Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: jonny2112 on 31 January 2014, 14:22:48
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Finally in the position to buy a new lpg kit as planned. I rang this morning with a quick query before ordering online, only to be told that he doesn't have a v6 Stag kit atm! Tried to talk me into another (KME?) more expensive one, but apart from the money, the whole point was to get a recognised kit for all the help and support available here.
Ah well. I've to check back to see if there are any kits coming in in the near future, but I guess I'll have to start looking elsewhere too :-\
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Just spoke to the guy at lpg gpl. Can't decide if it's a sales ploy or not but he tells me that due to regular failts after 6-8 months, they won't be getting the Stag kits back in!
Need to start again :-\
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Just spoke to the guy at lpg gpl. Can't decide if it's a sales ploy or not but he tells me that due to regular failts after 6-8 months, they won't be getting the Stag kits back in!
Need to start again :-\
Failures of what though, injectors? Vaps?
Considering the extensive use of Stag Kit here, it's proven very reliable I'd say. The only issues being slight lag at high RPM and abuse by some of our more, "lead footed" members.
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Yep, can't recall many failures with the Stag kits on here. Someone had an ECU die, IIRC? There've been a few minor sensor faults but not much else, if memory serves. Mine is one of the earlier ones and it's still going strong after getting on for 90k miles.
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I got the impression it was a software issue, though I didn't exactly catch what he said. Would I have understood anyway? Probably not!
Stag was the target due to its proven worthiness here
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Indeed. The knowledge of that system here makes it top of the list, IMHO.
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I got the impression it was a software issue, though I didn't exactly catch what he said. Would I have understood anyway? Probably not!
Stag was the target due to its proven worthiness here
AC frequent release updates.
That said, both of mine are well out of date. Job for the summer... ...on a night that Kevin Wood chap lights his BBQ, and we can mull it over with a beer in hand... ...I see a plan forming ;D
I have got a potential injector fault I need to look at when I get a garage. I think chrisgixer had similar on the same injector type.
One does suffer a tad of lag, worse as tank empties, at 6750rpm gear changes. Suspect evap not man enough. Other sees no lag.
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Indeed. The knowledge of that system here makes it top of the list, IMHO.
Exactly right Kevin :y
I got the impression it was a software issue, though I didn't exactly catch what he said. Would I have understood anyway? Probably not!
Stag was the target due to its proven worthiness here
AC frequent release updates.
That said, both of mine are well out of date. Job for the summer... ...on a night that Kevin Wood chap lights his BBQ, and we can mull it over with a beer in hand... ...I see a plan forming ;D
That sounds familiar TB! Something about AC :y
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Any other suppliers recommended?
I know the bay has a couple, though was previously warned off these. Most other companies seem to want to fit the whole thing, rather than supply a kit for DIY install.
Whilst I could wait another month or so for the more expensive kit, as discussed this would defeat the purpose, particularly with my lack of knowledge. Will have to be Stag.
On looking at the site again, it starts with a base kit to which you add your preferred package - based on number of cylinders and power output. I'm guessing the latter is basically the vap and injectors, and am now wondering if he still has the base kits but not the right number of injectors, etc, or vice versa? A call for tomorrow I think, but probably no stag stuff left at all. I don't really need injectors and I guess a vap could be bought separately somewhere ......
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Any other suppliers recommended?
I know the bay has a couple, though was previously warned off these. Most other companies seem to want to fit the whole thing, rather than supply a kit for DIY install.
Whilst I could wait another month or so for the more expensive kit, as discussed this would defeat the purpose, particularly with my lack of knowledge. Will have to be Stag.
On looking at the site again, it starts with a base kit to which you add your preferred package - based on number of cylinders and power output. I'm guessing the latter is basically the vap and injectors, and am now wondering if he still has the base kits but not the right number of injectors, etc, or vice versa? A call for tomorrow I think, but probably no stag stuff left at all. I don't really need injectors and I guess a vap could be bought separately somewhere ......
There is a queue for my Romano system!
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You only need the loom and Stag ECU, software and leads can be borrowed I would have thought :-\
KME gold vaporiser, plus suitable injectors, both readily available, and the likes of Tinley Tech will freely sell you all the other hardware, albeit at a price :y
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I'm not sure if this is useful jonny but I saw this company's website the other day.
Land Rover focused, no mention of the brand and I've no idea if the prices are competitive to be honest, but thought it might be of interest as he supplies kits for the Landy DIYers. Might be worth a phone call? :)
http://www.blazegas.com/kits.html
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I'm not sure if this is useful jonny but I saw this company's website the other day.
Land Rover focused, no mention of the brand and I've no idea if the prices are competitive to be honest, but thought it might be of interest as he supplies kits for the Landy DIYers. Might be worth a phone call? :)
http://www.blazegas.com/kits.html
Supposedly very good installer. But pricey when I enquired and an authorised Prins installer.
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Thanks for all the info guys - much appreciated :y
As Al suggests, I need the loom and ECU, along with the vap. Depending on the generic nature, or otherwise, of the install I may have the rest of the required parts in situ already.
Plenty of food for thought!
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If looking away from stag, Prins is the only way I'd go. With the support level here, the odd quirk is easily diagnosed on a stag kit. Take that away and IMO something more reliable us needed.
But they are only available from Prins approved fitters. They won't entertain diy, which will get the "jobs for the boys" sabres rattling.
As Al says re Stag, you only need the loom and ecu, and arguably a set up lead. Assuming you have access to a lap top which most people do. Software is available From the Ac web site so no problem there. (Prins won't allow that I'm sure.)
The rest can be acquired from the usual source, or in the trade generally. Personally I'd splash a bit more on the injectors than the usual moto-gas ones. They are only just capable of keeping up, ime. No,problems with the Kme hold vap, or the stag side of things here.
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Just spoke to the guy at lpg gpl. Can't decide if it's a sales ploy or not but he tells me that due to regular failts after 6-8 months, they won't be getting the Stag kits back in!
Need to start again :-\
Failures of what though, injectors? Vaps?
Considering the extensive use of Stag Kit here, it's proven very reliable I'd say. The only issues being slight lag at high RPM and abuse by some of our more, "lead footed" members.
;D driving everywhere at tickover rpm levels is no guide on a suitable lpg system ;D
A system needs to cover ALL areas of the cars performance. From tickover to red line.
And actually, they don't tickover too well either. Most of the stag systems have a slight hunt, of varying degrees on the v engines. No biggy, but its there.
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It would take more than an lpg kit to make mine idle smoothly ;D
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Should have stretched myself maybe before Christmas Al :-X
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Should have stretched myself maybe before Christmas Al :-X
If we're talking about Tilo, he stopped trading and ran out of actual kits long before Xmas. He still has stock though, injectors, vamps and odes and sods.
Iirc he ordered tanks from elsewhere anyway. :)
Tried Tinley Tech...?
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Should have stretched myself maybe before Christmas Al :-X
If we're talking about Tilo, he stopped trading and ran out of actual kits long before Xmas. He still has stock though, injectors, vamps and odes and sods.
Iirc he ordered tanks from elsewhere anyway. :)
Tried Tinley Tech...?
Find their website a bit awkward, but once I decide what I actually need I'll give them a ring. Not sure they do Stag though :-\
I need to re read the fitting guide to suss out the Stag setup against what I previously fitted, to check for other components, sensors, etc which I may need?
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Yes I have just been on their site and it's not great, nor do they appear to stock the stag kit. But they may be able to get it? :-\
Ac stag site doesn't make it clear who the uk supplier is either.
Re the kit components, any supplier should be able to include the correct parts you'll need. So you as a customer would only need to decide on tank shape/size for the rear end, and which lpg kit manufacturer for your cars number cylinders.
They might go into which vap (Kme gold) or injectors, but the engine bhp and number of cylinders should dictate all that anyway.
All these questions can be answered on here as to what people have on their cars already. :)
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Yes, thanks Chris. I have the non-working, unknown kit fitted, and was hoping to retain some of it at least. The injectors are fairly new, so is the filter and the tank is fine. Just need to establish if there are any other sensors, etc required on the Stag which may not be present already, or vice versa.
Email sent to Tinley, and to some of the eBay suppliers, to ask if they can supply individual bits rather than full kits?
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Yes, thanks Chris. I have the non-working, unknown kit fitted, and was hoping to retain some of it at least. The injectors are fairly new, so is the filter and the tank is fine. Just need to establish if there are any other sensors, etc required on the Stag which may not be present already, or vice versa.
Email sent to Tinley, and to some of the eBay suppliers, to ask if they can supply individual bits rather than full kits?
Ah i see. Sorry. Fingers crossed then :y
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Yes, thanks Chris. I have the non-working, unknown kit fitted, and was hoping to retain some of it at least. The injectors are fairly new, so is the filter and the tank is fine. Just need to establish if there are any other sensors, etc required on the Stag which may not be present already, or vice versa.
Email sent to Tinley, and to some of the eBay suppliers, to ask if they can supply individual bits rather than full kits?
Ah i see. Sorry. Fingers crossed then :y
No need mate. All comments and advice more than welcome :y
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No word back as yet from main queries, though a few bay sellers have stated only full kits can be supplied.
This one states it has a gold reducer, with stag ECU and loom - 121020790516
Any thoughts about it? I know other similar kits were discarded, but this does have the uprated vap?
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And actually, they don't tickover too well either. Most of the stag systems have a slight hunt, of varying degrees on the v engines. No biggy, but its there.
There speaketh a man with the inferior 3.2. No idle issues whatsoever on the superior 3.0l engine, despite running so rich at idle the trims get hard pinned so hard, they never recover ;)
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Yup that 3.2 is so inferior, you can change the plugs in about 15minutes ;D
Depending on how the lpg kit has been fitted of course ::)
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Came across this supplier the other day while pricing up an LPG system.
http://www.lpgshop.co.uk/ (http://www.lpgshop.co.uk/)
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Yup that 3.2 is so inferior, you can change the plugs in about 15minutes ;D
Depending on how the lpg kit has been fitted of course ::)
They're about the same to change plugs, what you gain on the 1/3/5 bank on the 3.0l you lose on the 2/4/6 bank.
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And actually, they don't tickover too well either. Most of the stag systems have a slight hunt, of varying degrees on the v engines. No biggy, but its there.
There speaketh a man with the inferior 3.2. No idle issues whatsoever on the superior 3.0l engine, despite running so rich at idle the trims get hard pinned so hard, they never recover ;)
The 3.0 with the old black single feed vap, older injectors and single hole tank with older stag kit that lags, you mean.
Bit of hunting or lag. I'll have the hunting thanks. Or eventual hunting, to be more accurate. Its nout go do with the car. I had your kit on my other 3.2 don't forget. ;)
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And actually, they don't tickover too well either. Most of the stag systems have a slight hunt, of varying degrees on the v engines. No biggy, but its there.
There speaketh a man with the inferior 3.2. No idle issues whatsoever on the superior 3.0l engine, despite running so rich at idle the trims get hard pinned so hard, they never recover ;)
The 3.0 with the old black single feed vap, older injectors and single hole tank with older stag kit that lags, you mean.
Bit of hunting or lag. I'll have the hunting thanks. Or eventual hunting, to be more accurate. Its nout go do with the car. I had your kit on my other 3.2 don't forget. ;)
Yeah, I reckon its the evap causing that lag. Its fine with a lot of gas in the tank, but occasionally lags with lower gas levels - wonder if thats why you noticed it more on your old one (due to small tank)?
But my point I was trying to make is the superior 3.0l auto doesn't lag in the same way the inferior 3.2l auto does (on petrol).
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No hunting or lag on this 3.2 on LPG .... (or on petrol although its a long while since I did any distance on that fuel ... ) :) :) :) :)
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No hunting or lag on this 3.2 on LPG .... (or on petrol although its a long while since I did any distance on that fuel ... ) :) :) :) :)
Yes there is, as its still a piggyback ecu, and the problem is inherent in the 3.2 petrol ECU.
Its just you drive it in such a way that you don't notice it.
:P
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No hunting or lag on this 3.2 on LPG .... (or on petrol although its a long while since I did any distance on that fuel ... ) :) :) :) :)
You sir, are not trying hard enough ;D ;)
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No hunting or lag on this 3.2 on LPG .... (or on petrol although its a long while since I did any distance on that fuel ... ) :) :) :) :)
You sir, are not trying hard enough ;D ;)
You tried really hard and found no lag when you compared it to yours ... :)
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No hunting or lag on this 3.2 on LPG .... (or on petrol although its a long while since I did any distance on that fuel ... ) :) :) :) :)
You sir, are not trying hard enough ;D ;)
You tried really hard and found no lag when you compared it to yours ... :)
He wasn't trying hard enough either! ;D
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And actually, they don't tickover too well either. Most of the stag systems have a slight hunt, of varying degrees on the v engines. No biggy, but its there.
There speaketh a man with the inferior 3.2. No idle issues whatsoever on the superior 3.0l engine, despite running so rich at idle the trims get hard pinned so hard, they never recover ;)
The 3.0 with the old black single feed vap, older injectors and single hole tank with older stag kit that lags, you mean.
Bit of hunting or lag. I'll have the hunting thanks. Or eventual hunting, to be more accurate. Its nout go do with the car. I had your kit on my other 3.2 don't forget. ;)
Yeah, I reckon its the evap causing that lag. Its fine with a lot of gas in the tank, but occasionally lags with lower gas levels - wonder if thats why you noticed it more on your old one (due to small tank)?
at the time I wasn't sure what component was causing what symptom, but yes I think your right. The switching back was the tank valve, the lag on changes was worse with a low fuel level, which being smaller meant it was low more often. Lag is lean. Or on this set up, it needs a bit more fuelling anyway(think that's right :-\ ;D )
But my point I was trying to make is the superior 3.0l auto doesn't lag in the same way the inferior 3.2l auto does (on petrol).
Must say I was surprised to see the faults we did on petrol when mapping it with Kev. Suggests room for improvement somewhere ;)
Only question is how hard it is to improve on. Which ultimately means.... How much?
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No hunting or lag on this 3.2 on LPG .... (or on petrol although its a long while since I did any distance on that fuel ... ) :) :) :) :)
You sir, are not trying hard enough ;D ;)
You tried really hard and found no lag when you compared it to yours ... :)
He wasn't trying hard enough either! ;D
....and nor would i in someone else's car with the owner sat next to me, remember the journey back from Newent? :-X ;D
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Only question is how hard it is to improve on. Which ultimately means.... How much?
If its mapping, its probably possible if you can find someone who is prepared to do it (as little gain for them, unlike performance maps). If its in the coding side, thats likely to be a non starter.
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Only question is how hard it is to improve on. Which ultimately means.... How much?
If its mapping, its probably possible if you can find someone who is prepared to do it (as little gain for them, unlike performance maps). If its in the coding side, thats likely to be a non starter.
Can you not get your stethoscope out, or something...? :)
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Only question is how hard it is to improve on. Which ultimately means.... How much?
If its mapping, its probably possible if you can find someone who is prepared to do it (as little gain for them, unlike performance maps). If its in the coding side, thats likely to be a non starter.
Can you not get your stethoscope out, or something...? :)
It melted :P
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Only question is how hard it is to improve on. Which ultimately means.... How much?
If its mapping, its probably possible if you can find someone who is prepared to do it (as little gain for them, unlike performance maps). If its in the coding side, thats likely to be a non starter.
Can you not get your stethoscope out, or something...? :)
It melted :P
I'm sure Kev could lend you one. :)
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Came across this supplier the other day while pricing up an LPG system.
http://www.lpgshop.co.uk/ (http://www.lpgshop.co.uk/)
Thanks for that - I'll check them out too :y
How did you get on with your own search? Any joy?
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No hunting or lag on this 3.2 on LPG .... (or on petrol although its a long while since I did any distance on that fuel ... ) :) :) :) :)
You sir, are not trying hard enough ;D ;)
You tried really hard and found no lag when you compared it to yours ... :)
He wasn't trying hard enough either! ;D
....and nor would i in someone else's car with the owner sat next to me, remember the journey back from Newent? :-X ;D
Correction. The Lakes
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Came across this supplier the other day while pricing up an LPG system.
http://www.lpgshop.co.uk/ (http://www.lpgshop.co.uk/)
Thanks for that - I'll check them out too :y
How did you get on with your own search? Any joy?
Yes, this kit off ebay is a possibility with stag 300-6, KME gold and OMVL injectors at £385.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121020790516?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121020790516?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649)
The rest of the bits will be from wherever it is cheapest and / or have what I want. It is going to be a few months down the line, before I start on this as I have a long list of jobs to get my car back on the road and I will do this before I think about LPG.
I suspect the total installation cost will be around £800 plus certification.
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That is a pretty realistic figure Rods, especially if you have to ferret around for odds and sods :y Pipe is cheap enough, but you need to buy enough to allow for routing it around the car, clips are cheap, but again quantity comes into play, if you need one every 4-5" along a 15' pipe... then that's basically 50 clips. It's these bits that add up :-\
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I'm lucky (??) this time round in that I'm only looking for the parts between tank and filter.
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The scarlet pimpernel may have some smaller items left over?
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The scarlet pimpernel may have some smaller items left over?
They seek him here...
They seek him there....
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The scarlet pimpernel may have some smaller items left over?
They seek him here...
They seek him there....
Every bloody where.
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His clothes are loud, but never square.
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The scarlet pimpernel may have some smaller items left over?
I had a lot of the LPG spares, I'm afraid :'(