Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: omega3000 on 02 December 2014, 18:53:14
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Anyone driven one of these , ok so we all know its not the best looking car but it looks better in this white . Auto diesel , any problematic things to be a concern :-\
sri (http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201411199104437/sort/default/postcode/nn171hu/transmission/automatic/make/vauxhall/model/insignia/radius/50/onesearchad/used/page/1/usedcars?logcode=p)
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Some would say 62,000 miles a year is bad. Others would say it's good, as car is now cheap but probably never been off a motorway. As regards to auto boxes, I'm not sure, but it's certainly spent a lot of time in top gear.
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Go for it! Full service history. Just run in.
But first have a look on ww.insigniaowners.com to see what they say about the diesels and auto. Lets hope it isn't the horror story of Ford Focus!
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My Honda is a diesel, 2.2 iDetec engine, or something like that..... ::) ::)
Auto and no problems at all, it can be a spirited drive if you want, or you can use it as a manual with flappy paddles. I just stick to auto, occasional using the paddle to drop a gear or two for an overtake.......... :y :y
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"Diesel" and "Auto" is a combination I'd probably avoid at all costs. Not quite as bad as "Arse" and "Saddle", but... ;)
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"Diesel" and "Auto" is a combination I'd probably avoid at all costs. Not quite as bad as "Arse" and "Saddle", but... ;)
Can't agree with that,auto's suit a nice torquey diesel lump,I do agree with the Arse and saddle bit though :-X
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"Diesel" and "Auto" is a combination I'd probably avoid at all costs. Not quite as bad as "Arse" and "Saddle", but... ;)
Can't agree with that,auto's suit a nice torquey diesel lump,I do agree with the Arse and saddle bit though :-X
I quite like arse and saddle but not diesel and auto. Takes all sorts....
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I had one on a two day rental back in 2012 for business did about 400 miles in it. Drove really nice I thought, can't remember the fuel economy but I didn't refuel it until the night before it went back and then only took about 45ltrs to fill back up. You know your driving a diesel but the autobox was nice and never seemed to be in the wrong gear and seats in the SRi are really comfy, or at least I thought so.
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I ticked the box for Auto Insignia diesel when I hired in the Uk. Instead I got a 2litre diesel (bluemotion) 177bhp? Passat.
Apart from no cruise I could not fault it. Fast, always in right gear either five or six in total can't remember, great in traffic and despite being ragged a lot, returned over 60mpg (3 weeks approx 4000miles). If they do one in a Golf it would be very high up my list. I think it even had aselectable option that in effect provides engine braking but not sure.
I am perhaps a lone voice but all cars ought(for years) to be autos and if diesels are more economic than petrols- then diesels. Manual an option only. Lets be honest, there aren't many places south of Leeds in England where you can use a manual to good effect. Wales, Scotland now that is different assuming no speed cameras.
200 miles a day , six days a week that advertised car has done. I don't think it would be many short journeys but you never know!
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..... Instead I got a 2litre diesel (bluemotion) 177bhp? Passat.
Apart from no cruise I could not fault it. Fast, always in right gear either five or six in total can't remember, great in traffic and despite being ragged a lot, returned over 60mpg (3 weeks approx 4000miles). .....
presumably a DSG automated manual ....... I wasn't keen on DSG Passat SWMBO was given as a courtesy car a few years back :-\
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When all is said and done it's an Insignia. A car that comes with a flabby arse that resembles a mutt taking a dump. The front is even more hideous....if that is possible.
The Insignia is like that girl you shagged when you were three sheets to the wind. You remember, don't deny it.......the bint with the blotchy legs and beard. Even after all these years the memory still has the power to make you shudder.
Good value though.... ;D ;D
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diesel and auto..
nope and nope.. :P
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When all is said and done it's an Insignia. A car that comes with a flabby arse that resembles a mutt taking a dump. The front is even more hideous....if that is possible.
The Insignia is like that girl you shagged when you were three sheets to the wind. You remember, don't deny it.......the bint with the blotchy legs and beard. Even after all these years the memory still has the power to make you shudder.
Good value though.... ;D ;D
Boss eyed and juicy but don't recall much else...
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Sorry, you meant the car... well we all know how that turned out ;D
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diesel and auto..
nope and nope.. :P
Why not? My Merc is ;)
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diesel and auto..
nope and nope.. :P
Why not? My Merc is ;)
honestly not my cup of tea :)
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When all is said and done it's an Insignia. A car that comes with a flabby arse that resembles a mutt taking a dump. The front is even more hideous....if that is possible.
The Insignia is like that girl you shagged when you were three sheets to the wind. You remember, don't deny it.......the bint with the blotchy legs and beard. Even after all these years the memory still has the power to make you shudder.
Good value though.... ;D ;D
Tell me about it, still remember many years later, still I was single in those days and aged about 32 years I would put it just about anywhere................ :D :D This particular one was 57 though...... :-[ :-[ not such a problem these days though............. :D :D
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diesel and auto..
nope and nope.. :P
Why not? My Merc is ;)
So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
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diesel and auto..
nope and nope.. :P
Why not? My Merc is ;)
Exactly......... :y :y But not in a Mercedes Benz................. :D :D
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I want neither a diseasel nor an auto , either be it a bugatti or a porsche full stop ;D
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In 30 years time you old gits (the current old gits will be dead of course) will be posting " do you remember when we used to debate which was be best manual/auto diesel/petrol" now we just debate which driverless car is best
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In 30 years time you old gits (the current old gits will be dead of course) will be posting " do you remember when we used to debate which was be best manual/auto diesel/petrol" now we just debate which driverless car is best
:D :D :D :y
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diesel and auto..
nope and nope.. :P
Why not? My Merc is ;)
honestly not my cup of tea :)
Good job it's my car then and not yours ;) ;) ;)
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diesel and auto..
nope and nope.. :P
Why not? My Merc is ;)
honestly not my cup of tea :)
Good job it's my car then and not yours ;) ;) ;)
:D :D ;) :y
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Mine's a (BMW) Turbo Weasel Auto Omega, and to be honest, no complaints as a driving machine. I press the right pedal it goes, hardly anything, then a second later the revs rise, and it goes faster. Then I press the left pedal, and it slows down.
Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.. though that said catconverters, aircon, and about 400kg of extra lard that all cars seem to come with also have a detrimental affect on mpg, but people don't seem to mind that! :)
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.. :)
why ? drivers who are capable of shifting still prefer manual.. 2-3 litre 95 ron fuel difference per 100 km makes a lot of cost for the life time of car..
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
;D
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
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why ? drivers who are capable of shifting still prefer manual.. 2-3 litre 95 ron fuel difference per 100 km makes a lot of cost for the life time of car..
Depends what kind of car. My Merc only comes in auto flavour and by all accounts, manual Mercs in general aren't impressive anyway. As above, if it was a Lotus 7 wanna be, then a manual would be the gearbox of choice ....... I have to admit, that the automated manual in our Smart would be better replaced with a proper manual gearbox.
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
;D
My auto Merc has three pedals ....... throttle, brake & emergency/parking brake ;) ;)
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That's all I could think of Andy, but I thought that was unique to Mercedes (thankfully) and not VAG cars like the Tuareg..
As for automated manuals - ditto for the SMG and, really, SMG-II in the BMW, Andy.. Although the DSG (or whatever it is BMW call it, I forget) in the E9x and onward is infinitely better.
I went down to Porsche a month or so ago (I know, I know, rich, etc etc) and asked if they could find a 997.2 911 C2 or C2S Cabriolet (so 2009-2012 model) with a manual gearbox for me to try.. they're still trying to find one. Apparently almost everyone went for the PDK gearbox once Porsche did away with the tiptronic (which was really just a slush box)..
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
::)
so goes faster with less fuel... yep..when the fish climbs the tree ;D
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
;D
My auto Merc has three pedals ....... throttle, brake & emergency/parking brake ;) ;)
parking brake is in the most left (left hand drive) near the pillar and not near the usual pedal set.. so not counted ;D ;)
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That's all I could think of Andy, but I thought that was unique to Mercedes (thankfully) and not VAG cars like the Tuareg..
As for automated manuals - ditto for the SMG and, really, SMG-II in the BMW, Andy.. Although the DSG (or whatever it is BMW call it, I forget) in the E9x and onward is infinitely better.
I went down to Porsche a month or so ago (I know, I know, rich, etc etc) and asked if they could find a 997.2 911 C2 or C2S Cabriolet (so 2009-2012 model) with a manual gearbox for me to try.. they're still trying to find one. Apparently almost everyone went for the PDK gearbox once Porsche did away with the tiptronic (which was really just a slush box)..
both smg and dsg's are automated manuals and not relevant with the usual slush boxes that the omega have..
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
;D
My auto Merc has three pedals ....... throttle, brake & emergency/parking brake ;) ;)
Ah yes, Mr Beanz.
I wondered what the f**k it was when I first saw this 'strange device'
In practice......and after some practice, it works pretty well after a fashion. :y
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
;D
My auto Merc has three pedals ....... throttle, brake & emergency/parking brake ;) ;)
Ah yes, Mr Beanz.
I wondered what the f**k it was when I first saw this 'strange device'
In practice......and after some practice, it works pretty well after a fashion. :y
it may work but all proper cars have a hand brake ;D
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Ah yes, Mr Beanz.
I wondered what the f**k it was when I first saw this 'strange device'
In practice......and after some practice, it works pretty well after a fashion. :y
I rarely use it.
I'd come across them years ago when one of the funeral places my Dad worked at had a US 'station wagon' as a hearse and then used one in the early 80s when I hired a car in Florida. The other lads that hired a car stumbled at the first hurdle trying to get their car to move because they'd never come across one. :y :y
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That's all I could think of Andy, but I thought that was unique to Mercedes (thankfully) and not VAG cars like the Tuareg..
As for automated manuals - ditto for the SMG and, really, SMG-II in the BMW, Andy.. Although the DSG (or whatever it is BMW call it, I forget) in the E9x and onward is infinitely better.
I went down to Porsche a month or so ago (I know, I know, rich, etc etc) and asked if they could find a 997.2 911 C2 or C2S Cabriolet (so 2009-2012 model) with a manual gearbox for me to try.. they're still trying to find one. Apparently almost everyone went for the PDK gearbox once Porsche did away with the tiptronic (which was really just a slush box)..
Just a few short years ago this 'device of the devil' would have been considered heresy.
How times change.
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it may work but all proper cars have a hand brake ;D
they do ............ P for park ::)
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
::)
so goes faster with less fuel... yep..when the fish climbs the tree ;D
The fish must be climbing the trees then Cem. ;) ;D :y
I speak from my daily personal experience, so I'd like to think that I'm in a position to comment on this. ;)
Times have changed, technology has moved on, and you have flappy paddles to play with if you get bored. ::) ;) :y
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
;D
My auto Merc has three pedals ....... throttle, brake & emergency/parking brake ;) ;)
Ah yes, Mr Beanz.
I wondered what the f**k it was when I first saw this 'strange device'
In practice......and after some practice, it works pretty well after a fashion. :y
it may work but all proper cars have a hand brake ;D
I have to agree, Cem.
After trying both I much prefer a conventional handbrake.
It's like the difference between a gas cooker and an electric cooker. One allows far more control than the other. :y
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
::)
so goes faster with less fuel... yep..when the fish climbs the tree ;D
As engine efficiency increases there is no reason for this not to occur ... at one extreme compare the power/efficiency of a cast iron engine lump of 40 years ago to a present day engine, at the other compare the power efficiency of last years F1 cars to this years beasts.
Technology moves on, but some luddites don't ...... :) :) :)
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Oooh, well I wrote a reply, but 14(!) replies had been written in the time it took me to write mine. It appears much of what I was going to say has already been said... it went like
All fair enough - what I'm really saying is there are plenty of elements of car design which generations saw disappear, which each previous generation saw/lamented its passing, just thinking off the top of my head...
Hand-cranking (stupid electric motor adding weight, etc.. just maintain your car properly and it's go after the first crank or two)
Manual choke (the lost 'art' of where to have it and when, why do we need these swanky 'automatic' chokes)
Chassis, over monocoque construction (end of bespoke coachbuilding)
Proper Chrome bumpers (designed to protect the car, not deform at the slightest knock, and cost hundreds to replace/repair, as opposed to 15 mins with Autosol)
Power steering (more weight - exactly why do you need PAS on a Corsa? Skinny tyres + large steering wheel = worked for donkeys years)
and most recently...
Petrol (in 2010 Diesel overtook Petrol sales for the first time. Oh woe! Diesel isn't a 'proper' fuel etc.. Diseasel etc.. )
I'm not saying this is a list that can't be counter-argued, I'm sure it will, just that
Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.. :)
why ? drivers who are capable of shifting still prefer manual.. 2-3 litre 95 ron fuel difference per 100 km makes a lot of cost for the life time of car..
Yes, totally, however, as I said, cars weighing many hundreds of kilos more now that they did 20 yrs ago also ads to fuel consumption, but this hasn't deterred manufacturers/buyers. Just imagine what the mpg - and speed - would be on a Mk 1 Astra, with a modern 1.4 engine, with all the emissions PC junk taken off. Just imagine what carrying 400 kgs of weight around with you all the time would do to your mpg.
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
Again - there we go, autos are not 'automatically' (no pun intended) less fuel efficient. Not having a pop at all you manual drivers, of course, it's just for me, a car that does the gearchanging for you is as convenient as a car that tells me when the brake pads are worn badly, or adjusts the rear drums itself, and has electrically powered windows, heated seats etc... :)
I'd add that, as mentioned by previous poster, the eleccy handbrake is another feature that some say is better, others lament the passing of a 'proper' handbrake. Eee technology, in't it marvellous!
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I'd hazard a guess that part of the reason the BMW auto is more efficient (and quicker) is that it's (if memory serves) an 8 speed automatic vs a 6 speed manual..
That lets you tune the engine with a fairly narrow power band (it's easy to make an engine very efficient but only in a narrow range of operating parameters, otherwise you have to compromise and make it reasonable efficient over a wider range of parameters) and use the gearbox to make sure you're always within that power band. Not to mention that with 8 speeds you can lock the torque convertor up a lot more of the time, making it behave much more like a regular manual gearbox.
.. and anyone would get bored shuffling 8 cogs manually so that rules out 8 speed manuals ;D
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Not driven a truck then... Only 8 gears would be a blessing ;D
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it may work but all proper cars have a hand brake ;D
they do ............ P for park ::)
I'll recommend trying to use this P position when making sideways on a corner ;D
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
::)
so goes faster with less fuel... yep..when the fish climbs the tree ;D
The fish must be climbing the trees then Cem. ;) ;D :y
I speak from my daily personal experience, so I'd like to think that I'm in a position to comment on this. ;)
Times have changed, technology has moved on, and you have flappy paddles to play with if you get bored. ::) ;) :y
your proposal contradicts with the nature of mechanics..
what model and year your bmw is ?
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it may work but all proper cars have a hand brake ;D
they do ............ P for park ::)
I'll recommend trying to use this P position when making sideways on a corner ;D
Indeed P for Pollox when it goes krrrkrrrrgggghhh when you try it... ::)
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So is my Touareg,I wouldn't want that with the fourth pedal ::) ;)
Hang on..
Accelerator, brake, clutch … fourth pedal?
;D
My auto Merc has three pedals ....... throttle, brake & emergency/parking brake ;) ;)
Aye,same as Touareg :y :y
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Not driven a truck then... Only 8 gears would be a blessing ;D
Yes but it takes a certain kind of weirdo to want to drive trucks for a liv.. uhhh.. oh hi Al! ;)
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
::)
so goes faster with less fuel... yep..when the fish climbs the tree ;D
The fish must be climbing the trees then Cem. ;) ;D :y
I speak from my daily personal experience, so I'd like to think that I'm in a position to comment on this. ;)
Times have changed, technology has moved on, and you have flappy paddles to play with if you get bored. ::) ;) :y
your proposal contradicts with the nature of mechanics..
what model and year your bmw is ?
As per signature below, 2014 430d 8 speed auto, but it matters not as the 2.0d auto is more efficient around town and marginally quicker to 60mph than its manual brother/sister as well. :y As said, not much in the combined figures. :y
If someone orders a manual, with the exception of M's, it's normally the smaller engines with lower spec. :y
As Aaron said, the 8 speed box does rapid changes to keep within the power band. You get less feeling of brutal acceleration but it still delivers the goods. :y
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And what was so very wrong with the 3 speed Borg Warner auto as fitted to the 1972 Jaguar XJ12?
It used good old fashioned torque to fill in any gaps in the power curve. ;) ;D ;D
My CLS 500 came with a 7 speed auto....and it could never quite decide which gear was needed.
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And what was so very wrong with the 3 speed Borg Warner auto as fitted to the 1972 Jaguar XJ12?
It used good old fashioned torque to fill in any gaps in the power curve. ;) ;D ;D
My CLS 500 came with a 7 speed auto....and it could never quite decide which gear was needed.
Thats luxury,remember the Cresta/Viscount 2 speed powerglide transmission
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Not driven a truck then... Only 8 gears would be a blessing ;D
Yes but it takes a certain kind of weirdo to want to drive trucks for a liv.. uhhh.. oh hi Al! ;)
;D
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I'll stick the pickup in 4LO (and 4HI when I run out) tonight and pretend I have 12 gears, just for you ;)
(Actually I think if I tried to flip from 4LO to 4HI in 6th the gearbox would probably go bang.. or more likely the ECU will just beep at me)
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Personally I'm amazed the manual gearbox still exists in this century in all but the most driver-focused cars like Caterhams etc.. I'd imagine it's purely down to extra costs of manufacture and fractional lower mpg.......
On the later bmw diesels the mpg of the auto is better around town than the manual and marginally quicker 0-60mph. :y
Not much in it combined. :)
::)
so goes faster with less fuel... yep..when the fish climbs the tree ;D
The fish must be climbing the trees then Cem. ;) ;D :y
I speak from my daily personal experience, so I'd like to think that I'm in a position to comment on this. ;)
Times have changed, technology has moved on, and you have flappy paddles to play with if you get bored. ::) ;) :y
your proposal contradicts with the nature of mechanics..
what model and year your bmw is ?
As per signature below, 2014 430d 8 speed auto, but it matters not as the 2.0d auto is more efficient around town and marginally quicker to 60mph than its manual brother/sister as well. :y As said, not much in the combined figures. :y
If someone orders a manual, with the exception of M's, it's normally the smaller engines with lower spec. :y
As Aaron said, the 8 speed box does rapid changes to keep within the power band. You get less feeling of brutal acceleration but it still delivers the goods. :y
2014 430d carries a newly designed 8 speed (zf 8hp) .. and there is no produced similiar ratio 8 speed manual for 430d to compare acceleration and consumption values.. ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_4_Series_%28F32%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_4_Series_%28F32%29)
but I can easily say any 8 speed manual with same ratios can beat it hands down..
why because there is still a torque converter which will loose energy (meaning power).. it may shift quickly (200 ms) but inevitable to be beaten by an automated manual.. if we compare like by like..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shift_time (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shift_time)
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Didn't V12 Jags use the GM TH400 like Rolls Royce and Ferrari?
But you're right about torque, it makes for a much better drive.
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and by the way still most autos combined with diesels have stupid microchips incapable of shifting quickly..
even if we assume they shift quickly and have lots of gears , I dont want to be the owner when this complicated trannys go bang ;D
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I'll stick the pickup in 4LO (and 4HI when I run out) tonight and pretend I have 12 gears, just for you ;)
(Actually I think if I tried to flip from 4LO to 4HI in 6th the gearbox would probably go bang.. or more likely the ECU will just beep at me)
You have a warranty, what's the worst that could happen not my car ::)
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This
argument discussion is easily sorted. If you don't like the idea of a vehicle that has a diesel engine coupled with an automatic/semi automatic gearbox, then do not purchase one. If, on the other hand, you are a fickin stupid moron you think this combination is acceptable, then there are plenty out there to choose from.
No need to thank me. ;D
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I'll stick the pickup in 4LO (and 4HI when I run out) tonight and pretend I have 12 gears, just for you ;)
(Actually I think if I tried to flip from 4LO to 4HI in 6th the gearbox would probably go bang.. or more likely the ECU will just beep at me)
You have a warranty, what's the worst that could happen not my car ::)
;D You can switch between 2HI & 4HI up to 60mph (although you have to dip the clutch, obviously).. I did try 4LO briefly.. hilarity ensued ;D
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Selecting 2nd in an empty rear wheel drive van whilst braking from speed is always entertaining ;D not that I have ever tried it... Oh no, never ::) :-X
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
Oh I'm sorry, I thought this was the news page... :P
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
ok.. I said 2 things..
1 - I dont like diesels and autos or combination
2 - manuals consume less and accelerate faster.. statistically true and widely accepted fact..
any exception of automated manuals or rocket science trannies with XXXX gears wont change the fact
and this truth dont belong to me.. its universal..
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This argument discussion is easily sorted. If you don't like the idea of a vehicle that has a diesel engine coupled with an automatic/semi automatic gearbox, then do not purchase one. If, on the other hand, you are a fickin stupid moron you think this combination is acceptable, then there are plenty out there to choose from.
No need to thank me. ;D
;D ;D
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by the way , here is the new famous zf 8hp
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/transmissions/ZF8.html
probably its heavier than my clit ;D ;D
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93Kg including oil, so about 3x a Getrag 250 manual box but only about 13Kg heavier than the 4 speed 4L80E in the Omega.. not bad for twice as many gears.
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93Kg including oil, so about 3x a Getrag 250 manual box but only about 13Kg heavier than the 4 speed 4L80E in the Omega.. not bad for twice as many gears.
yep.. I've checked that also.. 93 kg negligible on a car thats 250-300 hp and weighs more than 1600-1700 kg..
but still I would prefer the pre-historic manuals ;D :D
auto lovers may plan a swap , but will need deep pockets :-\
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A diesel auto is, in my opinion, highly desirable. ....in theory.
However, ignoring the horrendous physics of running a fuel system at 450bar(7000odd psi :o )for a minute, my concern with a front wheel drive auto especially is, limited space between the front wheels means a transvers engine of a gay wheel drive means there simply isn't room to fit an auto box on the end of the engine WITHOUT OFFSETTING THE DRIVE LINE.
As you all know the omega is rear wheel drive and the engine is mounted pointing forwards. Not side ways. This means there is acres of room to fit an auto box on the end of the engine before the rear wheels and axle get in the way.
On a front wheel drive, you have to take the drive from the crank and make the drive go round corners to fit all the gears in between the road wheel and the end of the crank. This means extra weaknesses in the drive line of the auto gear box on front wheel drives that simply don't exist on rear wheel drives.
Then, add in the low down torque of a diesel,( which is bad for autos as we know from the omega tractors killing ar25's if chipped, and sometimes even if not chipped,) then we have even more potential for the torque of a diesel destroying the auto box.
Add in possibly towing, poor servicing, and an aggressive driving style on top of that, and the odds of an auto seeing more than 60k on a front wheel drive diesel is, I would say, possibly reduced.
Some manufacturers are better than others of course, (Aisin Warner are exceptionally poor with plastic parts in the valve body) but imo, avoid a front wheel drive diesel auto, unless your prepared to do a great deal more research than asking on here in order to avoid a large bill for auto box repair.
Tread veeeeeery carefully, imo.
Heavy car, torquey engine, front wheel drive, auto box...... Bad idea, sadly. Although hopefully more modern autos have had the weaknesses engineered out by now. But how to know before buying?
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Yes. :y
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...,, lift pumps on diesels often fail, £1500 quid odd? I don't like diesels.
Injectors, huge great things compared to petrol ones due the massive fuel pressure, BMW E39 ones are over £300 each (x6) to replace, and £90 each to refurb.
Numerous pumps in the fuel system to multiply the fuel pressure at each stage.
Need i go on?
Would add, I have zero experience of that particular car, so might not be relevant, but satisfy yourself of the reliability of that model.
Did I mention, I don't like diesels?
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Are you stalking me again?
Yes. :y
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Are you stalking me again?
Yes. :y
I'm agreeing with you. Don't knock it, it doesn't happen that often.
Now stop worrying about cars and start thinking about how you're going to get anyone to come to your Christmas party. ;D
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Are you stalking me again?
Yes. :y
I'm agreeing with you. Don't knock it, it doesn't happen that often.
Now stop worrying about cars and start thinking about how you're going to get anyone to come to your Christmas party. ;D
In dont like agreeing with you, it leeds to bad places.
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
ok.. I said 2 things..
1 - I dont like diesels and autos or combination
2 - manuals consume less and accelerate faster.. statistically true and widely accepted fact..
any exception of automated manuals or rocket science trannies with XXXX gears wont change the fact
and this truth dont belong to me.. its universal..
Ok, God has spoken, no use arguing. You will only get a headache. Which is often what I get when I read God's posts. ::)
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A diesel auto is, in my opinion, highly desirable. ....in theory.
However, ignoring the horrendous physics of running a fuel system at 450bar(7000odd psi :o )for a minute, my concern with a front wheel drive auto especially is, limited space between the front wheels means a transvers engine of a gay wheel drive means there simply isn't room to fit an auto box on the end of the engine WITHOUT OFFSETTING THE DRIVE LINE.
As you all know the omega is rear wheel drive and the engine is mounted pointing forwards. Not side ways. This means there is acres of room to fit an auto box on the end of the engine before the rear wheels and axle get in the way.
On a front wheel drive, you have to take the drive from the crank and make the drive go round corners to fit all the gears in between the road wheel and the end of the crank. This means extra weaknesses in the drive line of the auto gear box on front wheel drives that simply don't exist on rear wheel drives.
Then, add in the low down torque of a diesel,( which is bad for autos as we know from the omega tractors killing ar25's if chipped, and sometimes even if not chipped,) then we have even more potential for the torque of a diesel destroying the auto box.
Add in possibly towing, poor servicing, and an aggressive driving style on top of that, and the odds of an auto seeing more than 60k on a front wheel drive diesel is, I would say, possibly reduced.
Some manufacturers are better than others of course, (Aisin Warner are exceptionally poor with plastic parts in the valve body) but imo, avoid a front wheel drive diesel auto, unless your prepared to do a great deal more research than asking on here in order to avoid a large bill for auto box repair.
Tread veeeeeery carefully, imo.
Heavy car, torquey engine, front wheel drive, auto box...... Bad idea, sadly. Although hopefully more modern autos have had the weaknesses engineered out by now. But how to know before buying?
good one Chris.. :y
but dont be hopeful, those diesels have a turbo heating upto 900-1000 degrees frequently, pressured air lines, intercooler, wastegate, related sensors and controllers.. which is not existent on a na car.. and personally I wouldnt bet when they will fail ;D
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
ok.. I said 2 things..
1 - I dont like diesels and autos or combination
2 - manuals consume less and accelerate faster.. statistically true and widely accepted fact..
any exception of automated manuals or rocket science trannies with XXXX gears wont change the fact
and this truth dont belong to me.. its universal..
Ok, God has spoken, no use arguing. You will only get a headache. Which is often what I get when I read God's posts. ::)
ok.. go buy one auto diesel and share your experience later :)
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(http://images.yuku.com/image/gif/a5126f21c888e21dd7b04899176dd385728b07af_r.gif)
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
ok.. I said 2 things..
1 - I dont like diesels and autos or combination
2 - manuals consume less and accelerate faster.. statistically true and widely accepted fact..
any exception of automated manuals or rocket science trannies with XXXX gears wont change the fact
and this truth dont belong to me.. its universal..
Ok, God has spoken, no use arguing. You will only get a headache. Which is often what I get when I read God's posts. ::)
ok.. go buy one auto diesel and share your experience later :)
I've had two diesel autos,both turbo,both have high milage and both drive beautifully,probably two of the best cars I've owned and there have been many.
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http://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/15673/do-modern-turbo-diesel-car-engines-fail-significantly-more-often-than-gasoline-o
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2175879/The-great-diesel-exposed-Its-time-ditched-inferior-vehicles.html
no need to comment more..
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I knew it. Daily fail reader! ;D
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I knew it. Daily fail reader! ;D
believe me I'm fed up cleaning diesel particles from my hood and roof periodically.. dirty tractors..
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My beliefs have nothing at all to do with anything the Daily Fail, or Cem, says :y
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
ok.. I said 2 things..
1 - I dont like diesels and autos or combination
2 - manuals consume less and accelerate faster.. statistically true and widely accepted fact..
any exception of automated manuals or rocket science trannies with XXXX gears wont change the fact
and this truth dont belong to me.. its universal..
Ok, God has spoken, no use arguing. You will only get a headache. Which is often what I get when I read God's posts. ::)
ok.. go buy one auto diesel and share your experience later :)
Well what can I say? A pleasure to drive, no problems in the daily commute, having to keep your foot on the third pedal, quick kickdown or manual using the flappy controls giving all the advantage of a manual with the convenience of an auto.
You even drive with spirit if you want, unless you race or rally then why would you drive a manual? the world is progressing........... :y :y
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but dont be hopeful, those diesels have a turbo heating upto 900-1000 degrees frequently, pressured air lines, intercooler, wastegate, related sensors and controllers.. which is not existent on a na car.. and personally I wouldnt bet when they will fail ;D
Well they don't on a diesel though CEM, the exhaust temperatures are much lower than petrol engines (you have to work hard to get them up to 500-600 degrees to regen DPF's.
Of course no waste gates either and the only other sensor is a manifold pressure sensor which is pretty bomb proof (might want cleaning every 50K miles).
I should add we have an Insignia diesel Auto and a few others including an A4 2.0 diesel auto here at work. I am no fan of the Insignia as it has a few to many fundamental design issues (particularly the hatch back) but the Insignia knocks spots off the A4 and is pretty smooth to drive (but annoying when you use it in semi auto and it comes up with 'shift denied' because the resulting engine revs will be below 1500rpm)
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The Eclass box is a bit like that... you have to physically force it to change up into top below 45 mph, and it doesn't always stick...
Kills the economy, but guess it's related to the Torque Convertor limitations :-\
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Must admit I sometimes find myself thinking I should have got the auto Ranger rather than the manual; on paper it's only ~1mpg difference and I spend most of my life in traffic.
Then again, it's not a bad gearbox and it's much easier to drive like a lunatic with the manual box :-[
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but dont be hopeful, those diesels have a turbo heating upto 900-1000 degrees frequently, pressured air lines, intercooler, wastegate, related sensors and controllers.. which is not existent on a na car.. and personally I wouldnt bet when they will fail ;D
Well they don't on a diesel though CEM, the exhaust temperatures are much lower than petrol engines (you have to work hard to get them up to 500-600 degrees to regen DPF's.
Of course no waste gates either and the only other sensor is a manifold pressure sensor which is pretty bomb proof (might want cleaning every 50K miles).
I should add we have an Insignia diesel Auto and a few others including an A4 2.0 diesel auto here at work. I am no fan of the Insignia as it has a few to many fundamental design issues (particularly the hatch back) but the Insignia knocks spots off the A4 and is pretty smooth to drive (but annoying when you use it in semi auto and it comes up with 'shift denied' because the resulting engine revs will be below 1500rpm)
you forgot the turbo and intercooler ::)
by the way my egt quickly reaches 500 celcius in fifth gear without turbo kicking if I touch the accelerator a "bit" .. and thats with an equal length ex.manifold.. most diesels have log type which rockets the egt..
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http://www.bankspower.com/techarticles/show/25-why-egt-is-important
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http://www.bankspower.com/techarticles/show/25-why-egt-is-important
So far, we've been talking about peak sustained EGTs at full power or under a heavy load, and certainly EGT needs to be kept within limits for engine and turbocharger reliability. At all other times, the EGT of a turbo-diesel will be lower, usually below 1000º F., and sometimes much lower. Such low EGTs pose no threat. In fact, the lower the EGT for a given speed and load, the more efficiently the engine is running.
:y
That's the key, if it was always around the 500 deg C mark (circa 100 deg F) then DPF's would be simple affairs and permanently regenerating :y (oh we wish lol)
Its interesting watching the EGT on my unit, it rarely gets much about 300 deg C
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http://www.bankspower.com/techarticles/show/25-why-egt-is-important (http://www.bankspower.com/techarticles/show/25-why-egt-is-important)
So far, we've been talking about peak sustained EGTs at full power or under a heavy load, and certainly EGT needs to be kept within limits for engine and turbocharger reliability. At all other times, the EGT of a turbo-diesel will be lower, usually below 1000º F., and sometimes much lower. Such low EGTs pose no threat. In fact, the lower the EGT for a given speed and load, the more efficiently the engine is running.
:y
That's the key, if it was always around the 500 deg C mark (circa 100 deg F) then DPF's would be simple affairs and permanently regenerating :y (oh we wish lol)
Its interesting watching the EGT on my unit, it rarely gets much about 300 deg C
::) you are not trying..
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See, cem. When TB says things like that there's usually some substance behind it. Like on petrol face lift pre cats. ;D
But as we know, the diseasels clearly don't get as wram as patrols. Hence the webasto pre heater in the 2.2 Dti omega to heat the cabin as there isn't enough heat in the engine coolant for about 20mins. Long enough for most people to get to work with no heat at all without one.
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See, cem. When TB says things like that there's usually some substance behind it. Like on petrol face lift pre cats. ;D
But as we know, the diseasels clearly don't get as wram as patrols. Hence the webasto pre heater in the 2.2 Dti omega to heat the cabin as there isn't enough heat in the engine coolant for about 20mins. Long enough for most people to get to work with no heat at all without one.
if there is a turbo, 20 minutues for me is more than enough to burn the car ;D
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See, cem. When TB says things like that there's usually some substance behind it. Like on petrol face lift pre cats. ;D
But as we know, the diseasels clearly don't get as wram as patrols. Hence the webasto pre heater in the 2.2 Dti omega to heat the cabin as there isn't enough heat in the engine coolant for about 20mins. Long enough for most people to get to work with no heat at all without one.
if there is a turbo, 20 minutues for me is more than enough to burn the car ;D
*News flash*
This thread.... NOT for cem. It's for the op.
Fail to see the relevance of cem playing with petrol turbos on a clit to a thread on diesel autos.
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(http://images.yuku.com/image/gif/a5126f21c888e21dd7b04899176dd385728b07af_r.gif)
This is my favourite emoticon. It says it all without saying anything. ;D ;D :y
This post has no relevance to the OP but hey ho, neither do half of the others in front of it. ::) ::)
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
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::) ;D
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
:y :y :y
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
:y :y :y
I was always taught not to 'supercharge' a battery.
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
:y :y :y
I was always taught not to 'supercharge' a battery.
Wrong thread? ::)
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Wrong account ? ;D
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
auto .............yuk...
diesel .... double yuk :D
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
auto .............yuk...
diesel .... double yuk :D
It's not a quality thing cem, it's an issue of reliability.
If it where a quality issue, then clearly you have it completely arse backwards, as usual ;D
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....
auto .............yuk...
diesel .... double yuk :D
I kinda agree with you ....... but only on one part if it. But needs must, hence my auto diseasal ;) because you can't get three pedals in a R Class :y
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Cem has spoken. Everyone else is wrong FAKT!
ok.. I said 2 things..
1 - I dont like diesels and autos or combination
2 - manuals consume less and accelerate faster.. statistically true and widely accepted fact..
any exception of automated manuals or rocket science trannies with XXXX gears wont change the fact
and this truth dont belong to me.. its universal..
Ok, God has spoken, no use arguing. You will only get a headache. Which is often what I get when I read God's posts. ::)
ok.. go buy one auto diesel and share your experience later :)
I did, for the second time and it's a great car, I am happy with my choice, thank you........... :y :y
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
auto .............yuk...
diesel .... double yuk :D
It's not a quality thing cem, it's an issue of reliability.
If it where a quality issue, then clearly you have it completely arse backwards, as usual ;D
reliabity together with auto and diesel.. bollirx .. no.. double bollirx as usual :D
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
auto .............yuk...
diesel .... double yuk :D
It's not a quality thing cem, it's an issue of reliability.
If it where a quality issue, then clearly you have it completely arse backwards, as usual ;D
reliabity together with auto and diesel.. bollirx .. no.. double bollirx as usual :D
I don't know what you have in your country, but in the UK I find diesel and auto, perfectly acceptable and am on my second; OK the first was a Citroen 45K miles without a hitch, now with a Honda 52K no problem............. :y :y
You may disagree but please do not TELL me what I should drive.......... :y :y
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I can't believe anyone is disagreeing with Cem. He is the Oracle!
Maybe, but he fails to understand the concept that Auto is better than a Manual, even in a modern diesel................ :D :D ;) :-X
auto .............yuk...
diesel .... double yuk :D
It's not a quality thing cem, it's an issue of reliability.
If it where a quality issue, then clearly you have it completely arse backwards, as usual ;D
reliabity together with auto and diesel.. bollirx .. no.. double bollirx as usual :D
I don't know what you have in your country, but in the UK I find diesel and auto, perfectly acceptable and am on my second; OK the first was a Citroen 45K miles without a hitch, now with a Honda 52K no problem............. :y :y
You may disagree but please do not TELL me what I should drive.......... :y :y
the question is : really where in my posts have you seen that I tell you or someone what to drive ?
all of them reflect my personal opinions.. but I see for some (not you) its a chance to criticise which I dont care..
by the way , to say my last word about that subject diesels are expensive to buy from the beginning.. complicated parts and labor also more expensive.. and from engineering point of view if you complicate a device (car or whatever) you increase the chance of it failing.. same is valid for auto.. that simple..
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Just google auto problems with Ford Focus diesel Auto.
Some friends thought Good car, diesel that will be economical and auto will be nice in heavy traffic. Didn't take long for the known fault to occur that left them with a repair bill of more thann the car was worth!! Well done Ford.
Going back to the OP, I still think it a good punt.
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....
auto .............yuk...
diesel .... double yuk :D
I kinda agree with you ....... but only on one part if it. But needs must, hence my auto diseasal ;) because you can't get three pedals in a R Class :y
But that's a merc Andy.....Ive owned a couple of merc diesel auto's that ive used for a cab.....before selling them on....both were nearly at 200k, with no engine/gearbox problems during that time :y
But don't buy a merc diesel manual....your asking for trouble ;)
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This was taken a couple of years ago and it's still going strong. A family friends bmw diesel auto with a fair few miles on the clock. :y
(http://i894.photobucket.com/albums/ac142/Alan-Hearn/bf0f7111-475e-4d49-8a2a-0bd4b839fa9a_zps16ed7beb.jpg) (http://s894.photobucket.com/user/Alan-Hearn/media/bf0f7111-475e-4d49-8a2a-0bd4b839fa9a_zps16ed7beb.jpg.html)
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
;D
It's a hard driven 730d as well. :y
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
;D
It's a hard driven 730d as well. :y
My brother mentioned yesterday that he recently received a promotional offer from a BMW dealer he had test driven a second hand 730 at last year... A brand new 730LD for £39,995 :o
I doubt the boot is upto estate standards though :-\
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
;D
It's a hard driven 730d as well. :y
My Touareg shows a 700 mile range when the tank is full,big tank though :y
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
;D
It's a hard driven 730d as well. :y
My Touareg shows a 700 mile range when the tank is full,big tank though :y
So does the E class, until I pull away ::) it does have the optional larger tank though...
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
;D
It's a hard driven 730d as well. :y
My Touareg shows a 700 mile range when the tank is full,big tank though :y
So does the E class, until I pull away ::) it does have the optional larger tank though...
Think mines around 100lt,like a well being filled. :'(
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
;D
It's a hard driven 730d as well. :y
My Touareg shows a 700 mile range when the tank is full,big tank though :y
So does the E class, until I pull away ::) it does have the optional larger tank though...
Think mines around 100lt,like a well being filled. :'(
I think mine's only 80 litres and it rarely does a tank full at a steady motorway plod unless there's a tin shed on the back, in which case it does around 23/24 mpg
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Look at the range on that bastid. :o
;D
It's a hard driven 730d as well. :y
My Touareg shows a 700 mile range when the tank is full,big tank though :y
My 430d has a tank capacity of 57 litres. As I've said before, it will get me to my usual holiday place in Cornwall (286 miles) or the Lake District (also 286 miles) using just over a quarter of a tank of diesel. :y
If I travel at night and I *press on* it drops to low forties. :-X Seeing a range of 700 not unreal on a run these days. :y
* 70mph on all roads where permitted. ;)
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This was taken a couple of years ago and it's still going strong. A family friends bmw diesel auto with a fair few miles on the clock. :y
(http://i894.photobucket.com/albums/ac142/Alan-Hearn/bf0f7111-475e-4d49-8a2a-0bd4b839fa9a_zps16ed7beb.jpg) (http://s894.photobucket.com/user/Alan-Hearn/media/bf0f7111-475e-4d49-8a2a-0bd4b839fa9a_zps16ed7beb.jpg.html)
how much is a brand new 730d ? ::)
I bet its worth more than the online members cars sum at a busy time ;D ;D ;D
and how much is the insurance cost alone ?
and how much is the cost of repair on that auto alone when it goes bang ?
and as for reliability just google 730d problems ;D ;D ;D ;D
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how much is a brand new 730d ? ::)
I bet its worth more than the online members cars sum at a busy time ;D ;D ;D
and how much is the insurance cost alone ?
and how much is the cost of repair on that auto alone when it goes bang ?
and as for reliability just google 730d problems ;D ;D ;D ;D
Indeed. So, in summary, diseasel autos are fantastic as long as you buy a £50k car. ;D
Alternatively, you can spend a few % of that sum on a V6 Petrol Omega. Admittedly, you'll have higher fuel costs unless you LPG it, but what's left of your savings won't be depreciating uncontrollably.
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Anyone driven one of these , ok so we all know its not the best looking car but it looks better in this white . Auto diesel , any problematic things to be a concern :-\
I believe the original question was as above, to which many have given their opinion, based on actual ownership. :y
I didn't realise that there was a price limit where diesel auto's become good or bad. :-\