Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega Electrical and Audio Help => Topic started by: Lazydocker on 03 June 2011, 10:44:34
-
Right, now I've got the LPG sorted and rubber stamped I should start thinking about the TM and H/F kit.
I have both here and also have the Autoleads 06-115b(?) (whatever it is!) suitable for the pre-wired cars with Bose. Mine's already got the telematics so I'm thinking of butchering the autoleads telemute cable to suit my purpose.
I have a fully populated 36 way TM loom and need to know which pins/wires I need to splice the H/F into and I assume it's best done up at the H/U end to run everything over to the passenger kick panel?
Do I need the trickery of the autoleads telemute cable (Bose equipped car) or can I feed directly into the TM loom? I'm referring to the output level control gubbins and the little circuit ;)
I suppose this is probably aimed at TB or VXLV6, being the masters of it ::) I'm planning to get it all prepared and probably fit it at the Lakes where there will be some more knowledgeable people about ::)
-
Well, fit the TM, get that all sorted, as that shouldn't have any bearing on anything.
The CK-7W, we need to test. Forget the autoleads. Pointless in this scenario. The one thing we do need to test is levels without isolation transformers (as fitted to prefacelifts). It may well be, the audio can just be joined, and the mute extended to TM loom from CK-7W. At worse, I have a circuit diagram, which is what I used (but due to Telematics having an issue with the isolation transformers fitted to prefacelifts)
-
Or lose the Telematics, some idiot will buy it ;D
-
Make sure you have the HF kit wired in after the TM so TM sits between HF kit and HU.
-
Make sure you have the HF kit wired in after the TM so TM sits between HF kit and HU.
And the mute wire as well - that how the TM knows ;)
Actually, not sure how well it copes with just Telematics, as no mute wire, therefore the TM unit won't know you are on the phone?
-
Make sure you have the HF kit wired in after the TM so TM sits between HF kit and HU.
And the mute wire as well - that how the TM knows ;)
Actually, not sure how well it copes with just Telematics, as no mute wire, therefore the TM unit won't know you are on the phone?
It's magic ;)
-
Sounds like I would be better to just bring the relevant bits to the Lakes ::) ::)
Seems silly to fit the TM and then have to make the connections to it in the car when it could all be done in the comfort of the dining room table :-/ :-/ ::)
-
Sounds like I would be better to just bring the relevant bits to the Lakes ::) ::)
Seems silly to fit the TM and then have to make the connections to it in the car when it could all be done in the comfort of the dining room table :-/ :-/ ::)
Nah, fit the TM, as that can be time consuming, but add a mute line to the Telematics side of the TM 'T' piece, and bring that out behind glovebox.
-
Sounds like I would be better to just bring the relevant bits to the Lakes ::) ::)
Seems silly to fit the TM and then have to make the connections to it in the car when it could all be done in the comfort of the dining room table :-/ :-/ ::)
Nah, fit the TM, as that can be time consuming, but add a mute line to the Telematics side of the TM 'T' piece, and bring that out behind glovebox.
Surely I need to run Audio and power lines too? Oh... Best get the correct wires to connect to as well ::) I assume I need to do the connections as close to the HU connection as possible?
-
Well you are also going to need a +12V ignition switched as the feed to the Telematics is perm live. You could get that from the glovebox lamp.
Not really sure about hacking into the Telematics car loom unless you could make a sub loom but you'll still be missing some lines, as you say the Trafficmaster sub loom is a better bet IMHO.
-
I believe everything else is availble either from telematics or from nearby
-
My theory was that I may as well sort all the wiring out before feeding the TM loom in, then it's fairly simple to fit the CK :y :y
-
OK, lets list it:-
+12V Perm - Telematics loom
+12V Switched - Glovebox lamp
0V Ground - Telematics loom
Audio out (to HU) - Telematics loom
Mic - Use Nokia HFM
Mute - Trafficmaster loom (extend line after TM connector)
-
OK, lets list it:-
+12V Perm - Telematics loom
+12V Switched - Glovebox lamp
0V Ground - Telematics loom
Audio out (to HU) - Telematics loom
Mic - Use Nokia HFM
Mute - Trafficmaster loom (extend line after TM connector)
Oh dear... I'm getting a little confused now :-[ :-[
Might be that I've been off the painkillers and on the booze today :-[ ::)
-
Thing is... If you are going to route a TM loom then you have to have the HU cage out, if you are doing that it seems sensible to me to run the CK wiring out to the left straight of the ISO (except mute as after TM). At least you won't be hacking the original Telematics wiring.
So in theory I agree with LD!!!
-
Thing is... If you are going to route a TM loom then you have to have the HU cage out, if you are doing that it seems sensible to me to run the CK wiring out to the left straight of the ISO (except mute as after TM). At least you won't be hacking the original Telematics wiring.
So in theory I agree with LD!!!
That was my thinking too... Surely all the connections I need are present in the 36 way TM loom... Must be easier to pick them off before threading it in :-/
-
Yep, except mute has to come from the car loom side of the TM as the TM mute is over-ridden by CK mute when using the CK.
-
Yep, except mute has to come from the car loom side of the TM as the TM mute is over-ridden by CK mute when using the CK.
I think I'll revisit this on Sunday (busy tomorrow!) when I'm not so tired and incohol fuzzled ::)
If I understand correctly, the mute has to come from the car end of the loom, not the HU end?
-
That's correct. :y
-
Getting there slowly :-X :-[ ::)
All I need now are the pin numbers and/or wire colours I need to use ::)
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
-
See, as much as I hate butchering built in looms, I would in this case pick off what I could from the telematics loom.
-
See, as much as I hate butchering built in looms, I would in this case pick off what I could from the telematics loom.
The way I see it, if I'm feeding wires across from the TM loom anyway (and the TM loom as well) I may as well do it all together ;)
-
See, as much as I hate butchering built in looms, I would in this case pick off what I could from the telematics loom.
The way I see it, if I'm feeding wires across from the TM loom anyway (and the TM loom as well) I may as well do it all together ;)
Your choice, but its already tight behind/around stereo, without trying to force more in ;)
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... Going to build the loom up in the next few days so any chance of wire colours to check please?
Also, can you please confirm that I can just put the audio feed directly into the HU (being Bose equipped) or does it need anything in between? Oh... And explain what pins 35 and 36 actually mean as I'm being thick :-[ :-[
Finally... What colour/pin is the mute wire?
Thanks :y
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... Going to build the loom up in the next few days so any chance of wire colours to check please?
Also, can you please confirm that I can just put the audio feed directly into the HU (being Bose equipped) or does it need anything in between? Oh... And explain what pins 35 and 36 actually mean as I'm being thick :-[ :-[
Finally... What colour/pin is the mute wire?
Thanks :y
IIRC pins are numbered on the ISO
-
Also, as I don't have enough bits of old loom kicking about any more, what grade wire do I need to build this loom up? Is it readily available at Craplins?
-
Also, as I don't have enough bits of old loom kicking about any more, what grade wire do I need to build this loom up? Is it readily available at Craplins?
Albs???????
-
Also, as I don't have enough bits of old loom kicking about any more, what grade wire do I need to build this loom up? Is it readily available at Craplins?
Albs???????
Yeah, but I want to have it built before I go see him so I can feed it all through whilst we've got my stereo out to test his ;) He can help me feed it all through as payment for using my car as a test bed ;D
-
Also, as I don't have enough bits of old loom kicking about any more, what grade wire do I need to build this loom up? Is it readily available at Craplins?
Albs???????
Yeah, but I want to have it built before I go see him so I can feed it all through whilst we've got my stereo out to test his ;) He can help me feed it all through as payment for turning my car into an inferno ;D
Hopefully it wont come to that. Jammy was right, you do worry too much. :D ;D ;D
I could possibly post some wires to you if need be. ;)
Mute wire is black btw ;)
-
Also, as I don't have enough bits of old loom kicking about any more, what grade wire do I need to build this loom up? Is it readily available at Craplins?
Albs???????
Yeah, but I want to have it built before I go see him so I can feed it all through whilst we've got my stereo out to test his ;) He can help me feed it all through as payment for turning my car into an inferno ;D
Hopefully it wont come to that. Jammy was right, you do worry too much. :D ;D ;D
I could possibly post some wires to you if need be. ;)
Mute wire is black btw ;)
TBH, I'll just buy a roll of the correct cross section wire from craplins and make the loom up... It won't matter to me if it's all one colour as long as I make it up on the bench ;)
-
Also, as I don't have enough bits of old loom kicking about any more, what grade wire do I need to build this loom up? Is it readily available at Craplins?
Albs???????
Yeah, but I want to have it built before I go see him so I can feed it all through whilst we've got my stereo out to test his ;) He can help me feed it all through as payment for turning my car into an inferno ;D
Hopefully it wont come to that. Jammy was right, you do worry too much. :D ;D ;D
I could possibly post some wires to you if need be. ;)
Mute wire is black btw ;)
With your problems then all your wires must be that colour :D
-
If going from TM loom, the wire colours vary with age of TM loom! Count the pins!
Check the fuses on the CK-7W, from memory, both are 2A, but double check. That will give some idea of power wire requirements. Rest are all signal, so almost anything.
The audio must be screened, and one leg connected to screening as per VXL V6's post.
Until we can try one, its unknown if we need the mixer circuit, so bear that in mind. My circuit needs switched 12v, 0v, both audio inputs and audio output, so bear that in mind. Until we get GayBoy's done, that remains unclear...
As to Autoleads, I think they have made an incorrect assumption. I have only ever used their standard cable (with no circuitry/relays/etc on).
-
TBE is Bose equipped... What did you do when you fitted that one?
-
TBE is Bose equipped... What did you do when you fitted that one?
No Telematics in that, so slightly different.
I just used a generic (autoleads style, but 3rd party) lead.
Honestly, on the NCDC series (or any other factory fit radio from mini facelift onwards), why would Bose make any difference whatsoever ;)
-
Honestly, on the NCDC series (or any other factory fit radio from mini facelift onwards), why would Bose make any difference whatsoever ;)
Shouldn't be needed because the HF audio is going through the HU instead of direct to the speakers?
Am I right in my thinking there? :-/
But, as I have the Autoleads Telemute lead with the circuitry on it, is it worth me just butchering that to keep that as an option?
-
The audio must be screened, and one leg connected to screening as per VXL V6's post.
Please confirm this is what I think... The Audio lines +ve (solid colour?) to pin 35, -ve (with the trace) to the screen, pin 36?
It that all that's involved? I have speaker wire to extend the audio to the HF kit but do I need something special?
-
Is this any help LF?
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12034245/Trafficmaster_Harness_Connector.jpg)
-
The audio must be screened, and one leg connected to screening as per VXL V6's post.
Please confirm this is what I think... The Audio lines +ve (solid colour?) to pin 35, -ve (with the trace) to the screen, pin 36?
It that all that's involved? I have speaker wire to extend the audio to the HF kit but do I need something special?
Sounds right to me, take shielded cable from the CarKit Audio out to the ISO Audio in (35/36), run the mute to the trafficmaster pink/blue pin.
I'd also fit an inline fuse on your +12V and +12V switched lines to the Car Kit.
-
Is this any help LF?
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12034245/Trafficmaster_Harness_Connector.jpg)
Not really! :-[ :-[ ::) ::)
-
You keep saying "shielded cable"... I've only got maplins speaker cable... Is that ok?
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... Got some wire and bits to build up the loom...
Is the 12V switched correct on pin 2?
And, I have normal speaker wire... Is that OK for the audio?
-
Honestly, on the NCDC series (or any other factory fit radio from mini facelift onwards), why would Bose make any difference whatsoever ;)
Shouldn't be needed because the HF audio is going through the HU instead of direct to the speakers?
Am I right in my thinking there? :-/
But, as I have the Autoleads Telemute lead with the circuitry on it, is it worth me just butchering that to keep that as an option?
Nope
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... Got some wire and bits to build up the loom...
Is the 12V switched correct on pin 2?
And, I have normal speaker wire... Is that OK for the audio?
Far from ideal, but no harm will be done. At worse, you'll have to rerun it.
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... Got some wire and bits to build up the loom...
Is the 12V switched correct on pin 2?
And, I have normal speaker wire... Is that OK for the audio?
Far from ideal, but no harm will be done. At worse, you'll have to rerun it.
Why? ::)
-
It will be susceptable to interference...
-
It will be susceptable to interference...
Aahh... Don't suppose I can do anything to shield it?
Anyway... Are the pin out's correct?
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... On My TM Loom (36 way, fully populated)
Pin 2 - Thinner Red - 12V Switched
Pin 4 - Chunky Brown - 0V Ground
Pin 8 - Chunky Red - 12V Permanent
35 and 36 relate to the 2 lower wires in this pic: (which is +ve from the jack plug normally?)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12034245/Trafficmaster_Harness_Connector.jpg)
And mute is Pink with Blue trace on the above diagram (which goes to the car side of the TM loom
Does that look/sound right?
-
CK7W TM loom
Mute 'mute from phone'
Audio+ 'audio signal from phone/cdc'
Audio- 'audio earth from phone/cdc'
I'd pick up power locally (but then I'd pick up audio locally, thus utilising the Vx sheilded audio cable ::)), to reduce loom size behind HU.
There is a suitable earth stud above where you put the nokia, and power is easily found up above glovebox
-
CK7W TM loom
Mute 'mute from phone'
Audio+ 'audio signal from phone/cdc'
Audio- 'audio earth from phone/cdc'
I'd pick up power locally (but then I'd pick up audio locally, thus utilising the Vx sheilded audio cable ::)), to reduce loom size behind HU.
There is a suitable earth stud above where you put the nokia, and power is easily found up above glovebox
Thanks. Don't really want to pick up power locally because I don't want to butcher the car loom or drop the glovebox ;)
I'm sure the audio will be ok... At the end of the day the vehicle specific telemute leads don't use anything special ::)
As for loom size, I'll manage ::) An extra couple of wires to the TM loom can't make that much difference surely :-/
-
CK7W TM loom
Mute 'mute from phone'
Audio+ 'audio signal from phone/cdc'
Audio- 'audio earth from phone/cdc'
I'd pick up power locally (but then I'd pick up audio locally, thus utilising the Vx sheilded audio cable ::)), to reduce loom size behind HU.
There is a suitable earth stud above where you put the nokia, and power is easily found up above glovebox
Thanks. Don't really want to pick up power locally because I don't want to butcher the car loom or drop the glovebox ;)
I'm sure the audio will be ok... At the end of the day the vehicle specific telemute leads don't use anything special ::)
As for loom size, I'll manage ::) An extra couple of wires to the TM loom can't make that much difference surely :-/
Autoleads is only 6" long. The audio from the prewiring socket to HU is proper audio cable.
Govebox is easy.
But, if you want to get the power from TM, VXL V6 did post up how earlier :y
Potentially, if you do need a mixer, that will need 12v, 0v, audio in from Nokia, audio in from Telematics, so you may still have to go into Telematics loom, or potentially run yet another cable...
-
Need gayboy to get a move on and fit his really... Then I'll know for certain ::)
My biggest concern is blowing something :-[
-
Need gayboy to get a move on and fit his really... Then I'll know for certain ::)
My biggest concern is blowing something :-[
Its all pretty robust, as long as you get the power round the right way
-
Need gayboy to get a move on and fit his really... Then I'll know for certain ::)
My biggest concern is blowing something :-[
Its all pretty robust, as long as you get the power round the right way
I'm sure I can manage that :y :y
Just had a quick poke around the Autoleads site and they seem to think that the 4 digit stereo's are just a simple lead with no trickery involved so hopefully my home made one will be fine :y
-
Need gayboy to get a move on and fit his really... Then I'll know for certain ::)
My biggest concern is blowing something :-[
Its all pretty robust, as long as you get the power round the right way
I'm sure I can manage that :y :y
Just had a quick poke around the Autoleads site and they seem to think that the 4 digit stereo's are just a simple lead with no trickery involved so hopefully my home made one will be fine :y
Understand, Autoleads don't know their arse from their elbow. They make shite. Overpriced shite.
Get it out of your head that the special Bose Autoleads was ever, EVER required in any Omega. It wasn't.
-
Right... Considering my current physical limitations and the fact I didn't start anything until about half 3 today was reasonably productive :y
Loom all built up and all CK connections made on the TM loom, stereo out (that was easier than I expected!) but the cage really did fight... Think it cut me 4 times >:( >:(
Anyway, got it out eventually and managed to route the TM Loom and the CK loom in the relevant directions without too many temper tantrums ::)
Struggling to get the cage back in (and in so much pain it was time to stop :'() but not because of the additional wires... Can't see where the additional bit of loom (and the ISO plugs) should be tucked to get the cage back in place... Do they go off to the passenger side in the slight void there? or elsewhere? :-/ :-/
But... Wasn't expecting to get it all done today as I had to solder the connections as well so reasonably happy with the progress ;)
Tomorrow... Fight with the cage and get it back into the correct position and re-fit the radio. Fit the TM switch and drop the cable through and fit the CK box of tricks into the N/S Kick Panel :y :y
Any hints on where the ISO plugs should go?
-
If its the longer style TM loom, back/right. Shorter, behind cage just below the pulgs into back of cage.
-
And I really hope now you understand my signature, and stop laughing about my foot >:(
-
And I really hope now you understand my signature, and stop laughing about my foot >:(
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
The cage was very stubborn though ::) ::)
-
If its the longer style TM loom, back/right. Shorter, behind cage just below the pulgs into back of cage.
I'm guessing it's the shorter one... About 8" between ISO plugs
-
Got it all fitted and back together today but... ::)
Telematics is now very faint, Nokia Kit powers up and connects/functions fine but doesn't mute and no audio.
Trafficmaster powers up but no mute or audio unless on a telematics call, when it works but faintly.
Really didn't want to have to pull the radio back out and pull the loom back out but it looks like I'm going to have to >:( ::)
-
OK, thats answered the mixer query. Its needed ;D ;D ;D
The mute - reckon you've cocked up the mute, hence you can get TM to speak when making a call (as the telematics puts HU to aux in (via can, not via mute line))
Unplug the audio lead from Nokia, does the Telematics come back to normal volume?
-
OK, thats answered the mixer query. Its needed ;D ;D ;D
The mute - reckon you've cocked up the mute, hence you can get TM to speak when making a call (as the telematics puts HU to aux in (via can, not via mute line))
Unplug the audio lead from Nokia, does the Telematics come back to normal volume?
Took the mute exactly as per this thread ::)
Anyway, I've got to pop out in a while to water the in-law's garden so I'll unplug the Nokia in full and see what happens ;) Glad I didn't pack it all away in the kick panel now ::)
-
that won't affect the mute I think, but should help with faintness... ...in which case, you need an extra 2 wires in your loom...
Nokia > TM
\
> Mixer/impedence matcher > HU
/
Telematics
-
Right, unplugged the Nokia kit and the telematics is back to full volume :y
But if you hit the TM button when making a telematics call it's very loud! Nearly gave Mrs LD a heart attack :-X ::)
So... I guess you need to bring the relevant bits to the Lakes then :-X ::) ;D
[edit]The impedance matcher... What's involved in that then?[/edit]
-
Right, unplugged the Nokia kit and the telematics is back to full volume :y
But if you hit the TM button when making a telematics call it's very loud! Nearly gave Mrs LD a heart attack :-X ::)
So... I guess you need to bring the relevant bits to the Lakes then :-X ::) ;D
[edit]The impedance matcher... What's involved in that then?[/edit]
TM can be adjusted. I'm sure you've Please read the manual, but press the button 3 times...
-
Right, unplugged the Nokia kit and the telematics is back to full volume :y
But if you hit the TM button when making a telematics call it's very loud! Nearly gave Mrs LD a heart attack :-X ::)
So... I guess you need to bring the relevant bits to the Lakes then :-X ::) ;D
[edit]The impedance matcher... What's involved in that then?[/edit]
TM can be adjusted. I'm sure you've Please read the manual, but press the button 3 times...
No point in doing anything with that yet though as it only works when making a telematics call ::)
Not sure when I'll be going a little further afield to check whether it was just a dodgy mast today, but still no light working on the button ::)
-
Odd, but an easy problem to solve. You have bigger issues first...
-
Odd, but an easy problem to solve. You have bigger issues first...
Indeed.......... Open to suggestions, especially if they don't involve removing the head unit and new loom as the front of the H/U is very fragile ::) ::) Someone had definitely been there before me >:( >:(
-
Odd, but an easy problem to solve. You have bigger issues first...
Indeed.......... Open to suggestions, especially if they don't involve removing the head unit and new loom as the front of the H/U is very fragile ::) ::) Someone had definitely been there before me >:( >:(
As said in PM, meter out between TM plug and Nokia, to see if you got the mutes the right way round (suspect they are wrong).
reckon you still need to run 2 wires, due to mixer requirement.
-
Odd, but an easy problem to solve. You have bigger issues first...
Indeed.......... Open to suggestions, especially if they don't involve removing the head unit and new loom as the front of the H/U is very fragile ::) ::) Someone had definitely been there before me >:( >:(
As said in PM, meter out between TM plug and Nokia, to see if you got the mutes the right way round (suspect they are wrong).
reckon you still need to run 2 wires, due to mixer requirement.
Will meter it out when I get a chance, although I know 100% certain that I used the "mute from phone" wire as you instructed ;)
If I understand correctly I can fit the mixer without removing the loom/Head unit again, as the Nokia loom has everything except the telematics input. :-/
-
Depends on if you don't mind going in to telematics loom or not ;)
I made an assumption that that posted diagram was correct
-
Depends on if you don't mind going in to telematics loom or not ;)
Think I'd prefer it to pulling it all out again ::)
Anyway, I'll speak nicely to you at the Lakes :-X ::)
I made an assumption that that posted diagram was correct
Never Assume! ::) ::) ;D
If needs be I'll insulate the current mute I fitted and run a new one directly across the car (to avoid having to remove the Head Unit again) ;)
-
My best mate, bless him, will get a apair of boards milled up for you and gayboy for this mixer, should be done in next week or 2
-
My best mate, bless him, will get a apair of boards milled up for you and gayboy for this mixer, should be done in next week or 2
How about another 1 or 2? ::) :y
-
My best mate, bless him, will get a apair of boards milled up for you and gayboy for this mixer, should be done in next week or 2
How about another 1 or 2? ::) :y
I can give you the circuit. I can prolly get you the artwork when he's done it, but thinnk its too cheeky to ask for more milled boards from him :-[s
-
I think you have already sent me the circuit.
The artwork would be excellent though, I could get one made up for a possible project I may have in mind ::)
-
My best mate, bless him, will get a apair of boards milled up for you and gayboy for this mixer, should be done in next week or 2
Excellent. Thank you/him!
Fancy fitting it at the Lakes? ::)
-
Thank you..... :)
-
Quick update... I've not had chance to meter it out yet but the light on the button has started lighting up :y
Still no mute/audio though so it hasn't fixed itself ::)
As the Nokia kit is completely unplugged I'm guessing that the TM loom isn't compatible with my HU without modification... Just hope I can do it at the TM plug ::)
I wonder if RobG can remember what year car/head unit it came from :-/
-
Quick update... I've not had chance to meter it out yet but the light on the button has started lighting up :y
Still no mute/audio though so it hasn't fixed itself ::)
As the Nokia kit is completely unplugged I'm guessing that the TM loom isn't compatible with my HU without modification... Just hope I can do it at the TM plug ::)
I wonder if RobG can remember what year car/head unit it came from :-/[/quoute]
If yours was a straight loom (all standard Omega full 36 way ones are), then its compatible.
I suspect a Cripple-Cockup...
I'll dig out a loom, and see whats what
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... On My TM Loom (36 way, fully populated)
Pin 2 - Thinner Red - 12V Switched
Pin 4 - Chunky Brown - 0V Ground
Pin 8 - Chunky Red - 12V Permanent
35 and 36 relate to the 2 lower wires in this pic: (which is +ve from the jack plug normally?)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12034245/Trafficmaster_Harness_Connector.jpg)
And mute is Pink with Blue trace on the above diagram (which goes to the car side of the TM loom
Does that look/sound right?
Oh FFS, this is wrong!!!
-
ISO Pins
2 - 12V switched (* double check that one!)
4 - 0V Ground
8 - 12V Permanent
35 - Audio +
36 - Audio shield
Right... On My TM Loom (36 way, fully populated)
Pin 2 - Thinner Red - 12V Switched
Pin 4 - Chunky Brown - 0V Ground
Pin 8 - Chunky Red - 12V Permanent
35 and 36 relate to the 2 lower wires in this pic: (which is +ve from the jack plug normally?)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12034245/Trafficmaster_Harness_Connector.jpg)
And mute is Pink with Blue trace on the above diagram (which goes to the car side of the TM loom
Does that look/sound right?
Right, there is an error on this >:(. But, at least its not my car ::)
Cripple, if you are 100% sure you've done it right, swap over:
Orange/Red (Audio from phone/CDC)
and
Orange/Blue (Audio to HU)
You can do this at the TM end of the loom, though it will be awkward due to lying on your back, head on the brake pedal ;D
-
Right, there is an error on this >:(. But, at least its not my car ::)
Cripple, if you are 100% sure you've done it right, swap over:
Orange/Red (Audio from phone/CDC)
and
Orange/Blue (Audio to HU)
You can do this at the TM end of the loom, though it will be awkward due to lying on your back, head on the brake pedal ;D
Not had a chance to try swapping them yet but I do remember that some of my wire colours were different to the diagram. I connected it to the wire from the appropriate pin in the above diagram and think these 2 were correct :-/
I have a dreadful feeling that I'm going to be pulling it all out again ::) but will try swapping those wires around first ;)
Can the pins be removed from the plug and swapped that way or am I going to need to cut & solder them?
I know 100% that I connected everything to the wires as per the (now found to be incorrect) diagram posted by that Zok bloke ::) ::)
-
I care not about the colours, as I know they can vary. Its the pins that are incorrect.
Will swapping those 2 make a difference? Who knows. But its a fault.
This is unlike to affect the (lack of) MUTE, so I suspect you will be yanking it all out again.
-
Ah, a few things become clear. Non of them helpful though :-[
1 clearly I have no clue what most of this thread means. ;D
2 I fully intended go get my similar project under way before meeting TB sat last by getting stuff plugged in , trim panels off, loom in place etc. Sadly no time, I didn't bring it as I didn't feel it fair to ask him to do the stuff I could prepare anyway. But no matter as it pessed down all day anyway.
3 we discussed it briefly and TB mentioned yours needed a mixer, and being thick I dint fully appreciate I would need one as well, and hence that he was doing me a real favor with the boards so thanks again. :)
4 my fobia about these things ment I've only just summoned the strength to read this :-[. ;D
5 although I thought it would be helpful to make a start, seems from what TB was saying, I'll likely be making more work for finishing the project ie soldering connections.... And probably braking kick panels as well by the sound of it....? :-[
6 looks like the lakes is next opportunity...? What can I do in the mean time?
...and this other project... I wonder? ::)
-
Ah, a few things become clear. Non of them helpful though :-[
1 clearly I have no clue what most of this thread means. ;D
2 I fully intended go get my similar project under way before meeting TB sat last by getting stuff plugged in , trim panels off, loom in place etc. Sadly no time, I didn't bring it as I didn't feel it fair to ask him to do the stuff I could prepare anyway. But no matter as it pessed down all day anyway.
3 we discussed it briefly and TB mentioned yours needed a mixer, and being thick I dint fully appreciate I would need one as well, and hence that he was doing me a real favor with the boards so thanks again. :)
4 my fobia about these things ment I've only just summoned the strength to read this :-[. ;D
5 although I thought it would be helpful to make a start, seems from what TB was saying, I'll likely be making more work for finishing the project ie soldering connections.... And probably braking kick panels as well by the sound of it....? :-[
6 looks like the lakes is next opportunity...? What can I do in the mean time?
...and this other protect... I wonder? ::)
It will be a couple of weeks before I can get the boards milled up, as I'm reliant on favours from others (as I don't have the equipment to do it, and the old etching method is difficult to get decent etching fluids).
Given the close proximity you are to me, and the fact that you will, no doubt, be busy playing with everyone's bushes at the Lakes, we can have a play before or after the meet, rather than try to fit too much in on a busy weekend?
-
Ah, a few things become clear. Non of them helpful though :-[
1 clearly I have no clue what most of this thread means. ;D
2 I fully intended go get my similar project under way before meeting TB sat last by getting stuff plugged in , trim panels off, loom in place etc. Sadly no time, I didn't bring it as I didn't feel it fair to ask him to do the stuff I could prepare anyway. But no matter as it pessed down all day anyway.
3 we discussed it briefly and TB mentioned yours needed a mixer, and being thick I dint fully appreciate I would need one as well, and hence that he was doing me a real favor with the boards so thanks again. :)
4 my fobia about these things ment I've only just summoned the strength to read this :-[. ;D
5 although I thought it would be helpful to make a start, seems from what TB was saying, I'll likely be making more work for finishing the project ie soldering connections.... And probably braking kick panels as well by the sound of it....? :-[
6 looks like the lakes is next opportunity...? What can I do in the mean time?
...and this other protect... I wonder? ::)
It will be a couple of weeks before I can get the boards milled up, as I'm reliant on favours from others (as I don't have the equipment to do it, and the old etching method is difficult to get decent etching fluids).
Given the close proximity you are to me, and the fact that you will, no doubt, be busy playing with everyone's bushes at the Lakes, we can have a play before or after the meet, rather than try to fit too much in on a busy weekend?
Sounds like an excuse for a curry! ::) ::) :D :D
-
Sounds like an excuse for a curry! ::) ::) :D :D
The last curry I had with Gayboy, Saturday evening, I could barely drink... ...I hadn't recovered from the night before when I went out for a quiet drink with my best mate, and ended up in the curry house.
I was a bit dopey Saturday morning :-[
-
Sounds like an excuse for a curry! ::) ::) :D :D
The last curry I had with Gayboy, Saturday evening, I could barely drink... ...I hadn't recovered from the night before when I went out for a quiet drink with my best mate, and ended up in the curry house.
I was a bit dopey Saturday morning :-[
Man Up! ;D ;D ;D ;D
Were you on little bottles again? :-? :-?
-
Big bottles, only one here though, as "I" was driving. So Groomer had no excuse. ;D
-
Sounds like an excuse for a curry! ::) ::) :D :D
The last curry I had with Gayboy, Saturday evening, I could barely drink... ...I hadn't recovered from the night before when I went out for a quiet drink with my best mate, and ended up in the curry house.
I was a bit dopey Saturday morning :-[
Man Up! ;D ;D ;D ;D
Were you on little bottles again? :-? :-?
No, no little bottles again - unless you count the bottles of Becks in the hotel Friday night (because the best Hotel in Brackley sells shite beer on draft).
I think its age catching up with me - recovery takes longer :-[
-
Ah, a few things become clear. Non of them helpful though :-[
1 clearly I have no clue what most of this thread means. ;D
2 I fully intended go get my similar project under way before meeting TB sat last by getting stuff plugged in , trim panels off, loom in place etc. Sadly no time, I didn't bring it as I didn't feel it fair to ask him to do the stuff I could prepare anyway. But no matter as it pessed down all day anyway.
3 we discussed it briefly and TB mentioned yours needed a mixer, and being thick I dint fully appreciate I would need one as well, and hence that he was doing me a real favor with the boards so thanks again. :)
4 my fobia about these things ment I've only just summoned the strength to read this :-[. ;D
5 although I thought it would be helpful to make a start, seems from what TB was saying, I'll likely be making more work for finishing the project ie soldering connections.... And probably braking kick panels as well by the sound of it....? :-[
6 looks like the lakes is next opportunity...? What can I do in the mean time?
...and this other protect... I wonder? ::)
It will be a couple of weeks before I can get the boards milled up, as I'm reliant on favours from others (as I don't have the equipment to do it, and the old etching method is difficult to get decent etching fluids).
Given the close proximity you are to me, and the fact that you will, no doubt, be busy playing with everyone's bushes at the Lakes, we can have a play before or after the meet, rather than try to fit too much in on a busy weekend?
Depending when you plan to do these installs I might be able to pop over and destroy help out :y
-
Ah, a few things become clear. Non of them helpful though :-[
1 clearly I have no clue what most of this thread means. ;D
2 I fully intended go get my similar project under way before meeting TB sat last by getting stuff plugged in , trim panels off, loom in place etc. Sadly no time, I didn't bring it as I didn't feel it fair to ask him to do the stuff I could prepare anyway. But no matter as it pessed down all day anyway.
3 we discussed it briefly and TB mentioned yours needed a mixer, and being thick I dint fully appreciate I would need one as well, and hence that he was doing me a real favor with the boards so thanks again. :)
4 my fobia about these things ment I've only just summoned the strength to read this :-[. ;D
5 although I thought it would be helpful to make a start, seems from what TB was saying, I'll likely be making more work for finishing the project ie soldering connections.... And probably braking kick panels as well by the sound of it....? :-[
6 looks like the lakes is next opportunity...? What can I do in the mean time?
...and this other protect... I wonder? ::)
It will be a couple of weeks before I can get the boards milled up, as I'm reliant on favours from others (as I don't have the equipment to do it, and the old etching method is difficult to get decent etching fluids).
Given the close proximity you are to me, and the fact that you will, no doubt, be busy playing with everyone's bushes at the Lakes, we can have a play before or after the meet, rather than try to fit too much in on a busy weekend?
Depending when you plan to do these installs I might be able to pop over and destroy help out :y
After lakes probably, by the sound of it. But I'll stick the box in the car just in case. ;) .... Is there a curry house in the lakes? No never mind. ;D
-
I'm going to have to leave it all alone until after I've been into hospital next week... Just went out to try and swap those 2 wires over and within a few minutes (as long as it took to get the unit out and unplug it) I was in agony :'( :'(
Hopefully someone (TB!) will take pity on me at the Lakes and have a look for me :-* ::) ;D
-
Scrub my last... Except for the volume issues with the Nokia plugged in, which I'm sure the mixer circuit will fix, all is working :y
Well... I'm getting audio from the TM now and, for the brief time I plugged the Nokia kit in to test it, from the Nokia too :y
I can only assume that one of the pins in the TM plug wasn't connecting properly as I haven't changed anything :-[ :-[
There is a "Tick" behind the TM audio though and it hasn't fired up by itself, although I think this is a duff mast as I only passed the one and it seemed to be lighting up the button OK on a longer journey last week :y :y
And before anyone asks, yes it is in automatic mode ::)
-
Thats the second one I've seen that always seems to be in manual mode, even though in automatic. Seems to be an actual fault with the TM unit.
Not the end of the world, as easy to change...
-
After lakes probably, by the sound of it. But I'll stick the box in the car just in case. ;) .... Is there a curry house in the lakes? No never mind. ;D
Depends on when you next have a few spare hours... ...anything for a break from messing with bloody computers ;D
-
Thats the second one I've seen that always seems to be in manual mode, even though in automatic. Seems to be an actual fault with the TM unit.
Not the end of the world, as easy to change...
Yup... But it looks like the TM loom was fine after all ::)
Oh... And all the connections for the CK are fine too, although it's going to need cutting into to fit the mixer (I assume) ::) Are we going to be able to fit it all at the lakes? :-?
-
Thats the second one I've seen that always seems to be in manual mode, even though in automatic. Seems to be an actual fault with the TM unit.
Not the end of the world, as easy to change...
Yup... But it looks like the TM loom was fine after all ::)
Oh... And all the connections for the CK are fine too, although it's going to need cutting into to fit the mixer (I assume) ::) Are we going to be able to fit it all at the lakes? :-?
I can give you the mixer to fit, assuming I have them done by then. It just needs (switched) 12v, 0v, audio from Telematics, audio from Nokia, and audio towards the HU. So as long as you have those available, its a straightforward job electrically. Finding somewhere to mount it though.....
Because the Telematics has no mute line, Trafficmaster can interrupt your Telamatics call (Nokia call is OK, as Nokia has mute line).
-
And yes, you need to cut into the Telematics audio wires for the mixer.
-
Thats the second one I've seen that always seems to be in manual mode, even though in automatic. Seems to be an actual fault with the TM unit.
Not the end of the world, as easy to change...
Yup... But it looks like the TM loom was fine after all ::)
Oh... And all the connections for the CK are fine too, although it's going to need cutting into to fit the mixer (I assume) ::) Are we going to be able to fit it all at the lakes? :-?
I can give you the mixer to fit, assuming I have them done by then. It just needs (switched) 12v, 0v, audio from Telematics, audio from Nokia, and audio towards the HU. So as long as you have those available, its a straightforward job electrically. Finding somewhere to mount it though.....
Because the Telematics has no mute line, Trafficmaster can interrupt your Telamatics call (Nokia call is OK, as Nokia has mute line).
So, the only connections that aren't already there are the telematics audio, which I assume you can point me towards? Are those spliced into or cut?
The others are all available at the nokia kit end of the loom :y
As for TM interrupting telematics call, it used to on the saloon anyway ;) If on a call and traffic info pops up a quick press of the button shuts it up or listen and ignore the caller ::) :D
-
Your CCRT shouldn't have done that, as it should not be interupted when in a call. But then those CCRTs are unreliable ;D. So, yes, same applies, quick press to shut it up :y
The power (12v and 0v) is spliced (or nicked from Nokia bit).
The audio is cut to feed via mixer circuit.
A field insn't ideal, as anything powerful enough to shrink heatshrink tends to pop out the campsite trips - esp there, as we had a fair amount of trouble last year, because we have to share hookups, and most tents are using high power Peltier type coolboxes. We can attempt it, but it might need redoing when you get home.
-
Your CCRT shouldn't have done that, as it should not be interupted when in a call. But then those CCRTs are unreliable ;D. So, yes, same applies, quick press to shut it up :y
The power (12v and 0v) is spliced (or nicked from Nokia bit).
The audio is cut to feed via mixer circuit.
A field insn't ideal, as anything powerful enough to shrink heatshrink tends to pop out the campsite trips - esp there, as we had a fair amount of trouble last year, because we have to share hookups, and most tents are using high power Peltier type coolboxes. We can attempt it, but it might need redoing when you get home.
We've got a static ;)
But anyway, I'll try to remember my little gas blow torch... I normally use it for heat shrink with a gentle waft ::) Can you bring your gas soldering iron please?
As the audio is cut to feed via mixer, I assume that the Nokia audi will go through the same audio cables to HU (so will now be shielded ::)) and the existing Nokia audio that I spliced into the TM loom will become redundant? Not a problem, I'll just cut and insulate instead of digging it all out again ::)
-
correct.
I wouldn't be using blowtorches or gas soldering irons on it. Gas soldering irons too big for the task, blowtorches, too much other stuff nearby!
-
I wouldn't be using blowtorches or gas soldering irons on it. Gas soldering irons too big for the task, blowtorches, too much other stuff nearby!
When I say blow torch, it's a bit of an exaggeration. It's one of the little modelling ones, a bit like this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BUTANE-MICRO-BLOW-TORCH-MODEL-MAKER-MECHANIC-DIYer-/370130550076)
As for soldering iron... I thought it would be easier to get your little gas one in than an electric one ;)
You could, of course, stick some fly leads onto the mixer if you get it in time, then it will just be a case of joining the wires ::)
-
Strange... Not done anything at all and the car hasn't moved and it's stopped working again :-/ I wonder if it's an intermittently faulty unit :-/
-
Strange... Not done anything at all and the car hasn't moved and it's stopped working again :-/ I wonder if it's an intermittently faulty unit :-/
Unusual, but not beyond the realms of possibility. TM unit would have been tested before I gave it to you, but not fitted to a car...
-
Does the Telematics still work as expected?
-
Does the Telematics still work as expected?
Yep. Obviously the Nokia kit is unplugged so it's at the right volume, as it was when I parked the car up with the TM working, got back in and it had stopped :-/
Basically decided that I shouldn't do anything else until I've tried a different unit ;)
Did you get my PM regarding the spares box?
-
Does the Telematics still work as expected?
Yep. Obviously the Nokia kit is unplugged so it's at the right volume, as it was when I parked the car up with the TM working, got back in and it had stopped :-/
Basically decided that I shouldn't do anything else until I've tried a different unit ;)
Did you get my PM regarding the spares box?
That confirms my suspicions that the fault lies with the mute.
-
That confirms my suspicions that the fault lies with the mute.
But where? In the TM unit? If not, why did it work yesterday and then stop for no apparent reason? :-?
I'm confused ::)
-
That confirms my suspicions that the fault lies with the mute.
But where? In the TM unit? If not, why did it work yesterday and then stop for no apparent reason? :-?
I'm confused ::)
Why would intermittent make it the unit and not anything else - your diagnostics are flawed ;)
The unit is the least likely, but easiest to test.
Pressing the button, do you get External Audio on the CID briefly? Do you get click from TM unit?
-
I agree that it's not definitely the unit but it's easy to swap it for a known good one to eliminate it ;) Far easier than pulling the loom out again ;D
There is definitely a problem with the unit... Today on a journey to Albs' place it picked up a signal from a mast (lit up the button) just once. That can't be some 20+ faulty masts ;)
The unit is definitely only working intermittently so I'll try a known working one before trying anything else ;)
-
Put another (not necessarily working) one in, see if it *always* responds to button presses...
-
Put another (not necessarily working) one in, see if it *always* responds to button presses...
That's the plan... Not got one at the moment though ::)
-
Put another (not necessarily working) one in, see if it *always* responds to button presses...
That's the plan... Not got one at the moment though ::)
I'll bring the ones I have here to the Lakes.
There are two black box type (one possibly faulty) which I obtained from TB. and at least a silver one with an expired licence.
So far I only got around to fitting one on the DTi Elite.... haven't got around to the other two yet! :-X
-
I've got the black box type ;)
I might get chance to steal borrow one from johnnycboy before the Lakes meet if I can get down to see him ::)
-
PM me your address and I will try and post them off tomorrow.
-
PM me your address and I will try and post them off tomorrow.
Not really desperate but if you want to :y
Pm incoming
-
Put another (not necessarily working) one in, see if it *always* responds to button presses...
That's the plan... Not got one at the moment though ::)
Mine arrived from RobG today if it's any use to you? I assume that there isn't a current subscription on it though. :-/
-
Put another (not necessarily working) one in, see if it *always* responds to button presses...
That's the plan... Not got one at the moment though ::)
Mine arrived from RobG today if it's any use to you? I assume that there isn't a current subscription on it though. :-/
Might have one in the post anyway but if it hasn't arrived before I see you I can try yours :y It's only to test the audio, which will work without a subscription ;)
-
Put another (not necessarily working) one in, see if it *always* responds to button presses...
That's the plan... Not got one at the moment though ::)
Mine arrived from RobG today if it's any use to you? I assume that there isn't a current subscription on it though. :-/
Might have one in the post anyway but if it hasn't arrived before I see you I can try yours :y It's only to test the audio, which will work without a subscription ;)
No probs, just let me know! :y
-
zero chance of me getting to a PO this side of the lakes, sorry :-[
-
zero chance of me getting to a PO this side of the lakes, sorry :-[
No point in rushing to get one in the post... I have several offers of a unit to swap in and try ;)
Audio working fine today but not picking up any masts... Does lean towards the unit IMO ::) Any chance there was a mix up and I got the dodgy one with Andy getting 2 good ones? :-?
-
zero chance of me getting to a PO this side of the lakes, sorry :-[
No point in rushing to get one in the post... I have several offers of a unit to swap in and try ;)
Audio working fine today but not picking up any masts... Does lean towards the unit IMO ::) Any chance there was a mix up and I got the dodgy one with Andy getting 2 good ones? :-?
The symptoms dont match.
-
zero chance of me getting to a PO this side of the lakes, sorry :-[
No point in rushing to get one in the post... I have several offers of a unit to swap in and try ;)
Audio working fine today but not picking up any masts... Does lean towards the unit IMO ::) Any chance there was a mix up and I got the dodgy one with Andy getting 2 good ones? :-?
The symptoms dont match.
Ok. We'll see what happens tomorrow then ;D
-
zero chance of me getting to a PO this side of the lakes, sorry :-[
No point in rushing to get one in the post... I have several offers of a unit to swap in and try ;)
Audio working fine today but not picking up any masts... Does lean towards the unit IMO ::) Any chance there was a mix up and I got the dodgy one with Andy getting 2 good ones? :-?
The symptoms dont match.
Ok. We'll see what happens tomorrow then ;D
Mute and audio worked, then didn't, then worked again ::)
Still not picking up the masts properly though ::) I'll try out a different unit when I get a chance... That'll (hopefully) confirm/rule out the unit and I can start hunting through the wiring if neccessary :y
-
zero chance of me getting to a PO this side of the lakes, sorry :-[
No point in rushing to get one in the post... I have several offers of a unit to swap in and try ;)
Audio working fine today but not picking up any masts... Does lean towards the unit IMO ::) Any chance there was a mix up and I got the dodgy one with Andy getting 2 good ones? :-?
The symptoms dont match.
Ok. We'll see what happens tomorrow then ;D
Mute and audio worked, then didn't, then worked again ::)
Still not picking up the masts properly though ::) I'll try out a different unit when I get a chance... That'll (hopefully) confirm/rule out the unit and I can start hunting through the wiring if neccessary :y
Was that on replacement TM?
Forget the masts, if its not muting when you press the button (don't do this within first 30s of starting car), then you have a fauly somewhere.
-
Have you metered out the wiring as suggested last week (or the week before)?
-
No, that was with the existing unit. It's muting and playing audio still today but not been far enough to do anything much ::)
I haven't metered it out yet... It started working when I was thinking about it so I forgot :-[ I'll try and swap a different unit in tomorrow (I have the 2 from Andy to try now) :y What were the symptoms of the faulty one?
-
Not that ;)
Meter it out, then we know. Post back when you have the results of that metering out.
-
Not that ;)
Meter it out, then we know. Post back when you have the results of that metering out.
Not likely to get done before the Lakes TBH... Busy tomorrow and into hospital Wednesday am. Likely to be unfit for anything much after that ::)
Might just about be able to swap the units over. Planning to try tomorrow morning before I go out :y
-
if its not muting when you press the button (don't do this within first 30s of starting car), then you have a fauly somewhere.
That's just it... It is most of the time ;)
-
Didn't have time to meter it out bit have swapped for another unit and, so far, all seems good :y
Only thing is, and this may not be an issue, it doesn't beep when it first picks up a clear signal. Don't know if it will cut in automatically when it picks up traffic yet (as I haven't met any ;)) but all seems good so far. :y It certainly is picking up direction of travel and masts... Considerable progress on the last few weeks :y
-
Check its in Automatic mode.
However, I still think its a wiring fault - before when you unplugged it and plugged back in, it worked briefly...
-
Check its in Automatic mode.
However, I still think its a wiring fault - before when you unplugged it and plugged back in, it worked briefly...
It's in automatic mode. Other unit worked randomly, this one (so far) is still going strong :-/
The other unit only ever said "Trafficmaster", even if the light was on.