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Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: TaxiManDan on 20 November 2009, 22:03:54

Title: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 20 November 2009, 22:03:54
Hi guys, really need some advice please.
i have a mettalic rattle from the lower part of the engine, really only noticible when down low listning, first i thought big ends but now not so sure as it does not get worse with revving the engine, the car drive perfect, i have got a bit of a worn aux belt tensioner and if i use a mechanical stefisicope it sounds rattly on it, but can the noise travel that far? when revving the engine u can hardly here it at all. i just hope its nothing to do with the big ends, any ideas?
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: rustym95 on 20 November 2009, 22:56:50
could be weak engine oil when was it changed, i use a bit of hose pipe and listern to engine with that should find out were it is coming from. :y
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 20 November 2009, 23:04:44
Quote
could be weak engine oil when was it changed, i use a bit of hose pipe and listern to engine with that should find out were it is coming from. :y
i changed it not long ago at all with genuine vaux 10/40
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: rustym95 on 20 November 2009, 23:10:12
well that ok then just check with hose pipe and find out were the rattle is coming from, run engine and listern to it with the pipe, get rid of the engine sound a bit so you can pin point the rattle. :y
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: RobG on 20 November 2009, 23:23:04
Remove aux. belt and run engine for about a minute. If noise has gone gonna possibly be tensioner, water pump or aircon compressor
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 20 November 2009, 23:40:20
it almost sounds like a ball bearing ish sort of rattle, are the big ends common on the 2.6 s
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: RobG on 20 November 2009, 23:44:39
If it was the big end bearings you`d know about when you revved the engine :o
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 20 November 2009, 23:45:41
thats what i thought, i have just seen so many vectra engines die from this i am probably a bit paranoid
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: RobG on 20 November 2009, 23:47:52
Try it with the aux belt removed first. At least it will give you some idea (might even rid you of your paranoia) ;D
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 20 November 2009, 23:48:38
lol yea cheers will have a go first thing 2moz  :y
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: dbug on 21 November 2009, 14:26:47
Quote
Try it with the aux belt removed first. At least it will give you some idea (might even rid you of your paranoia) ;D

Agreed but don't run it for long as aux belt drives water pump!
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: acura on 21 November 2009, 16:00:27
My 2.2 also has a rattle which has been driving me mad, I also suffer from mild paranoia  :D

This afternoon I investigated it and it seemed to be coming from the heat shield area above the exhaust manifold. Pressing a bar against the shield seemed to reduce the noise considerably plus I noticed that the middle bolt holding it to the manifold was missing, whether sheared or just not there I don't know.

Anyway, the noise seems to have reduced so I guess the shield has been 'bent' a little by my attentions and is not rattling as much.

I don't think these engines are the quietest ever made and do seem to have a fair bit of lifter noise as well. If your noise is light rattling it's probs from the top area of the engine or ancilliary, anything (usually) from the bottom end is big end or main bearing and these are usually heavy knocks and rumbles respectively.
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 21 November 2009, 16:52:11
Been under the car with a stefiscope and the noise is coming from around the fly wheel area, also noticed the rubber inspection cover on the back of the flywheel has very badly perished, half was gone anyway and the rest dropped off when i touched it. could this just be the flywheel or bearings?
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 21 November 2009, 17:20:22
is there anything else in the area that could also be rattling
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: tunnie on 21 November 2009, 17:21:28
have you run the engine with the aux belt off? (don't run it for more than a few seconds)
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 21 November 2009, 17:22:48
yes and the noise is still there m8, forgot to mention that i found some metal shards on the sump plug on the last oil change
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 21 November 2009, 23:30:30
its coming from where the flywheel is, is the oil pump near that?
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: acura on 22 November 2009, 09:34:42
Hi, you mention the flywheel area. From this I presume your car is manual?
The rattles you describe could be clutch/gearbox related.
Does the noise reduce when the clutch is depressed? If so then it could be a number of things including a worn release bearing ( you may hear a squeal when taking up the drive), it could be a broken/worn finger on the clutch diaphragm or it may be a worn layshaft bearing on the gearbox.
It's sometimes hard to pinpoint noises in a running engine as the sounds can often appear to come from areas other than the cause.
If the car is auto then none of this applies but it still may be transmission related.

Good luck.
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: Andy H on 22 November 2009, 09:46:43
Manual Omegas have a dual mass flywheel IIRC. Don't know if that could be the cause.

My last Omega did over 200,000 miles. It did develop a rattle when the exhaust heat shields came loose (but that stopped when they fell off). It also rattled when one of the studs holding the underbody heat shields snapped off but I stopped that with a self adhesive foam pad.

I never did work out what the the remaining rattle was, I assumed it was 'happy tappets' but it might have been slack in the dual mass flywheel.

When I had the engine out at 130,000 miles the clutch & flywheel looked to be original & they were still going strong at 200,000 so I don't think it is a weak point.

HTH
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 22 November 2009, 12:28:48
If it's the noise I am thinking of, I think I have heard it on most V6's...
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 22 November 2009, 14:38:18
its a auto but i mean the flywheel off bottom of the  the engine? it just sounds like a ball bearing rattling
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 22 November 2009, 14:40:19
its not overly loud but u can hear it on tick over and if i rev it to 1500 rpm it rattles faster
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 22 November 2009, 15:05:59
lower cambelt idler? :-/
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 22 November 2009, 15:29:01
Quote
lower cambelt idler? :-/
do u think the noise could be traveling down to the bottom of the car
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 22 November 2009, 15:35:53
It's always so hard to tell....

Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 22 November 2009, 15:38:27
thanks i will check it though
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 23 November 2009, 20:52:30
i think it may be the crankshaft bearing, if it is would it be worth changing the engine or getting it fixed,
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 23 November 2009, 20:54:58
the car has 110.00 on the clock
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: Andy H on 23 November 2009, 21:11:55
Crankshaft bearings are white metal shell bearings, they don't have ball bearings. As long as the engine hasn't been run without oil they should be almost 'as new' at 110,000 miles.

I have heard a torque converter making dreadful noises when one of the flex plate bolts fell out and went bouncing round inside the bell housing (it was my brothers fault for not using loctite when he put them in).

We can't hear the noise you are describing but from your description it doesn't sound terminal.

If your engine did need replacing then you should be able to get a decent engine from one of the people breaking cars on here.
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 23 November 2009, 21:15:49
pop it over to me for a second opinion.....
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 23 November 2009, 23:08:25
thanks for the replys guys, i hope its not terminal, and that would be great james for the second opinion see what u think :y
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 23 November 2009, 23:08:54
Can you get to Gloucester tomorrow lunchtime?
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 25 November 2009, 20:30:05
sorry james just got back to the computer, i took it to a garage and they seem to think it might be the torque converter, are they expensive and can i use a second hand one, sorry to drag this post out longer guys  ::)
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 25 November 2009, 20:44:54
Where exactly is the noise mate, front or back?
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 25 November 2009, 20:48:41
Quote
Where exactly is the noise mate, front or back?
front of the converter m8 towards the engine
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 25 November 2009, 20:50:05
I need to have a look at this.....

 :y
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 25 November 2009, 20:52:00
sound m8 when can i show you
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: JamesV6CDX on 25 November 2009, 20:52:44
depending on when I finish, tomorrow night sometime might be possible.... or failing that, lunchtime if you can come to gloucester....
Title: Re: engine rattle?
Post by: TaxiManDan on 25 November 2009, 20:58:46
i can come glos 2moz m8 if u want what ever is easier for u