Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: TheDufster on 20 December 2006, 13:23:40
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My silver Omega 2.2 CD (53 reg) has developed rust spots around the edge of the nearside rear passenger door. I originally brought this up with my local Vauxhall Dealer back in June 2005, however they failed to provide any assistance whatsoever. I noticed a clause in the warranty statement that you need to have the paintwork checked over regularly and the corrosion checklist completed in the service book for any paint warranty to be honoured. I had done this but they still walked away from my problem.
I eventually wrote them a letter:
Further to your paintwork inspection of the above vehicle today, I write to confirm that I disagree with your inspector’s findings that the rust spots and blemishes on the bodywork are all down to ‘stone chips’ and therefore not covered under the vehicle’s warranty. I do not find it acceptable that the paintwork on a car of this age should deteriorate in this manner and I am surprised that you have advised me that the warranty does not provide cover in this situation. Even if the marks were caused by ‘stone chips’ I would not expect any rust to show after such a short period of time.
I am disappointed that you have been quick to dismiss the matter and not offer any further help or support. Unless you write to advise me that your stance on this matter has changed within the next 7 days, I intend to obtain an independent inspection of the bodywork and opinion of the situation from a third party, as well as taking the matter up with Vauxhall directly. Following this, should it be found that the warranty does indeed cover this work, I will seek to recover any costs involved with the above inspection from yourselves.
As they failed to do anything about it, I contacted Vauxhall. They refused to do anything at all. I can't believe that the warranty doesn't cover it.
So the end of it is that I am left with these rust spots and I am now not sure what to do about them. How much should it cost to have some local repairs/repainting done? I can remember the Vauxhall garage quoting circa £400.
I only intend to keep the car for another 2 years and wonder if it will affect the resale value as it's probably worth next to nothing now anyway. I don't want to throw "good money after bad" as the saying goes.
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Someone like chips away will probably fix for 1/2 that!
charged me about £70 for 1st spot and a bit more for each one after that.
Had 5 done iirc and cost about £200
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Your car is very young, I'd agree with you that it's not right. I don't see how they just dismiss it if you kept the anti-corrosion warranty stamps up to date.
If I were you (and I've never had a car that new so I'm not an authority!), I'd start making a bit of a nuisance of myself at both your local dealers and Vauxhall headquarters, with plenty of letters, e-mails & phonecalls.
So how often does one get stonechips on the rear passenger door?
Annoy the hell out of them, even if you get nowhere at least you've tried, and it might even make you feel better!
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........ I contacted Vauxhall. They refused to do anything at all. ........
Why am I not suprised!
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I just sold a 1994 Audi with more miles than the space shuttle and I'm confident in saying that I expect it had less rust than your 3 year old Omega does. Put quite simply, Vauxhalls (and GM in general) are utter junk in terms of build quality. Let them know your opinion on the matter, and make sure you tell everyone you know of that same opinion. It won't help your case any, but the more people who are warned away from this manufacturer the better!
The Omega suits me great for what I bought it - a cheap, comfortable and spacious car for doing all my mundane motorway driving and lugging stuff around. It's also RWD and has quite a good chassis for its size. However I'm under no illusions of the standard of build - I've been driving since I was 17 and never had breakdown cover as I didn't think I'd need it, but I do now! A few months after buying it my dad was using it and got stranded when the crank sensor failed (very common fault); maybe I'm being unfair as it's been fine ever since but I can't say it fills me with confidence. I'm prepared to put up with things like that and the rust though as they're cheap to buy used for that very reason - few people want them due partly to image but also lack of quality, which drives down the used price.
If you want a car that won't rust, buy an Audi (or indeed just about anything except a Vauxhall!). Unfortunately rusting is just part and parcel of owning these cars, and VX are obviously well aware of this hence why they're very reluctant to budge on the warranty issue as they'd go bust trying to fix rust on just about every car they've shipped in the past 10 years :O
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....... Put quite simply, Vauxhalls (and GM in general) are utter junk in terms of build quality. .........and VX are obviously well aware of this hence why they're very reluctant to budge on the warranty issue as they'd go bust trying to fix rust on just about every car they've shipped in the past 10 years :O
So Paul ...... how do you rate your Omega? ;) ;) ;D
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Thanks for the replies peeps. I am of the mind to maybe get it repaired (I tried chips away but they failed to turn up!) and I am counting down the days when I can get rid of the car for good, but I have 21 more monthly payments to make on the outstanding loan which is about double what the car is worth (it's a long story!).
The car has served its purpose (and it still continues to do so) - I needed a cheap big car for the family, and for £9,000 with 15k miles and under 1yr old, at the time it was a bargain. I still find it comfortable to drive, but the image, performance and service levels from dealers let it down. Apart from Peugeot, I haven't come across a more obnoxious, obstructive and "couldn't care less attitude" bunch of people.
My wife's car is a Toyota and on the rare occastion that it has to go into the garage (i.e. for a service) the difference in the level of service is remarkable. Even without doing much, they actually make you feel good when you hand over your credit card to pay. :o
I don't even understand the mentality of the Vauxhall garage managers - the environments are hardly the soft of place that makes you want to shell out £££ for a new / nearly new car. The showrooms are a mess!
Oh well that's enough moaning for now - I'd better stop otherwise I could go on and on and on and on............ ::)
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Hopefully Taxi Driver will be along shortly, he's an expert when it comes to getting VX to do rust spots on his 03 plate Omega ::)
Try going to another dealershit :-X whoops meant dealership, and ask !
Taxi Driver seems to get on famously at his dealership regarding his little rust spots and i'm VERY sure he didnt keep up his bodywork warrenty
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I just sold a 1994 Audi with more miles than the space shuttle and I'm confident in saying that I expect it had less rust than your 3 year old Omega does. Put quite simply, Vauxhalls (and GM in general) are utter junk in terms of build quality. Let them know your opinion on the matter, and make sure you tell everyone you know of that same opinion. It won't help your case any, but the more people who are warned away from this manufacturer the better!
The Omega suits me great for what I bought it - a cheap, comfortable and spacious car for doing all my mundane motorway driving and lugging stuff around. It's also RWD and has quite a good chassis for its size. However I'm under no illusions of the standard of build - I've been driving since I was 17 and never had breakdown cover as I didn't think I'd need it, but I do now! A few months after buying it my dad was using it and got stranded when the crank sensor failed (very common fault); maybe I'm being unfair as it's been fine ever since but I can't say it fills me with confidence. I'm prepared to put up with things like that and the rust though as they're cheap to buy used for that very reason - few people want them due partly to image but also lack of quality, which drives down the used price.
If you want a car that won't rust, buy an Audi (or indeed just about anything except a Vauxhall!). Unfortunately rusting is just part and parcel of owning these cars, and VX are obviously well aware of this hence why they're very reluctant to budge on the warranty issue as they'd go bust trying to fix rust on just about every car they've shipped in the past 10 years :O
Vauxhall, in my experience, are no worse than Ford/VAG (Audi aside) or most others for rust. Prefacelifts did have an issue with just under the rubber strip by windows, granted.
Vauxhall are let down by their dealer network, which is almost as bad as Renault and BMW, which is a shame, as the cars ain't that bad (Astra-H excluded :p).
Every car I've ever owned (or been responsible for in case of company vehicles) has let me down - the Omega has only done so once (crank sensor, like yours), so again from my experience, no worse than any other car I've owned/responsible for, in fact better than most. Even my supposedly utterly reliable Honda broke down with a known, common electronic failure.
I bought my MV6 for a specific reason, and only intended to keep it 6 months. Thats was over 3 yrs ago. There is nothing to replace it with for what I'm prepared to spend (5 - 6k).
I'm certainly not a Vauxhall fan, never have been, but the Omega ain't that bad really. Obviously, it won't suit everyone. Generally, most problems are due to lack of proper maintenence, though it has got one or 2 bits that probably could have been better designed (eg, running of crank sensor wiring).
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.....Vauxhall, in my experience, are no worse than Ford/VAG (Audi aside) or most others for rust. .....
BMWs always seem to be in far better nick age for age than a comparible Vx - probably reflected to a degree (discounting snob value) in their far lower depreciation costs.
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.....Vauxhall, in my experience, are no worse than Ford/VAG (Audi aside) or most others for rust. .....
BMWs always seem to be in far better nick age for age than a comparible Vx - probably reflected to a degree (discounting snob value) in their far lower depreciation costs.
The older ones - such as the classic early nineties 5 series, yes. The one that replaced it in late nineties, I'm not convinced judging from the beemers I know (come from a family of BMW drivers).
Omega's finish was improved greatly with the facelift model - you don't see many rusty facelifts (nor should you at that age!)...
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Omega's finish was improved greatly with the facelift model - you don't see many rusty facelifts (nor should you at that age!)...
Is that apart from TheDufster's car? :-?
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Omega's finish was improved greatly with the facelift model - you don't see many rusty facelifts (nor should you at that age!)...
Is that apart from TheDufster's car? :-?
;)
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....... Put quite simply, Vauxhalls (and GM in general) are utter junk in terms of build quality. .........and VX are obviously well aware of this hence why they're very reluctant to budge on the warranty issue as they'd go bust trying to fix rust on just about every car they've shipped in the past 10 years :O
So Paul ...... how do you rate your Omega? ;) ;) ;D
It's actually not that bad when you take into account the used price reflects the (lack of) quality ;)
I'm quite happy with a car that is inevitably going to rust here and there, as I bought it in full knowledge of that fact and I just wanted a cheap car with reasonable power and handling for enjoyement when I hit the B-roads, along with plenty of toys and space for going snowboarding trips etc. Basically a cheap luxo-barge that can do all the things I don't want to or can't in my BMW (like carry more than 2 people ;)) that admittedly isn't particularly well built.
If I'd paid £27,000 for it (or whatever it cost new), it would be a completely different story! It amazes me that any private buyers actually pay that sort of money for a new Vauxhall, they make decent used buys because of their savage depreciation but the new buyer gets a double-whammy of a mediocre quality car combined with a huge depreciation hit :O
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.....Vauxhall, in my experience, are no worse than Ford/VAG (Audi aside) or most others for rust. .....
BMWs always seem to be in far better nick age for age than a comparible Vx - probably reflected to a degree (discounting snob value) in their far lower depreciation costs.
The older ones - such as the classic early nineties 5 series, yes. The one that replaced it in late nineties, I'm not convinced judging from the beemers I know (come from a family of BMW drivers).
My 840Ci is actually slightly older than my Omega (1997 vs 1998), and although it has probably had a much easier life the difference between them is quite amazing. Open the driver's door on the BMW and it feels absolutely solid, no play whatsoever and it shuts with a good thud. Seems like you could lift the car by the doors. The Omega on the other hand... well sometimes you have to use the key before opening as sometimes the remote locking doesn't quite lift the catch enough to unlock it (probably just needs oiled but still).... then you're greeted by a door that flaps about because the check strap has ripped itself out. Inside, start the engine and you often get a slight hunting idle, start driving and the gas pedal can feel like an on-off switch in slow traffic. Give it too much gas at low revs and it sometimes splutters (classic misfire symptoms, probably leaking cam covers). The BMW on the other hand idles perfectly, pulls like a train from 800 RPM even in 6th gear, oh and the HID lights actually illuminate more than about 2 metres in front of the car ;)
Granted, the 840 cost £64,000 when it was new and is currently worth about 9 times what the Omega is worth, but the difference in quality is huge. Even though it's a V8 most things are loads easier to work on too compared to the Omega - I could change the crank sensor in 10 minutes, atlthough I don't expect I'll need to as they rarely fail due to not being routed right next to the exhaust and oil pipes!
Don't get me wrong the Omega is a decent car as a used purchase, just don't expect it to be trouble free, and don't expect it to seem like the £27,000 car it once was ;)
PS I'd agree that newer BMWs seem to be taking a nosedive in quality. They're certainly still miles ahead of Vauxhall but not so much compared to several other mainstream manufacturers. And the interior design seems to have taken some major steps backwards :O
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i don't see where the extra money goes apart from on the badge.
Several years ago, my dad hired a Merc E320 as he needed an Auto. We had recently taken delivery of his Y Reg 2.2 CD megga with leather. The Merc we had was a good 10k more than the list price of the Omega, and we could not see the difference or where the 10k goes, the build felt the same.
I think comparing the Omega against the BMW 840 is a little biased... BMW's of the early 90's where built much better than BMW's of today.
The updated facelift feels like its built much better, i discovered that with the R reg project car i had. Everything just feels more solid and "screwed together better" if you get my meaning.
You can't beat them for second hand value, where else would 1g grand get you a 2000 model V6 luxo barge with RWD, climate, TC, leather, sat nav, bose sounds??
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I think quite a lot of Omegas have had a hard life, possibly not helped by shockingly bad servicing at main dealers.
My MV6 feels solid and well built, and rattle free. Easy a match for the 540 my brother had that was same age, performance aside (his 540 was a nice torquey engine, I think it was v8, not sure though). Agreed, I have developed a rust spot under the rubber strip on n/s rear door :(.
I know you seem to have an issue with your HIDs - mine were around the same as my brothers 540 and his Alpina, which surprised me as I would have expected the round lights on the beemer to be better than the odd shaped Vx ones - I guess with projectors, it makes little difference, as no reflectors?
The Vx build quality is nowhere near that of Audi etc, but imho better than Ford's Mondeo/Jag/(current) 5 series/large Pugs/Rover 75/C5 Citroen/Laguna etc...
As said though, some do seem to have a hard life (possible because they don't have a badge, and because their value is low, therefore people won't spend as much on them). Additionally, I cannot imagine many started life as a private car...
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I had a 540i before I got the 840, and they're pretty damn nice motors for the money. Especially with the 6-speed gearbox (which mine had) it's plenty fast for most driving although it's certainly no sports car. Mine had huge mileage, and although it did show some signs of neglect was still generally holding up much better than my Omega.
The HIDs on my Omega work fine, it's just that the beam angle is far too low. It's a real PITA coming off a slip road in the dark cos by the time you can see that 90 degree bend you're almost on top of it! Fine if there are no other cars around allowing main beam to be used. The only other car I've owned with HID is my 840, and those have a significantly better range. The lights on the 540 weren't that great but being halogen they were adjustable beam so no problems with range. I seem to remember the Vectra CDX my dad owned years ago had HID and I thought the range on that was noticably poor too. One of the lights on that completely lost all height control meaning it pointed straight down - required complete replacement at a cost of £800 under warranty - typical VX!
I'd agree that if anything VX quality is a little better than the French stuff (that is generally really poor IMO) but I'm not convinced it's better than equivalent Fords. They're still very platicky inside but seem solid enough. I'd expect all the equivalent Fords to handle better across the range too; VX's front wheel drive cars are all pretty mediocre in this department whereas Ford have been getting better and better for a few generations now. The RWD cars are a different matter but neither of them really do RWD now other than niche models "borrowed" from the parent company (Monaro, VX220).
My Omega has had a fair bit spent on it (I have the receipts), including the best part of £1500 a few months before I bought it. Considering the value of the car isn't much higher than that I wouldn't say it's been completely neglected. Stuff like the door check strap just shouldn't break whether maintained or not - I've never seen another car with a hole punched in the metal of the door due to a seized check strap, and I've seen some seriously neglected cars in my time. Likewise the rust issue at the bottom of the doors is a bit of a joke for a late 90s car, especially considering the paint is in generally good condition. My sister's 1998 Laguna doesn't have any rust and I consider that to be a bit of a shed lol!
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I had a 540i before I got the 840, and they're pretty damn nice motors for the money. Especially with the 6-speed gearbox (which mine had) it's plenty fast for most driving although it's certainly no sports car. Mine had huge mileage, and although it did show some signs of neglect was still generally holding up much better than my Omega.
The HIDs on my Omega work fine, it's just that the beam angle is far too low. It's a real PITA coming off a slip road in the dark cos by the time you can see that 90 degree bend you're almost on top of it! Fine if there are no other cars around allowing main beam to be used. The only other car I've owned with HID is my 840, and those have a significantly better range. The lights on the 540 weren't that great but being halogen they were adjustable beam so no problems with range. I seem to remember the Vectra CDX my dad owned years ago had HID and I thought the range on that was noticably poor too. One of the lights on that completely lost all height control meaning it pointed straight down - required complete replacement at a cost of £800 under warranty - typical VX!
I'd agree that if anything VX quality is a little better than the French stuff (that is generally really poor IMO) but I'm not convinced it's better than equivalent Fords. They're still very platicky inside but seem solid enough. I'd expect all the equivalent Fords to handle better across the range too; VX's front wheel drive cars are all pretty mediocre in this department whereas Ford have been getting better and better for a few generations now. The RWD cars are a different matter but neither of them really do RWD now other than niche models "borrowed" from the parent company (Monaro, VX220).
My Omega has had a fair bit spent on it (I have the receipts), including the best part of £1500 a few months before I bought it. Considering the value of the car isn't much higher than that I wouldn't say it's been completely neglected. Stuff like the door check strap just shouldn't break whether maintained or not - I've never seen another car with a hole punched in the metal of the door due to a seized check strap, and I've seen some seriously neglected cars in my time. Likewise the rust issue at the bottom of the doors is a bit of a joke for a late 90s car, especially considering the paint is in generally good condition. My sister's 1998 Laguna doesn't have any rust and I consider that to be a bit of a shed lol!
Alas, I had to tolerate a Ford Focus for 2 years. Worse handling car I've owned since my old Triumph Acclaim. Its build quality was poor, both from a design and manufacturing point of view. I've had a few Vx (4) and Fords (6). For a cheap, mass market manufacturer, their quality is higher that of their competitor (Ford).
The check strap should have been fixed (a simple service procedure, takes 2 mins and costs pence) before it got that bad.
If your HIDs are simply too low, there is a manual adjustment on them, but technically be callibrated afterwards via Tech2. It may be they just need calibrating in first place.
The high value of receipts you have to make me suspicious that it may not have been as cared for as it could have been, hence the high cost of maintenence all of a sudden (and probably reason it was sold). Some sellers are proud that "2k spent in last year" etc type claims - these claims put me off, as to me, things have been left until it has failed (and hence more expensive...)
As you say, I wouldn't spend £25k+ on this car, but not sure I'd be happy spending £25k on any other similar car either...
So, was the 540 (circa 1998) a v8?
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The 540 was a 1995/96, last of the E34. It was a V8 but only a 4.0 whereas the 840 engine is a 4.4 (as are later 540s). 286 bhp or thereabouts, along with about 280 lbft torque. Worked well enough with the 6-speed box. The 840 is noticable perkier though.
I bought the 540 as a cheap, but relatively fast, runaround when I had my Impreza WRX STi. I got fed up with the two car thing, so sold the WRX and bought the 840Ci to replace the 540i. Sold the 540i a few months later and was happy at that. Then I decided I'm putting way too many miles on the 840, using way too much gas, and couldn't take more than one passenger! Started using my old 2.0 Audi that I'd given to my mum but she didn't use, but it was waaaaay too slow for my liking so another runaround was sought, enter the Omega. That was about 10 months ago, I've just got round to selling the Audi so back down to two cars. To be honest I don't need two any more as I've moved to a place in the city so seldom use the car during the week, and sometimes not at weekends either! Two cars to share an average mileage of 5,000... I must be mad :o. Very nearly bought myself a new Gixxer Thou too, but I'll wait until spring even though prices will be higher.
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The 540 was a 1995/96, last of the E34. It was a V8 but only a 4.0 whereas the 840 engine is a 4.4 (as are later 540s). 286 bhp or thereabouts, along with about 280 lbft torque. Worked well enough with the 6-speed box. The 840 is noticable perkier though.
I imagine that the 840 is probably a fair bit lighter?
My bike stays in the garage this time of year - I ain't man enough to tame it when its slippery (or even when its dry if last year is anything to go by :-[). Prices will rise, but may be able to get a pre-reg deal early spring...
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It's actually not that light surprisingly enough, damn heavy for what's basically a two seater. The construction is absolutely solid though, which goes a large way to explaining the weight. As a result even with 315 BHP the low speed acceleration isn't that great (6-something seconds 0-60 which my previous WRX STi would obliterate) but it's got really good aerodynamics so keeps pulling at higher speeds, topping out at 173 MPH or thereabouts. You can supercharge them up to about 480-500 BHP which the standard gearbox copes with just fine, but the price tag of £5-6k puts me off that idea just a little :O.
I'm definitely a fair weather biker too, it's just no fun when the roads are wet or worse, especially on a sports bike with sticky semi-slick tyres! I'm planning on keeping my eye out over the coming months, if a good offer comes up I may just jump in there. I can always leave it in my folks' garage for a few months until the weather improves :).
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Guys, my personal view is that you cannot judge a car unless you have owned from new, i have owned 2 omegas used they were somewhat neglected but i was lucky in general with them so i have a good opinion about the car but again i don't know how the car would have been if i had it from new. I once met a guy in Greece when i had my first omega tech2 checked, he had his omega since 1993 2lt16v GLS it had 189.000km on the clock he said to me that this was the best car he owned for 7 years he would only do the dealer services plus and extra oil change, apart from that he had nothing gone wrong ever. Rust is a matter of maintenance as well, right now in the carpark outside is an 03 Audi with both rear arches rotten to death. As mark has said in the past a used car is as good as it's previous owner.
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Hopefully Taxi Driver will be along shortly, he's an expert when it comes to getting VX to do rust spots on his 03 plate Omega ::)
Try going to another dealershit :-X whoops meant dealership, and ask !
Taxi Driver seems to get on famously at his dealership regarding his little rust spots and i'm VERY sure he didnt keep up his bodywork warrenty
2nd time at posting this :( 1st time it time out :(
Sorry ive only just read this thread :-[
I had a rust on the tailgate just under the wiper....common place on estates.....vx dealer had no problem booking it in and doing it under warranty......tho ive noticed recently its bubbling in the same place again :( and yes you are correct i dont have any anti corrosion stamps in my service book.
Vx dealer will be seeing the car again as soon as it starts to show rust stains !
Tho dont know how it will fare 2nd time around.....as ive vowed a vx dealer will never touch my car service/mechanically wise again! So dont know what there reaction will be as the service book wont have any more vx dealer stamps in it.
Its on 80k now....my local backstreet garage will do an oil/filter change on it (i supply vx semi synth and filter) i will change the plugs and change the air filter myself......get the garage to check the pads....they were last changed at 60k if ok then thats it. But no vx stamp in the book!
Try asking AA i know he had rust done on his 2.2 under warranty, i think the back door area :-/
Hes away for a few days so might not reply straight away :y
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2nd time at posting this :( 1st time it time out :(
If that happens, remember that with this forum software, the contents of your post will be in clipboard ;)
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Vauxhall dealer won't be bothered about service by non main dealer as it no longer affects the Vx warranty but may try it on. I let a muppet spray my rear bumper earlier this year and when I was Tcutting the overspray off the car I found 2 small air bubbles - 1 each side at the lower edge of the doors. No rust yet but I wash & wax my car very often so perhaps this kept it at bay. So I gave it some TLC & now it looks like a small stone chip that's been fixed. Dealer won't run to respray but they have deals with "chips away" type firms and usually pay £20 for small repairs. Why not offer to pay the garage for the "trade" cost of repair and you may both come out as winners. :y
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Hopefully Taxi Driver will be along shortly, he's an expert when it comes to getting VX to do rust spots on his 03 plate Omega ::)
Try going to another dealershit :-X whoops meant dealership, and ask !
Taxi Driver seems to get on famously at his dealership regarding his little rust spots and i'm VERY sure he didnt keep up his bodywork warrenty
2nd time at posting this :( 1st time it time out :(
Sorry ive only just read this thread :-[
I had a rust on the tailgate just under the wiper....common place on estates.....vx dealer had no problem booking it in and doing it under warranty......tho ive noticed recently its bubbling in the same place again :( and yes you are correct i dont have any anti corrosion stamps in my service book.
Vx dealer will be seeing the car again as soon as it starts to show rust stains !
Tho dont know how it will fare 2nd time around.....as ive vowed a vx dealer will never touch my car service/mechanically wise again! So dont know what there reaction will be as the service book wont have any more vx dealer stamps in it.
Its on 80k now....my local backstreet garage will do an oil/filter change on it (i supply vx semi synth and filter) i will change the plugs and change the air filter myself......get the garage to check the pads....they were last changed at 60k if ok then thats it. But no vx stamp in the book!
Try asking AA i know he had rust done on his 2.2 under warranty, i think the back door area :-/
Hes away for a few days so might not reply straight away :y
I have had no problems with the dealer regarding anti-perforation warranty.
Although to be fair, what I thought was rust turned out to be the inner door seal breaking down.
Front and rear offside doors fixed by the dealer under warranty, my book wasn't stamped at that point.