / earth and take it to another socket ( a max of 4 sockets can be spured off a ring ) :y
a radial is where you come out of the fuseboard ( like in a ring ) and go upto a max of 4 sockets then stop ! these are normally on a 15 or 20amp fuse :y
You really need to go slightly more in depth if you are going to start explaining what's what with the juice.
A very high percentage here don't have a clue, and your "generalisation" isn't going to help IMO.
Hmmm, better have a look behind there then, drag the dishwasher out and get behind the units. :-(
You are less than 20 miles from me Chris.
My working hours are as follows:
Mon - Thur 9am - 3pm
Fri - 9am - 12 noon
Now ignoring the fact that I work according to pub opening hours, if you are seriously that worried about the lx in your home then I am more than happy to give it a full inspect/test while you ply me with lager for the duration (no more than 2 hours).
Full report at the end, and the only charge is a drink if you are REALLY that worried.
Not worried at all in all honesty, but thanks very much for the offer :-). I just dont like not understanding these things. In the course of this thread its clear serious training, or at least a heavy interest, is needed to understand it fully, or to a decent level at least.
Its not something i'm going to pick up in 5 mins. But put something in front of me and i'll usually find whats wrong. I just wont know the correct terminology or the mathematics and symbols.....
Like tiger said earlier about a spur, i knew what it was when he described it, i just didnt know what it was called before hand.
I think maybe i need a little project and learn hands on.... hang on, i'll see if i can find it. :-)
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found it, click the link and then click DVB-t Astra G CID
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=y&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.migrosser.de.vu%2F&sl=de&tl=en&history_state0=&swap=1
:y ::)
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found it, click the link and then click DVB-t Astra G CID
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=y&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.migrosser.de.vu%2F&sl=de&tl=en&history_state0=&swap=1
:y ::)
May I be so bold as to suggest starting with one described in English? ;)
Kevin
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found it, click the link and then click DVB-t Astra G CID
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=y&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.migrosser.de.vu%2F&sl=de&tl=en&history_state0=&swap=1
:y ::)
May I be so bold as to suggest starting with one described in English? ;)
Kevin
yeah, slight problem admitedly... :(
diags alone are no good i take it?
he supplys the parts, as confirmed by email....as far as i can tell anyway ;D
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No, I can see what he's getting at. Looks like a circuit that just switches in a separate RGB feed to the CID, with a sync separator.
Kevin
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No, I can see what he's getting at. Looks like a circuit that just switches in a separate RGB feed to the CID, with a sync separator.
Kevin
yes, from what i can make out/understand....
he also lists an aux in for mp3 player as a mod, and seems it can be done without opening the unit, or something like, and there by not affecting warranty,not that that matters now, but may point to something simpler?
shame the google translation is not a bit more accurate
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yeah listed under "Display + Line IN" :)
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Hmm. His line-in looks like a bit of a bodge. :-/
Kevin
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Hmm. His line-in looks like a bit of a bodge. :-/
Kevin
Oh, how do you mean? :-?