Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Rods2 on 24 June 2012, 15:52:45
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As it was a reconnaissance aircraft, was it on a test flight, as claimed, or probing Syrian defenses?
Did it enter Syrian airspace?
Was this a deliberate response by Syria as a warning to the West?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/9352113/Syria-shot-down-Turkish-jet-in-international-airspace-claims-foreign-minister.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/9352113/Syria-shot-down-Turkish-jet-in-international-airspace-claims-foreign-minister.html)
Finally, deepest sympathies to the pilot's families and friends, where they are both missing.
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it was 5 miles in internatiol waters syria are trying to provoke turkey in to action to take the heat of but turkey went the right way and gone to un for suport then they will kick assads arse
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As it was a reconnaissance aircraft, was it on a test flight, as claimed, or probing Syrian defenses?
Did it enter Syrian airspace?
Was this a deliberate response by Syria as a warning to the West?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/9352113/Syria-shot-down-Turkish-jet-in-international-airspace-claims-foreign-minister.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/9352113/Syria-shot-down-Turkish-jet-in-international-airspace-claims-foreign-minister.html)
Finally, deepest sympathies to the pilot's families and friends, where they are both missing.
there are many questions that needs to be answered like yours Rods.. but the govt kept silence for some 8 hours after the incident.. ???
first of all what was the reason that the plane entered Syria zone.. and who gave the order for what reason :(
Syria shot the plane ( and if they really shot as we are still not sure , the remains of the plane must be examined to be sure) without warning (as its claimed) .. and I'm sure even they can shoot it, they cant determine the aircrafts origin..
if the timing of event and the dangerous game played by intelligency services of mutiple countries in that zone taken into account bad smells come into my nose..
one thing is definitely sure, thats not a reason for war.. and I think my country have this level of logic and experience from its long history despite the wrong efforts of some politicians >:(
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2 days ago, a syrian mig 21 defected with the upto date iff codes in his aircraft.
My guess is that the turks deceided to take a little flight to test the syrian air defences by popping across the border for a few seconds then heading back out to sea sharpish ;)
Sadly for them, they came up against the Sa22 point defence system which is about as good as you can get.
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2 days ago, a syrian mig 21 defected with the upto date iff codes in his aircraft.
My guess is that the turks deceided to take a little flight to test the syrian air defences by popping across the border for a few seconds then heading back out to sea sharpish ;)
Sadly for them, they came up against the Sa22 point defence system which is about as good as you can get.
sorry for my ignorance but whats an iff code ? :-\
testing the syrian air defence.. ??? really bad move.. russians are backing syria.. no doubt they will have latest defence systems.. :-\
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2 days ago, a syrian mig 21 defected with the upto date iff codes in his aircraft.
My guess is that the turks deceided to take a little flight to test the syrian air defences by popping across the border for a few seconds then heading back out to sea sharpish ;)
Sadly for them, they came up against the Sa22 point defence system which is about as good as you can get.
sorry for my ignorance but whats an iff code ? :-\
testing the syrian air defence.. ??? really bad move.. russians are backing syria.. no doubt they will have latest defence systems.. :-\
Iff code is "Identification friend or foe" :y
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identification_friend_or_foe
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2 days ago, a syrian mig 21 defected with the upto date iff codes in his aircraft.
My guess is that the turks deceided to take a little flight to test the syrian air defences by popping across the border for a few seconds then heading back out to sea sharpish ;)
Sadly for them, they came up against the Sa22 point defence system which is about as good as you can get.
I smell the same rat. :y Hit about 13 miles outside Syrian airspace after infringing it. Doesn't take long for a F4 Phantom to cover 13 miles when it's running for cover. :-\
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2 days ago, a syrian mig 21 defected with the upto date iff codes in his aircraft.
My guess is that the turks deceided to take a little flight to test the syrian air defences by popping across the border for a few seconds then heading back out to sea sharpish ;)
Sadly for them, they came up against the Sa22 point defence system which is about as good as you can get.
Looks like you are right as this has been added to the Wikipedia page of the SA-22.
"A Pantsir-S1 unit of the Syrian Armed Forces reportedly scored the first combat kill of the type by downing a Turkish Air Force RF-4E carrying out a reconnaissance flight over the Syrian coast near Latakia on 22 June 2012".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantsir-S1 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantsir-S1)
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There is something fishy about it that is for certain.
I put it down to war games. Russia, Nato, Syria - who knows. The rocket that downed the plane was no doubt fired by a third party..........
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2 days ago, a syrian mig 21 defected with the upto date iff codes in his aircraft.
My guess is that the turks deceided to take a little flight to test the syrian air defences by popping across the border for a few seconds then heading back out to sea sharpish ;)
Sadly for them, they came up against the Sa22 point defence system which is about as good as you can get.
sorry for my ignorance but whats an iff code ? :-\
testing the syrian air defence.. ??? really bad move.. russians are backing syria.. no doubt they will have latest defence systems.. :-\
Iff code is "Identification friend or foe" :y
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identification_friend_or_foe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identification_friend_or_foe)
thanks for that :y
seems my knowledge about military communication is "miserable" ;D :-\
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I wasn't sure exactly what had happened. It's good to know I can get the full picture on here ::)
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I wasn't sure exactly what had happened. It's good to know I can get the full picture on here ::)
Yep, we are all applying to work for MI5. :-X ;D
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upto now, for all those years I have watched a bunch of incompetent , ignorant politicians which brought the country on its kness.. >:( >:( >:(
I wish all the sins and fires of hell rain on those who vote them >:( >:( >:(
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ok.. after some series of events and the evidences on pilots bodies and jets parts I have concluded that the jet was shot down by an electromagnetic weapon .. which is definitly not the syrians job.. :-\
there were no rocket or shell traces on the jet parts and the bodies!
and it was a warning by the russians that the west cannot play alone :-\
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Em weapons do excist.
The yank F22 and the new F35 and potentally any aircraft or ground unit with a aesa system is capable of offensive electronic warfare but tbh, these toys are kept locked away for a rainy day when the big boys kick off ;)
With respect to the lads who fly even that modified version of the F4, I don't think the aircraft has any critical systems onboard which could cause it to go bang in mid flight.
Sadly, imho the Turkish goverment, just like all goverments have made total cocks out of themselfs in this instant ;)
Imo, they saw a chance to gain some infomation and it blew up in there faces and 2 crew members lost there lifes because of it :(
Sadly, in cases like this goverments never tell the truth and always try to cover it up or drag somebody else / blame somebody else for there f*ckups :(
Your goverment have maybe being taking leasons from the UK goverment on that score ;) >:(
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Yep, doesn't add up to me. :-\
You get your avionics disabled - worst case your engine too. Wouldn't you just drop down to a safe altitude and pull the Martin Baker?
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Yep, doesn't add up to me. :-\
You get your avionics disabled - worst case your engine too. Wouldn't you just drop down to a safe altitude and pull the Martin Baker?
The J79's on the phantom have old school analog control units so EW would have no affect on them.
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Em weapons do excist.
The yank F22 and the new F35 and potentally any aircraft or ground unit with a aesa system is capable of offensive electronic warfare but tbh, these toys are kept locked away for a rainy day when the big boys kick off ;)
1.With respect to the lads who fly even that modified version of the F4, I don't think the aircraft has any critical systems onboard which could cause it to go bang in mid flight.
Sadly, imho the 2.Turkish goverment, just like all goverments have made total cocks out of themselfs in this instant ;)
Imo, they saw a chance to gain some infomation and it blew up in there faces and 2 crew members lost there lifes because of it :(
Sadly, 3.in cases like this goverments never tell the truth and always try to cover it up or drag somebody else / blame somebody else for there f*ckups :(
Your goverment have maybe being taking leasons from the UK goverment on that score ;) >:(
1.there were no reason to go bang.. and besides they even dont have time to say mayday.. :(
2.definitely.. and there were some talks/chats behind scene.. and no official announcement..
3. Cant agree more.. :y
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Yep, doesn't add up to me. :-\
You get your avionics disabled - worst case your engine too. Wouldn't you just drop down to a safe altitude and pull the Martin Baker?
there were many questions unanswered .. autopsy show that the pilots died when they crashed the sea..
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Yep, doesn't add up to me. :-\
You get your avionics disabled - worst case your engine too. Wouldn't you just drop down to a safe altitude and pull the Martin Baker?
The J79's on the phantom have old school analog control units so EW would have no affect on them.
I think the type/strength of EW is important.. I'm sure engine was effected.. besides they were modernised some time ago..
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Yep, doesn't add up to me. :-\
You get your avionics disabled - worst case your engine too. Wouldn't you just drop down to a safe altitude and pull the Martin Baker?
there were many questions unanswered .. autopsy show that the pilots died when they crashed the sea..
Coupled with no sign of aggression on aircraft or pilots.
Sounds more like they were overcome during flight, then. Maybe it was a simple accident such as hypoxia or a sudden structural failure and the powers that be don't want to climb down from their claim that it was aggression?
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Yep, doesn't add up to me. :-\
You get your avionics disabled - worst case your engine too. Wouldn't you just drop down to a safe altitude and pull the Martin Baker?
there were many questions unanswered .. autopsy show that the pilots died when they crashed the sea..
Coupled with no sign of aggression on aircraft or pilots.
Sounds more like they were overcome during flight, then. Maybe it was a simple accident such as hypoxia or a sudden structural failure and the powers that be don't want to climb down from their claim that it was aggression?
Kevin , both pilots were experienced.. and one of them was really special.. I cant think they simply drop off :-\
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In a combat situation, the crew would have been flying the aircraft manually.
At the end of the day, 500 plus knots at 200 feet or less.
Flying away from a hostile threat.
A distraction comes along (seagull ect)
Pilot is distracted for a milisecond and they are fish food.
No time to make any radio call.
Sorry cem but if they wasn't shot down, they could have simply flown into the sea :(
It does happen and it will always happen.
I have been sat in the back of a Tornado during a "jolly" around Goose Bay, Canada at 550 knots at a indicated (rad alt) 45 feet :o :D
I have also walked around a crash site with a bin liner hopeing in hell that I didn't find any parts of a pilot I knew who had crashed :( :(
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In a combat situation, the crew would have been flying the aircraft manually.
At the end of the day, 500 plus knots at 200 feet or less.
Flying away from a hostile threat.
A distraction comes along (seagull ect)
Pilot is distracted for a milisecond and they are fish food.
No time to make any radio call.
Sorry cem but if they wasn't shot down, they could have simply flown into the sea :(
It does happen and it will always happen.
I have been sat in the back of a Tornado during a "jolly" around Goose Bay, Canada at 550 knots at a indicated (rad alt) 45 feet :o :D
I have also walked around a crash site with a bin liner hopeing in hell that I didn't find any parts of a pilot I knew who had crashed :( :(
I think soon engine will be investigated and we can see :-\
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In a combat situation, the crew would have been flying the aircraft manually.
At the end of the day, 500 plus knots at 200 feet or less.
Flying away from a hostile threat.
A distraction comes along (seagull ect)
Pilot is distracted for a milisecond and they are fish food.
No time to make any radio call.
Sorry cem but if they wasn't shot down, they could have simply flown into the sea :(
It does happen and it will always happen.
I have been sat in the back of a Tornado during a "jolly" around Goose Bay, Canada at 550 knots at a indicated (rad alt) 45 feet :o :D
I have also walked around a crash site with a bin liner hopeing in hell that I didn't find any parts of a pilot I knew who had crashed :( :(
I think soon engine will be investigated and we can see :-\
Sorry cem, the bird wouldn't have had to have hit.
The distraction of a near miss could have been enough.
Or ............ your goverment could be telling lies and it was shot down.
The media will show what they are told to show and say what they are told to say ;)
We in the United Kingdom call it the "The Official Secrets Act" :-X :-X :-X
Goverments lie and cover things up like this ;)
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Money talks, have the Syrian Government paid Turkey some money or cancelled any loans? This sort of face saving double dealing does happen. ::) ::)
The Syrians have admitted they shot at the aircraft, so it might have crashed while taking evasive action. At 200ft, there is not much room for pilot error, plus it is notoriously difficult to judge an aircraft's height when over water. :o :o :o
EM weapon bringing down the aircraft, I have my doubts as all military systems are EMP hardened.
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Money talks, have the Syrian Government paid Turkey some money or cancelled any loans? This sort of face saving double dealing does happen. ::) ::)
The Syrians have admitted they shot at the aircraft, so it might have crashed while taking evasive action. At 200ft, there is not much room for pilot error, plus it is notoriously difficult to judge an aircraft's height when over water. :o :o :o
EM weapon bringing down the aircraft, I have my doubts as all military systems are EMP hardened.
Syrians cant shoot even their arse.. I'm watching the fight in halep and they cant beat a group of ak 47 loaded rebels.. ;D
the jet was followed by long range radars.. and there were not any trace for a missile..
and I dont think they dropped it with AK 47 ;D
and the type of EM.. it may not be an ordinary one as we think :-\
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IF such EM capability exists, why would its' beholder blow its' cover on something like this, which was always bound to be a high profile international incident when a conventional weapon would have been just as effective?
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IF such EM capability exists, why would its' beholder blow its' cover on something like this, which was always bound to be a high profile international incident when a conventional weapon would have been just as effective?
if it exists ( as we dont have proof, but a short search returns many interesting events and occasions that em was thought to be used, and the personalities that claim are serious military staff) its beholder may have planned to stop the other sides air maneuverability with an effective show..besides there are interesting claims from the russian side that you may not heard about..