Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: richardirv on 01 December 2011, 12:34:50
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The Mig has always been spot on at speed regarding vibrations, the wheel has always be silky smooth but I have noticed after having 4 new tires recently I can feel a vibration at 80+. Its not bad at all but I notice it, others may not.
Do you think its a straight get the wheels balanced again or do you think if it was the balancing it would start at lower speeds?
I also had Discs & pads done recently, I admittedly drove on warped discs for longer than I should which used to vibrate badly when braking from motorway speeds & I am worried I may have done some damage somewhere!
Any thoughts ;)
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Balancing IMHO ;)
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Agree. Balancing seems to be a fine art. Most shops get it right some of the time. The very good tyreshops get it right all the time. I use Elite in Rainham and they are superb.
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Ok, cheers chaps!
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Place i used locally where crap, took it to WIM & they said one wheel was out by 35g :o
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You'd just think if they were out it would at least vibrate at 70 but its perfect at 70
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
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If you take it back they will probably tell you it's the new anti-speeding option :D.
Have them check that the tyres have seated properly :).
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If you take it back they will probably tell you it's the new anti-speeding option :D.
Have them check that the tyres have seated properly :).
Yeah I know I'm a naughty boy, I only went that fast once to test them honest!! :P
Will take it back at some point :y
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I would tell them that it happens at 70 if you want them to balance them again for free, what I got told once was there was nothing they could do because the machine was only calibrated to the legal limit. Check the mating surface between wheel and hub is clean and also dont rule out the new discs. I fitted new front discs to a jaguar I once owned and the same thing vibration starting at 80 got slightly better around 90 but by the time in was into three figures it was like hanging onto a hammer drill, had the brand new discs skimmed problem solved.
http://www.skimmydiscs.co.uk/find_a_lathe.html
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I would tell them that it happens at 70 if you want them to balance them again for free, what I got told once was there was nothing they could do because the machine was only calibrated to the legal limit.
PMSL
They do come up with some old cr@p! ;D It's either balanced or it's not.
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Place i used locally where crap, took it to WIM & they said one wheel was out by 35g :o
35g.. tire needs to be turned around the wheel..
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
...then i guess no balance issues on yours...? They are not commonly used as they take longer to set up. Wims work on an accentric system with 3 or 4 for 3,4,or5 stud patterns, where as my guys have similar but work on a peg and hole system with every denominator for each makers stud pattern. So that might explane why they are not the default equipment at most tyre bays. Where as wim use nothing else i believe.
I have yet to have an accepable balance using the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
...then i guess no balance issues on yours...? They are not commonly used as they take longer to set up. Wims work on an accentric system with 3 or 4 for 3,4,or5 stud patterns, where as my guys have similar but work on a peg and hole system with every denominator for each makers stud pattern. So that might explane why they are not the default equipment at most tyre bays. Where as wim use nothing else i believe.
I have yet to have an accepable balance using the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
WIM balanced mine, they didn't use (or suggest) the 5 stud system.
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Not convinced the 5 stud system is required on Vx rims to be honest as if you look at the fit onto the hub, its bloody tight so must be pretty central (hence why they can seize on the hub). That or the bolts wont seat fully because there is no way you will pull the centre hole to an offset.
The biggest issue i find is the balancing method used (e.g. single speed on balancing based on a centre line) and the speed and lack of attention to detail by the operators.
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Difficult for those who havent had balance issues to understand the need admitadly....
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....
the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
What Mark said ..... ??? ???
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Must admit, had no problems with mine, since WIM balanced them.
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Ok, once more for the hard of understanding ;D
If you've not had a balance issue where a normal cone balancer has not been accurate enough to eliminate vibration, then you wont have had need for, or have encountered, a 5 stud balancer.
If however repeated balances fail to solve the issue, the more accurate option is the 5 stud system. Hence the advice given.
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The biggest issue i find is the balancing method used (e.g. single speed on balancing based on a centre line) and the speed and lack of attention to detail by the operators.
I'd tend to agree with that. 9 times out of 10 in tyre shops I've been to they seem to spin the wheel up, add a weight where indicated and chuck it on the car. Don't even bother to spin it up again to check that it's worked.
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Ok, once more for the hard of understanding ;D
If you've not had a balance issue where a normal cone balancer has not been accurate enough to eliminate vibration, then you wont have had need for, or have encountered, a 5 stud balancer.
If however repeated balances fail to solve the issue, the more accurate option is the 5 stud system. Hence the advice given.
Sorry, don't understand, could you be more specific please ::)
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Difficult for those who havent had balance issues to understand the need admitadly....
To be honest I have had balancing issues a few times and it was always sorted by finding somebody with a reasonable machine who knew how to use it.
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Difficult for those who havent had balance issues to understand the need admitadly....
To be honest I have had balancing issues a few times and it was always sorted by finding somebody with a reasonable machine who knew how to use it.
...thats not a balance issue though. Thats a "technician" issue.
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
...then i guess no balance issues on yours...? They are not commonly used as they take longer to set up. Wims work on an accentric system with 3 or 4 for 3,4,or5 stud patterns, where as my guys have similar but work on a peg and hole system with every denominator for each makers stud pattern. So that might explane why they are not the default equipment at most tyre bays. Where as wim use nothing else i believe.
I have yet to have an accepable balance using the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
WIM balanced mine, they didn't use (or suggest) the 5 stud system.
Its all they use AA ;)
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
...then i guess no balance issues on yours...? They are not commonly used as they take longer to set up. Wims work on an accentric system with 3 or 4 for 3,4,or5 stud patterns, where as my guys have similar but work on a peg and hole system with every denominator for each makers stud pattern. So that might explane why they are not the default equipment at most tyre bays. Where as wim use nothing else i believe.
I have yet to have an accepable balance using the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
WIM balanced mine, they didn't use (or suggest) the 5 stud system.
Its all they use AA ;)
...snigger :-X
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Not convinced the 5 stud system is required on Vx rims to be honest as if you look at the fit onto the hub, its bloody tight so must be pretty central (hence why they can seize on the hub). That or the bolts wont seat fully because there is no way you will pull the centre hole to an offset.
The biggest issue i find is the balancing method used (e.g. single speed on balancing based on a centre line) and the speed and lack of attention to detail by the operators.
I reckon there is too much scope for it to be off centre, esp as every GM alloy I've seen corrodes like Omega bodywork ;D.
Only takes for a bit of corrosion to sit on the cone for it to then be off - never seen a tyre place clean the centre before balancing.
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
...then i guess no balance issues on yours...? They are not commonly used as they take longer to set up. Wims work on an accentric system with 3 or 4 for 3,4,or5 stud patterns, where as my guys have similar but work on a peg and hole system with every denominator for each makers stud pattern. So that might explane why they are not the default equipment at most tyre bays. Where as wim use nothing else i believe.
I have yet to have an accepable balance using the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
WIM balanced mine, they didn't use (or suggest) the 5 stud system.
Its all they use AA ;)
I thought I remembered H21 saying they'd now got a 5 studder, before you snigger too much :P
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Not convinced the 5 stud system is required on Vx rims to be honest as if you look at the fit onto the hub, its bloody tight so must be pretty central (hence why they can seize on the hub). That or the bolts wont seat fully because there is no way you will pull the centre hole to an offset.
The biggest issue i find is the balancing method used (e.g. single speed on balancing based on a centre line) and the speed and lack of attention to detail by the operators.
My first inclination was to agree absolutely, but...........
The centre bore of the Omega wheel is parallel sided but it is chamfered at the end where a cone balancer would sit. It is quite possible for the centre bore to be accurate but for the chamfer to be off centre. That might explain peoples varying experiences with cone balancers
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
...then i guess no balance issues on yours...? They are not commonly used as they take longer to set up. Wims work on an accentric system with 3 or 4 for 3,4,or5 stud patterns, where as my guys have similar but work on a peg and hole system with every denominator for each makers stud pattern. So that might explane why they are not the default equipment at most tyre bays. Where as wim use nothing else i believe.
I have yet to have an accepable balance using the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
WIM balanced mine, they didn't use (or suggest) the 5 stud system.
Its all they use AA ;)
I thought I remembered H21 saying they'd now got a 5 studder, before you snigger too much :P
;D they had them at the first Wim open day iirc. Certainly on the second, years ago. Although relatively speaking, age wise, not that long ago perhaps... ahemmovingonquicklycoughcough.... :-\ ::) :o
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Find a fitter that can use a 5 stud balancer.
In all the years I've had wheels balanced they've never used the stud/bolt holes to mount it in their machine, it always uses the centre of the rim. ???
Stud balancers are better as they match how it is on the car, not unknown for the centre hole to be marginally out, ot corrosion cause it not to sit centrally.
Never come across one
...then i guess no balance issues on yours...? They are not commonly used as they take longer to set up. Wims work on an accentric system with 3 or 4 for 3,4,or5 stud patterns, where as my guys have similar but work on a peg and hole system with every denominator for each makers stud pattern. So that might explane why they are not the default equipment at most tyre bays. Where as wim use nothing else i believe.
I have yet to have an accepable balance using the traditional cone balancer through the centre hole, which bares no relation to the centre of the wheel when fitted with the bolts! (relatively speaking of course)
...its the bolts that centre the wheel, so thats the referance to use for balancing. But usually only used if cone balance doesnt resolve the issue. Wim aside. :y
WIM balanced mine, they didn't use (or suggest) the 5 stud system.
Its all they use AA ;)
I thought I remembered H21 saying they'd now got a 5 studder, before you snigger too much :P
;D they had them at the first Wim open day iirc. Certainly on the second, years ago. Although relatively speaking, age wise, not that long ago perhaps... ahemmovingonquicklycoughcough.... :-\ ::) :o
Indeed, ever since opening their own centre they've had one. Never went to Kiplings, though think Watford didn't
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Also, from earlier as i was on a mobile...
A balance issue, imo, is several repeated failed attempts to balance out vibration with no inbalance showing on the machine. Moving wheels for and aft has an effect but doesnt cure the problem, wheels inspected for dings, tyres for damage, balance checked again no fault found after returning to tyre fitter 2 or 3 times with even the boss doing the job himself and driving the car to witness the problem. Hubs checked as flat, wheel seated correctly. All on a cone balancer...
...so where does one go from there? stud balancer system is where. Fits on the same machine, and instantly a discrepamcy is found. Wheels fitted, problem solved.
Thing is any fitter with said system will have found the limits of the standard equipment and recognise the need for something else. So by definition will know full well how to use thier machinary, and the limits of it. They may not have used the stud system, but will have it to fall back on should it be needed.