Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: AndySnapper on 29 November 2011, 09:49:31
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I have a 1998 Omega Elite Auto Estate with the BMW 2.5TD lump.
Driven the car from new, initially as company car (lucky me) which I became so attached to, I bought it for myself when it turned 4 years old.
I think there has always been a problem with warm starting on this model and I understand that some electronics have been produced at one time, to enable the glow plugs to be heated even when the engine is warm. I have lost track of where I read this (it might have been in this forum).
Having spent lots of money on replacing glow plugs, injector strip-downs and cleaning, leak-off pipe replacements I am loathe to continue chucking good money after bad all the time. It may be I have to move on from this old favourite as I cannot take the risk of becoming stranded.
I already keep the installed battery on daily charge with a Cetek MXS 7.0 to give me the best chance of a purposeful turn each start. I also carry a brand new Varta Silver 85ah backup in the boot with some jump leads for use in an emergency.
As you are probably aware if the straight 6 TD engine fails to start after 3 or 4 turns you are left without enough power to make any further attempts without a jump or recharge. Even begining with a 100% charged brand new battery!
I would really appreciate any ideas or contacts of people who might help me solve this. Apart from this problem the car is going great in every other respect.
Cheers!
Andy
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is this the kit you are asking about
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HOT-STARTING-FIX-RANGE-ROVER-BMW-DIESEL-P38-2-5DT-DSE-/370504759153?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item5643cdf771
:y
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Thanks! I think it is the one (albiet configured for an Omega not Range Rover).
I have emailed them to see if the Vauxhall version is available.
Not sure if this will solve the problem but for the money, it has to be worth a try I think.
Cheers!
Andy
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We can also supply this unit configured for BMW Diesel cars most bmw’s made between 1994-2001 uses this engine And the Vauxhall Omega using the BMW 6 cylinder engine please email if you need one of these.
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Hehe!
That is why I emailed them :-)
Have you had similar problems and did this gadget solve them?
Cheers!
Andy
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I've got one you can have for £15 delivered. I bought it for an Omega I had, fitted it but the gearbox went the day after ;)
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I have a 1998 Omega Elite Auto Estate with the BMW 2.5TD lump.
Driven the car from new, initially as company car (lucky me) which I became so attached to, I bought it for myself when it turned 4 years old.
I think there has always been a problem with warm starting on this model and I understand that some electronics have been produced at one time, to enable the glow plugs to be heated even when the engine is warm. I have lost track of where I read this (it might have been in this forum).
Having spent lots of money on replacing glow plugs, injector strip-downs and cleaning, leak-off pipe replacements I am loathe to continue chucking good money after bad all the time. It may be I have to move on from this old favourite as I cannot take the risk of becoming stranded.
I already keep the installed battery on daily charge with a Cetek MXS 7.0 to give me the best chance of a purposeful turn each start. I also carry a brand new Varta Silver 85ah backup in the boot with some jump leads for use in an emergency.
As you are probably aware if the straight 6 TD engine fails to start after 3 or 4 turns you are left without enough power to make any further attempts without a jump or recharge. Even begining with a 100% charged brand new battery!
I would really appreciate any ideas or contacts of people who might help me solve this. Apart from this problem the car is going great in every other respect.
Cheers!
Andy
sounds like a lead or lazy start issue as well?
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I've got one you can have for £15 delivered. I bought it for an Omega I had, fitted it but the gearbox went the day after ;)
Hi Pete,
if the original [poster doesent have this i will, post to oxfordshire ok?
must be within the next 10 days though! or it wont get here! lolol
:y
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I've got one you can have for £15 delivered. I bought it for an Omega I had, fitted it but the gearbox went the day after ;)
Aargh! Saw your post too late :'(
Already ordered and paid for one from Taw Park 4X4. It's not the one that looks like it is housed in a 35mm film case. I went for a rectangular version with the wires less exposed. Fingers-crossed I can fit it ok and it solves my hot starting issue.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hot-Start-Starting-Fix-BMW-Vauxhall-Opel-Omega-M51-Diesel-Engine-/390352398314?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item5ae2d0e7ea (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hot-Start-Starting-Fix-BMW-Vauxhall-Opel-Omega-M51-Diesel-Engine-/390352398314?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item5ae2d0e7ea)
Cheers to all who replied!
Andy
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I made one for my 2.5TD. It would just start with full batt & I also carried a spare. 2K2 resistor in series with pump temp sensor. But lazy starter was the problem , and sorting that fixed every thing.
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That's interesting!
Sorry for my thickness but what is a lazy starter and how is it cured? ???
My starter motor whizzes the engine around when the battery is 100% but then subsequent attempts drain the remaining power very quickly. Bear in mind I have a new 85ah heavy duty battery installed.
If that is symptom of the battery being lazy, what next please?
Cheers!
Andy
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That's interesting!
Sorry for my thickness but what is a lazy starter and how is it cured? ???
My starter motor whizzes the engine around when the battery is 100% but then subsequent attempts drain the remaining power very quickly. Bear in mind I have a new 85ah heavy duty battery installed.
If that is symptom of the battery being lazy, what next please?
Cheers!
Andy
Anybody please? :y
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always start with the battery test first. i know you say its relatively new, but some of the cheap rubbish out there is just a waste of time. go old fashion "drop test". a service available at most motor factors who sell batteries.
then test the cables between the battery and the starter motor, positive and negative under staring conditions. any more than .5 of a volt is considered resistance (ie corrosion or poor joint connection.
then consider a possible starter motor fault which can also be tested by those that rebuild them.
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Don't be too quick to dismiss the battery, especially if it's new. It may not be being adequately charged on the vehicle, for example.
Here's the proper diagnosis procedure to follow: http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90619.0 (http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90619.0)
A good check of the connections between battery, alternator and charger would be worthwhile in case something is making a poor connection.
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My previous TD suffered from this hot-starting problem, and that was after a new injection pump at over 1200 quid! >:(
Whilst the charge rate was perfect, and the (existing) battery was really very good, in sheer desperation, I lashed out and fitted a quality (Varta I think) model-specific battery.
Result: Problem solved immediately, and that car's still running beautifully over three years later. And I know of one other member who followed this procedure, who also effected an immediate and lasting cure.
If your alternator's in good health, I'd fit a top notch battery (of the correct spec), and see what happens! ;)
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Hi Seth
Don't think it can be that in my case.
I just forked-out £120 for a new Varta Silver 85ah and it makes no difference as far as I can tell :-(
Thanks for the reply though.
Andy
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May be worth a try... When the engine is warm sensors will disconnect the glowplug circuit quite quickly after switching on the ignition. Try switching the ignition to the "on" position several times before trying to start. If that's no help, connect one of your jump leads to the +ve battery terminal and press the other onto the exposed metal contact end of any of the glow plugs for 3 or 4 seconds. Whip the lead off, jump in and start immediately. If that works, I assume the electronics patch mentioned previously in the thread will resolve your issues.
Hope this helps
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Thanks for your reply.
I can't get access to the glow plugs as the damn plastic cover refuses to release. It's the bolt at the back which I cannot get undone.
Sounds a bit gymnastic for me to attempt but I appreciate the suggestion.
I have fitted the 'Hotfix' unit from Taw Park 4X4 connected and tested as far as possible. I have been trying to get in touch with David of Taw Park all day to find-out whether the red led inside the unit should be illuminated when the ignition is on. Unfortunately, I constantly get the message he is 'temporarily unavailable'. I did speak to him the other day before ordering so he may just be otherwise engaged as he seemed a straight enough chap then. Has anyone here had any experience with this particular 'Hotfix' version?
After taking the car on a long run and getting it plenty warm enough I tried a restart. Same old problem was evident I'm afraid so either I haven't fitted it correctly, the unit is broken or just not appropriate for the Vauxhall set-up ::)
Cheers!
Andy
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Lazy starter! will it turn over fast when hot?
Plastic cover! Just break it off, it's flimsy.
The hot start thing just puts a resistor in series with pump temp sensor, 2kohm thin grey wire on ecu poss with colour stripe.
My worst offender for bad hot start would flash eml on overrun and go to limp if throttle pressed while light on.
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Sounds like your problems was worse than mine as once started, my car behaves in all respects.
I have fitted the Taw Park hotfix but I must have screwed-up or the unit is faulty as it appears to do absolutely nothing for warm starting. I am thinking something is wrong as the glow plug light does not illuminate when the engine is restarted hot. If the unit was working, I understand this would happen regardless of the engine being hot or cold and then reflect the true temperature after 30 seconds to avoid over-fueling.
Not had much luck speaking to Taw Park since. I hope that isn't a bad sign! >:(
Andy