Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: CyNick on 07 April 2010, 12:01:29
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Hi Guys..
Car visited by AA late at night - "there's no compression - that's going nowhere tonight mate, sounds like the cambelt has gone"
Relay collected the vehicle and dropped her off.. Not looked at it yet..
What are the chances of the belt or tensioner failing 600 miles after fitting a complete new kit and water pump?
Is there anything else that may have caused this and what should I do first to check? :-/
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595 miles more than i got.....
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First job would be to remove the timing belt cover and check the condition of the belt/tensioners. If they look OK then check the timing marks to see if it has jumped any teeth.
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Hi Nick
I have a very distant memory that this cambelt had previously slipped 3 teeth - and we just managed to save it...
I remember after that - there was a leak around the crank - did you ever do the crank seal?
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Yes I remember the one now - April 2008 - old belt had slipped three teeth.
I remember how part of the old belt had got crunched up in the crank seal, and we spent ages cleaning it all out from around the sprocket :D and I recall thinking how much of a lucky escape it was.
I remember that we got it going, and running OK afterwards, but belching oil all over the floor - from that suspected crank seal?
Can you give us some more info mate about the circumstances that led to it not running?
Did it just fail to start - did it die on the move?
Were there any noises - and what were the engine revs when it died?
Did you ever do that crank seal?
Let us know, and we'll do what we can to offer advice :y
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Mine went within 2 miles following change. The tensioner bolt had snapped. VX dealer claimed faulty bolt (took it to metallurgist), VX Luton claimed wrong torque on bolt -between them they fitted new engine - fortunately at no cost to me.
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I would be surprised if the belt has Broken due to any fitting issue. Nick and I worked together on this particular one, and I remember us both going through and checking all torque, tension and timing, using a calibrated wrench...
I am not sure it's cambelt kit, in this case - but if it is, I wonder if it's either a) oil contamination from the crank seal (awaiting info from OP on that one) or a faulty part...
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Check the engine earths.
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And the fault codes...
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I am not sure it's cambelt kit, in this case - but if it is, I wonder if it's either a) oil contamination from the crank seal (awaiting info from OP on that one) or a faulty part...
The vehicle didn't move anywhere after the kit was fitted.. Just to Mum's garage, where it awaited the seal being fitted ::) .. it has been sitting there ever since.. It's been started and run regularly, with one short trip last year to get the oil seal changed..
Some pillock reversed into me in a Gloucester car park and wrote off the car I was using in replacement of miggy.. So decided the time was right for her to come back on the road.. (Mid March this year)
Oil changed.. Wheels changed.. Oil removed from spark plug wells (only a very small amount in 2 wells).. Passed MOT after failing for the colour of 1 rear indicator ;D.. has been running very smoothly for 2 weeks on short trips..
I ran her gently to Glasgow over easter with not a murmour and the engine failed on entry to Hilton Services Car Park southbound.. Low speed/revs.. I coasted her for about 200 yards and came to rest in front of an AA patrolman - how lucky was that!!
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And the fault codes...
Thanks.. These I'll try to do this afternoon..
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Hiya mate,
Can you confirm that the oil seal was changed, before the (suspected) belt failure?
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Check the engine earths.
Thanks.. But I'm not sure where these are.. Could someone let me know where to look.. I'm sure there must be more than 1?
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Can you confirm that the oil seal was changed, before the (suspected) belt failure?
Yes, the seal was done a long time ago, but the car has only been back on the road very recently..
But you're right James, at this stage we've no idea what is wrong with the car.. "AA Relay" might just have just been the easy option? ;)
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Absolutely, Nick, there is no clear evidence of that diagnosis, at this stage.
If the car's not running, I would do these things -
1) Check for any fault codes (expecting a code 19!!)
2) Check for fuel delivery, at the rail
3) Check for a spark, at the plugs
4) Check Compression on all cylinders
Chances are that will help you pin it down :)
I understand that, albeit a long time ago, I didn't get back to you about assisting with the oil seal. I should have been more upfront about the stuff I had going on and the time restraints - so all things considered, I apologise for keeping you waiting :y
Asusming (and hoping!) there are no sour grapes, then I would be happy to drop by and have a look - but realistically, I'm not about for a couple of weeks, and then on hols till the 26th - so it'd be worth you trying a few of the above first, if you can :y
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I understand that, albeit a long time ago, I didn't get back to you about assisting with the oil seal. I should have been more upfront about the stuff I had going on and the time restraints - so all things considered, I apologise for keeping you waiting :y
Asusming (and hoping!) there are no sour grapes, then I would be happy to drop by and have a look - but realistically, I'm not about for a couple of weeks, and then on hols till the 26th - so it'd be worth you trying a few of the above first, if you can :y
There were a few issues in the past as you can see above..
All I can say is that James can be hugely commended for being so up front on this site..
[size=12]It takes a good person and some courage to say sorry publicly.. :y[/size]
I had sent James a PM assuming that he may wish to keep the past quiet, but following his post I'm sure he wont mind me stating publicly that all that is in the past and forgotten..
I really appreciate all the help you guys give not only to myself but to all of us that find ourselves out of our depth and comfort zones!
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Hi James..
Thanks for getting involved in my posting.. It's really appreciated..
[Deleted]
But that was a long time ago and water under the bridge now.. I found out afterwards that you had some personal issues at that time.. Which I truly hope you have overcome?
I have no lingering bitterness about the past.. and in no way do I think that these present problems have any blame at your door, you did a fantastic job in '08 and I'm still very grateful!
I just wanted to clear the air privately about the past, and make sure you knew this.
So far as the future is concerned I would be very glad of any help or advice you could give..
Cheers for now, and best wishes .. Nick
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And the fault codes...
Thanks.. These I'll try to do this afternoon..
Hi Guys..
Fault codes :
12
94
31
12 etc
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I didn't want to start a new thread.. So :
Do the codes I posted earlier mean anything .. either good or bad? :)
Or do I need to strip down to cambelt and check timing before I know anything?
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12 - start of sequence
31 - no RPM - correct if engine not running !!
94 - Hall Sensor Voltage High usually means unplugged .. but probably means the crank sensor wiring is on its way out ... I think the hall sensor is the crank sensor ... but I could be wrong ....
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1160152415
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Both the crank and cam sensors are "hall effect" sensors, although I believe this one relates to the cam sensor, from memory...
Nick, I'll PM you tomorrow if that's ok.. :y
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Both the crank and cam sensors are "hall effect" sensors, although I believe this one relates to the cam sensor, from memory...
Nick, I'll PM you tomorrow if that's ok.. :y
Thanks James..
Your memory is seldom far out! ;)
Tomorrow is O.K.
Is there a small chance that a plug may have worked loose then??
Or is it more likely that the belt has snapped/lost tension resulting in an error code due to the cams not turning properly?? :-/
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what we need to do is clear those codes and see if anything obvious comes back - followed by standard checks for spark, fuel and compression :y
I don't think the belt has broken, I'd have thought you'd know about it by the noise!!!
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Both the crank and cam sensors are "hall effect" sensors, although I believe this one relates to the cam sensor, from memory...
Nick, I'll PM you tomorrow if that's ok.. :y
Actually, to be pedantic, the crank sensor is a variable reluctance sensor. Not sure about the cam sensor. :-/
;)
Kevin
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Ii recall them both being referred to as hall effect sensors - and I guess they feed back their values in simelar way?
I may be wrong - wouldn't be a first ;D :y
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First job would be to remove the timing belt cover and check the condition of the belt/tensioners. If they look OK then check the timing marks to see if it has jumped any teeth.
Almost there.. started dismantling today and got as far as slackening the bolts on the Crank Pulley and one has its torx head almost stripped bare.. Strange as all the others on all the pulleys were not too tight? Will attempt this bolt tomorrow!! >:(
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Nick, you don't strictly need to remove the crank pully if all you're looking for is any obvious tension loss, etc.
I would urge you to do a methodical diagnosis mate, especially checks for spark and such, before taking anything apart...
I was going to PM you tonight - but may as well just post on the board instead...
This weekend I am doing a head gasket Job. IF - and only if, I finish it in good time, I would be happy to swing by and give you a pair of eyes / a few checks, on the Sunday -
But I really have to stress, it's subject to my head gasket job and a few other things I've got on getting completed in time.... :y
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Hall sensor in this case = CAM sensor
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Car visited by AA late at night - "there's no compression - that's going nowhere tonight mate, sounds like the cambelt has gone"
Is there anything else that may have caused this and what should I do first to check? :-/
Just thought I'd check belt, tension and timing.. I can do this.. I think.. (I bought the DVD 2 years ago - so thought I'd use it ;D)
I'll not be altering anything and it doesn't take me long to dismantle..
The only thing that stopped me was one of the bolts had a problem on the head so I'll gett a better torx socket tommorrow and try to remove the bolt..
Cam belt casing will come off.. then I can check the belt and tensioner for any obvious signs of damage or slipping..
May save a lot of time?
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Nick, you don't strictly need to remove the crank pully if all you're looking for is any obvious tension loss, etc.
I would urge you to do a methodical diagnosis mate, especially checks for spark and such, before taking anything apart...
I was going to PM you tonight - but may as well just post on the board instead...
This weekend I am doing a head gasket Job. IF - and only if, I finish it in good time, I would be happy to swing by and give you a pair of eyes / a few checks, on the Sunday -
But I really have to stress, it's subject to my head gasket job and a few other things I've got on getting completed in time.... :y
Thanks James.. :y
I'll try to do as much as I can at this end to at least save some time.. Maybe we'll have a clearer idea of what we're facing before then?
By the way - and quite importantly - the car is stuck in [size=14]Kidderminster[/size] - not at home!
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Let me know the results when you take the cover off and we'll take it from there - if it comes to it, we can still arrange for me to pop by the car sometime :y
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Let me know the results when you take the cover off and we'll take it from there - if it comes to it, we can still arrange for me to pop by the car sometime :y
Just want to find out if there's any possible valve damage asap... :(
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Let me know the results when you take the cover off and we'll take it from there - if it comes to it, we can still arrange for me to pop by the car sometime :y
Just want to find out if there's any possible valve damage asap... :(
If you heard no noise upon the engine dying, I doubt it, personally... :y
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If you heard no noise upon the engine dying, I doubt it, personally... :y
I so hope you are right!!! :y
I've never heard a V6 cambelt go or pistons or valves, but I would imagine it would sound like a load of nails in a metal dustbin.. That definately didn't happen!
But why was the AA patrolman saying "no compression" and he was adamant and seemed plausable - is there anything else that would give the same symptoms?
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If you heard no noise upon the engine dying, I doubt it, personally... :y
I so hope you are right!!! :y
I've never heard a V6 cambelt go or pistons or valves, but I would imagine it would sound like a load of nails in a metal dustbin.. That definately didn't happen!
But why was the AA patrolman saying "no compression" and he was adamant and seemed plausable - is there anything else that would give the same symptoms?
Did he do a compression test or was he just flying by the seat of his pants?
The AA are trained to do a quick fix on simple faults.
If they can't find the fault it's recovery time and onto the next job giving the owner some cock and bull story of major faults that can't be fixed at the roadside.
Recently fixed a friend's matiz that the AA had relayed home for her with a faulty ecu all because the ecu fuse had blown, which I diagnosed with a Mk1 eyeball so don't put too much stock on an AA man's diagnosis.
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Recently fixed a friend's matiz that the AA had relayed home for her with a faulty ecu all because the ecu fuse had blown, which I diagnosed with a Mk1 eyeball so don't put too much stock on an AA man's diagnosis.
Amen to that. :y I'd say completely disregard it and start again from the basics yourself. ;)
Kevin
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Indeed......there is a reason why they work for the AA with un-sociable hours and lower pay than say a good mechanic.
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Indeed......there is a reason why they work for the AA with un-sociable hours and lower pay than say a good mechanic.
me - ow! ;)
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Indeed......there is a reason why they work for the AA with un-sociable hours and lower pay than say a good mechanic.
me - ow! ;)
Actually in this case he turns out to be right..
And it's me that needs to go AWWW! ::) [terrible but I couldn't resist!] ;D ;D ;D
A bolt has snapped on the upper tensioner and I'll post some pictures in about 30 mins..
Then I hope to get a dose of good advice from you guys?? :'(
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The car is in Kidderminster? Only round the corner from me ;)
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Couldn't get pictures to load.. See new thread.. "Tensioner bolt snapped"