Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Lizzie_Zoom on 10 August 2014, 11:42:26
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Last week I took a week's holiday in one of my favourite parts of Britain, The Lake District.
So on Friday 1st of August I drove from Ashford in Kent to Flookburgh in Cumbria. The journey took from 0915 to 2015 with four stops at services; 11 hours over 550+ miles!! When I returned on Friday 8th, it took 9 hours with 2 stops at services.
Why so long? Because there was simply too many motor vehicles fighting for too little road space on especially the M25, M40, M42, and M6 (the worst!). I used the M6 Toll coming back down that speeded things up a bit, but basically it was two journeys that consisted of continual stop start motoring, with the M6 in particular just a car park in so many places.
I have 1 million miles of driving experience, the majority accumulated on nationwide business from 1973 to 1996. I used many motorways, including all the major motorways, frequently. Up to 2003 I was still travelling around on business for another company, but never, never, did I find in all those years so many major hold ups on our major motorways. Not due to road works or accidents, but purely too many vehicles bunching up and causing complete stops for considerable lengths of road. On the radio whilst driving back I kept on hearing about severe tailbacks and hold-ups on the M4, M5, M11, and M25,in addition to what I was experiencing. One report in particular mentioned "solid stationery traffic" from Bristol to past Weston-super-mare on the M5, a road I made a considerable percentage of my million miles business driving so know it all too well. However, although considerable hold-ups were common in the 1990s from Almondsbury to Weston on this road on holiday get away days, especially Saturday's, it was never that bad.
No, I have now the distinct impression that my prediction of the end of motor vehicle mass use is within 50 years is out; it will be within the next 15-20 years. If I project the great increase I have seen in motor car use in the last 20 years forward, coupled with what is actually happening on our roads now, with motor ways already incapable of handling the current level of traffic, it is obvious the "Great Motor Age" is coming to an end. The new age of The Train, high speed of course, coupled with super integrated local bus services based on rail link hubs, is now the way to go, with air transport continuing to provide a significant alternative.
:)
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I've had a similar view for some time.
There was a time when I could predict how long a journey would take. This is now impossible. I don't think it is caused by any one factor, but a combination of many.
Increase of adult population = more cars
Elf & Safe T = Long delays caused by relatively minor accidents/incidents
Compensation culture = Long delays caused by excessive caution by authorities
I also think that it is caused the hotel industry deliberately clogging our roads so that if you really REALLY need to be somewhere the next morning, you go the night before and stay in a hotel ;D
I now routinely travel between London and West Wales. Whenever possible I take the train, cheaper, quicker, and even allowing for delays, more reliable. Yes it's cheaper, The Severn Crossing now costs £6.40, and my 3.2 is not exactly frugal on fuel ! My trip this weekend £64 return by train, by car it would be about that each way.
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I went back to Scarborough recently (Spring) and was shocked at the volumes of cars queuing on the dual carriageways on their way to the coast as I went back to Leeds airport. In my youth the bottlenecks were Malton, Tadcaster and York but they now have bypasses. It was a relief to get back to the quiet Spanish roads.
The golden age of motoring was ten or twenty years ago. perhaps more. We just didn't know it.
The way forward is of course driverless cars with speed, distance apart etc controlled by computer and not by humans. There would be no butterfly effect, tailgating would be the norm! and no choice. The car of today will be phased out OR cost a fortune per mile to use.
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I've had a similar view for some time.
There was a time when I could predict how long a journey would take. This is now impossible. I don't think it is caused by any one factor, but a combination of many.
Increase of adult population = more cars
Elf & Safe T = Long delays caused by relatively minor accidents/incidents
Compensation culture = Long delays caused by excessive caution by authorities
I also think that it is caused the hotel industry deliberately clogging our roads so that if you really REALLY need to be somewhere the next morning, you go the night before and stay in a hotel ;D
I now routinely travel between London and West Wales. Whenever possible I take the train, cheaper, quicker, and even allowing for delays, more reliable. Yes it's cheaper, The Severn Crossing now costs £6.40, and my 3.2 is not exactly frugal on fuel ! My trip this weekend £64 return by train, by car it would be about that each way.
All agreed Rog. Of course the cost of train travel is easily justified versus the cost of a single person using a 3.2 Omega, but when there is a family involved the situation becomes very different. To resolve that issue family rail/bus tickets should be made a lot cheaper to encourage them to leave the car at home. But then my point about super integrated public transport really comes into focus, with an easier method of suitcase logistics involved. :y
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The new age of The Train, high speed of course, coupled with super integrated local bus services based on rail link hubs, is now the way to go, with air transport continuing to provide a significant alternative.
:)
I doubt that there will ever be any sort of cohesive transport policy such as you describe Lizzie, as usual in this country we'll just muddle through.... ::)
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I went back to Scarborough recently (Spring) and was shocked at the volumes of cars queuing on the dual carriageways on their way to the coast as I went back to Leeds airport. In my youth the bottlenecks were Malton, Tadcaster and York but they now have bypasses. It was a relief to get back to the quiet Spanish roads.
The golden age of motoring was ten or twenty years ago. perhaps more. We just didn't know it.
The way forward is of course driverless cars with speed, distance apart etc controlled by computer and not by humans. There would be no butterfly effect, tailgating would be the norm! and no choice. The car of today will be phased out OR cost a fortune per mile to use.
All agreed Varche, but the "driverless" cars are envisaged to be all electric. At the services I saw ONE bay reserved for recharging. How does that work if 20/30/ whatever cars need recharging (over how many hours / 6, 8 ??) and how do these cars cope with a distance of travel over 550 miles? How many re-charges v. hours would that take? The answers will no doubt come with new technology and revised mind-sets, but when? Will it be in time?
Let's face it we need answers and solutions now. :)
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The new age of The Train, high speed of course, coupled with super integrated local bus services based on rail link hubs, is now the way to go, with air transport continuing to provide a significant alternative.
:)
I doubt that there will ever be any sort of cohesive transport policy such as you describe Lizzie, as usual in this country we'll just muddle through.... ::)
I fear that could indeed be the case! ::) ::)
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I've had a similar view for some time.
There was a time when I could predict how long a journey would take. This is now impossible. I don't think it is caused by any one factor, but a combination of many.
Increase of adult population = more cars
Elf & Safe T = Long delays caused by relatively minor accidents/incidents
Compensation culture = Long delays caused by excessive caution by authorities
I also think that it is caused the hotel industry deliberately clogging our roads so that if you really REALLY need to be somewhere the next morning, you go the night before and stay in a hotel ;D
I now routinely travel between London and West Wales. Whenever possible I take the train, cheaper, quicker, and even allowing for delays, more reliable. Yes it's cheaper, The Severn Crossing now costs £6.40, and my 3.2 is not exactly frugal on fuel ! My trip this weekend £64 return by train, by car it would be about that each way.
All agreed Rog. Of course the cost of train travel is easily justified versus the cost of a single person using a 3.2 Omega, but when there is a family involved the situation becomes very different. To resolve that issue family rail/bus tickets should be made a lot cheaper to encourage them to leave the car at home. But then my point about super integrated public transport really comes into focus, with an easier method of suitcase logistics involved. :y
Agreed. If SWMBO is with me we almost always drive. SWMBO hates that as she has to listen to my music in the car ::)
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I'm going to disagree! :P ;D ;D ;D
The motorways are clogged and they are a pain in the butt. Me and 2 buddies went to Cardiff the other day and due to the weather and subsequent accidents it took us 5 hours. 3 hours on the way back on the Sunday.
However I checked for trains. £60-ish each with 2 changes (at Birmingham New Street and another I cant remember). So for just 3 of us the cost would have been £180. Plus the ball-ache of changes.
Petrol in his diesel Megane ( :-X) cost £50. And arguably was more convenient.
Now that's just one example.
So say everybody decided to use the trains or planes. That would then free up the roads for people who have only been using their cars for work...........
just my opinion. :y
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I went to Luton Airport this Friday gone.....2hrs there (not bad really), its about 100miles, but 3.5hrs to get back :o :(
The long return trip was all to do with heavy traffic......
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I'm going to disagree! :P ;D ;D ;D
The motorways are clogged and they are a pain in the butt. Me and 2 buddies went to Cardiff the other day and due to the weather and subsequent accidents it took us 5 hours. 3 hours on the way back on the Sunday.
However I checked for trains. £60-ish each with 2 changes (at Birmingham New Street and another I cant remember). So for just 3 of us the cost would have been £180. Plus the ball-ache of changes.
Petrol in his diesel Megane ( :-X) cost £50. And arguably was more convenient.
Now that's just one example.
So say everybody decided to use the trains or planes. That would then free up the roads for people who have only been using their cars for work...........
just my opinion. :y
That is of course one answer Webby, but I personally think one outstanding issue is still the amount of freight still being transported by road.
Some of it is unavoidable as it is for local deliveries, but so much more of the long distance freight should go by rail, high speed preferably, as in the case of the freight coming through the Chunnel on container trains. I see thousands of lorries coming through Kent from foreign ferry ports, and via the Chunnel shuttle trains, carrying freight destined for all parts of Britain that should be going by train. Take those lorries off our roads and it would free up a considerable amount of road space.
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I'm going to disagree! :P ;D ;D ;D
The motorways are clogged and they are a pain in the butt. Me and 2 buddies went to Cardiff the other day and due to the weather and subsequent accidents it took us 5 hours. 3 hours on the way back on the Sunday.
However I checked for trains. £60-ish each with 2 changes (at Birmingham New Street and another I cant remember). So for just 3 of us the cost would have been £180. Plus the ball-ache of changes.
Petrol in his diesel Megane ( :-X) cost £50. And arguably was more convenient.
Now that's just one example.
So say everybody decided to use the trains or planes. That would then free up the roads for people who have only been using their cars for work...........
just my opinion. :y
That is of course one answer Webby, but I personally think one outstanding issue is still the amount of freight still being transported by road.
Some of it is unavoidable as it is for local deliveries, but so much more of the long distance freight should go by rail, high speed preferably, as in the case of the freight coming through the Chunnel on container trains. I see thousands of lorries coming through Kent from foreign ferry ports, and via the Chunnel shuttle trains, carrying freight destined for all parts of Britain that should be going by train. Take those lorries off our roads and it would free up a considerable amount of road space.
Definitely! And it would stop them pulling out AT ANY TIME THEY LIKE in to the middle lane >:(
Where I'm from we have Eddie Stobart just round the corner and I see loads of lorries destined for Eastern Europe. Is it feasible they go by train though due to costs? :-\ I don't know anything about train freight costs but woulda thought it'd be expensive hence all the lorries? :-\
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I'm going to disagree! :P ;D ;D ;D
The motorways are clogged and they are a pain in the butt. Me and 2 buddies went to Cardiff the other day and due to the weather and subsequent accidents it took us 5 hours. 3 hours on the way back on the Sunday.
However I checked for trains. £60-ish each with 2 changes (at Birmingham New Street and another I cant remember). So for just 3 of us the cost would have been £180. Plus the ball-ache of changes.
Petrol in his diesel Megane ( :-X) cost £50. And arguably was more convenient.
Now that's just one example.
So say everybody decided to use the trains or planes. That would then free up the roads for people who have only been using their cars for work...........
just my opinion. :y
That is of course one answer Webby, but I personally think one outstanding issue is still the amount of freight still being transported by road.
Some of it is unavoidable as it is for local deliveries, but so much more of the long distance freight should go by rail, high speed preferably, as in the case of the freight coming through the Chunnel on container trains. I see thousands of lorries coming through Kent from foreign ferry ports, and via the Chunnel shuttle trains, carrying freight destined for all parts of Britain that should be going by train. Take those lorries off our roads and it would free up a considerable amount of road space.
Definitely! And it would stop them pulling out AT ANY TIME THEY LIKE in to the middle lane >:(
Where I'm from we have Eddie Stobart just round the corner and I see loads of lorries destined for Eastern Europe. Is it feasible they go by train though due to costs? :-\ I don't know anything about train freight costs but woulda thought it'd be expensive hence all the lorries? :-\
Oh so true Webby! I have joked with friends that whenever you take a motorway journey of any reasonable length you are guaranteed to see at least one Eddie Stobart lorry! It was the same during my recent experience; every motorway revealed at least one of their trucks - they have of course some 2,200+ units, with 3,200 trailers!!
They also operate freight trains, so why don't they use those more? Any answers? Anyone knows why?
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All agreed Rog. Of course the cost of train travel is easily justified versus the cost of a single person using a 3.2 Omega, but when there is a family involved the situation becomes very different. To resolve that issue family rail/bus tickets should be made a lot cheaper to encourage them to leave the car at home. But then my point about super integrated public transport really comes into focus, with an easier method of suitcase logistics involved. :y
Not necessarily (pro rata) the case Lizzie .. a Family Railcard allows up to 4 adults + 4 children truly massive savings.
Rail travel is the way forwards, as currently being demonstrated in these parts:
Improving the Cardiff & Valleys Rail Network
An Artist's impression of Cardiff Queen Street station
You will soon see work happening at Cardiff Central and Cardiff Queen Street stations, improving the entrances and the addition of new platforms.
This work will also improve reliability and capacity on the Cardiff and Valleys rail network. The £220 million project is jointly funded by Network Rail and the Welsh Government. This will include;
a new platform at Cardiff Central
a new south-side entrance at Cardiff Central with lifts to the new platform
New platforms and entrance at Cardiff Queen Street station
an additional platform at Barry station
improved infrastructure on the Rhymney Valley line at Caerphilly and Tir-Phil
improved infrastructure at Cogan
line-speed improvements on the City Line
a new platform at Pontypridd
An Artist's impression of the new rear entrance for Cardiff Central station
The project, scheduled to be completed by 2015, will ‘future proof’ the railway by increasing capacity for potential future passenger services. It will also provide a more robust and flexible infrastructure in order to maintain and improve train reliability and punctuality.
For free email alerts to keep you up to date and to let you know of any service alterations relating to the project, please visit www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/EngineeringWorksAlerts.
For further information on this project, visit Network Rail's website.
Electrification is also looming for the Valleys network .. :y
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All agreed Varche, but the "driverless" cars are envisaged to be all electric. At the services I saw ONE bay reserved for recharging. How does that work if 20/30/ whatever cars need recharging (over how many hours / 6, 8 ??) and how do these cars cope with a distance of travel over 550 miles? How many re-charges v. hours would that take? The answers will no doubt come with new technology and revised mind-sets, but when? Will it be in time?
Let's face it we need answers and solutions now. :)
The charging point at the M20 services has been out of action for about 6 weeks now. I've recovered 3 Leafs to the M2 services for a recharge. Unless the range and charging problems are solved, which is a battery problem and nothing to do with the cars, electric cars are a dead end. Or a dead stop at about 100 miles!
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Great info there thanks Seth!! 8) 8) :y :y :y
It is wonderful for us rail fans to see such widespread developments. So much is going on to at last update the Victorian rail infrastructure.
In London we have of course a major re-development of London Bridge to cope with massive increases in passenger travel, coupled to the fantastic Crossrail project that is building a completely new rail link across the whole City.
Things are a-happening!! :y :y :y :y :y :y :y
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All agreed Varche, but the "driverless" cars are envisaged to be all electric. At the services I saw ONE bay reserved for recharging. How does that work if 20/30/ whatever cars need recharging (over how many hours / 6, 8 ??) and how do these cars cope with a distance of travel over 550 miles? How many re-charges v. hours would that take? The answers will no doubt come with new technology and revised mind-sets, but when? Will it be in time?
Let's face it we need answers and solutions now. :)
The charging point at the M20 services has been out of action for about 6 weeks now. I've recovered 3 Leafs to the M2 services for a recharge. Unless the range and charging problems are solved, which is a battery problem and nothing to do with the cars, electric cars are a dead end. Or a dead stop at about 100 miles!
I haven't strong feelings one way or the other with electric cars but just like with the advent of diesel cars diesel fuel became available everywhere so will charging points. Think WiFi on the move Internet .
I can't see flying taking much strain off the UK roads. Too much hassle getting to airport, being seen off for parking(or dropping off) then queuing ages for security checks. Trains? well there must be more capacity there but even with imagination it might only reduce todays traffic levels by say 10%. Buses? Perhaps better equipped than the UK ones I remember.
Some possible solutions:
Tax staycations to make it cheaper to go to Spain on holiday
Use teleconferencing for business meetings
Ban the school run
Stagger work and school start/finish times
More working from home or coffice
Bring back giving people lifts(use an app that auto reports vehicle reg you get in to allay safety concerns.)
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The last 4 would make a lot of sense imho
Ban the school run
Stagger work and school start/finish times
More working from home or office
Bring back giving people lifts
The biggest problem is we as a whole are lazy barstewards nowdays :(
We want everything done our way so that we have the least amount of disruption to our social life's and if anybody tries to say no then we scream blue murder ::) >:(
Trains can be more money efficient if you book weeks / months in advance BUT if you need to get somewhere at short notice then the prices are crazy and well out of the average persons pay packet >:(
As for motorways, I hate them with a passion and avoid them like the plague during the daytime.
If and when I carry my passport and head down south, i'm on the road at 2am when its quite and arrive as the sun comes up :y
Get my arse into a small town, find a café for breakfast and don't move until i've had a snooze and the rush hour has passed :y
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The last 4 would make a lot of sense imho
Ban the school run
Stagger work and school start/finish times
More working from home or office
Bring back giving people lifts
The biggest problem is we as a whole are lazy barstewards nowdays :(
We want everything done our way so that we have the least amount of disruption to our social life's and if anybody tries to say no then we scream blue murder ::) >:(
Trains can be more money efficient if you book weeks / months in advance BUT if you need to get somewhere at short notice then the prices are crazy and well out of the average persons pay packet >:(
As for motorways, I hate them with a passion and avoid them like the plague during the daytime.
If and when I carry my passport and head down south, i'm on the road at 2am when its quite and arrive as the sun comes up :y
Get my arse into a small town, find a café for breakfast and don't move until i've had a snooze and the rush hour has passed :y
Very sensible actions Tiger!! :y :y :y :y :y
That is the way it should be done if using common sense, but just emphasises how bad the road congestion has become.
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I went to Luton Airport this Friday gone.....2hrs there (not bad really), its about 100miles, but 3.5hrs to get back :o :(
The long return trip was all to do with heavy traffic......
Should get a Honda, just under 2 hours to Manchester Airport this morning and that is 136 Miles away and up a big hill.......... :D :D ;)
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Trouble with the train is you have to lug all your baggage around and your limited to how much stuff you can take , plus there's always some nutter on the train near you causing hassle ..we felt very nervous and threatened the last time we went on the train and will never use the train again :(
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Trouble with the train is you have to lug all your baggage around and your limited to how much stuff you can take , plus there's always some nutter on the train near you causing hassle ..we felt very nervous and threatened the last time we went on the train and will never use the train again :(
Yep.
I avoid public transport like the plague. It's not cheap either.
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yep m6 can be fun I remember last year going from Leicester to Carlisle and back to Leicester ( dam lorry drivers who lose vehicle keys ) in 6:30 including a 30 minute stop :-X
but we had no traffic as it was xmas eve morning.
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M6 toll every time I have the misfortune to go up that way ::)
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Unfortunately, anything that government's control or influence, they like to perversely make it scare and expensive. Good examples are energy, water and roads. This is why we are a knife edge this winter with expensive electricity, we have hosepipe bans every time we have slightly less than average rainfall and clogged roads with very expensive fuel prices, car parks and as many entrapment systems and fines as they can get away with. Added to this soon will be expensive road pricing, to ease congestion by making running a car out of reach for a bigger percentage of the population.
In the last 15 years due to mass migration the population of the UK has grown by 8 million, with zero increase in major roads, the only increase in road mileage has been due the building of new housing estates. With no slowdown in mass migration we either build more roads or accept ever slower journeys, just on the basis that a bigger population means more cars.
Personally, I would rather drive 500 miles on the continent than 50 miles in the UK where the majority of their roads are far less crowded.
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Personnal, I prefer the comfort of my own vehicle to any public transport sharing my space with strangers.
Without going into details why.
F@@@ the goverments and there ideas.
It's all about making it difficult for people to enjoy there likes for the sake of some good doer.
Follow the last 10 years about govt saying please do not use, to govt turning it to difficultys to do with laws and other excuses behind our backs to achieve there goal.