Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: pscocoa on 17 October 2008, 19:02:09
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Having followed closely the need to be vigilant on cam belt change I took my V6 3.2 elite to VX for cam belt change today - picked it up at about 4pm by 4.15pm on dual carriageway belt jumped.
Pulled over but at 60 mph I assume it will be big damage - VX came to pick me up and I just gave them keys and left it with them. Not a lot you can say. Will sort out hire car stuff with them next week when my son needs Omega.
Shame becuase it passed its MOT with no expense and even tyres with 20000 miles on them are only half worn.
VX will have to assess if it is technician error or part failure.
I am off to Cornwall in 20 mins for a week - lucky we have the Signum.
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If Vx supplied parts and fitted any damage is their problem and they should rectify to your satisfaction!!
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If Vx supplied parts and fitted any damage is their problem and they should rectify to your satisfaction!!
Indeed, even if it means a new engine!! :D :D :y
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VX will have to assess if it is technician error or part failure.
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It could be either but neither is your concern! Don't let them fob you off. When they've 'accessed' your car you should end up with a fully running car ... as it was when you drove in!
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Thanks - yes they have made that clear that I have no cost in this - it was just not quite the end to the day I was expecting - I cannot get uptight about it as I now have a 4 hour drive or so and will sort out when I get back.
They claim this is first V6 cam to have failed and it was one of their senior guys who fitted it first thing this morning - car went on same site for MOT later and so would have to be run for emissions test. It ran ok for a few mins out of garage and then engine light came on - rattling started and I just pulled over.
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ouch! it may be a pain in the arse to happen but it means alot of new parts in the top end of your engine which can only be a good thing!
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ah sandhurst, Roger Buden territory, very sorry to hear about your lovely car i would be very upset if that happened to me. Dealer or diy. As said, down to them. Might get a new motor? I will save my
****ing dealers rant for another time. You've had enough agro.
Its easy to leave a guide wheel undone i guess but, as i found out only last weekend, there is only one adjustable guide wheel on a 3.2, the other is a not adjustable. So fairly poor from the mech.
Very best of luck with your car, i hope it turns out well for you. To be honest i dont see how they can get out of it tbh. Will be interesting to see what they do. Chris.
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Thanks all - finally got to Cornwall destination at 2am - after being given some duff directions by a local as to the house we had rented.Still here now in Mawnan Smith/Penwarne area - for Cornwall, SAT NAV can only put you in the general area - private roads and deep foliage more challenging.
Waiting for VX to call!!
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this happend to my mv6 at its 80k belt change belt broke 3 miles down the road however interchape wouldnt admit liability so the previous owner (BT FLEET) commenced legal action againt interchape for a replacement engine vx charge £ 2970 for a v6 upper rebuild still got the invoice here
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VX dealer advises snapped bolt on tensioner causing tensioner to move - bolts supplied with kit therefore they think it is VX warranty issue. VX have advised dealer to refit belt and see what happens but I think we all know that the damage has been done. Nothing I can do now til tuesday
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...... VX have advised dealer to refit belt and see what happens .......
Just to make sure that all 24 valves are bent & their guides are fubared! :-? :-? :-?
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Thanks all - finally got to Cornwall destination at 2am - after being given some duff directions by a local as to the house we had rented.Still here now in Mawnan Smith/Penwarne area - for Cornwall, SAT NAV can only put you in the general area - private roads and deep foliage more challenging.
Waiting for VX to call!!
Bloody hell that is an area I know very well!
Are you on the the main Mawnan Argal road or on a side road
Make sure you visit Roskillys - VERY nice.
Brilliant beach about a mile from you.
Don't annoy any farmers, if they are in John Deere tractors they are related, I have relations working on a farm just north of Mawnan Smith, and live there, the pictures of me reversing with van are there, the beach picture is that beach.
Oh and my Great Grandad and Great Great Grandad (mums side) were head gardeners at Glendurgan gardens near Mawnan
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VX dealer advises snapped bolt on tensioner causing tensioner to move - bolts supplied with kit therefore they think it is VX warranty issue. VX have advised dealer to refit belt and see what happens but I think we all know that the damage has been done. Nothing I can do now til tuesday
No bolt on the tensioner, just a nut on a stud.....bet the handfisted bugger didn;t use a torque wrench to 20Nm on it!
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VX dealer advises snapped bolt on tensioner causing tensioner to move - bolts supplied with kit therefore they think it is VX warranty issue. VX have advised dealer to refit belt and see what happens but I think we all know that the damage has been done. Nothing I can do now til tuesday
No bolt on the tensioner, just a nut on a stud.....bet the handfisted bugger didn;t use a torque wrench to 20Nm on it!
You think it may have been overtightened, and maybe thread stripped?
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VX dealer advises snapped bolt on tensioner causing tensioner to move - bolts supplied with kit therefore they think it is VX warranty issue. VX have advised dealer to refit belt and see what happens but I think we all know that the damage has been done. Nothing I can do now til tuesday
No bolt on the tensioner, just a nut on a stud.....bet the handfisted bugger didn;t use a torque wrench to 20Nm on it!
You think it may have been overtightened, and maybe thread stripped?
Or damaged.....if the thread on the stud had been stretched then it would be weak and could shear at ony moment.....and most likely once everything had got nicely stinking hot, expanded adn been revved a bit.
Thing is, its rare you see mechanics using torque wrenches!
Either way, Vx will examine that stud and if it was over tightened then they will be able to tell by looking at the fracture and state of the nut etc!
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Thing is, its rare you see mechanics using torque wrenches!
I agree. I don't use one for everything, but for items such as cambelt pulleys I use one without fail. In fact, If it's someone elses car, I show them the torques before the covers go back on!! It's a kind of "insurance" against anything going belly up!
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I use it for almost all the bolts.....particularly into alloy!
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I use it for almost all the bolts.....particularly into alloy!
Apart from with geniune manifold gaskets.. ::)
(But I agree - I do these by hand too :) )
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VX dealer told me that they had checked thread and it was not cross threaded but the other responses on the site re. torquing look to hold most likely reasons
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VX dealer advises snapped bolt on tensioner causing tensioner to move - bolts supplied with kit therefore they think it is VX warranty issue. VX have advised dealer to refit belt and see what happens but I think we all know that the damage has been done. Nothing I can do now til tuesday
No bolt on the tensioner, just a nut on a stud.....bet the handfisted bugger didn;t use a torque wrench to 20Nm on it!
You think it may have been overtightened, and maybe thread stripped?
Or damaged.....if the thread on the stud had been stretched then it would be weak and could shear at ony moment.....and most likely once everything had got nicely stinking hot, expanded adn been revved a bit.
Thing is, its rare you see mechanics using torque wrenches!
Either way, Vx will examine that stud and if it was over tightened then they will be able to tell by looking at the fracture and state of the nut etc!
Do you thinks it could have been done up to 40 like the other bolts on the guide wheels and pensioner plate. Hope is 40 anyway, thats what i did mind to. Hang on a minute, he said the bolt was supplied with the kit. That says to me the top pulley adjustable guide(or whatever its called) bolt...? Rather than the pensioner itself? But then again that bolt may be less likely to shear perhaps?
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Thanks all - finally got to Cornwall destination at 2am - after being given some duff directions by a local as to the house we had rented.Still here now in Mawnan Smith/Penwarne area - for Cornwall, SAT NAV can only put you in the general area - private roads and deep foliage more challenging.
Waiting for VX to call!!
Bloody hell that is an area I know very well!
Are you on the the main Mawnan Argal road or on a side road
Make sure you visit Roskillys - VERY nice.
Brilliant beach about a mile from you.
Don't annoy any farmers, if they are in John Deere tractors they are related, I have relations working on a farm just north of Mawnan Smith, and live there, the pictures of me reversing with van are there, the beach picture is that beach.
Oh and my Great Grandad and Great Great Grandad (mums side) were head gardeners at Glendurgan gardens near Mawnan
We are on a side road - just spent evening in Red Lion in Mawnan Smith and will be out on Helford River tomorrow - yes there is a lot of tractor activity on the private road - I think you mean Grebe Beach.
Front spoiler on Omega would have been a bit of a problem round here - Signum higher and suspension is better suited to winding roads.
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Red Lion not brilliant try the Ferry Boat at Helford Passage, beaches Grebe is OK but the best is Maenporth, the ones along the Helford are OK, Durgan, Trebah and Helford Passage, walked to Trebah from Durgan along the waterside many years ago.
For food the best places we have found are Harbour Lights near Trago in Falmouth, Maenport Beach Cafe (open all year) burgers, chips bacon sandwiches all good quality.
Ferry Boat is nice but very expensive, lovely view over looking the water though.
http://www.martinimber.co.uk/hp.htm
If you go down past Goonhilly Earth Station and follow the signs Roskillys do lovely ice cream and very good food, we had a lovely barbeque on holiday there.
Never had any problems with Omegas down the lanes - even when the rear suspension wore out on my current car
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sounds really suspicious to me. The tensioner has a nut/stud not bolt I would have thought that you'd have to be really ham fisted to over tighten that. in any event the tensioner set up is not V6 specific so if the mechanic had over tighten it then it is quite likely he has done so before. More likely that he's either not done the tensioner up properly or that the idler pulleys have not been tighened properly.
it seems like the dealer is being fair but if they are 'refitting the belt and trying it' there may have been some longer term damage: suppose that one of the valve has been slightly damaged and it fails within say a year or two.
My advice, when you collect your car is to make sure that they specify what has happened in writing and the warranty they will give you should something arise later on: I think VX give 2 year warrant and they should stand up to that. It is after all why you are paying VX labour rates
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sounds really suspicious to me. The tensioner has a nut/stud not bolt I would have thought that you'd have to be really ham fisted to over tighten that. in any event the tensioner set up is not V6 specific so if the mechanic had over tighten it then it is quite likely he has done so before. More likely that he's either not done the tensioner up properly or that the idler pulleys have not been tighened properly.
it seems like the dealer is being fair but if they are 'refitting the belt and trying it' there may have been some longer term damage: suppose that one of the valve has been slightly damaged and it fails within say a year or two.
My advice, when you collect your car is to make sure that they specify what has happened in writing and the warranty they will give you should something arise later on: I think VX give 2 year warrant and they should stand up to that. It is after all why you are paying VX labour rates
Can they do a compression test or some other test to check valve condition without stripping engine down? Thanks for the advice.
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a compression test would be the obvious thing to do under the circumstances, just hope they dont try & fob you off by saying it sounds o,k so it must be o,k, sometimes they can take advantage of peoples lack of knowledge & fob them off, perhaps when you get it back get it checked by someone else just in case.
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If the valves have just been nicked then its possible that a compression test wont show much.
A vac test will show up any issues a lot better.
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i wonder if an evaluation by in independent body such as the AA would be worth going into? I suppose it depends if your entirely satisfied with the car when you get it back... I dont see how, when doing sixty, that the valves can not be damaged...? I saw an alpha 142(?) twin spark the other day. It had striped its belt. You could clearly see the half moon valve marks in the soot on the pistons when looking down the spark plug holes. A bit more of a fiddle on the omega and may need a scope to see in there but easier than taking the heads off imho.
Just a thought.
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i wonder if an evaluation by in independent body such as the AA would be worth going into? I suppose it depends if your entirely satisfied with the car when you get it back... I dont see how, when doing sixty, that the valves can not be damaged...? I saw an alpha 142(?) twin spark the other day. It had striped its belt. You could clearly see the half moon valve marks in the soot on the pistons when looking down the spark plug holes. A bit more of a fiddle on the omega and may need a scope to see in there but easier than taking the heads off imho.
Just a thought.
I suspect they will just drop a GMX exchange engine in.....
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I had both my 'meegas done at VX, and apart from the price it all went well.... I drove the second 'meega for another 25 miles before selling it, and it was spot-on.
Keep in mind that there are many V6 Vectras out there, so even considering the rarity of Omegas being serviced by main dealers these days, thy mechanics still get a fair chance to train on the V6 cambelt change.
Very feasible it wasn't the garage fault, but faulty part, and as said by others they seem to be pretty fair about it so far.
Not defending Vx dealers mind you, has my share of trouble (oil filter housing tightened to front-wheel-bearing torque, pads fitted wrong-way-round...) but they don't always get it wrong.
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Latest position is that VX cannot get the stud out of the head - they need a specialist who cannot do the job til Wednesday. VX
say there are 3 studs and do not believe that problem with just one is a torque problem. They have been told by Luton to try car with a new belt as soon as they can before proceeding further.
Only car they have is a new Agila - not an attractive substitute for the motorway.
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Latest position is that VX cannot get the stud out of the head - they need a specialist who cannot do the job til Wednesday. VX
say there are 3 studs and do not believe that problem with just one is a torque problem. They have been told by Luton to try car with a new belt as soon as they can before proceeding further.
Only car they have is a new Agila - not an attractive substitute for the motorway.
Kick up a stink and they will provide a hire car :y
I have to say I am getting more and more suspicious!
It now sounds more like an idler bolt that has failed and if that is the case then it is likely to be the one to block, if it is then it will be toast!
Now to snap that one, you really having to go some...cross threaded I wonder!
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(http://i344.photobucket.com/albums/p326/chrisgixer/10102008226.jpg)
pic of cam belt so you can see what everyone is on about.
4 cam wheels at the top, smaller adjustable idler in between cam wheels 2 and 3 (the one they are talking about) with torx bolt,torque to 40nm.
the tensioner on the left under cam wheel 1 with nut on smaller stud to adjust, 20nm.
Bottom idler lower right, not adjustable, also 40nm.
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(http://i344.photobucket.com/albums/p326/chrisgixer/20102008239.jpg)
ok just re read and i just twigged, the only idler that bolts into the engine is the bottom non adjustable one. the idler ,top midlle in previous pic, bolts into a backing plate that carrys the adjustable idler, on the right in this pic, and the tensioner on the left. if they used a cam belt kit for your car, all they do is swap the backing plate with rollers attached.
So, from your post it sounds like the bottom non adjustable pulley bolt has failed...? But that does not bolt into the cylinder head...
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complain to Vx direct stealer's are a joke when things go wrong going on my local stealer i doubt Luton even know id demand a new engine and a Suitable hire car ie signum/vectra! remember sale of goods act applies to garages aswell and you have the right to refuse an repair work they do!
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Thanks for all the support - I am still on holiday so trying not to get too involved as VX Luton are working with dealer. Dealer thinks engine is curtains but has to go through Luton procedure. I do not need a car now until next week as my son got sorted with something else and then for me a runabout will do for a week. Dealer is in touch with Luton and they have been ok in past so will go with the flow until tomorrow night and see if they have got stud out and tried cam.
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Update - specialist removed bolt from head - there is a fracture down centre of stud - VX Luton were on site for another job and observed that stud did not look good. Another VX Luton guy is coming on wednesday to make a decision as to whether it is a new engine or a rebuild. Local VX say I can have car by friday if it is a new engine - if they are told to strip it dowm it will be a week at least - especially if heads are damaged and they are searching for parts. Apparently there are a few V6 3.2 refurbed engines on shelf.
I have made the point that they have already incurred costs to refurb the engines on shelf so why not give me one of those rather than incur more cost in rebuilding mine and try and keep customer moderately happy. Only the Omega uses this engine.
Will go and pick up an Agila courtsey car tomorrow
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Where would one of us stand if this happend to us due to faulty parts? How would we be able to prove it?
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i wondered about that, i think i saw trade club parts haveing a 2 year warranty? Not sure about the time scale but i guess the real issue is how do you prove it was fitted correctly if not fitted by them? In the event of a diy failure, first thing they will say is, you must have over torqued it, or whatever.
Does seen like the garage are being reasonable in this case, if a little slow perhaps.
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I am getting very suspicious of what is happening with VX bolts and studs. I had the dual mass flywheel and clutch problem (common fault on the diesel apparently due to torque) on the Signum about 2/3 months ago which was replaced under warranty not at usual VX dealer (where Omega is now) but another one local to me as it had to be towed.
About 2 weeks later on another trip back from Cornwall a rattling begins - turns out the drive shaft bearing cover bolts have come off - had to wait best part of 2 weeks for parts to arrive - VX gave us ok cars for both periods off road.
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I am getting very suspicious of what is happening with VX bolts and studs. I had the dual mass flywheel and clutch problem (common fault on the diesel apparently due to torque) on the Signum about 2/3 months ago which was replaced under warranty not at usual VX dealer (where Omega is now) but another one local to me as it had to be towed.
About 2 weeks later on another trip back from Cornwall a rattling begins - turns out the drive shaft bearing cover bolts have come off - had to wait best part of 2 weeks for parts to arrive - VX gave us ok cars for both periods off road.
Sounds like another example of inferior workmanship by the fitters again to be honest!
The rive shafts etc have to be removed to get to the DMF!
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Update- VX Luton attended yesterday - they dispute the fractured bolt even though the specialist called in to remove it is of the opinion that it is a flaw in the bolt. VX Luton consider that dealer did not tighten bolts properly - eventhough car was run and MOTd and passed emsions test afterwards. This in contrast to other opinions on this site that it may have been over tightened.
Dealer and VX Luton now have to slug it out. Dealer is being very fair and is fitting new engine monday and all the parts are being sent for independent analysis. Left to VX Luton the car would just stay there until the parties had come to a conclusion so I am grateful for the dealer in making a decision to sort me ouit and deal with the consequences later. At retail prices this has got to be £4500 - I think the engine alone is £3000.
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Sounds like a good result really... Shame you've had the stress and inconvenience but a new engine.... Well done to your local dealer for just sorting it and then fighting it out later :y :y
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Update - interesting one- because I have not paid anything towards the new engine VX Luton maintain there is no warranty - but if I pay 10% then I get a warranty. After discussion dealer is going back to VX pointing out that VX and dealer have now agreed 50/50 split of costs and therefore dealer contribution is effectively my contribution.
I have pointed out also that I brought in a car which was working perfectly and had had no issues of any consequence for years - to go away with a new engine which might fail due to defects in materials and then have no come back leaves me in a worse position.
Also just what can go wrong in transfer of old parts to new engine?
I should get car back on Wed almost 3 weeks since the problem. Still have the V6 VX Agila (ok maybe it is not V6!) which is a fun car actually. Journey to Manchester and back not too bad at all as traffic was more or less at 70mph all the way on M6 and M40.
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Sounds like a load of cobblers to me. It's not your fault that you needed a new engine in the first place, and given that your engine was fitted by the same people who fitted your previous cam belt kit. I don't think I'd be inclined to drive it out of the garage without a warranty of some kind.
Kevin
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well, you should be paying for the new cambelt, less something for the inconvenience of the problem (perhaps less everything???)
All workmanship and materials should be covered by VX warranty, so as long as they invoice you for the work they have done it should be fine
YBH, it sounds like your dealer has been fair with you and the liklihood is that they will be fair if further trouble occurs. Despite us knocking VX dealers it is good to hear good stories sometimes
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VX dealer advises snapped bolt on tensioner causing tensioner to move - bolts supplied with kit therefore they think it is VX warranty issue. VX have advised dealer to refit belt and see what happens but I think we all know that the damage has been done. Nothing I can do now til tuesday
No bolt on the tensioner, just a nut on a stud.....bet the handfisted bugger didn;t use a torque wrench to 20Nm on it!
You think it may have been overtightened, and maybe thread stripped?
Or damaged.....if the thread on the stud had been stretched then it would be weak and could shear at ony moment.....and most likely once everything had got nicely stinking hot, expanded adn been revved a bit.
Thing is, its rare you see mechanics using torque wrenches!Either way, Vx will examine that stud and if it was over tightened then they will be able to tell by looking at the fracture and state of the nut etc!
yep..even in services :(
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Sounds to me mate that it's time to consult a solicitor, or Consumer Direct - http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/ (0845 04 05 06).
Find out what your rights are - don't guess.
Good luck :y
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well, you should be paying for the new cambelt, less something for the inconvenience of the problem (perhaps less everything???)
All workmanship and materials should be covered by VX warranty, so as long as they invoice you for the work they have done it should be fine
YBH, it sounds like your dealer has been fair with you and the liklihood is that they will be fair if further trouble occurs. Despite us knocking VX dealers it is good to hear good stories sometimes
I have already paid for the cambelt as the problem arose when driving it away from garage. I will have to wait and see what they come up with - but yes - the dealer has been good on this matter.
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maybe I've got the wrong end of the stick here but is the dealer saying that if you had paid for the new engine there would we a warranty but as you have not paid for it there is nothing. the answer is obvious!
Dealer refunds you for the cambelt change because after all that was faulty. you then pay the same amount for the new engine. Solution: you have a warranty!
Whether the dealer will play ball will depend on whether any warranty claims are reimbused by VX or are a dealer cost. I suspect the former so he should play ball
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maybe I've got the wrong end of the stick here but is the dealer saying that if you had paid for the new engine there would we a warranty but as you have not paid for it there is nothing. the answer is obvious!
Dealer refunds you for the cambelt change because after all that was faulty. you then pay the same amount for the new engine. Solution: you have a warranty!
Whether the dealer will play ball will depend on whether any warranty claims are reimbused by VX or are a dealer cost. I suspect the former so he should play ball
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maybe I've got the wrong end of the stick here but is the dealer saying that if you had paid for the new engine there would we a warranty but as you have not paid for it there is nothing. the answer is obvious!
Dealer refunds you for the cambelt change because after all that was faulty. you then pay the same amount for the new engine. Solution: you have a warranty!
Whether the dealer will play ball will depend on whether any warranty claims are reimbused by VX or are a dealer cost. I suspect the former so he should play ball
You make a good point - will try this if not sorted sensibly. About 5 years ago I had a sun roof under warranty but had to pay 10% as they considered sunroof an accessory - wrangling went on for a short while but it was only £20 to pay so dropped it.
Cam belt cost will be about 10% of VX costs for engine.
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I am a pretty laid back guy and maybe that is the source of the problem - engine arrived on Monday and was told ready for tuesday. I was away on tuesday so said no problems pick it up wednesday - give VX more time and no pressure (so I thought). Set off to pick up tonight - told sorry not ready - wait for it - a problem with some bolts!!! Awaiting parts from VX.
What is it with these bolts? Something very strange!
Get home and there is a VX letter recalling the Signum for a handbrake modification!!
Can't pick the Omega up tomorrow so hope for friday.
Warranty issue now resolved anyway -12 months warranty on engine agreed.
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I am a pretty laid back guy and maybe that is the source of the problem - engine arrived on Monday and was told ready for tuesday. I was away on tuesday so said no problems pick it up wednesday - give VX more time and no pressure (so I thought). Set off to pick up tonight - told sorry not ready - wait for it - a problem with some bolts!!! Awaiting parts from VX.
What is it with these bolts? Something very strange!
Get home and there is a VX letter recalling the Signum for a handbrake modification!!
Can't pick the Omega up tomorrow so hope for friday.
Warranty issue now resolved anyway -12 months warranty on engine agreed.
i bet the recall letter for the signum is for them to stick a note on the sunvisor telling you to leave it in gear when parked. we lost a few traffic cars when the handbrake failed and about a year ago they recalled the vectra to give us a sticker, still havent fixed the problem!
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I am a pretty laid back guy and maybe that is the source of the problem - engine arrived on Monday and was told ready for tuesday. I was away on tuesday so said no problems pick it up wednesday - give VX more time and no pressure (so I thought). Set off to pick up tonight - told sorry not ready - wait for it - a problem with some bolts!!! Awaiting parts from VX.
What is it with these bolts? Something very strange!
Get home and there is a VX letter recalling the Signum for a handbrake modification!!
Can't pick the Omega up tomorrow so hope for friday.
Warranty issue now resolved anyway -12 months warranty on engine agreed.
i bet the recall letter for the signum is for them to stick a note on the sunvisor telling you to leave it in gear when parked. we lost a few traffic cars when the handbrake failed and about a year ago they recalled the vectra to give us a sticker, still havent fixed the problem!
No manufacturer has.....its a standad brake setup used on loads of cars from VAG to Ford.
The issue is that you clamp a disc ....which might be hot and when it cools down it contracts and off it rolls.
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I am a pretty laid back guy and maybe that is the source of the problem - engine arrived on Monday and was told ready for tuesday. I was away on tuesday so said no problems pick it up wednesday - give VX more time and no pressure (so I thought). Set off to pick up tonight - told sorry not ready - wait for it - a problem with some bolts!!! Awaiting parts from VX.
What is it with these bolts? Something very strange!
Get home and there is a VX letter recalling the Signum for a handbrake modification!!
Can't pick the Omega up tomorrow so hope for friday.
Warranty issue now resolved anyway -12 months warranty on engine agreed.
i bet the recall letter for the signum is for them to stick a note on the sunvisor telling you to leave it in gear when parked. we lost a few traffic cars when the handbrake failed and about a year ago they recalled the vectra to give us a sticker, still havent fixed the problem!
No manufacturer has.....its a standad brake setup used on loads of cars from VAG to Ford.
The issue is that you clamp a disc ....which might be hot and when it cools down it contracts and off it rolls.
A guy at work had exactly that with a new honda civic, his parking space is on a slope, just got the key to his flat in the front door and bang, it hit a car in the bay opposite. He new what had happened, it just took him 5 mins to summon the courage to turn round and actually see it for himself. Not a happy chap.
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Easy answer is always leave an auto in park and always leave a manual in the gear opposite to the direction the car could roll.
I was always taught to start a manual car with the clutch engaged thereby removing the drag of turning the gearbox with the starter motor, point being that it's irrelevant if the car is in gear when you start it then.
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Dont know why they didnt stick with the older omega type handbrake setup.when the hot drum cools and contracts,it must contract tighter around the shoes, making the handbrake more effective. :-/
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Dont know why they didnt stick with the older omega type handbrake setup.when the hot drum cools and contracts,it must contract tighter around the shoes, making the handbrake more effective. :-/
Cost saving measure. The Omega effectively has 2 brake setups at the rear - a disk and a drum. Compared to just adding a few parts to the brake caliper to support a handbrake, it's expensive.
I have to say I have the Ford style rear disk brake with hand brake on my kit car and it has been fine. It's not a heavy car, though, and I guess in "normal" road driving the brake probably doesn't get too hot.
Kevin
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Dont know why they didnt stick with the older omega type handbrake setup.when the hot drum cools and contracts,it must contract tighter around the shoes, making the handbrake more effective. :-/
Cost saving measure. ......
You used to get twin pot calipers at the front of a Vauxhall/Opel eg Manta Mk I Cavalier. IMHO far better than the crappy sliding caliper set ups that are used now.
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Dont know why they didnt stick with the older omega type handbrake setup.when the hot drum cools and contracts,it must contract tighter around the shoes, making the handbrake more effective. :-/
Cost saving measure. ......
You used to get twin pot calipers at the front of a Vauxhall/Opel eg Manta Mk I Cavalier. IMHO far better than the crappy sliding caliper set ups that are used now.
Agreed, although twin pots are probably heavier, but that was a cost cutting measure too. IIRC, even my [size=8]Morris Ital[/size] had twin-pot front calipers and certainly all the early Ford stuff did too.
Kevin
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I am a pretty laid back guy and maybe that is the source of the problem - engine arrived on Monday and was told ready for tuesday. I was away on tuesday so said no problems pick it up wednesday - give VX more time and no pressure (so I thought). Set off to pick up tonight - told sorry not ready - wait for it - a problem with some bolts!!! Awaiting parts from VX.
What is it with these bolts? Something very strange!
Get home and there is a VX letter recalling the Signum for a handbrake modification!!
Can't pick the Omega up tomorrow so hope for friday.
Warranty issue now resolved anyway -12 months warranty on engine agreed.
i bet the recall letter for the signum is for them to stick a note on the sunvisor telling you to leave it in gear when parked. we lost a few traffic cars when the handbrake failed and about a year ago they recalled the vectra to give us a sticker, still havent fixed the problem!
No manufacturer has.....its a standad brake setup used on loads of cars from VAG to Ford.
The issue is that you clamp a disc ....which might be hot and when it cools down it contracts and off it rolls.
Letter re Signum says "Vauxhall is introducing as a Customer Satisfaction Programme a modification to the handbrake mechanism to reduce the possibility of incorrectly setting the handbrake"
But yes I am old school as well and always leave it in gear - not sure my wife does though!!
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Omega is now back from VX dealer looking pretty good as they have given it a valet clean given it took exactly 3 weeks to fix. I was handed a pack of papers about the exchange engine - it says on the envelope for completion by dealer but nothing is filled in so will have to look at that - to do with running in instructions recording mileage and some installation instructions about the new engine including the preparatory cleaning of parts before fitting to the exchange engine. This info also validates the 12 month warranty.
An oil and filter change is due at 1000 miles or 1 month - and to keep an eye on temperature gauge.
The only issue today is that central locking on key fob seems "lazy" - i.e. lock and unlock in quick succession and it does not seem to have power to operate door mechanisms. Is this likely to be a battery fault in the key fob? Will test again later.
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I'd suggest you wait until say wednesday: give it a few days for anything immediate to fall off: then I'd call them to say there is a bit of paperwork that they need to complete but you'll drop in in a month for them to do that and the oil/filter change (bearing in mind that you should not pay for that cos the new engine is their fault!!!)
Overall, sounds like they have been fair
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I have done 52 miles since last week when I picked car up as I have been away on business.
At 7.15am today guess what ?- engine light on - fortunately just entering station car park. Turned off and on - no joy light still on.
I have now swapped back to the dealer Agila again and they drove Omega away from station with light on.
What a first day back.
Good job I can handle the stress.
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oh dear. Well at least they are still trying to get it right
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We will try again tomorrow - car is ready for collection - again! Reason for EML light on new engine ?- "we wired something incorrectly" says dealer.
Not sure how they could do this with Tech 2 presumably giving fault codes to help avoid this.
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We will try again tomorrow - car is ready for collection - again! Reason for EML light on new engine ?- "we wired something incorrectly" says dealer.
Not sure how they could do this with Tech 2 presumably giving fault codes to help avoid this.
you should have asked them that, how can they manage that with a tech 2 to help them!
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We will try again tomorrow - car is ready for collection - again! Reason for EML light on new engine ?- "we wired something incorrectly" says dealer.
Not sure how they could do this with Tech 2 presumably giving fault codes to help avoid this.
See the pedal trick, listed under paper clip test. It would have flashed out any engine trouble code for you without the need for tech 2. Just to cross reference what they say.
When my next belt is due i may use this garage, you never know, might get a new lump... Refreshing response from the dealer, bound to be a few grenlins i suppose, it is vx after all.
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Omega is now back from VX dealer looking pretty good as they have given it a valet clean given it took exactly 3 weeks to fix. I was handed a pack of papers about the exchange engine - it says on the envelope for completion by dealer but nothing is filled in so will have to look at that - to do with running in instructions recording mileage and some installation instructions about the new engine including the preparatory cleaning of parts before fitting to the exchange engine. This info also validates the 12 month warranty.
An oil and filter change is due at 1000 miles or 1 month - and to keep an eye on temperature gauge.
The only issue today is that central locking on key fob seems "lazy" - i.e. lock and unlock in quick succession and it does not seem to have power to operate door mechanisms. Is this likely to be a battery fault in the key fob? Will test again later.
I had this on my car when left for a week or so if yours has been sitting for three weeks and battery has lost it's charge then try fully charging it and then try the central locking :).
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As regards key fob- I have given up wondering what it could be but a run down battery is interesting - given that I have only used the car 2 days in about 5 weeks now (4 weeks in VX dealer) - I pick it up today and am away again tomorrow - and no prospect of a long run for about 2/3 weeks.
As regards EML will try and get more info later.
Maybe they use my vehicles for training purposes. The signum is up country on another long haul - no adverse reports as yet - but obviously losing confidence in VX on reliability.
As stated before - no problems on Omega for a year since last service - now wondering if I dare venture too far in it. Will give it a good run when I get chance.
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Well what a saga you have had.
Would think your car will be like a new one once the teething problems are sorted. :y
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As regards key fob- I have given up wondering what it could be but a run down battery is interesting - given that I have only used the car 2 days in about 5 weeks now (4 weeks in VX dealer) - I pick it up today and am away again tomorrow - and no prospect of a long run for about 2/3 weeks.
As regards EML will try and get more info later.
Maybe they use my vehicles for training purposes. The signum is up country on another long haul - no adverse reports as yet - but obviously losing confidence in VX on reliability.
As stated before - no problems on Omega for a year since last service - now wondering if I dare venture too far in it. Will give it a good run when I get chance.
:(
careless and incompetent services..as usual..
dont worry this will end up..but stay on top of them if possible..
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We will try again tomorrow - car is ready for collection - again! Reason for EML light on new engine ?- "we wired something incorrectly" says dealer.
Not sure how they could do this with Tech 2 presumably giving fault codes to help avoid this.
you should have asked them that, how can they manage that with a tech 2 to help them!
Ok - car returned and running - the reason given was as follows:
" there are a number of sensors and the leads to them are all the same colour. The technician was not the same one as did the job and so he went through the manual to check everything in order. At the finish they waited for the return of the technician who had done the job and it transpires he had put one/two in wrong order but this did not manifest itself straight away. "
Well it took a week to reveal itself but I only did 52 miles in that week.
Handbrake now feels a bit odd - maybe something sticking. Will leave until 1000 mile service. Anyway away again tomorrow so it will sit here a bit longer.
Signum got back from 550 mile journey in 2 days without mishap - so I suppose that is something.
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" there are a number of sensors and the leads to them are all the same colour. The technician was not the same one as did the job and so he went through the manual to check everything in order. At the finish they waited for the return of the technician who had done the job and it transpires he had put one/two in wrong order but this did not manifest itself straight away. "
Good god, I would never, ever, let VX near my car...