Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: I_want_an_Omega on 19 August 2010, 10:22:15
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Does anyone on OOF have one of these mains powered devices fitted to their Mig?
They seem quite popular with Autobhanstormers members, but I don't recall seeing anyone on here mentioning that they have one fitted.
I had one on a V6 many years ago and removed it when I sold the car. I've still got it and am contemplating fitting it again before winter sets in.
Thanks .......... Rob
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Not on the mig, but I put one on my Golf last autumn.
I like it. Great to drive off knowing that the engine is already warm, and heaters will work straight away.
Probably easier to find space to site it on a 4-pot than a V6, though I've not really eyed it up in either case.
Omegas do warm up a lot quicker than my Golf though, so cost/benefit may not be so clear cut.
I don't do much in the way of short journeys, so I don't save a huge amount of fuel by cutting out the cold-start. Probably evens it out so that winter and summer economy is about the same (petrol-wise), not counting the electric cost (non-negligible these days ::)).
Try it. :)
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one model of Omega 2.2 Dti ? has one as standard.
I would have thought it very useful for LPG - it would mean that you never need to start on petrol
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Yes, the 2.2Dti was a wesbasto diesel heater as standard....although when not maintained they billow smoke as the fans sieze up!
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Had one fitted for about 5 yrs,I think there very good,in fact would never be without one,can be fitted to V6 ok. I fitted mine to my previous 2L Cav then my MV6,and transferred it to my present Elite. Its nice to start a journey and have your motor hot as if its done a 20ml run and there's also the advantage to the engine of no cold starts must mean less wear I posted up about them way back shortly after I joined the Forum. Of course you need to have a garage or as in my case a car port with a mains 13A power point
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Showing my age here (or lack thereof). How does it work? :o
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As I recall, heating element into the water system which causes heated coolant to circulate thermally around the block. But will be happy to be corrected....
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Showing my age here (or lack thereof). How does it work? :o
part of the car's coolant system is plumbed in via a box with a kettle element in it. You plug the element in & it heats the coolant. You set of with a car that's already up to temperature .... after you've unplugged :y
http://www.kenlowe.co.uk/pre-heaters/cars/diy.html
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Showing my age here (or lack thereof). How does it work? :o
It's just a little box with a heater element and a pump inside. It normally fits in the heater coolant circuit and starts circulating coolant around the engine when powered-up, heating it as it does. So, you run it from a timeswitch set to come on before you leave in the morning and, ideally, remember to unplug it before you drive off. ;)
Kevin
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Thanks Andy and Kevin.
It looks intriguing, especially warming the passenger compartment (with the extra gubbins).
I only live 10-12 minutes from work, but it's all dual-carriageway. Early in the morning, I'd like to put my foot to the floor, but never do because the engine hasn't had time to warm up. This looks like a great way of getting heat into the system.
I dont see how it can be as effective as it says though. Oil temp will still be at ambient temperature, right?
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Thanks Andy and Kevin.
It looks intriguing, especially warming the passenger compartment (with the extra gubbins).
I only live 10-12 minutes from work, but it's all dual-carriageway. Early in the morning, I'd like to put my foot to the floor, but never do because the engine hasn't had time to warm up. This looks like a great way of getting heat into the system.
I dont see how it can be as effective as it says though. Oil temp will still be at ambient temperature, right?
Yeeeessss, but getting warmed by the heat getting transmitted through the block by the warmed water. Could always fire it up a little while earlier....
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Oil temp will still be at ambient temperature, right?
I suppose it must be , apart from a little conducted heat. As the reast of the block is hot though I'd think the il would get hot much quicker. ;)
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True, it won't heat the oil, but the block and heads will be hot, along with the coolant. On a V6 the oil cooler will soon drag the oil temperature up as they work in reverse too. :y
I believe some emergency vehicles have elements in the sump to pre-heat the oil as well.
Kevin
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Cheers Guy's.
In a weird way, this system is a complete waste of time..... you are heating something which manufacturers spend billions on trying to keep cool ;D
The heater in the sump is what I would like, but, too much work to save myself 3 or 4 minutes of 'slow(ish)' driving of a morn!
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Cheers Guy's.
In a weird way, this system is a complete waste of time..... you are heating something which manufacturers spend billions on trying to keep cool ;D
The heater in the sump is what I would like, but, too much work to save myself 3 or 4 minutes of 'slow(ish)' driving of a morn!
The cold oil in the bottom of the sump would very quickly be brought up to engine temp if the rest of the block & coolant were already hot. :y
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Cheers Guy's.
In a weird way, this system is a complete waste of time..... you are heating something which manufacturers spend billions on trying to keep cool ;D
The heater in the sump is what I would like, but, too much work to save myself 3 or 4 minutes of 'slow(ish)' driving of a morn!
The cold oil in the bottom of the sump would very quickly be brought up to engine temp if the rest of the block & coolant were already hot. :y
You are probably very right. This is something I will seriously consider doing before the cold sets in. :y
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..... This is something I will seriously consider doing before the cold sets in. :y
Does it ever get cold in Brizzol? ::) ::) ::) ;)
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..... This is something I will seriously consider doing before the cold sets in. :y
Does it ever get cold in Brizzol? ::) ::) ::) ;)
Cold enough to do some damage when you want to be at full throttle 45 seconds from cold start :(
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.....Cold enough to do some damage when you want to be at full throttle 45 seconds from cold start :(
A very valid point! ;D ;D :y
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.....Cold enough to do some damage when you want to be at full throttle 45 seconds from cold start :(
A very valid point! ;D ;D :y
Some Oil brands (I wont mention any names) but Castrol GTX Magnetec claims to be as good from cold as it is hot.
I use GM Oil, as it's cheap, and seems to be the preferred tipple.
Does this (mentioning no brands) Castrol GTX Magnetec stuff really work, or is it just advertising spiel?
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the system comprises mains powered coolant heater 3K heater element cylinder, seperate 12V auxilery pump with independant 12V psu and all the supporting armoured wire sockets etc. Its a proper piece of kit don't forget its used by emergency vehicles on call etc I care very much for my motor and have no worries about useing the engine to its full potential on start up it's as if it's been on a good long run never checked the oil temp but don't think it comes into the frame that much as I use a fully synthetic 0/40 grade.
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the system comprises mains powered coolant heater 3K heater element cylinder, seperate 12V auxilery pump with independant 12V psu and all the supporting armoured wire sockets etc. Its a proper piece of kit don't forget its used by emergency vehicles on call etc I care very much for my motor and have no worries about useing the engine to its full potential on start up it's as if it's been on a good long run never checked the oil temp but don't think it comes into the frame that much as I use a fully synthetic 0/40 grade.
Is that not a bit thin for this engine? I popped in 0/30w in my old Omega (3.0) and the oil light would flicker at idle. Perhaps just a well worn engine. Drained and filled with 10/40w and all was well again.
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Can't understand the logic?? they also spend a tidy sum on developing fast warm ups
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Can't understand the logic?? they also spend a tidy sum on developing fast warm ups
Of coolant? :-?
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I've always used my oil for years and I suppose its what I have faith in, my engines are always very clean internally and don't appear to wear at all, other oils can be OK also,now haveing said this with my luck a run big end could be on the cards
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Yes on start up how about the engine stat!! I wonder if you follow the logic that the engine pre heater is unplugged before start up.
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Yes on start up how about the engine stat!! I wonder if you follow the logic that the engine pre heater is unplugged before start up.
Of course, I understand the pre-heater is unplugged before start-up. Although it has been explained that pre-heating the coolant, and therefore the block too will help, without pre-heating the oil, I cant see this being as good as it says it is on the tin.
It's going to be beneficial, so I'll definitely consider fitting one, I just dont want people to believe that it will 'make an engine as "ready to go" as a 20 mile warm up', because it wont. :)
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also it has it's own controlling stat to bring the coolant to a pre determined temp, there are optional value stats and also heater elements available, I have a 2K heater element as when on mains hookup with the caravan the 3K could easily trip out, it just takes longer to reach temp
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Is that not a bit thin for this engine? I popped in 0/30w in my old Omega (3.0) and the oil light would flicker at idle. Perhaps just a well worn engine. Drained and filled with 10/40w and all was well again.
Don't forget the 0w bit is the winter rating which is only applicable when cold. Cold oil is many times more thick than it is at running temperature anyway, so it's not really a much thinner oil. I use 5w30 GM oil in mine (as specified) and it is fine. Noticeably less (well, none, in fact) lifter noise on a cold start compared to the 10w40.
I still think an engine deserves a little respect after startup, even if pre-heated. The piston-bore clearances, for example, aren't necessarily correct until the engine is not only at normal coolant and oil temperature but when the flow of heat energy from combustion chamber, bore and piston out to the coolant and oil has been established. These parts normally run much hotter than the coolant due to the limited rate at which heat is conducted away from them. On a pre-heated engine we're probably only talking seconds rather than 5 or 10 minutes from cold though.
Kevin
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the main reason way back I opted to fit a engine heater to my cav 2L ecotec engine was to give me a quieter smoother cold start. In those days I was a silent engine fanatic, still have the bug to a smaller degree, mechanical noise/clatter simply gells on my nerves. Without doubt even after a night of sub zero temperatures 1hr's heating time and I have a warm engine and a very mechanically quiet start from miggy,even had her plugged in at Keswick (lecky could be classed as free) so based on evidence from my ears less noise means less wear.What can I say just would never be without one,especially in winter.
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Lots of replies to the thread I started ........
There are a couple of versions (apart from the power options), the current one is in two parts, but the older one is an all in one unit.
Re the oil temp - ok, so the block gets upto 80c or so, and the oil is cold(er) in the sump pan initially. By the time its into the oil pump its already in contact with hot metal and is upto temp within a few seconds. So, I really dont think this is a problem.
Having used one on my MV6 a few years back it does make the car happier within seconds from start, less emissions and instant hot air from the heater too. I've still got the Kenlowe and will hopefully put it on my Elite when I get the time.
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don't forget that the pre-heater fitted to the 2.2 Dti is diesel-powered and not a plug-into-the-mains job.
early warm-up is important to manufacturers because it lowers exhaust emissions, in just the same way as a high normal-running coolant temperature is important.
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Webasto also do a petrol version of their heater. I had a unit fitted to my discovery a few years back I fitted it with a seperate little fuel tank so it would run off petrol diesel mix from misfills. Set the timer off it would go no need for power supply so it would warm up for return journey as well. Ideal as I was running veg oil. Land rover as well as some other manufacturers use a diesel version on some vehicles as an auxilary heater as the engine runs too cool to heat the passenger compartment.