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[moggy]

Starter for ten...

http://www.tesco-careers.com/JobDetails/122188.aspx?utm_source=Indeed&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=Indeed

Thanks mate,but i need full time hours.We have to payout approximately £1200 per month for rent and bills.So unfortunately that wont cut it.  Regards Dean

Is moving an option?

https://www.ocsjobs.co.uk//templates/OCS_vetting/jobdetail/30013.aspx/Jobs/Mini-Bus-Driver-Passenger-Assistance

With both of you working, will clear £2,200 pm

Thanks mate,it looks like the kind of jobs for us.But we don't have the funds to move mate.If we did and could move back to Birmingham,there are lots jobs in electronics.Witch is our skill set but we are stuck in hartlepool.Regards Dean.

[05omegav6]

Not sure what else to suggest in that case

Good luck though.

[LC0112G]

Hi mate thanks for that,but we are not claiming benefits....

Huh? I hope to god you're claiming at least JSA/Dole or whatever it's now called? It is vital that you do.

The reason is that recent changes to the state pension mean that due to you being contracted out in the past that you will probably only get about £115 per week state pension when you reach state pension age (66?). You won't get the 'new' £155 per week unless you either find a job and pay more NI contributions, or get credited with them by virtue of claiming JSA. Each extra year of NI paid/credited will add around £4.45 to your eventual state pension, so it may take 8 years to increase your entitlement from £115 to the new maximum of £155.

Also, your wife - how many years NI contributions does she have? She won't get ANY state pension unless she has at least 10 years NI credits. She can't claim a state pension based on your NI record any more.

If you fluff this up, your household state pension might be as low as £115/pw (£500 per month). If you get it right, then you could both get £155 p/w (total £1340 per month)

[tigers_gonads]

Hi mate thanks for that,but we are not claiming benefits....

Huh? I hope to god you're claiming at least JSA/Dole or whatever it's now called? It is vital that you do.

The reason is that recent changes to the state pension mean that due to you being contracted out in the past that you will probably only get about £115 per week state pension when you reach state pension age (66?). You won't get the 'new' £155 per week unless you either find a job and pay more NI contributions, or get credited with them by virtue of claiming JSA. Each extra year of NI paid/credited will add around £4.45 to your eventual state pension, so it may take 8 years to increase your entitlement from £115 to the new maximum of £155.

Also, your wife - how many years NI contributions does she have? She won't get ANY state pension unless she has at least 10 years NI credits. She can't claim a state pension based on your NI record any more.

If you fluff this up, your household state pension might be as low as £115/pw (£500 per month). If you get it right, then you could both get £155 p/w (total £1340 per month)

Very good advice that 

Due to me being well behind with my stamp when the business went tits up, I have to sign on every week when i'm not working even though I don't get a penny in my hand. Only get class 1 NI paid but still have to go through the shite every 2 weeks 

Moggy if your internets working, go onto the HMRC website and sign up for a on line tax account.
It will take you about 20 minutes and there is a bit of oppsing about with codes texts to your mobile ect to verify who you are. Once done, you can see exactly what you have paid in stamp and which years you are behind 
It will also tell you how much you (and your lass if she registers too) will get on retirement.
It will also show if you can top up those years that you are short if / when you sort out your finances 

Just for the nosey gits on OOF 
I'm due to get a grand total of 130 quid when I retire unless I can find a way to top up some of the years i'm down 

It may be a case that you have paid enough stamp to gain a full pension 
I know my dad stopped paying full NI well before he retired due to the amount he had paid in 

[LC0112G]

Tiger, I agree with all you post, except...

It may be a case that you have paid enough stamp to gain a full pension 

Highly unlikely. To get the full new state pension (of £155 ish) you need 35 years of NI contributions, AND to have not been contracted out of SERPS/S2P. Moggy has £26K in his pension pot from being opted out. The govt therefore make a deduction (called the COD - Contracted Out Deduction) from the £155 to account for the fact that his SERPS NI money was paid into a different (private) plan. This dramatically reduces the amount of the new state pension - often down to only £50-£60 per week.

There is a safety net - As at 6-April-2016 the govt calculated how much you would have got under the old state pension scheme. This was made up of £115 basic (if you had 30 years NI), plus  any SERPS/S2P. Assuming Moggy has 30 years NI, but little or no SERPS/S2P (due to being opted out) then the old figure will almost always be higher than the new figure. It's highly unlikely that anyone with significant opted out years will be entitled to more than £115 + a bit of SERPS.

The starting amount is the higher of the old rules and new rules as at 5/6/2016. Going forward, you get £4.45 ish added to the starting amount for every post 2016 years NI you are credited with, up to the £155 maximum.  So if you start at £115, and work/are credited with 8 years @ £4.45 you'll make the £155 maximum, AND get to keep the money/income in/from your private pension plan.

I know my dad stopped paying full NI well before he retired due to the amount he had paid in 

You can't stop paying NI on earnings unless/until you reach state pension age. It doesn't only pay for pensions - it helps pay for the NHS amongst other things. If you continue to work past state pension age, then its true that you don't pay NI.

[omega2018]

To get the full new state pension (of £155 ish) you need 35 years of NI contributions, AND to have not been contracted out of SERPS/S2P. Moggy has £26K in his pension pot from being opted out. The govt therefore make a deduction (called the COD - Contracted Out Deduction) from the £155 to account for the fact that his SERPS NI money was paid into a different (private) plan. This dramatically reduces the amount of the new state pension - often down to only £50-£60 per week.

i'm pretty sure this bit isn't right.  least i hope it isn't.    SERPS was earnings related extra pension, on top of the £155 you can get if you have paid enough years ni.  i was contracted out and my state forecast is still £155 a week. as i mentioned you can get a forecast at https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/checkmystatepension this is what they tell me at present:

 "You were contracted out

In the past you've been part of one or more contracted out pension schemes, such as workplace or personal pension schemes.

When you were contracted out:

    you and your employers paid lower rate National Insurance contributions; or
    some of your National Insurance contributions were paid into your private pension schemes instead

Contracted Out Pension Equivalent (COPE)

Your workplace or personal pension scheme should include an amount of pension which will, in most cases, be equal to the additional State Pension you would have been paid. We call this amount your Contracted Out Pension Equivalent (COPE). Your COPE estimate is shown below.

The COPE amount is paid as part of your other pension schemes, not by the government. The total amount of pension paid by your workplace or personal pension scheme will depend on the scheme and on any investment choices.
     a week
Your State Pension forecast    £155.65
Your COPE estimate    £43.55
COPE added to your State Pension forecast    £199.20"

[omega2018]

this page explains the SERPS bit if you have a spare 1/2 hour https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/state-pension-fact-sheets/contracting-out-and-why-we-may-have-included-a-contracted-out-pension-equivalent-cope-amount-when-you-used-the-online-service

[LC0112G]

To get the full new state pension (of £155 ish) you need 35 years of NI contributions, AND to have not been contracted out of SERPS/S2P. Moggy has £26K in his pension pot from being opted out. The govt therefore make a deduction (called the COD - Contracted Out Deduction) from the £155 to account for the fact that his SERPS NI money was paid into a different (private) plan. This dramatically reduces the amount of the new state pension - often down to only £50-£60 per week.

i'm pretty sure this bit isn't right.  least i hope it isn't.    SERPS was earnings related extra pension, on top of the £155 you can get if you have paid enough years ni.  i was contracted out and my state forecast is still £155 a week. as i mentioned you can get a forecast at https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/checkmystatepension this is what they tell me at present:

 "You were contracted out

In the past you've been part of one or more contracted out pension schemes, such as workplace or personal pension schemes.

When you were contracted out:

    you and your employers paid lower rate National Insurance contributions; or
    some of your National Insurance contributions were paid into your private pension schemes instead

Contracted Out Pension Equivalent (COPE)

Your workplace or personal pension scheme should include an amount of pension which will, in most cases, be equal to the additional State Pension you would have been paid. We call this amount your Contracted Out Pension Equivalent (COPE). Your COPE estimate is shown below.

The COPE amount is paid as part of your other pension schemes, not by the government. The total amount of pension paid by your workplace or personal pension scheme will depend on the scheme and on any investment choices.
     a week
Your State Pension forecast    £155.65
Your COPE estimate    £43.55
COPE added to your State Pension forecast    £199.20"

No - SERPS was earnings related extra pension, on top of the £115 basic state pension you can get if you have paid enough (30) years ni.

The COPE is an estimate of what your private pension will pay you in addition to whatever new state pension you get. The state is not going to pay you £199.20.

In effect they are saying that if you had not contracted out, then your basic+serps amount would/might/could/may have been £199.20. However, since you did contract out, your state pension will be £155, and your private contracted out scheme should pay you £43 instead. What your private pension actually does pay you depends upon what it's been invested in - it might be £43, or any amount from £0 to £squillions.

They are forecasting you will get £155 state pension when you retire - they aren't saying that you already have £155 'banked'. How old are you? Providing you have more than 8 years to go till your state pension age, AND by the time you retire you will have at least 35 years NI credits then you'll get the £155, because from now on the basic £115 will increase by £4.45 a year till you reach the new maximum of £155.

Anyone who was contracted out for long periods is very unlikely to have much more than £115 already 'banked'. I was contracted out for 20+ years, and I've currently got 31 years NI credits. My state pension estimate as of today is £120 ish. But since I've got more than 8 years till I reach state pension age, I should reach the 35years/£155 maximum. The only people that won't get £155 are those that were contracted out for a long time and reach retirement age within the next 8 years, and/or those who don't have 35 years NI credits.

[STEMO]

Ah.......pensions. My wife started work as a teacher in 1993. She paid 6% of her pay into the teachers pension fund, with the promise of a good pension when she retired at 60. Many years later Gordon Brown decided that 6% wasn't really enough to keep the fund in credit so, after much negotiation with the unions, it was raised to 6.25% and Gordy said that would keep it in surplus for the foreseeable future.
Then Dave and George got into power and decided that it wasn't fair at all for public sector workers to have such a good pension. Why, they didn't even vote for the tories in the main. No sir, not fair at all.
So.....she now pays 12.5% of her wages into her pension, retires at 67 and gets less from her teachers pension. She also had to start paying an extra 1.4% NI last April because she's not contracted out any more, and probably won't get a full state pension.

Now that's more like it...much fairer.

[LC0112G]

Ah.......pensions. My wife started work as a teacher in 1993. She paid 6% of her pay into the teachers pension fund, with the promise of a good pension when she retired at 60. Many years later Gordon Brown decided that 6% wasn't really enough to keep the fund in credit so, after much negotiation with the unions, it was raised to 6.25% and Gordy said that would keep it in surplus for the foreseeable future.
Then Dave and George got into power and decided that it wasn't fair at all for public sector workers to have such a good pension. Why, they didn't even vote for the tories in the main. No sir, not fair at all.
So.....she now pays 12.5% of her wages into her pension, retires at 67 and gets less from her teachers pension. She also had to start paying an extra 1.4% NI last April because she's not contracted out any more, and probably won't get a full state pension.

Now that's more like it...much fairer.

You misunderstand. There is no fund. Your wife hasn't been paying into any 'fund'. There is no pot of money. The teachers pension, and most public sector schemes is unfunded. What your wife has is a promise from a long gone (communist!) government that future taxpayers will pay your wife a pension. That communist govt and others since have long since spent all the 6%/6.25%/12.5% contributions that your wife made. Now the chickens are coming home to roost, the future has arrived, and someone has to pay for these unfunded reckless promises.

The fact is that for a private sector person to accrue the benefits of most public sector schemes they would have to contribute between 20% and 30% of gross earnings to their pension plan for their entire working life. That's why the taxation on teachers/firemen/police etc pension schemes had to increase. Just be thankful that your wife had the free (well 6%) ride for so long.

Your wife is free to opt-out of the pension scheme if she wishes, and then she won't have to pay the 12.5%. It would be much better for future taxpayers and the country as a whole if she did so. However, she would be giving up a 20%-30% benefit in order to save 12.5%, so probably not in her/your interest.

Oh - and she WILL get a full/maximum state pension, providing she works for at least 8 years post 2016.

[Entwood]

LC0112G is absolutely correct, and I'll quote my own figures to prove it .... I spent 38 years "contracted out" of serps whilst in the RAF and just under 4 years contracted "in" whilst working for the Courts.

I am due to start getting the State pension in September and the breakdown is as follows

Basic "contracted out" Pension "  £115.00
Additional "SERPS" element        £  14.64

State Pension payable                £129.64
COPE Estimate                          £136.60

Total Pension + COPE                 £266.24

As I have a "full" record of NI contributions I cannot do anything to increase either of these amounts, the good news however is that my Military Pension is actually a good deal higher than the COPE estimate.

[tigers_gonads]

Tiger, I agree with all you post, except...

It may be a case that you have paid enough stamp to gain a full pension 

Highly unlikely. To get the full new state pension (of £155 ish) you need 35 years of NI contributions, AND to have not been contracted out of SERPS/S2P. Moggy has £26K in his pension pot from being opted out. The govt therefore make a deduction (called the COD - Contracted Out Deduction) from the £155 to account for the fact that his SERPS NI money was paid into a different (private) plan. This dramatically reduces the amount of the new state pension - often down to only £50-£60 per week.

There is a safety net - As at 6-April-2016 the govt calculated how much you would have got under the old state pension scheme. This was made up of £115 basic (if you had 30 years NI), plus  any SERPS/S2P. Assuming Moggy has 30 years NI, but little or no SERPS/S2P (due to being opted out) then the old figure will almost always be higher than the new figure. It's highly unlikely that anyone with significant opted out years will be entitled to more than £115 + a bit of SERPS.

The starting amount is the higher of the old rules and new rules as at 5/6/2016. Going forward, you get £4.45 ish added to the starting amount for every post 2016 years NI you are credited with, up to the £155 maximum.  So if you start at £115, and work/are credited with 8 years @ £4.45 you'll make the £155 maximum, AND get to keep the money/income in/from your private pension plan.

I know my dad stopped paying full NI well before he retired due to the amount he had paid in 

You can't stop paying NI on earnings unless/until you reach state pension age. It doesn't only pay for pensions - it helps pay for the NHS amongst other things. If you continue to work past state pension age, then its true that you don't pay NI.

Not sure how the old mans pension worked 
I know he had a works pension which he was forced to claim on when he was only 56 due to medical problems which stopped him doing his job.
I also remember him saying something about he wasn't paying stamp or maybe full stamp due to having 35 years under his belt 
Well you know parents 
They never tell there kids the full story 

[LC0112G]

Not sure how the old mans pension worked 
I know he had a works pension which he was forced to claim on when he was only 56 due to medical problems which stopped him doing his job.
I also remember him saying something about he wasn't paying stamp or maybe full stamp due to having 35 years under his belt 
Well you know parents 
They never tell there kids the full story 

Many pension schemes have/had an insurance element. If you become unable to work for medical reasons then you can claim the pension early - early retirement on medical grounds. Rules vary, but some schemes top up your works pension to the full amount that you would have got if you had continued working till normal (60/65) retirement age, so it's often a good deal. Some schemes even pay you extra between when you retire, and when you reach state pension age to make up for the state pension that you aren't getting yet because you retired early. This extra stops once you do reach SP age.

You only pay NI on 'earned income'. Income from pensions isn't counted as 'earned income', so you don't pay NI on it (although you do pay income tax). However, the upshot is that if you live on only pension income you don't accrue any additional NI 'stamps' so your state pension entitlement doesn't increase. This means that if you retire early (with less than 30/35 years stamps), then you won't have enough to get a full state pension. You can pay volountary stamps in these cases to make up your 30/35 years, but if you've already got 30/35 years there is no point.

[STEMO]

Ah.......pensions. My wife started work as a teacher in 1993. She paid 6% of her pay into the teachers pension fund, with the promise of a good pension when she retired at 60. Many years later Gordon Brown decided that 6% wasn't really enough to keep the fund in credit so, after much negotiation with the unions, it was raised to 6.25% and Gordy said that would keep it in surplus for the foreseeable future.
Then Dave and George got into power and decided that it wasn't fair at all for public sector workers to have such a good pension. Why, they didn't even vote for the tories in the main. No sir, not fair at all.
So.....she now pays 12.5% of her wages into her pension, retires at 67 and gets less from her teachers pension. She also had to start paying an extra 1.4% NI last April because she's not contracted out any more, and probably won't get a full state pension.

Now that's more like it...much fairer.

You misunderstand. There is no fund. Your wife hasn't been paying into any 'fund'. There is no pot of money. The teachers pension, and most public sector schemes is unfunded. What your wife has is a promise from a long gone (communist!) government that future taxpayers will pay your wife a pension. That communist govt and others since have long since spent all the 6%/6.25%/12.5% contributions that your wife made. Now the chickens are coming home to roost, the future has arrived, and someone has to pay for these unfunded reckless promises.

The fact is that for a private sector person to accrue the benefits of most public sector schemes they would have to contribute between 20% and 30% of gross earnings to their pension plan for their entire working life. That's why the taxation on teachers/firemen/police etc pension schemes had to increase. Just be thankful that your wife had the free (well 6%) ride for so long.

Your wife is free to opt-out of the pension scheme if she wishes, and then she won't have to pay the 12.5%. It would be much better for future taxpayers and the country as a whole if she did so. However, she would be giving up a 20%-30% benefit in order to save 12.5%, so probably not in her/your interest.

Oh - and she WILL get a full/maximum state pension, providing she works for at least 8 years post 2016.

I would have advised her to move as soon as the new 'career average' pension kicked in but........she gets tax relief at 40% on her contributions and her employer puts in a further 13%.

I also feel quite smug about my state pension. I will get the full whack in two years when I reach 65, and the last 12 years of my NI contributions were paid for me because I was named on the child benefit. (Something else that Dave and George took away). So at least I got something from them.

[LC0112G]

I would have advised her to move as soon as the new 'career average' pension kicked in but........she gets tax relief at 40% on her contributions and her employer puts in a further 13%.

It's true the new career average scheme isn't as generous as the old final salary one, but its still a cracking deal and much better than she would find outside of the public sector. And the employer 13% is smoke and mirrors - one part of govt paying another. They aren't putting anything 'in' since there isn't anything to put it 'in' to. There is no pot.

I also feel quite smug about my state pension. I will get the full whack in two years when I reach 65,

The full whack under the old (pre 2016) scheme was up to £276 p/w (£115 basic and £160 SERPS/S2P)
http://www.which.co.uk/money/retirement/guides/state-pension-explained/state-second-pension-and-serps/

and the last 12 years of my NI contributions were paid for me because I was named on the child benefit. (Something else that Dave and George took away). So at least I got something from them.

The govt hasn't stopped NI credits for those who qualify for Child Benefit, so you can/would still get NI years added if/while the kids are/were young enough. What the govt have stopped is the monetary payments for those where one partner is earning >£50K.

Someone earning almost £1K a week complaining about losing £20.70pw (plus £13.70 for additional sprogs)? I think STEMO doeth protest too much.