Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: rossco on 14 March 2013, 21:37:30
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So ive been thinking about replacing my 2.2 engine in my omega with either a 2.5 v6 or a 2.6. Ives done a few conversions in my time, but never with an omega. So whats involved in changing them, apart from the obvious loom, mounts, ecu etc...
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Just buy a V6 .... ;) ;) ;) far easier in the end. :y :y :y :y
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Just buy a V6 .... ;) ;) ;) far easier in the end. :y :y :y :y
+1..
not worth all that work..
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I could do that, but not what I asked. I have a v6 engine lying around, just wondering if theres anything else I need.
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...., but not what I asked. ......
I know ............ I made a constructive suggestion - just not worth the effort IMHO. Are diffs the same, is your gearbox the same, are all the exhaust hanger mounts there.
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...., but not what I asked. ......
I know ............ I made a constructive suggestion - just not worth the effort IMHO. Are diffs the same, is your gearbox the same, are all the exhaust hanger mounts there.
IIRC the backbox is the same for a 2.2 & a 2.6 :-\ so the backbox hangers will be the same. The centre sections hang on a bracket bolted to the gearbox mount so not an issue if the OP has an R25 gearbox (and all the brackets) bolted to the back of his engine......
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...., but not what I asked. ......
I know ............ I made a constructive suggestion - just not worth the effort IMHO. Are diffs the same, is your gearbox the same, are all the exhaust hanger mounts there.
Yeah, thats what I'm asking? I'm assuming I could use the 2.2 diff and would just have to change the front half of prop for the v6 box
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...., but not what I asked. ......
I know ............ I made a constructive suggestion - just not worth the effort IMHO. Are diffs the same, is your gearbox the same, are all the exhaust hanger mounts there.
IIRC the backbox is the same for a 2.2 & a 2.6 :-\ so the backbox hangers will be the same. The centre sections hang on a bracket bolted to the gearbox mount so not an issue if the OP has an R25 gearbox (and all the brackets) bolted to the back of his engine.....
Exhausts are the easy bit really, bit of cut and weld would fix it.
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It's really not worth the hassle, given Omegas are so cheap, why bother? Just buy a V6. What's the reason for the change?
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I could do that, but not what I asked. I have a v6 engine lying around, just wondering if theres anything else I need.
when you drop the v6 in and start to have electronic problems , it will be too late to give up..imo..
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I could do that, but not what I asked. I have a v6 engine lying around, just wondering if theres anything else I need.
Why does your original post say 2.5 or 2.6 as in this post you state you have an engine lying around surely you don't have one of each on your front lawn ??? ;D
But long term i agree with everyone else just buy an Omega with a V6 unless you want a serious project on your hands. :y
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I have a 2.5 in my unit. A good friend of mine likes his v6 vectras so has a few 2.6s lying around cheap. The 2.2 is too underpowered for drifting and fitting a v6 would cure that. My car also has a long mot and tax, and is a very clean shell which I got for very very cheap so dont see the point of selling to buy a car I know nothing about. Plus buying one thats already a v6 takes all the fun away from it.
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I could do that, but not what I asked. I have a v6 engine lying around, just wondering if theres anything else I need.
when you drop the v6 in and start to have electronic problems , it will be too late to give up..imo..
Why would I get electrical problems? id be changing the whole loom and ecu
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Issues would likely be upsets with other ECU's which communicate.
If yours is an auto - the TCM will have the wrong map and not be happy.
ABS - different unit and config again, eg v6 has TC, 2.2 doesnt
MID - Config will be wrong, easily changeable with tech2, whereas not sure the others are quite so simple.
Could be a fair few grumbles to sort.
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Issues would likely be upsets with other ECU's which communicate.
If yours is an auto - the TCM will have the wrong map and not be happy.
ABS - different unit and config again, eg v6 has TC, 2.2 doesnt
MID - Config will be wrong, easily changeable with tech2, whereas not sure the others are quite so simple.
Could be a fair few grumbles to sort.
Mines a manual, abs will be getting removed
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I have a 2.5 in my unit. A good friend of mine likes his v6 vectras so has a few 2.6s lying around cheap. The 2.2 is too underpowered for drifting and fitting a v6 would cure that. My car also has a long mot and tax, and is a very clean shell which I got for very very cheap so dont see the point of selling to buy a car I know nothing about. Plus buying one thats already a v6 takes all the fun away from it.
I believe that You now would have to get it re-moted and also have it certed by an motor engineer for insurance as it would be very much a different car. :-\ I know they are tightening up on this sort of thing
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I have a 2.5 in my unit. A good friend of mine likes his v6 vectras so has a few 2.6s lying around cheap. The 2.2 is too underpowered for drifting and fitting a v6 would cure that. My car also has a long mot and tax, and is a very clean shell which I got for very very cheap so dont see the point of selling to buy a car I know nothing about. Plus buying one thats already a v6 takes all the fun away from it.
I believe that You now would have to get it re-moted and also have it certed by an motor engineer for insurance as it would be very much a different car. :-\ I know they are tightening up on this sort of thing
Yeah I know. So, are all engine mounts different?
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The 2.6 is the same as the 3.2 and the 2.5 is the same as the 3.0 and I expect all are the same, but I would think the 4 pot would be different. :y
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Mines a manual, abs will be getting removed
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Genuine question (just out of interest) - why would you wish to remove the ABS? Is this for offroad / track use?
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Issues would likely be upsets with other ECU's which communicate.
If yours is an auto - the TCM will have the wrong map and not be happy.
ABS - different unit and config again, eg v6 has TC, 2.2 doesnt
MID - Config will be wrong, easily changeable with tech2, whereas not sure the others are quite so simple.
Could be a fair few grumbles to sort.
yep.. and if everything goes as planned :-\
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Mines a manual, abs will be getting removed
Genuine question (just out of interest) - why would you wish to remove the ABS? Is this for offroad / track use?
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Yes, will be used as a road/drift car. I learned the hard way in my BMW that when you're going backwards towards a tyre wall at 60mph, ABS is not your friend
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v6 has different front subframe to 4 pot -I would sell it and get v6-quicker/simpler and you can sell off bits you dont need :y
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Not to mention Vectra V6 is FWD, throttle & breather setup is all totally wrong for Omega.
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Ok - some answers to your questions......
V6 swap-in is possible with some effort.
exhaust hangers same
propshaft same (ish) manual V6s have a larger front coupling, but you can stick with the small one if you've already got the gearbox installed.
manual propshafts longer than auto
manual gearbox will allow a V6 no problem
engine mounts on subframe same
electrics. The only way is to start from scratch and make an engine loom for the V6 using a donor loom from a salvage car. There isn't a wiring diagram for the 2.6-Siemens style engine ECU, but its all pretty simple stuff. Just trace each wire interface with the car and replicate. 2.6 is of course drive-by-wire - so there's the added complication of the pedal interface. Note just running a 2.6 with 2.5 electrics is a bodge and shouldn't be attempted.
2.6 V6 is just about the worst of the range for power and driveability. Drop it and get a 3.0.
Don't remove an ABS - EVER. Just supposing you had an accident - how would you answer the question "so you've made your car less safe by removing the ABS.....?" You can add an "off" switch by all means, but don't remove it.
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Thats more like it. Useful info, cheers mate. And dont worry about the abs, ive had it removed on several cars and insured with that mentioned.
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Insurance is not your problem. I'm a part time expert witness and I assure you that any legal team would absolutely murder you with removed ABS. Leave it be.
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Just buy a V6 .... ;) ;) ;) far easier in the end. :y :y :y :y
+1..
not worth all that work..
:y
value increase-part cost/labor hours=0
unless you do it for fun
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Insurance is not your problem. I'm a part time expert witness and I assure you that any legal team would absolutely murder you with removed ABS. Leave it be.
Nah Its getting binned, thanks
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Insurance is not your problem. I'm a part time expert witness and I assure you that any legal team would absolutely murder you with removed ABS. Leave it be.
Nah Its getting binned, thanks
so why ask questions in the first place if you're going to do it your way what ever? :-X
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Insurance is not your problem. I'm a part time expert witness and I assure you that any legal team would absolutely murder you with removed ABS. Leave it be.
Nah Its getting binned, thanks
so why ask questions in the first place if you're going to do it your way what ever? :-X
Never asked questions about whether or not it would be safe to remove my abs, Asked about changing an engine...
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Insurance is not your problem. I'm a part time expert witness and I assure you that any legal team would absolutely murder you with removed ABS. Leave it be.
Nah Its getting binned, thanks
so why ask questions in the first place if you're going to do it your way what ever? :-X
Never asked questions about whether or not it would be safe to remove my abs, Asked about changing an engine...
you have your answers and advices from knowledgable members.. now its up to you to listen or not..
but of course there are always lessons to be learned :-X
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Insurance is not your problem. I'm a part time expert witness and I assure you that any legal team would absolutely murder you with removed ABS. Leave it be.
Nah Its getting binned, thanks
so why ask questions in the first place if you're going to do it your way what ever? :-X
Never asked questions about whether or not it would be safe to remove my abs, Asked about changing an engine...
you have your answers and advices from knowledgable members.. now its up to you to listen or not..
but of course there are always lessons to be learned :-X
Yes, I have many years experience building cars for the use i am intending, just not with fitting V6s in omegas. I was asking for advice on what needed changing for the engine to fit, not about how legal teams feel about ABS, or how it would be easier to just buy a V6 omega. I do conversions for fun and to learn things. Every time you do something like an engine conversion or similar, you always learn something new, and it's always a good laugh. Yes i know you all may think its not worth the hassle, but i enjoy the hassle, the stress, and the skint knuckles. This is what i enjoy doing with cars, not just buying one prebuilt 'cause its Easier.
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Insurance is not your problem. I'm a part time expert witness and I assure you that any legal team would absolutely murder you with removed ABS. Leave it be.
Nah Its getting binned, thanks
so why ask questions in the first place if you're going to do it your way what ever? :-X
Never asked questions about whether or not it would be safe to remove my abs, Asked about changing an engine...
you have your answers and advices from knowledgable members.. now its up to you to listen or not..
but of course there are always lessons to be learned :-X
Yes, I have many years experience building cars for the use i am intending, just not with fitting V6s in omegas. I was asking for advice on what needed changing for the engine to fit, not about how legal teams feel about ABS, or how it would be easier to just buy a V6 omega. I do conversions for fun and to learn things. Every time you do something like an engine conversion or similar, you always learn something new, and it's always a good laugh. Yes i know you all may think its not worth the hassle, but i enjoy the hassle, the stress, and the skint knuckles. This is what i enjoy doing with cars, not just buying one prebuilt 'cause its Easier.
ok then.. feasibility and experimenting are different things.. as you wish..
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Yes, I have many years experience building cars for the use i am intending, just not with fitting V6s in omegas. I was asking for advice on what needed changing for the engine to fit, not about how legal teams feel about ABS, or how it would be easier to just buy a V6 omega. I do conversions for fun and to learn things. Every time you do something like an engine conversion or similar, you always learn something new, and it's always a good laugh. Yes i know you all may think its not worth the hassle, but i enjoy the hassle, the stress, and the skint knuckles. This is what i enjoy doing with cars, not just buying one prebuilt 'cause its Easier.
Then good luck with conversation matey, I wish you lot of fun! If you had got any of new experience or lesson about which you think it is worth sharing please don't forget to do here ! :y
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Yes, I have many years experience building cars for the use i am intending, just not with fitting V6s in omegas. I was asking for advice on what needed changing for the engine to fit, not about how legal teams feel about ABS, or how it would be easier to just buy a V6 omega. I do conversions for fun and to learn things. Every time you do something like an engine conversion or similar, you always learn something new, and it's always a good laugh. Yes i know you all may think its not worth the hassle, but i enjoy the hassle, the stress, and the skint knuckles. This is what i enjoy doing with cars, not just buying one prebuilt 'cause its Easier.
Then good luck with conversation matey, I wish you lot of fun! If you had got any of new experience or lesson about which you think it is worth sharing please don't forget to do here ! :y
Wont be happening for a few months as i have to sort my BMW out first, but when i do I'll make sure to take pictures etc as i go
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If car is going to be used for track use only, then its fine of getting rid of ABS. But if its being used on standard roads, I think a very dangerous decision.
If you enjoy the challenge then why bother going to lot of hassle for very little extra horses.
Go the whole hog and pop an LS1 V8 in there, now that would be worth the effort!
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you might be needing to do some calcs for front-rear brake bias. I think all facelift Omegas ( i.e. your 2.2 ) had EBD, so the rears will be way too big for operating without the ABS unit.
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If it was me I wouldnt mess about with a v6 I would fit small block v8-if you gonna struggle an stuff for fun then make it worth while -I did with my rover-2litre out new tunnel and modded engine bay and used buick 5litre -but building 6litre chev for it :y