Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: smirnoff on 15 January 2011, 11:41:49
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Hello to all
I'm think of getting Omega but due to need it as my daily drive
the economy is on my mind
so. ......
Do I go for the 2.5 td with bmw motor in it
or
2.2 dti with vauxhall motor
???????????
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decisions decisions ;)
2.2 in only available with 3 pedals whereas a 2.5 also comes with 2 .... that might be a consideration. :-/
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if I where to pick a tractor, be 2.5TD. 2.2 DTi is rough, seen Transits pull away with more refinement. Its not really bad engine, just the 6 pots of the 2.5 make it much smoother.
Also worth considering is 2.5TD will generally be pre-facelift, 2.2 DTi was fitted in 2001, so if your after newer examples it has to be 2.2, plus as Andy mentioned, they are all manuals.
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It's gotta be the 2.5TD! :y
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2.2dti has more torque
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as for tunies comment, he must have seen a bad example of a 2.2dti as most run sweet as a nut!
i average 45 mpg on the motorway in mine
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2.2dti has more torque
but less bhp & less cylinders ;) ;) ;)
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indeed but a better engine i think as why would they have changed it from a bmw lump?
2.2dti does burn a bit of oil though but apparently was a design fault with a too high gloss finish somewhere inside the pots
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indeed but a better engine i think as why would they have changed it from a bmw lump? ......
But does newer mean better? Look at the finish inside a facelift car, that's definitely not better. I think it's just that manufacturers woud like their own engines in a car rather than rely on someone else.
I've only ever driven a 2.5 a couple of miles so can't comment on which is best. For me though I'd immediately dismiss the 2.2 cos it only comes with 3 pedals. :y
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im going to be biased with the 2.2dti as i drive one and i definately prefer 3 pedals to 2 all day long, for 1 better mpg and more fun to drive
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..... and more fun to drive
maybe for a 'sports car' but for a tonne & three quarter diseasal barge? :-/
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I drive a chipped '99 MFL 2.5TD, and it is NOT economical. I only get about 26 locally, and 33 on a run. I still love driving it however. HTH :y :y :y
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as for tunies comment, he must have seen a bad example of a 2.2dti as most run sweet as a nut!
i average 45 mpg on the motorway in mine
See quite a few of them in London, just pulling away the London Taxi's sound better!
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indeed but a better engine i think as why would they have changed it from a bmw lump?
2.2dti does burn a bit of oil though but apparently was a design fault with a too high gloss finish somewhere inside the pots
Cost. All changes are about cost.
Both have their pros and cons. The 2.5TD REALLY REALLY REALLY does need very regular oil changes. The 2.2DTi just REALLY needs regular oil changes (around 3k for both of them).
Personally, I think the TD is the better engine, but it needs chipping. DTi is only available as manual, but I think that the auto in the TD holds it back - its a much more pleasant car with a manual box.
Economy between a 2.2 and a 2.5 (chipped - std 2.5 is a dog) manual is around the same. The 2.5TD auto (chipped) is around 33mpg day to day, high thrities on a run (the chipping confuses the onboard MPG reading, so you have to do mpg the old fashioned way).
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indeed but a better engine i think as why would they have changed it from a bmw lump?
2.2dti does burn a bit of oil though but apparently was a design fault with a too high gloss finish somewhere inside the pots
Cost. All changes are about cost.
Both have their pros and cons. The 2.5TD REALLY REALLY REALLY does need very regular oil changes. The 2.2DTi just REALLY needs regular oil changes (around 3k for both of them).
Personally, I think the TD is the better engine, but it needs chipping. DTi is only available as manual, but I think that the auto in the TD holds it back - its a much more pleasant car with a manual box.
Economy between a 2.2 and a 2.5 (chipped - std 2.5 is a dog) manual is around the same. The 2.5TD auto (chipped) is around 33mpg day to day, high thrities on a run (the chipping confuses the onboard MPG reading, so you have to do mpg the old fashioned way).
Not with mine, see above :( :( :(
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if the 2.5 was a great engine it wouldnt need chipping!
each to their own!
if i had a 2.5 driver closer we could coulod get our willies out and have a sword fight to see who was the winner! lol
agree to dis agree
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if the 2.5 was a great engine it wouldnt need chipping!
each to their own!
if i had a 2.5 driver closer we could coulod get our willies out and have a sword fight to see who was the winner! lol
agree to dis agree
The 2.5 was de-tuned because of a chocolate gearbox, and is far smoother and quicker than a 2.2 when chipped and gives excellent MPG. I've got 2 2.5s and a Desmond and the 2.5 with manual box is my favorite :)
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if the 2.5 was a great engine it wouldnt need chipping!
each to their own!
if i had a 2.5 driver closer we could coulod get our willies out and have a sword fight to see who was the winner! lol
agree to dis agree
As others have mentioned, chipping it just brings it back to full BMW spec. It was de-tuned for the Omega
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i would go for the 2,2 if you are looking for economy. its the 2.0dti from opel (101hp) but with some longer thingies that connect the piston to crankshaft :P.. the only 2,5 BMW engine that was mounted on omega is the comonrail one with 150hp, and i think in uk it wasn't sold, the rest of them are just copies. on my 2,2 i change the oil at 10.000km (~6000miles), if you drive most of them on highway at legal speeds you can even change it at 10.000miles. you can also chiptune the 2,2 and reach: 2.2 DTI - Y22DTH - 155 CP and 380 Nm - 250 EUR (including PSG16) . with chip how much does it gain the 2,5??
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I`ve got the 2.5td and to be honest its the best car I`ve owned. it has done 165000 mile now and it still runs sweet as a nut. I might be tempting fate here but I have never had any problems with the engine since buying the car 6 years ago. It even tows a caravan from Leeds to St Ives a couple of times a year with no problems. So I`d say pretty good reliable work horse!!!!!
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i would go for the 2,2 if you are looking for economy. its the 2.0dti from opel (101hp) but with some longer thingies that connect the piston to crankshaft :P.. the only 2,5 BMW engine that was mounted on omega is the comonrail one with 150hp, and i think in uk it wasn't sold, the rest of them are just copies. on my 2,2 i change the oil at 10.000km (~6000miles), if you drive most of them on highway at legal speeds you can even change it at 10.000miles. you can also chiptune the 2,2 and reach: 2.2 DTI - Y22DTH - 155 CP and 380 Nm - 250 EUR (including PSG16) . with chip how much does it gain the 2,5??
Interesting, are you saying that BMW did NOT build the engines fitted to the UK 2.5 TDs, even though the cars were assembled by Opel in Germany? If so, who did? :-?
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if the 2.5 was a great engine it wouldnt need chipping!
each to their own!
if i had a 2.5 driver closer we could coulod get our willies out and have a sword fight to see who was the winner! lol
agree to dis agree
The GM detuning made it a dog. Popping it back to BMW spec (or better ::)) makes it a different beast.
Neither are bad engines. The 2.2 suffers with clogged boost sensors and egrs, esp with poor servicing. The 2.5 suffers with silted rads and BMW spec waterpumps (ie, shite). Both suffer with clogged oilways if poorly serviced.
Both work well with a manual gearbox. No idea about how good the 2.2DTi is with an auto, as it was not an option, but the TD isn't ideal with that option.
Without doubt, though, the BMW 6cyl unit is much smoother. As previously said, little to choose in economy with 'BMW spec' chips in the TD with manual. And its quicker.
But there is certainly nothing wrong with the 2.2DTi (except poor servicing takes its toll). Very drivable, still smooth, and reasonably refined :y
Shame we didn't get the Y25DT engine in our Vauxhalls. Only Opels got that.
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i would go for the 2,2 if you are looking for economy. its the 2.0dti from opel (101hp) but with some longer thingies that connect the piston to crankshaft :P.. the only 2,5 BMW engine that was mounted on omega is the comonrail one with 150hp, and i think in uk it wasn't sold, the rest of them are just copies. on my 2,2 i change the oil at 10.000km (~6000miles), if you drive most of them on highway at legal speeds you can even change it at 10.000miles. you can also chiptune the 2,2 and reach: 2.2 DTI - Y22DTH - 155 CP and 380 Nm - 250 EUR (including PSG16) . with chip how much does it gain the 2,5??
Interesting, are you saying that BMW did NOT build the engines fitted to the UK 2.5 TDs, even though the cars were assembled by Opel in Germany? If so, who did? :-?
All Omega TDs had BMW made engines, be it the U25DT or X25DT. Our lucky European neighbours got the BMW produced Y25DT in the 2.5DTi.
The only differences between those engines fitted in BMW 525tds and 325tds, apart from ancillaries due to car differences, are the Vauxhall ones are detuned to 120bhp.
Note that U25DT, X25DT and Y25DT are GM designations, BMW designate it M51
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i would go for the 2,2 if you are looking for economy. its the 2.0dti from opel (101hp) but with some longer thingies that connect the piston to crankshaft :P.. the only 2,5 BMW engine that was mounted on omega is the comonrail one with 150hp, and i think in uk it wasn't sold, the rest of them are just copies. on my 2,2 i change the oil at 10.000km (~6000miles), if you drive most of them on highway at legal speeds you can even change it at 10.000miles. you can also chiptune the 2,2 and reach: 2.2 DTI - Y22DTH - 155 CP and 380 Nm - 250 EUR (including PSG16) . with chip how much does it gain the 2,5??
Interesting, are you saying that BMW did NOT build the engines fitted to the UK 2.5 TDs, even though the cars were assembled by Opel in Germany? If so, who did? :-?
thats what i know, and everywhere i looked confirmed my sayings.. at least official. even wikipedia mentions that the bmw engine is the y25dt wich is comonrail. and if they were made by opel germany doesn't mean anthing.. on a beemer engine there will be branding letters on most of the parts but on omegas engine there aren't any ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vauxhall_Omega
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i would go for the 2,2 if you are looking for economy. its the 2.0dti from opel (101hp) but with some longer thingies that connect the piston to crankshaft :P.. the only 2,5 BMW engine that was mounted on omega is the comonrail one with 150hp, and i think in uk it wasn't sold, the rest of them are just copies. on my 2,2 i change the oil at 10.000km (~6000miles), if you drive most of them on highway at legal speeds you can even change it at 10.000miles. you can also chiptune the 2,2 and reach: 2.2 DTI - Y22DTH - 155 CP and 380 Nm - 250 EUR (including PSG16) . with chip how much does it gain the 2,5??
Interesting, are you saying that BMW did NOT build the engines fitted to the UK 2.5 TDs, even though the cars were assembled by Opel in Germany? If so, who did? :-?
thats what i know, and everywhere i looked confirmed my sayings.. at least official. even wikipedia mentions that the bmw engine is the y25dt wich is comonrail. and if they were made by opel germany doesn't mean anthing.. on a beemer engine there will be branding letters on most of the parts but on omegas engine there aren't any ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vauxhall_Omega
The Opel/Vauxhall Omega-B 2.5 diesels are all BMW supplied engines.
And having been very intimate with U25DT and X25DT engines, believe me when I said they all have BMW markings on the components ;D
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my bad then... but from all data sheets i had from opel diesel engines only the comonrail one was said to be a bmw.. wich was givven in return of their auto 5 speed gearbox.. bastards. on opels they weren't puting it but they suplied it to bmw...
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i would go for the 2,2 if you are looking for economy. its the 2.0dti from opel (101hp) but with some longer thingies that connect the piston to crankshaft :P.. the only 2,5 BMW engine that was mounted on omega is the comonrail one with 150hp, and i think in uk it wasn't sold, the rest of them are just copies. on my 2,2 i change the oil at 10.000km (~6000miles), if you drive most of them on highway at legal speeds you can even change it at 10.000miles. you can also chiptune the 2,2 and reach: 2.2 DTI - Y22DTH - 155 CP and 380 Nm - 250 EUR (including PSG16) . with chip how much does it gain the 2,5??
Interesting, are you saying that BMW did NOT build the engines fitted to the UK 2.5 TDs, even though the cars were assembled by Opel in Germany? If so, who did? :-?
thats what i know, and everywhere i looked confirmed my sayings.. at least official. even wikipedia mentions that the bmw engine is the y25dt wich is comonrail. and if they were made by opel germany doesn't mean anthing.. on a beemer engine there will be branding letters on most of the parts but on omegas engine there aren't any ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vauxhall_Omega
The Opel/Vauxhall Omega-B 2.5 diesels are all BMW supplied engines.
And having been very intimate with U25DT and X25DT engines, believe me when I said they all have BMW markings on the components ;D
Yip just take off the viscous fan and there it is BMW.
as for original post I'd go for the tractor :y
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opel omega from 2001 got the common rail as an option!! rest of the poor uk had to make do with the 2.2dti,
owned my TD for god knows how many years now, bought a 2.2dti to replace it last year, was not impressed!! nice enough but absolutely gutless and i didnt find it any more economical than my TD!!, Loved the colour of it liked the way it drove but absolutely hated that unrefined 4 pot!!!
vxhl v6 on here bought it and he liked so much he bought another one(only cos his mrs stole the original one though)
drivng the TD wins hands down, economy about the same from my experience(was expecting much more from the dti) but it didnt happen in spite of driving it like miss daisy, where as the TD sits all day at 80-85 and returns the same economy i was getting from the dti, at 70
maybe i didnt give it long enough i dont know but just over 600 miles in it i did, me mate chris borrowed it and did another 500 and he named it" the hateful car" purely cos of the engine,lol
best advice is to test drive both of them in manual form and see which you prefer
should add I was very disapointed with the TD the first week i owned it, however as soon as i chipped it, it was a different animal and i was happy!
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hmmm... i really think that economy sits on 2,2 side.. i get almost 57mpg when i drive alone on side roads and on highway at legal speed i get 44mpg... these figures are made with cruise control. i doubt that the 2,5 gets better than this, but w8ing for some data from 2,5 owners :p
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hmmm... i really think that economy sits on 2,2 side.. i get almost 57mpg when i drive alone on side roads and on highway at legal speed i get 44mpg... these figures are made with cruise control. i doubt that the 2,5 gets better than this, but w8ing for some data from 2,5 owners :p
This is what my tractor gets cruising at around 70
(http://i978.photobucket.com/albums/ae262/broke-again/SP_A0100.jpg)
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hmmm... i really think that economy sits on 2,2 side.. i get almost 57mpg when i drive alone on side roads and on highway at legal speed i get 44mpg... these figures are made with cruise control. i doubt that the 2,5 gets better than this, but w8ing for some data from 2,5 owners :p
not to sure but you may be right, all i am able to tell you is mine will do around 650miles to a tank full, its done this numerous times when driving from england to spain, and spain to england,
when i can i travel at 80mph and i usually drive at night as the roads are clearer!!
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So after all of this I'm gonna say BIG Thanks to all and then .......
looks like I'm gonna have to test drive both 2.5 and 2.2 and think about it
but the economy is what I'm after and due to its a huge inside , it makes a great family ride
and may be if finances let me I'll get the 3.0 as a toy for my self due to like back-end-sliding-game called drifting
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I already had two 4-pot cars as daily drive
Skoda and Saab and they where good cars and they both gave me about 700miles to 1 tank (about 65Litres)
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I have both,I enjoy the 2.5td best,but am going too,start taking the 2,2 to work(as that where i do my most miles)But if its down to mpg the 2.2 wins hands down.ps both mine are manuals same spec,and facelifts.
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hmmm... i really think that economy sits on 2,2 side.. i get almost 57mpg when i drive alone on side roads and on highway at legal speed i get 44mpg... these figures are made with cruise control. i doubt that the 2,5 gets better than this, but w8ing for some data from 2,5 owners :p
Yes, but you also told us that 2.5 TD engines were BMW copies! ::) ::) ::)
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hmmm... i really think that economy sits on 2,2 side.. i get almost 57mpg when i drive alone on side roads and on highway at legal speed i get 44mpg... these figures are made with cruise control. i doubt that the 2,5 gets better than this, but w8ing for some data from 2,5 owners :p
Yes, but you also told us that 2.5 TD engines were BMW copies! ::) ::) ::)
i did but that was a supposition, and said i was wrong :-[. if you read my profile you will see that i own a 2,2dti so i would know :).
@hoofing it on what roads did you got that fuel consumption??
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hmmm... i really think that economy sits on 2,2 side.. i get almost 57mpg when i drive alone on side roads and on highway at legal speed i get 44mpg... these figures are made with cruise control. i doubt that the 2,5 gets better than this, but w8ing for some data from 2,5 owners :p
Yes, but you also told us that 2.5 TD engines were BMW copies! ::) ::) ::)
i did but that was a supposition, and said i was wrong :-[. if you read my profile you will see that i own a 2,2dti so i would know :).
@hoofing it on what roads did you got that fuel consumption??[/quote]
Falkirk to Blackpool around 210 miles M74/M6/M55 :y
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its got to be the 2.5td.seen one in a 525 bmw with 500 thou on it still running sweet and useing no oil or water.just do oil and filters reg
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Can't give much advice, as i have only just got a 2.5TD 1999 MFL.
But have found the MPG info interesting.
I've covered around 600 mile so far, mostly town driving, and the trip comp. is showing 27 MPG. On a couple of longish runs this has gone up to 37 MPG.
Now reading this thread, my MPG seems a bit low. I have no history to the car but have done an oil and fillter change. Is there anything else i can do to try and get better MPG?
Also a lot of you have mentioned a chip upgrade, how easy is it to do, where can I get a chip from and is it worth it?
Over all I am happy with the car, but it will take time to get use to it as it has replaced a V6 Carlton. :D
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Had my 2.2 Dti for a number of years. Around town i get 36 Mpg, in the winter that drops to 28-30 , motorway running is 45 - 50 mpg
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Can't really compare but personally I like the 2.2DTi's, uncomplecated and easy enough to work on should the need arise.
Go well enough as standard and more to be found if you de-cat them and get them re-mapped.
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Can't give much advice, as i have only just got a 2.5TD 1999 MFL.
But have found the MPG info interesting.
I've covered around 600 mile so far, mostly town driving, and the trip comp. is showing 27 MPG. On a couple of longish runs this has gone up to 37 MPG.
Now reading this thread, my MPG seems a bit low. I have no history to the car but have done an oil and fillter change. Is there anything else i can do to try and get better MPG?
Also a lot of you have mentioned a chip upgrade, how easy is it to do, where can I get a chip from and is it worth it?
Over all I am happy with the car, but it will take time to get use to it as it has replaced a V6 Carlton. :D
The auto in the 2.5TD saps mpg. Chipping them back to BMW spec will get the manuals returning good mpg.
However, chipping generally mucks up the MID display, making it over read mpg by a noticible margin.
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Sorry should have metioned mine is a manuel.
Where does one get a chip from and what sort of price should be expected?
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I've got the 2.5td, and I'm very satisfied, the only con is very slow till 2000rpm :o
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Send a PM to The Boy, he has a contact. Price in the region of £70
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I was shocked with the economy when i changed my 85 Audi td for an omega, however I'm now on my 4th, I need the auto to tow a skiboat up a steep slip.
all 4 did c33mpg about 250k mls, so if you want economy it's got to be the 2.2.
I believe the current audi slushbox uses more plastecine than the maligned Ar25.
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I was shocked with the economy when i changed my 85 Audi td for an omega, however I'm now on my 4th, I need the auto to tow a skiboat up a steep slip.
all 4 did c33mpg about 250k mls, so if you want economy it's got to be the 2.2.
I believe the current audi slushbox uses more plastecine than the maligned Ar25.
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Hi guys, 2.5td any day, just for the noise of 2 more cylinders!!, beats 4 cyl any day. 135k & all ive done is oil/filter every 5k & glow plugs @ 90k, trouble is now finding a good one. Used to tow a large caravan with ease, now use it to tow jetski to slipway, brill car wish they still made them! :)
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2.2 but im biased