Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: philhoward on 13 May 2008, 19:48:07
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My Mig has been giving me major cause for concern this last week - has emptied the header tank of coolant 3 times over no more than a couple hundred miles.
It's always had a lumpt idle/stalling fetish and a rattle on startup, but it longer rattles on startup, just runs on 3 cylinders for 5 seconds. Strangely it no longer stalls after about 30 seconds idling (badly), but its now drinking water quicker than a fish. I think the bottom end of the engine isn't too clever either as the regular puffing of fumes from the oil filler cap is more reminisant of a knachered diesel.
I can't see any leaks anywhere, no evidence of any either. So far, its record is 130 miles before the heater goes cold and the temp jumps straight to the top of the gauge.
My first guess is a head gasket - but don't want to do it if the head might be cracked (I suspect the brown overspray in the engine bay is from a blown rad sometime in the past, given its new-ish appearance). Plus, given the blow-by, it's looking like a replacement lump. Oh, and the gearbox doesn't play ball as soon as its warm, either.
ANyone got an engine and auto box lying around, or will a Vectra lump fit...or an Auto Estate going cheap?
Bugger...nearly finished fitting the LPG as well...
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Sounds like the head gasket has gone but I wouldn't condemn the whole engine unless you are sure the bottom end is knocking. Is there exhaust fumes in the expansion tank? If you insist on driving it - which I personally think is a really bad idea (ceased/wrecked my engine doing this) then make sure you check the oil as well as the water. The oil will burn out from the heat and that is what will wreck it.
The idle - if not a symptom of the gasket failing will be your idle control valve. To fix that all you need to do is clean it and lubricate it. Clean the throttle body and it's surrounding breather pipes as well and you should find the car as good as new.
I'd change the head gasket and see how you go from there. It's not expensive if you do it yourself and not a bad job on the 2 litre. Can you describe the rattle a bit more - mabye even a video clip to get a better idea of the noise?
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Leaving aside the gearbox for the moment - you don't explain how it doesn't 'play ball' so lets take that separately.
You need to give the breather hoses/nozzle/throttle body and ICV a very thorough clean (there is an excellent guide in the Maint guide section). That should fix the idling and also improve running no end.
Drinking water - are you sure its not a leaking HBV? (round the back and difficult to see)
Fumes from oil filler - don't think that's particularly unusual, esp on a cold day.
What kind of mileage is it? 2L are known for bore wear on no.1 at high miles.
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Pretty sure its the head cracked now..fine drizzle of bubbles in the header tank from cold startup, and immediate pressure buildup. A certain whiff of exhaust gasses in there as well...definately not antifreeze mix...
Bottom end blow-by it quite profuse expulsions of air (from the filler cap) on each compression, cold, hot, whenever. Just gets more fumey (?) when warm.
The rough idling (which i was sure was actually the small bore breather - haven't had chance to do that one yet) has turned into a definite "miss" on one cylinder when warm at idle - almost rhythmic.
Didn't think the 4-pots had a HBV..but no signs of external leakage anywhere.
Have found a couple of Vectra engines - bar ancilliaries and exhaust manifold, are they the same?
Oh...mileage is 142k, by the way, and have also cleaned the ISCV out and lubed.
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Pretty sure its the head cracked now..fine drizzle of bubbles in the header tank from cold startup, and immediate pressure buildup. A certain whiff of exhaust gasses in there as well...definately not antifreeze mix...
Bottom end blow-by it quite profuse expulsions of air (from the filler cap) on each compression, cold, hot, whenever. Just gets more fumey (?) when warm.
The rough idling (which i was sure was actually the small bore breather - haven't had chance to do that one yet) has turned into a definite "miss" on one cylinder when warm at idle - almost rhythmic.
Didn't think the 4-pots had a HBV..but no signs of external leakage anywhere.
Have found a couple of Vectra engines - bar ancilliaries and exhaust manifold, are they the same?
Oh...mileage is 142k, by the way, and have also cleaned the ISCV out and lubed.
Yes but, you need to swap the ancillaries and sump over.
Also, try to get a 1998 or later engine as it has the balance shafts :y
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These symptoms all sound familar - the lump in my project car is totally clapped out!
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Word of caution when using an engine from another vauxhall. My replacement engine was from a cavalier so can't vouch for the vectra but when swapping sumps, the bolts and threads that connect it onto the block were totally different. I had to tap the block to fit the old sump on which ain't the brightest of ideas although still going strong. I'd imagine this won't be the case on a newer engine with the counter-weights.
Anyone vouch that the vectra engine will fit with no problem?
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Anyone vouch that the vectra engine will fit with no problem?
I hope it will...what about any differences between auto and manual engines? Spigot bearings?
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Anyone vouch that the vectra engine will fit with no problem?
I hope it will...what about any differences between auto and manual engines? Spigot bearings?
Manual will have a spigot bearing, the auto wont......but it can be removed with a bit of brute force if needed (not sure you do need to though).
The later Vec engine will fit with the same sump bolt holes.
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Pretty sure its the head cracked now..fine drizzle of bubbles in the header tank from cold startup, and immediate pressure buildup. A certain whiff of exhaust gasses in there as well...definately not antifreeze mix...
Bottom end blow-by it quite profuse expulsions of air (from the filler cap) on each compression, cold, hot, whenever. Just gets more fumey (?) when warm.
The rough idling (which i was sure was actually the small bore breather - haven't had chance to do that one yet) has turned into a definite "miss" on one cylinder when warm at idle - almost rhythmic.
Didn't think the 4-pots had a HBV..but no signs of external leakage anywhere.
Have found a couple of Vectra engines - bar ancilliaries and exhaust manifold, are they the same?
Oh...mileage is 142k, by the way, and have also cleaned the ISCV out and lubed.
If it has AC it will have HBV, otherwise not.
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Anyone vouch that the vectra engine will fit with no problem?
I hope it will...what about any differences between auto and manual engines? Spigot bearings?
Manual will have a spigot bearing, the auto wont......but it can be removed with a bit of brute force if needed (not sure you do need to though).
The later Vec engine will fit with the same sump bolt holes.
What's a definition of a later Vectra engine? I'm looking for an X20XEV - is that sufficient? Or am i looking for a post 98 (eg) Vectra?
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Same engine code (X20XEV) but you ARE looking for a POST 98 engine or you will not get the counter-weights and you run the risk of the bolts being different. You'll get a smoother drive with the counter-weights as well.
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How strange that Vauxhall (well, Opel) would do two engines of the same code, with differing sump bolt patterns!
Post 98 Vectra, then...
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That's what I thought but it's more to do with front wheel drive/rear wheel drive and date. I would actually imagine the sump bolts to be the same on the vectra engine pre 98 but I know for a fact it's different on the cavalier which is why you probably want to go post 98 to be on the safe side. You'll get the counter-weights on the post 98 engine as well, so makes sense to go for that one. The bolts being different on the cavalier probably has more to do with it having a completely different sump to the veccies and miggys (don't quote me on that).
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Think i've found an Omega engine...but carriage will cost more than the engine!
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Picked up the engine today - Early (non-balance shaft) one, but 90k on it and from an Auto as well. Hopefully £80 well spent (!) Will spend the rest of the savings on water pump, belt and tensioner..
Chap I got it from seems to know his Omegas - and reckoned that 90% of head/gasket failures are due to a clogged heater matrix. Now mine doesn't burn my fingers off so will give it a hosepiping first..
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AFAIK .. the experts here will tell you most HG failures are caused by an incorrect coolant/antifreeze mixture ... 50% water 50% vauxhall red is what is needed at all times .. and don't "top up" with just water ...
"Proper" antifreeze has anti-corrosion inhibitors in it .. in some ways these are more important then the anti-freezing properties .. :)
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I bought a job lot of antifreeze (Shell stuff, rebadged as Halfords, FWIW) a couple of years ago, so have plenty. For the last week only, i've been using water - purely because at 3l a day i can't afford it!
Normally have a bottle of 50/50 for topups anyway..just wondered if there was any truth in the matrix idea - is it part of the coolant bypass circuit?
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..just wondered if there was any truth in the matrix idea - is it part of the coolant bypass circuit?
If the heater is OFF there is no flow through the matrix.. so I wouldn't have thought so ... but an expert will pass by and correct me shortly ... :)
I'm not sure if non-VX antifreeze has the "corrrect" properties ... their own stuff is so cheap with a TC that it's not worth messing about elsewhere .. IMHO :)
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This stuff is the dogs dangly bits as far as generic antifreeze goes - anti-corrision, etc. Shocked me when it was in Halfords bottles, but it was left-overs from some Shell sponsorship deal someone had for a race series.
Unless VX+TC anti-freeze comes in at less than £5/5 litres, then i'll keep using up my stock (which is starting to run low..)
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..just wondered if there was any truth in the matrix idea - is it part of the coolant bypass circuit?
If the heater is OFF there is no flow through the matrix.. so I wouldn't have thought so ... but an expert will pass by and correct me shortly ... :)
Strange question - why else would there be a HBV for aircon cars (I don't have one on mine - no aircon)?
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..just wondered if there was any truth in the matrix idea - is it part of the coolant bypass circuit?
If the heater is OFF there is no flow through the matrix.. so I wouldn't have thought so ... but an expert will pass by and correct me shortly ... :)
Strange question - why else would there be a HBV for aircon cars (I don't have one on mine - no aircon)?
HBV there to prevent hot coolant going into heater matrix when you are trying to chill car...
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Picked up the engine today - Early (non-balance shaft) one, but 90k on it and from an Auto as well. Hopefully £80 well spent (!) Will spend the rest of the savings on water pump, belt and tensioner..
Chap I got it from seems to know his Omegas - and reckoned that 90% of head/gasket failures are due to a clogged heater matrix. Now mine doesn't burn my fingers off so will give it a hosepiping first..
What a load of crap.....the heater matrix is not considered part of the engine cooling system as on many of the cars, the flow though it can be stopped!
Its normally due to poor antifreeze changes resulting in the composite material failing and/or corrosion of the alloy head
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Don't shoot the messenger! I know its plausible with other cars, just wondered if there was any truth in it, that's all..
Just grabbing a bacon butty given rain has stopped play..oh for a double garage/barn...