Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: 377 on 17 September 2010, 20:33:38
-
Well the only problem (other than the wrong coding for the autobox) I appear to be left with is Error 64. I have been through the check list for the Actuator as per TIS and have drawn a blank.
I guess as I have shaken a lot of stuff around I might have disturbed a load of crud and it's just bunging stuff up, so a general service would be the first step.
The car seems to run reasonable well other than idle, which it really struggles to do, misses etc
I guess I may have a pipe or connector on the wrong bit, but there is nothing I can see.
I'm no diesel expert so could do with a few poiters to look at.
I'm on holidays for a week from sunday, so I'm not going to be near the car to try stuff, but will try and keep in touch with the forum.... perhaps ::)
-
The diesel magic trick sounds to be in order
-
Assuming the connections to pump are fine, as suggested, empty fuel filter, fill to brim with Diesel Magic, and start - it may run rough for a few secs....
-
may take more than one go!!! to clear it completely or it may not but its worth trying it
-
Well one down, and I have another can to try as no real improvement. Still ticks over like a bag of nails. Fine on the run, accelerates like a scolded cat, but it would with a V6 diff in it :o
No real black smoke, except when chugging on tick over.
I'll try the other can when I get back off holidays, but for now it's got me beat.
-
Well one down, and I have another can to try as no real improvement. Still ticks over like a bag of nails. Fine on the run, accelerates like a scolded cat, but it would with a V6 diff in it :o
No real black smoke, except when chugging on tick over.
I'll try the other can when I get back off holidays, but for now it's got me beat.
no smoke except on tickover ? thats a strange one, if it performs well in other areas, is the engine mechanically noisy?
cos that dont half sound like the chain has slipped, hope it isnt but did you by chance turn the engine backwards when lining the gearbox up? if it is this you will have to remove the timing cover and use the special tool to hold the pump in place while you renew the chains and guides!! Elite Pete has recently done this job if it turns out thats the fault, hope its not but it could be
-
Well one down, and I have another can to try as no real improvement. Still ticks over like a bag of nails. Fine on the run, accelerates like a scolded cat, but it would with a V6 diff in it :o
No real black smoke, except when chugging on tick over.
I'll try the other can when I get back off holidays, but for now it's got me beat.
no smoke except on tickover ? thats a strange one, if it performs well in other areas, is the engine mechanically noisy?
cos that dont half sound like the chain has slipped, hope it isnt but did you by chance turn the engine backwards when lining the gearbox up? if it is this you will have to remove the timing cover and use the special tool to hold the pump in place while you renew the chains and guides!! Elite Pete has recently done this job if it turns out thats the fault, hope its not but it could be
Bugger hope not, but I honestly can't remember if I did turn the engine backwards. It only puts out a puff of black smoke when it is missfiring (?) , and it doesn't do that all the time. I'm up for just general gunked-up-ness. When I had the inlet off, it was thick with black goo. When I get back i'll give it a good service and see what the result is.
Oh and I desperatly need to sort the gearbox ecu map out, that possibly isn't helping
-
try advancing the pump slightly.
easy to do theres a 12mm bolt at the back of the pump this one is a knuckle scraper I took the battery out, theres a 12mm nut at the back down behind the base of the oil filter casing and the easy one at the side you can see.
once slackend turn the top of the pump towards the engine and tighten the easy nut tightly then start engine.
ive got 64 and diesel magiced it x3 and put 5 in the tank no joy
I recently fitted a re-con pump but it now looks like im going to have to buy a brand new one ive got the same a you idles rough.
-
Well one down, and I have another can to try as no real improvement. Still ticks over like a bag of nails. Fine on the run, accelerates like a scolded cat, but it would with a V6 diff in it :o
No real black smoke, except when chugging on tick over.
I'll try the other can when I get back off holidays, but for now it's got me beat.
no smoke except on tickover ? thats a strange one, if it performs well in other areas, is the engine mechanically noisy?
cos that dont half sound like the chain has slipped, hope it isnt but did you by chance turn the engine backwards when lining the gearbox up? if it is this you will have to remove the timing cover and use the special tool to hold the pump in place while you renew the chains and guides!! Elite Pete has recently done this job if it turns out thats the fault, hope its not but it could be
Bugger hope not, but I honestly can't remember if I did turn the engine backwards. It only puts out a puff of black smoke when it is missfiring (?) , and it doesn't do that all the time. I'm up for just general gunked-up-ness. When I had the inlet off, it was thick with black goo. When I get back i'll give it a good service and see what the result is.
Oh and I desperatly need to sort the gearbox ecu map out, that possibly isn't helping
hope its not also!!! however if the engine pulls well otherwise i would be wondering about a gummed up lifter or something? in other words, maybe not opening the valve at slow rpms and then working when the oil pressure rises with rpms?
hope it is mate!!
-
Back off the hols and more chance to look at it...
Poor tickover seems to only occur when in "Park" and "N" other wise when "on load" it seems to tick over reasonably nicely although when slowing down it gives a bit of a cough.
On another note anyone know how to get rid of an airlock in the PAS system... i though it would have cured itself after nearly 300 miles. It won't turn right easily :(
-
Have you stripped A cleaned the fuel lift pump?
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1251298222
-
Sounds like it's overfuelling by a fair margin to me and borderline flooding at idle.. leaky injector maybe?
-
Have you stripped A cleaned the fuel lift pump?
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1251298222
It's on the list to do tomorrow :)
-
Sounds like it's overfuelling by a fair margin to me and borderline flooding at idle.. leaky injector maybe?
Now that's beginning to be my feeling after running it for a while, fuel consumption does seem quite high.
When I first got the doner it did appear to have been leaking from the overflow pipes so I replaced all of that lot.
So where do I start? dismantling and cleaning the injectors or is there some way of winding the pump back to deliver less ??
-
if it was over fueling there would be black soot on the rear bumper.
start with cleaning the injectors.
Before you re-connect them put a diesel magic in the filter then put rags under each injector feed pipe and turn the engine over(this is best done when the injectors are removed)keep turning the engine over for about a minute then have a look at each rag to see if any crud has been spat out :y
-
No real black smoke, except when chugging on tick over.
What's the black smoke, if not overfuelling?
-
No real black smoke, except when chugging on tick over.
What's the black smoke, if not overfuelling?
Fair point, well made :y
-
More proof that something is slightly amiss, popped into my local garage for a chat and stuck the diesel probe up the exhaust.
Off load "P" or "N" (tick over) the smoke was all over the place 30-90% depending on how it felt
In gear ticking over <2% generally
Revving >1k then about 0.3%
Couple of things spring to mind
I have a manual TD ECU connected (The engine came from a manual car), I wonder if an ECU from an auto has a different map for tickover ?
Wonder if i've missed something out in the wiring between the autobox and the ECU ??
-
so as soon as its under load it sorts itself? is that what your saying :-/
-
Bugger, might have answered my own question here... One thing I have left to connect is a relay (K13) to P/N signal and pin 26 on the ECU (anyone know what that does ?) PIn 26 on a manual goes to plug X3 pin 5 and goes to CRC (cruise ??)
Wonder what that lot does then ???
-
so as soon as its under load it sorts itself? is that what your saying :-/
appears to yep :-/
-
so as soon as its under load it sorts itself? is that what your saying :-/
appears to yep :-/
god thats strange, its old skool diesel apart from the elctronic throttle, so theory says it should be quite happy loaded or not,
what speed does it tickover at? is it stable or all over the place?
what happens if you just very very lightly press the accelerator? any difference does it smooth out slightly or not at all?
oohhh just thought try putting a blanking plate in the egr pipe at the throttle body just for a trial, unless you already have it blanked?
-
No real black smoke, except when chugging on tick over.
What's the black smoke, if not overfuelling?
Fair point, well made :y
.. but... On a diesel you have all the air you like flowing through it, even at idle, so more fuel correctly injected just makes it run faster to a point. More fuel injected with the wrong timing or dribbling out of the injector instead of spraying, however,...
oohhh just thought try putting a blanking plate in the egr pipe at the throttle body just for a trial, unless you already have it blanked?
Might well be worth a try. :y
Kevin
-
ticks over at 600 ish, seems happiest at 900+, except when in gear and it ticks over at 600 happily, although takes a second or two to settle (excess fuel i guess)
I'll try blanking the egr valve off, I'm sure I can find something at work to block it off with ::)
-
EGR on a diesel should be fully open at idle so I doubt thats it.
-
Bugger, might have answered my own question here... One thing I have left to connect is a relay (K13) to P/N signal and pin 26 on the ECU (anyone know what that does ?) PIn 26 on a manual goes to plug X3 pin 5 and goes to CRC (cruise ??)
Wonder what that lot does then ???
I'm going to guess it tells the ECU it's in Park or Neutral.. ;D
Sorry, no real help, but.. I wonder if it tells the ECU to inject (much) less fuel as there's no gearbox load on the engine?
-
EGR on a diesel should be fully open at idle so I doubt thats it.
So what happens if it's not ??
Anyone spotted i'm a little out of my depth with diesels :-[
-
Bugger, might have answered my own question here... One thing I have left to connect is a relay (K13) to P/N signal and pin 26 on the ECU (anyone know what that does ?) PIn 26 on a manual goes to plug X3 pin 5 and goes to CRC (cruise ??)
Wonder what that lot does then ???
I'm going to guess it tells the ECU it's in Park or Neutral.. ;D
Sorry, no real help, but.. I wonder if it tells the ECU to inject (much) less fuel as there's no gearbox load on the engine?
Not sure, I've searched for the ECU (DDE 2.11) schematic to no avail. Fuel injector pump I can work out is controlled by P68 and that seems to go to pins 1,2,35,39,14, 21 and in a convoluted way to pins 10 and 17 but externally it isn't connected to pin 26.. internally that may be a different matter.
The electronics and wiring I can get my head round if it's available, the internal bits (ECU) are a mystery and that really does not help.
-
EGR on a diesel should be fully open at idle so I doubt thats it.
So what happens if it's not ??
Anyone spotted i'm a little out of my depth with diesels :-[
so, it was a diesel out of an auto and now its manual....let me consult my wiring info
-
EGR on a diesel should be fully open at idle so I doubt thats it.
So what happens if it's not ??
Anyone spotted i'm a little out of my depth with diesels :-[
Nothing, diesels of this era regulate the fuel, not the air and hence as long as there is some air it will combust fine
-
EGR on a diesel should be fully open at idle so I doubt thats it.
So what happens if it's not ??
Anyone spotted i'm a little out of my depth with diesels :-[
so, it was a diesel out of an auto and now its manual....let me consult my wiring info
Nope, diesel out of a manual and now an auto... mated to a confused petrol (late model) autobox ecu that needs a reprogram too....
-
Is pin 24 (Brown wire) on the ECU connected to chassis ground?
-
I guess cruise is not working unless you have removed K13 and connected pin 28 to F15 via the clutch switch
-
Pin 24 looks to be key, its connected to chassis 0V in Manual setups and direct to the autobox ecu in auto setups
-
Is pin 24 (Brown wire) on the ECU connected to chassis ground?
Not anymore, that's been replaced with a wire from pin 31 on the gearbox ecu to pin 24 on ecu (Brown with White Stripe)
-
I guess cruise is not working unless you have removed K13 and connected pin 28 to F15 via the clutch switch
No cruise, and I need to sort that out, but not important right now)
-
Pin 24 looks to be key, its connected to chassis 0V in Manual setups and direct to the autobox ecu in auto setups
Just going to double check that bit, but i'm sure it's right... (Trouble with working with a late model Autobox ECU and a early model engine ECU... two lots of wiring to check ::) )
-
So its gone from Manual to auto or auto to manual?
-
Well the only problem (other than the wrong coding for the autobox) I appear to be left with is Error 64.
I guess I may have a pipe or connector on the wrong bit, but there is nothing I can see.
For want of any other ideas, you may want to check the map sensor and it's vac pipe.
:-/ :-/
-
Have you also connected
ECU Autobox
Pin 40 to Pin 38
Pin 43 to Pin 26
Pin 50 to Pin 40 (I think, print is not clear)
-
So its gone from Manual to auto or auto to manual?
car has always been an auto (V6 petrol) doner car (TD) was a manual, but DVLA have restricted my licence to Auto only so I had to make the TD drive an autobox
so I guess the easy answer is manual to auto
-
Did it used to be a petrol then?
-
Have you also connected
ECU Autobox
Pin 40 to Pin 38
Pin 43 to Pin 26
Pin 50 to Pin 40 (I think, print is not clear)
43 to 24 i have, but now i'm not too sure about 50 to 40, (X2-2) GN. I have also spotted that it goes to TC which I completely ignored for the time being ::)
-
Did it used to be a petrol then?
yep :)... did you miss the thread ;)
That I now can't find... :-[
-
Have you also connected
ECU Autobox
Pin 40 to Pin 38
Pin 43 to Pin 26
Pin 50 to Pin 40 (I think, print is not clear)
43 to 24 i have, but now i'm not too sure about 50 to 40, (X2-2) GN. I have also spotted that it goes to TC which I completely ignored for the time being ::)
And that might well be for a speed signal.....(of course it might not as well, it could be the power off signal)
-
Did it used to be a petrol then?
yep :)... did you miss the thread ;)
That I now can't find... :-[
To many threads and to many members ;D
-
Have you also connected
ECU Autobox
Pin 40 to Pin 38
Pin 43 to Pin 26
Pin 50 to Pin 40 (I think, print is not clear)
43 to 24 i have, but now i'm not too sure about 50 to 40, (X2-2) GN. I have also spotted that it goes to TC which I completely ignored for the time being ::)
And that might well be for a speed signal.....(of course it might not as well, it could be the power off signal)
Goes to DZM (instruments), but i don't have that bit of the wiring with me at work so can't remember where it connects.
-
Well you need to get it connected up fully first so we can rule that bit out :y
-
Well you need to get it connected up fully first so we can rule that bit out :y
Yep, think i'll go through the wiring again with a fine tooth comb, I thought I had snagged everything, but it's been nothing less that a nightmare trying to do this bit and it's easy to think because you have a wire the right colour at pin 50 and pin 40, i've not really thought if they are connected together at any point...
I'll report back...
-
Anyone know where Y20 (injection regulation) lives ??
-
It may be on the very bottom of the diesel pump :y
-
Yup thats where it is (it under adjustment and not regulation)
-
Me again... :D
Still haven't manage to locate the component called Y20 which has a couple of wires (Red/White & White) coming out of it.
But on another note Omegatoy mentioned I may have knocked the timing out, is there a simple way to check this ? Haynes is a bit rubbish for the TD.
-
Me again... :D
Still haven't manage to locate the component called Y20 which has a couple of wires (Red/White & White) coming out of it.
But on another note Omegatoy mentioned I may have knocked the timing out, is there a simple way to check this ? Haynes is a bit rubbish for the TD.
stand to be corrected,
the timing is set by coloured links on the timing chain >:( dont know of any other way of setting it except by someone who may have a dti gauge and the bosch equipment?
-
Anyone know where Y20 (injection regulation) lives ??
It is on the bottom of the pump(the one inside the engine bay)it may be located inside the pump its self :y
-
Anyone know where Y20 (injection regulation) lives ??
It is on the bottom of the pump(the one inside the engine bay)it may be located inside the pump its self :y
Is this the one that on another post somewhere, someone has called it "Fuel Quantity Sensor" ?? erm which sort of brings this post full circle... ;D
-
Me again... :D
Still haven't manage to locate the component called Y20 which has a couple of wires (Red/White & White) coming out of it.
But on another note Omegatoy mentioned I may have knocked the timing out, is there a simple way to check this ? Haynes is a bit rubbish for the TD.
stand to be corrected,
the timing is set by coloured links on the timing chain >:( dont know of any other way of setting it except by someone who may have a dti gauge and the bosch equipment?
Which does mean stripping the front of the engine down then ?? >:( bugger :-[ Still here's hoping it isn't that and I really have done something stooopid
-
Doesn't code 64 link with injector 4???
Or am I barking up the wrong tree....
-
Anyone know where Y20 (injection regulation) lives ??
It is on the bottom of the pump(the one inside the engine bay)it may be located inside the pump its self :y
Is this the one that on another post somewhere, someone has called it "Fuel Quantity Sensor" ?? erm which sort of brings this post full circle... ;D
no, two different parts of the pump :y
-
Doesn't code 64 link with injector 4???
Or am I barking up the wrong tree....
A problem with this injector will throw 81 or 82 - trust me! :y
-
Doesn't code 64 link with injector 4???
Or am I barking up the wrong tree....
A problem with this injector will throw 81 or 82 - trust me! :y
I shall stop barking then... lol...
-
Doesn't code 64 link with injector 4???
Or am I barking up the wrong tree....
A problem with this injector will throw 81 or 82 - trust me! :y
I shall stop barking then... lol...
;D ;D ;D ;D
-
.... and this gets dafter...
just had the autobox fault out (limp home mode) and when like this the engine is almost happy, I say almost as it has a chug or two to itself before it settles at idle (even in P/N)
This leads me to believe that I have a problem between the autobox ECU and the engine ECU to sort out.
and a recent ebay purchase >>> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140460650580&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT might help with this :D just got to sort out getting it home ::) ;D
-
In A strange way Rich thats good news!! at least now you know it isnt anything to do with timing chains or fuel pumps etc?if its just a wiring interface problem it should be sortable with patience? would it be worth paying a visit to your nearest tech2 holder within OOF to see exactly what the car is sayin?
nice lttle purchase there!!!! :y
-
In A strange way Rich thats good news!! at least now you know it isnt anything to do with timing chains or fuel pumps etc?if its just a wiring interface problem it should be sortable with patience? would it be worth paying a visit to your nearest tech2 holder within OOF to see exactly what the car is sayin?
nice lttle purchase there!!!! :y
That was my thoughts, and I will fix it... Was going to visit Mark tonight, but in light of the purchase I'm going to hang on until I've had a bit more of a fiddle about with it.
The one I have bought will have a different engine ECU i'm guessing as it's likely to be a X25TD so will have MAF sensor, but it will have a shed load of spares that will come in handy, not least a correct gearbox ECU. It's actually built later than mine according to EPC but registered earlier...
-
Engine with MAF runs smoother than the earlier one. My Opinion.
-
damn wrong thing!!
-
Just an update, I have acquired the e bay bargain to help with the sorting of this problem. (Thanks to the AA for rescuing me when the gearbox exploded on the A1...)
Plan of attack
1) remove engine harness from donor car and fit to mine, including ECU and MAF sensor, hopefully this will sort any strange wiring issues when I fit the gearbox ECU.
Then if necessary, rewire from the engine bay to the Gearbox ECU and fly by wire.
2) If that fails and I have as suggested skipped a tooth an knocked the timing out, then swap the engines over
3)... If all else fails then I give up and buy a bike...
-
I know someone selling a couple of BMXes.. ;)
Anyway - good luck!
-
and after 9 hours of complete rewiring....... it appears to have worked. The thing runs properly, changes gear as it should etc. I still have a little tidying to do and connect one wire, CC I think (X2-9 black/yellow) but that's about it. The ebay bargain certainly proved it's worth and now for all intents I have a X25DT.
Just got to blink test it to see if code 64 has vanished and monitor fuel consumption
Next job.... fit the diff from the TD so the revs are a bit more sensible.