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[Marks DTM Calib]

Having recently been retrained on this topic, it was made clear that speed was a contributing factor but generally never considered the route cause.

Clearly it results in greater energy in an impact and needs control.

What gets me is that mobile phone use, drugs/alcohol and, it would appear sadly. not wearing seat belts (this is increasing!) are massive problems and can be considered a route cause of death yet, the fines associated with these are still fixed penalties and not income related......go figure?

[Varche]

I have the following observations on Spanish habits.

I often watch and sometimes count the number of folk driving by breaking the law when I am having a roadside coffee. No seat belts is routine in small towns. Crash helmets on Motorbikes are still viewed as optional in towns. When worn they often do not have the strap fastened. I regularly see folk on mobile phones and some are texting or other labour intensive distracting tasks. On motorways the main problem is lane discipline especially for big lorries. I have seen these drivers operating devices but i suspect the main problem is nodding off. I ask Spanish friends about the seat belts and they openly admit they "don't bother " around town. Funny thing is I haven't come across or seen an accident for a couple of years now.

Oh and a reminder if you are going to Costa del Sol on holiday. They have loads of money generating speed cameras in and around Malaga. The A45 dual carriageway out of Malaga to inland was generating 600 plus a day each way last time I looked.50 mph down and 62 up.   

[Bigron]

Is there ANYONE outside an institute for the criminally insane who actually believes that any of these draconian speed regulations are for safety reasons - apart from those aforementioned Labour MPs?

Ron.

[Sir Tigger KC]

Anyone who describes themselves or their thoughts as progressive should be added to TB,s cull list. I hate that word. 

TB probably thinks his cull list is progressive! 

So......   

Mmm, I doubt it. Probably common sense rather than progressive. I find it increasingly difficult to disagree with the idea tbh, but I (as a Brexiteer) am probably on it. 

I think he'd probably progressively cull us all!   

[Mr Gav]

Is there ANYONE outside an institute for the criminally insane who actually believes that any of these draconian speed regulations are for safety reasons - apart from those aforementioned Labour MPs?

Ron.

Nope, and it was strange seeing three lots of coppers on the A64 coming home tonight, only usually one 

[Rods2]

Ron, speed limits and their enforcement are primarily aimed at the 10% of irresponsible citizens who are on TB's 'list'.

Things will start to change from 2019 onwards with mass trials of self driving cars, with their massed produced introduction from 2020 onwards, with Ford currently in the lead on this. Once fully integrated, by about 2030, non-self driving cars will be banned and with the 'right political will' speeds can start increasing due to the massive reduction in accidents.

[JamesV6CDX]

but if policing were more about safety () and not revenue collection

Ron. With the greatest of respect, I don't think you have much of an idea as to how a Roads Policing department functions and the processes involved.

If policing were mainly about revenue collection, why, for first time offenders involved in road traffic matters such as speeding, seat belts, mobile phone use, do the forces offer educational programmes to these people as an alternative to being prosecuted? Whilst an administration fee would still apply to join the course, no "profit" is made by running these courses.

Are you aware that when police attend an RTC where there is an injury, and the motorist who caused it is dealt with for careless driving - it is commonplace for this person to be given a course, rather than points/fine and court appearances?
If it were just about money, would they not just be given a £100 fixed penalty?

[JamesV6CDX]

Whilst updating our Farcebook profiles, having a fag, etc., as those don't seem to be enforced al all.

This sort of thing, in addition to targeting drink drivers, uninsured motorists etc, is my bread and butter, and is actively targeted and dealt with.

The reason the public have a perception that these things don't seem to be enforced, is because the government have been constantly crippling police forces with cuts to funding, and as a result, traffic officers are becoming quite few and far between, in comparison to the amount of cars on the roads. Statistically, in probably all force areas, there are just nowhere near enough roads policing officers to deal with the true scale of the problem, and as such, only manage to scratch the surface.

[ronnyd]

Once again the police get the stick for Government funding cuts.

[Marks DTM Calib]

but if policing were more about safety () and not revenue collection

Ron. With the greatest of respect, I don't think you have much of an idea as to how a Roads Policing department functions and the processes involved.

If policing were mainly about revenue collection, why, for first time offenders involved in road traffic matters such as speeding, seat belts, mobile phone use, do the forces offer educational programmes to these people as an alternative to being prosecuted? Whilst an administration fee would still apply to join the course, no "profit" is made by running these courses.

Are you aware that when police attend an RTC where there is an injury, and the motorist who caused it is dealt with for careless driving - it is commonplace for this person to be given a course, rather than points/fine and court appearances?
If it were just about money, would they not just be given a £100 fixed penalty?

Given the cost of running the course compared to that of processing the penalty points, I suspect that there is more to be gained financially from the course.....

[Andy B]

But James ......
If the powers that be were interested in prevention, there'd be more coppers on the road stopping you from speeding in the first place  rather than catching speeders after the event with Gatsos/etc. Coppers would be sat before the bend in full view instead of hiding after the bend peeping out of the back of a plain van.

[Kevin Wood]

Whilst updating our Farcebook profiles, having a fag, etc., as those don't seem to be enforced al all.

This sort of thing, in addition to targeting drink drivers, uninsured motorists etc, is my bread and butter, and is actively targeted and dealt with.

The reason the public have a perception that these things don't seem to be enforced, is because the government have been constantly crippling police forces with cuts to funding, and as a result, traffic officers are becoming quite few and far between, in comparison to the amount of cars on the roads. Statistically, in probably all force areas, there are just nowhere near enough roads policing officers to deal with the true scale of the problem, and as such, only manage to scratch the surface.

I don't doubt that it's due to lack of resources as opposed to a policy actively pursued by the Police, but disregard for the mobile phone law is so blatant now, that it would embarrass me if I were in uniform. Just on my commute this morning, a large Mercedes panel van started straying towards me from the opposite side of the carriageway. Driver had his head down staring into a phone. This was in a small village, kids playing on the pavements, cyclists passing, etc. Fortunately, he looked up before he hit anything or anybody.

I appreciate that this is resource intensive to Police, since you can't just park at the roadside and watch the fines come in, but I think the aggressive policing of speeding while other more important issues of driving standards perceived to be allowed to slip is not doing anybody any favours.

[Bigron]

Sorry james, my anger wasn't directed at you; I know that you are a fine fellow , a man of integrity. I am in accord with Kevin and Andy, though, regarding the stealth tactics employed by some police: surely such tactics fly in  the face of the "prevention rather than prosecution" ethos? If they maintained a highly visible presence, the declared objective of lowering speeds at danger spots would be more readily accomplished - BEFORE the event rather than after it, as Andy said.
What can be gained by such draconian measures as penalising drivers for straying 1mph over the posted limit? That is SO blatantly a revenue-raising tactic as to leave no doubt as to its purpose.
I do appreciate that for the most part police are carrying out government policy, but please do it openly and not sneakily.

Ron.

[Entwood]

Sorry james, my anger wasn't directed at you; I know that you are a fine fellow , a man of integrity. I am in accord with Kevin and Andy, though, regarding the stealth tactics employed by some police: surely such tactics fly in  the face of the "prevention rather than prosecution" ethos? If they maintained a highly visible presence, the declared objective of lowering speeds at danger spots would be more readily accomplished - BEFORE the event rather than after it, as Andy said.
What can be gained by such draconian measures as penalising drivers for straying 1mph over the posted limit? That is SO blatantly a revenue-raising tactic as to leave no doubt as to its purpose.
I do appreciate that for the most part police are carrying out government policy, but please do it openly and not sneakily.

Ron.

Far too simplistic and totally ignores "human nature" .. if they did what you suggest the speeding motorist would slow down when the camera/object is noticed, then immediately speed up again once past .. just like the idiots with fixed speed cameras... result .. nothing achieved ... if the camera/object is of an unknown position and "may" catch you unawares then the idea is , as you don't know where it is or when it is operational, you should obey the limits at all times.

There is no excuse for speeding, yes we all do it, but it is NOT "accidental" .. it is a deliberate action taken in defiance of the law, do it and accept the consequences, don't then whinge. You are an adult who makes conscious decisions, accept the responsibility for those decisions.

[Marks DTM Calib]

I for one would happily swap the Road Wombles for Police in cars