Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: Doug Chase on 08 December 2010, 08:12:55
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I've seen a bunch of talk on here about LPG conversions and it has made me curious, as this is virtually unheard of in the states.
What is driving all these conversions? Is it for performance reasons because of the higher octane? Is it economically advantageous, either with taxes or fuel cost?
Just curious.
Doug
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in my country regular gas is 1,2 euros and LPG is 60 eurocents. if a car has an average of 10liters per 100km with lpg will have 11 liters per 100km. so to do 100km on gas you pay 12 euros and on lpg 6.60 euros. but there is also the price of the lpg kit...
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Economic reasons. Petrol is approx.£1.20 per litre. LPG is approx. £0.65 per litre.
Not sure on exchange rates at the moment, nor how many litres per U.S. gallon, but if you convert the figures I would imagine you would find the price of petrol quite shocking. ;)
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I've seen a bunch of talk on here about LPG conversions and it has made me curious, as this is virtually unheard of in the states.
What is driving all these conversions? Is it for performance reasons because of the higher octane? Is it economically advantageous, either with taxes or fuel cost?
Just curious.
Doug
I am one of the 'bunch' here doug, and there is only one main reason...the cost of petrol here! >:(
We pay the equivalent of $8.50 per gallon!
The other 'plus' is that lpg burns cleaner & is ultimately better for the engine & the air quality :y
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in my country regular gas is 1,2 euros and LPG is 60 eurocents. if a car has an average of 10liters per 100km with lpg will have 11 liters per 100km. so to do 100km on gas you pay 12 euros and on lpg 6.60 euros. but there is also the price of the lpg kit...
Wow, that's quite a substantial cost difference! Since you save 5.4 euros per 100km, you'd save 540 in 10000km and it seems like it shouldn't cost more than that to retrofit. If so, that seems like a pretty quick breakeven - basically two oil change intervals and then you're money ahead.
Over here regular (87 octane) gasoline is about $3.17/gallon and propane is about $2.20/gallon so the payback would be longer. Plus, although propane is readily available for barbecue grills and heating homes, there's not much infrastructure built for fueling cars.
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The other 'plus' is that lpg burns cleaner & is ultimately better for the engine & the air quality :y
That's cool. It's good when things are a benefit all around.
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regular (87 octane)
:-? Don't you have proper gas in the us?
I don't even recall regular existed as a fuel
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wow... our euro engines would blow up with 87 grqade fuel :)).. i remember i used some 92 fuel in a renault 21 and with ignition off it would keep autoignite :)). had to turn it off in first gear with foot on brake :o
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regular (87 octane)
:-? Don't you have proper gas in the us?
I don't even recall regular existed as a fuel
Beware there are several ways of rating octane. UK/EU fuel is sold bearing the "research octane number" (RON). US fuel is sold bearing the average of the RON and "motor octane number" (MON).
So it's not as bad as it looks. ;)
87 octane (US) is equivalent to around 92 octane (EU).
Our "Regular" unleaded (95 RON) would be about 91 octane in the US whereas "Super Unleaded" (98) would be 94.
Kevin
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....
Over here regular (87 octane) gasoline is about $3.17/gallon and ......
It's gone up some in 5 years then, 'gas' had recently gone over $2/US gallon when we were over there.
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regular (87 octane)
:-? Don't you have proper gas in the us?
I don't even recall regular existed as a fuel
Beware there are several ways of rating octane. UK/EU fuel is sold bearing the "research octane number" (RON). US fuel is sold bearing the average of the RON and "motor octane number" (MON).
So it's not as bad as it looks. ;)
87 octane (US) is equivalent to around 92 octane (EU).
Our "Regular" unleaded (95 RON) would be about 91 octane in the US whereas "Super Unleaded" (98) would be 94.
Kevin
92 is still low.. even in eu :(
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Cost! We pay for the litre here in the UK what you pay for the gallon. LPG conversions reduce your fuel bill by about 30/40%
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I was in New Hampshire in August 2001 and iirc petrol was around $1.25 per U.S. gallon.
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regular (87 octane)
:-? Don't you have proper gas in the us?
I don't even recall regular existed as a fuel
Beware there are several ways of rating octane. UK/EU fuel is sold bearing the "research octane number" (RON). US fuel is sold bearing the average of the RON and "motor octane number" (MON).
So it's not as bad as it looks. ;)
87 octane (US) is equivalent to around 92 octane (EU).
Our "Regular" unleaded (95 RON) would be about 91 octane in the US whereas "Super Unleaded" (98) would be 94.
Kevin
92 is still low.. even in eu :(
And hence why the V6 in the Caterra has a lower compression ratio
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regular (87 octane)
:-? Don't you have proper gas in the us?
I don't even recall regular existed as a fuel
Beware there are several ways of rating octane. UK/EU fuel is sold bearing the "research octane number" (RON). US fuel is sold bearing the average of the RON and "motor octane number" (MON).
So it's not as bad as it looks. ;)
87 octane (US) is equivalent to around 92 octane (EU).
Our "Regular" unleaded (95 RON) would be about 91 octane in the US whereas "Super Unleaded" (98) would be 94.
Kevin
92 is still low.. even in eu :(
And hence why the V6 in the Caterra has a lower compression ratio
so lower compresion equals no autoignite right?? learned something good today :)
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UK V6 owners reckon its 10p per mile cheaper to run on LPG, so a £580 kit (from memory) breaks even in just under 6,000 miles...
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It's gone up some in 5 years then, 'gas' had recently gone over $2/US gallon when we were over there.
Indeed it has. At the peak of it a couple years ago gas was over $4/gallon. High for us. Still cheap for the rest of the world.
Beware there are several ways of rating octane. UK/EU fuel is sold bearing the "research octane number" (RON). US fuel is sold bearing the average of the RON and "motor octane number" (MON).
So it's not as bad as it looks. ;)
87 octane (US) is equivalent to around 92 octane (EU).
Our "Regular" unleaded (95 RON) would be about 91 octane in the US whereas "Super Unleaded" (98) would be 94.
Kevin
Excellent point. Fuel here is available in 87, 89, and 92 octane, specified with the (R+M)/2. In other states 93 is available. And 100 octane unleaded race fuel is available for around $8/gallon.
And hence why the V6 in the Caterra has a lower compression ratio
I didn't know that the Catera 3.0 has a lower compression ratio than the Omega. Perhaps that's why the Catera is rated at 200hp and the Omega is something like 206hp?
What's the difference? Head gasket? Different pistons?
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its a tax thing really.
in the UK, petrol is subject to around 370% tax
or to put it another way, over 75% of what is paid at the pump is tax.
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its a tax thing really.
in the UK, petrol is subject to around 370% tax
or to put it another way, over 75% of what is paid at the pump is tax.
yep,lots of tax then vat on the the tax ::) :P
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its a tax thing really.
in the UK, petrol is subject to around 370% tax
or to put it another way, over 75% of what is paid at the pump is tax.
Yep, we don't half get the sh*ft on that! Then again, our roads seem better (at least than the roads in Seattle - pot holes the size of craters, concrete slab road sections that have lifted 3" and had a bit of tarmac added so it's a violent ramp instead of a kerb etc).
Having said that.. with the difference in petrol prices I could afford a lot of sets of alloy wheels & suspension ;D
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All the factors of LPG being economical and environmentally beneficial I agree with. But I was discussing this recently and was told the performance (spped/accelleration) drops.
Therefore, choice will be dependent on what matters most and where you stand. >:( ;D
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All the factors of LPG being economical and environmentally beneficial I agree with. But I was discussing this recently and was told the performance (spped/accelleration) drops.
Therefore, choice will be dependent on what matters most and where you stand. >:( ;D
you can switch from lpg to gas whenver you want with just a push of a button so you can get acceleration and speed but when cruising on the highway switch to lpg and you won't feel it. besides if you have a 3,2 from 160kw lets say you end up on lpg with "just" 140kw. do you think thats low for an every day use?
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If you can notice the performance difference, it's a clue that your LPG system isn't behaving. ;)
Kevin
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its a tax thing really.
in the UK, petrol is subject to around 370% tax
or to put it another way, over 75% of what is paid at the pump is tax.
Yep, we don't half get the sh*ft on that! Then again, our roads seem better (at least than the roads in Seattle - pot holes the size of craters, concrete slab road sections that have lifted 3" and had a bit of tarmac added so it's a violent ramp instead of a kerb etc).
Having said that.. with the difference in petrol prices I could afford a lot of sets of alloy wheels & suspension ;D
Now we know where the UK road repair budget is spent... The majority of the roads around here are terrible... ::) ::)
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its a tax thing really.
in the UK, petrol is subject to around 370% tax
or to put it another way, over 75% of what is paid at the pump is tax.
Yep, we don't half get the sh*ft on that! Then again, our roads seem better (at least than the roads in Seattle - pot holes the size of craters, concrete slab road sections that have lifted 3" and had a bit of tarmac added so it's a violent ramp instead of a kerb etc).
Having said that.. with the difference in petrol prices I could afford a lot of sets of alloy wheels & suspension ;D
Now we know where the UK road repair budget is spent... The majority of the roads around here are terrible... ::) ::)
Believe me they're not great around here either.. but lightyears ahead of Seattle! I've really rarely seen potholes that size over here, where over there they are all over the residential roads. Imagine this, but worse, all over the place:
(http://www.myballard.com/images/pothole.jpg)