Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Webby the Bear on 18 October 2011, 20:17:17
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hi guys,
got in to an interesting discussion at work today with a friend.
the auto vs manual debate came up and we chatted about the advantages and disadvantages of each.
he then made a comment that automatics, although very easy to drive, can promote bad driving habits e.g. just lazing back driving one handed. i then said if thats true then aren't manuals dangerous bearing in mind you're taking your hand off the wheel a lot to change gear.
we then talked about a guy we went on a trip with who cruised up to a roundabout in 4th. foot on clutch to ''coast'' to the roundabout entrance. saw that it was clear, got on the roundabout, forgot to change gear and only noticed when he applied the accelerator. he then had to quickly shift from 4th to 2nd whilst steering round the round about 1 handed. it definitely felt unsafe.
your thoughts please.
ps, dont want to turn this in to a squabbling fest. just a discussion :y
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I discovered that autos create more danger if you are an impatient driver and take over frequently..
under those conditions autos response are slow and sometimes cause danger..
but a normal driver probably wont face it..
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imo they are only as dangerous as the driver input
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I discovered that autos create more danger if you are an impatient driver and take over frequently..
under those conditions autos response are slow and sometimes cause danger..
but a normal driver probably wont face it..
not with sports mode engaged ;D
but to be fair thats a slightly different thang. i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
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I don't think auto's or manual's are more dangerous than the other.. its the driver that allows him or herself to drop basic driving skills and put either themselves or others in danger.
I enjoy manual driving as I feel that is what driving is about, BUT I've had a few autos' (always Omega's) and love them just as much. It really depends on what sort of driving experience you want or prefer.
They are both as good or as bad as you want them to be :y
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I don't think auto's or manual's are more dangerous than the other.. its the driver that allows him or herself to drop basic driving skills and put either themselves or others in danger.
I enjoy manual driving as I feel that is what driving is about, BUT I've had a few autos' (always Omega's) and love them just as much. It really depends on what sort of driving experience you want or prefer.
They are both as good or as bad as you want them to be :y
very true mate very true.
however with an auto you can keep two hands on't wheel at all time........
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Well designed, well maintained cars aren't dangerous. Its the organic prick in the driving seat....
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Well designed, well maintained cars aren't dangerous. Its the organic prick in the driving seat....
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Its the organic prick in the driving seat....
Don't sit on the fence ;D
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Replace the airbag with a 9 inch surgical steel spike. That should waken folks up behind the wheel, irrespective of manual or auto!
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i'd be interested to see stats on crashes of auto cars vs manual ones. relative to the amount of manual / auto cars on the road of course
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well stats state that most crashes are from the under 25's and most under 25's want a manual car so by the stats more crashes per manual than auto
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well stats state that most crashes are from the under 25's and most under 25's want a manual car so by the stats more crashes per manual than auto
thats normal.. but if you try to drive an auto car like a manual thats more dangerous and stats dont tell this ;D
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well stats state that most crashes are from the under 25's and most under 25's want a manual car so by the stats more crashes per manual than auto
so in typical jeremy clarkson style..........
we have proved that manual cars are dangerous and you should purchase an auto! :y
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I discovered that autos create more danger if you are an impatient driver and take over frequently..
under those conditions autos response are slow and sometimes cause danger..
but a normal driver probably wont face it..
not with sports mode engaged ;D
but to be fair thats a slightly different thang. i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
even with sports mode, been there done that.. depending on your speed, autobox locks up after some silly speed.. >:(
its like accelerating with the half clutch.. :(
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well stats state that most crashes are from the under 25's and most under 25's want a manual car so by the stats more crashes per manual than auto
so in typical jeremy clarkson style..........
we have proved that manual cars are dangerous and you should purchase an auto! :y
to drive like miss daisy ;D
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im 42 and prefer manual no accidents though
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
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Personally it's auto all the way for me, but I prefer the control of a manual ::)
I tend to use my auto box like a manual when it comes to going down the gears anyway, although it still decides if it wants to give you the gear you want ::)
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well stats state that most crashes are from the under 25's and most under 25's want a manual car so by the stats more crashes per manual than auto
so in typical jeremy clarkson style..........
we have proved that manual cars are dangerous and you should purchase an auto! :y
to drive like miss daisy ;D
haha autos aint that slow ::)
besides the manual box will be gone in the not too distant future. semi auto will take over imo :y
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well stats state that most crashes are from the under 25's and most under 25's want a manual car so by the stats more crashes per manual than auto
so in typical jeremy clarkson style..........
we have proved that manual cars are dangerous and you should purchase an auto! :y
to drive like miss daisy ;D
haha autos aint that slow ::)
besides the manual box will be gone in the not too distant future. semi auto will take over imo :y
Lets hope not, worse of both options rolled into one
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
But the auto doesn't give the same degree of engine braking unless you force it ;)
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
Not if driven properly whilst negotiating obstacles.
Having a solid connection between engine and driven wheels will always be safer than having a fluid coupling in between, for those days when power will get you out of harms way.
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
You are not in control of the vehicle doing that....... ::) ::) ::)
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try them both on a track where your speed drops and increases several times.. you will see the timing difference..
anyway its an 8 bit chip..
but if we were talking on a smg box, debate would be interesting.. those boxes have launch option which you can hardly control like it.. but I would still prefer manual
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
Not if driven properly whilst negotiating obstacles.
Having a solid connection between engine and driven wheels will always be safer than having a fluid coupling in between, for those days when power will get you out of harms way.
but then should crappy slow little euro boxes like kia picanto's be banned then? e.g. a manual kia picanto (1 litre or whatever they are) vs my auto omega. irrespective of whether he was in the right gear or not i'd put money on my mig out performing that in every way whether going round a bend, up a hill or standing start.............
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
You are not in control of the vehicle doing that....... ::) ::) ::)
thats my point vamps..... you cant do this in an auto :y
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
Not if driven properly whilst negotiating obstacles.
Having a solid connection between engine and driven wheels will always be safer than having a fluid coupling in between, for those days when power will get you out of harms way.
but then should crappy slow little euro boxes like kia picanto's be banned then? e.g. a manual kia picanto (1 litre or whatever they are) vs my auto omega. irrespective of whether he was in the right gear or not i'd put money on my mig out performing that in every way whether going round a bend, up a hill or standing start.............
WTF?
Now you are comparing cheap, economical, budget runarounds with a 30 grand executive 200bhp saloon :-X
For the record, around town, I'd put my Rover 25 (manual) up against your Omega (auto) and probably embarrass you ;)
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
You are not in control of the vehicle doing that....... ::) ::) ::)
thats my point vamps..... you cant do this in an auto :y
/panto mode
Oh yes you can.
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sure you can carefully select N
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
You are not in control of the vehicle doing that....... ::) ::) ::)
thats my point vamps..... you cant do this in an auto :y
:y :y So always in control as in the right gear for anything in an auto...... :y
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:y :y So always in control as in the right gear for anything in an auto...... :y
One of the issues with autos just rammed in D is it cannot predict what you haven't started to do. Thus us has a rather nasty habit of dropping a peg or 2 mid corner, which can be far from ideal if traction isn't there.
A manual's ECU in this scenario knows what you were planning, thus ensures suitable cog already selected ;)
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If you find yourself trying to change gear while manoeuvring it's time to hang up your keys and resort to public transport. ;)
In a manual, driven properly, you should always be in a sensible gear for your speed with drive engaged before manoeuvring, so the gearbox is not a distraction, which is more than an auto manages sometimes.
Even if you get caught out, a manual can be slipped into the correct gear quicker than an auto will pick up, if competently driven. The driver will also know, when he buries his right foot, whether he'll get 1st, 2nd or 3rd gear, which can be useful, at times. :-X
Autos are great for piddling about in traffic and commuting but the more I drive my auto (and it's almost 100% of my driving currently), the more I appreciate the few occasions when I get back into a manual car. :-\
..and as for cruising in neutral, that's exactly what every auto does when you take your foot off the loud pedal. No engine braking whatsoever.
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
Not if driven properly whilst negotiating obstacles.
Having a solid connection between engine and driven wheels will always be safer than having a fluid coupling in between, for those days when power will get you out of harms way.
but then should crappy slow little euro boxes like kia picanto's be banned then? e.g. a manual kia picanto (1 litre or whatever they are) vs my auto omega. irrespective of whether he was in the right gear or not i'd put money on my mig out performing that in every way whether going round a bend, up a hill or standing start.............
WTF?
Now you are comparing cheap, economical, budget runarounds with a 30 grand executive 200bhp saloon :-X
For the record, around town, I'd put my Rover 25 (manual) up against your Omega (auto) and probably embarrass you ;)
yes. you're saying that in manual cars you have more control because you can dictate the acceleration better. yet (in the kia example) my auto would wee on the manual because its a small engined car. so, as you've deemed my auto to be less safe than your manual rover (due to the aforementioned better acceleration for those times when you need immediate power), do you think the little kia should be banned because it's less safer than my omega and much less safer than your rover. :)
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i just specifically meant the one handed driving example :y
Drive a manual properly, and you'll have both hands on the wheel during a manouver.
As to cruising, I bet as many manual owners do this as auto owners.
Though a manual gives ultimate control, and control=safety
i disagree. yes, driving it properly should give you full control but of course being human we are prone to human error however good a driver we are. and of course with the manual, yes you can get speed exactly as you want it but not two hands on the wheel all the time. swings and roundabouts.
sorry, dont understand the second bit. obviously auto is go and stop so no cruising in neutral as is poss with manual :-\ :)
You are not in control of the vehicle doing that....... ::) ::) ::)
thats my point vamps..... you cant do this in an auto :y
/panto mode
Oh yes you can.
sorry, i meant you can't do this when in drive :)
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you sure about your last paragraph kev? When I go down birdlip hill, i seem to get quite a bit of engine braking in my auto. Especially if i hit sport mode? :y
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yes. you're saying that in manual cars you have more control because you can dictate the acceleration better. yet (in the kia example) my auto would wee on the manual because its a small engined car. so, as you've deemed my auto to be less safe than your manual rover (due to the aforementioned better acceleration for those times when you need immediate power), do you think the little kia should be banned because it's less safer than my omega and much less safer than your rover. :)
As I said in my original post on this thread, its not the gearbox or the engine thats unsafe, its the tit in holding the wheel.
You query was is an auto safer than a manual. Its reasonable to assume that your were comparing like with like - there is a tank driving experience place around the corner here, no ideal what sort of gearbox they have, but can assure you it will be a safer drive than any Omega ;)
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sorry, i meant you can't do this when in drive :)
A manual can't coast if the driver leaves it in gear with the clutch out ;)
See, its the driver, not the gearbox.
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yes. you're saying that in manual cars you have more control because you can dictate the acceleration better. yet (in the kia example) my auto would wee on the manual because its a small engined car. so, as you've deemed my auto to be less safe than your manual rover (due to the aforementioned better acceleration for those times when you need immediate power), do you think the little kia should be banned because it's less safer than my omega and much less safer than your rover. :)
As I said in my original post on this thread, its not the gearbox or the engine thats unsafe, its the tit in holding the wheel.
You query was is an auto safer than a manual. Its reasonable to assume that your were comparing like with like - there is a tank driving experience place around the corner here, no ideal what sort of gearbox they have, but can assure you it will be a safer drive than any Omega ;)
my son will disagree on taking his lessons in a tank he hit a tree and broke his nose ;D
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you sure about your last paragraph kev? When I go down birdlip hill, i seem to get quite a bit of engine braking in my auto. Especially if i hit sport mode? :y
Downhill, an auto will lock TC.
On the flat, at lower than cruise speeds it won't.
And you can never quite be sure when it will lock and unlock it - when the manual's ECU is organic, you know exactly when it is going to do it. Assuming you don't have pencils up your nose, and underpants on head. Wibble.
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yes. you're saying that in manual cars you have more control because you can dictate the acceleration better. yet (in the kia example) my auto would wee on the manual because its a small engined car. so, as you've deemed my auto to be less safe than your manual rover (due to the aforementioned better acceleration for those times when you need immediate power), do you think the little kia should be banned because it's less safer than my omega and much less safer than your rover. :)
As I said in my original post on this thread, its not the gearbox or the engine thats unsafe, its the tit in holding the wheel.
You query was is an auto safer than a manual. Its reasonable to assume that your were comparing like with like - there is a tank driving experience place around the corner here, no ideal what sort of gearbox they have, but can assure you it will be a safer drive than any Omega ;)
very true :) we'll leave ith there :y
just out of interest though, coming back to comments re engine braking. what exactly does that mean? i've always wondered what happens to the gearbox under brealing? does it go in to neutral so in effect coasts? :-\ :)
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yes. you're saying that in manual cars you have more control because you can dictate the acceleration better. yet (in the kia example) my auto would wee on the manual because its a small engined car. so, as you've deemed my auto to be less safe than your manual rover (due to the aforementioned better acceleration for those times when you need immediate power), do you think the little kia should be banned because it's less safer than my omega and much less safer than your rover. :)
As I said in my original post on this thread, its not the gearbox or the engine thats unsafe, its the tit in holding the wheel.
You query was is an auto safer than a manual. Its reasonable to assume that your were comparing like with like - there is a tank driving experience place around the corner here, no ideal what sort of gearbox they have, but can assure you it will be a safer drive than any Omega ;)
my son will disagree on taking his lessons in a tank he hit a tree and broke his nose ;D
Had he done the same in Webby's auto Omega, he'd be far worse off after snogging an airbag ;)
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i've always wondered what happens to the gearbox under brealing? does it go in to neutral so in effect coasts? :-\ :)
Depends on the inputs into the ecu. On the flat, approaching a roundabout (one of your previous 'pros' for autos), it will be coasting with the engine 'mostly' disconnected from the wheels.
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yes. you're saying that in manual cars you have more control because you can dictate the acceleration better. yet (in the kia example) my auto would wee on the manual because its a small engined car. so, as you've deemed my auto to be less safe than your manual rover (due to the aforementioned better acceleration for those times when you need immediate power), do you think the little kia should be banned because it's less safer than my omega and much less safer than your rover. :)
As I said in my original post on this thread, its not the gearbox or the engine thats unsafe, its the tit in holding the wheel.
You query was is an auto safer than a manual. Its reasonable to assume that your were comparing like with like - there is a tank driving experience place around the corner here, no ideal what sort of gearbox they have, but can assure you it will be a safer drive than any Omega ;)
my son will disagree on taking his lessons in a tank he hit a tree and broke his nose ;D
Had he done the same in Webby's auto Omega, he'd be far worse off after snogging an airbag ;)
lol. i actually wrote off my astra in 2003. got to say hitting the airbag was quite a comfortable experience. although i dont think ill ever forget the smell (from the airbag, not my pants) :-[
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.... When I go down birdlip hill, .....
Ah! Birdlip Hill. I used to go up & down that hill going to & from Pompey. Many many moons ago, road markings allowed the middle lane to used to go up or down the hill. I saw the results of quite a few accidents. It was also a test of any work carried out on my Cortina that week end, if I was lucky I might still be doing 30 mph at the top of the hill - in 2nd gear. ;D ;D ;D
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lol. i actually wrote off my astra in 2003. got to say hitting the airbag was quite a comfortable experience. although i dont think ill ever forget the smell (from the airbag, not my pants) :-[
Airbags weren't fitted to 99% of cars when I last had a head-on. Eating a steering wheel isn't a comfortable experience. Smarts a bit, if I'm honest.....
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.... When I go down birdlip hill, .....
Ah! Birdlip Hill. I used to go up & down that hill going to & from Pompey. Many many moons ago, road markings allowed the middle lane to used to go up or down the hill. I saw the results of quite a few accidents. It was also a test of any work carried out on my Cortina that week end, if I was lucky I might still be doing 30 mph at the top of the hill - in 2nd gear. ;D ;D ;D
Struggle to do 30mph by the top nowadays - too many retards driving like, errr, retards.
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lol. i actually wrote off my astra in 2003. got to say hitting the airbag was quite a comfortable experience. although i dont think ill ever forget the smell (from the airbag, not my pants) :-[
Airbags weren't fitted to 99% of cars when I last had a head-on. Eating a steering wheel isn't a comfortable experience. Smarts a bit, if I'm honest.....
bit like eating a mcdonalds then ;D
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.....
..and as for cruising in neutral, that's exactly what every auto does when you take your foot off the loud pedal. No engine braking whatsoever.
Errr!? 'dangle berries'. ;)
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lol. i actually wrote off my astra in 2003. got to say hitting the airbag was quite a comfortable experience. although i dont think ill ever forget the smell (from the airbag, not my pants) :-[
Airbags weren't fitted to 99% of cars when I last had a head-on. Eating a steering wheel isn't a comfortable experience. Smarts a bit, if I'm honest.....
bit like eating a mcdonalds then ;D
hahahaha here we go............
mcdonalds, although looks like its been kicked around (probably has) is yummy!!!!
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.....
Struggle to do 30mph by the top nowadays - too many retards driving like, errr, retards.
I used to travel back during the small hours. :y :y
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.....
..and as for cruising in neutral, that's exactly what every auto does when you take your foot off the loud pedal. No engine braking whatsoever.
Errr!? 'dangle berries'. ;)
The ECU, under most circumstances below cruising speed, completely unlocks the TC, leaving minimal engine braking (there is still a drag through the TC fluid).
Mini facelifts and the first of the facelifts, having the GS820 ECU is probably the best for engine braking, but still more often than not, TC is disconnected.
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.....
Struggle to do 30mph by the top nowadays - too many retards driving like, errr, retards.
I used to travel back during the small hours. :y :y
Maybe I'm getting old, but no matter what time I go up that slope, there is some prat doing it in 2nd, and not wanting to let the engine rev. And they are the ones overtaking >:( ;D
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.....
The ECU, under most circumstances below cruising speed, completely unlocks the TC, leaving minimal engine braking (there is still a drag through the TC fluid).
Mini facelifts and the first of the facelifts, having the GS820 ECU is probably the best for engine braking, but still more often than not, TC is disconnected.
I agree there's little engine braking ......... but little isn't 'no engine braking whatsoever' ;) ;) gear box will change down one itself too to help compensate :y
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.....
The ECU, under most circumstances below cruising speed, completely unlocks the TC, leaving minimal engine braking (there is still a drag through the TC fluid).
Mini facelifts and the first of the facelifts, having the GS820 ECU is probably the best for engine braking, but still more often than not, TC is disconnected.
I agree there's little engine braking ......... but little isn't 'no engine braking whatsoever' ;) ;) gear box will change down one itself too to help compensate :y
Its as near as makes no difference as no engine braking - see the difference when coasting to a halt from 50mph when you slip it in neutral.
As said, IIRC, yours is a 99 model, GS820 ECU, if it has the latest firmware, thats about the best map for any Omega.
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As said, IIRC, yours is a 99 model, GS820 ECU, if it has the latest firmware, thats about the best map for any Omega.
It is ............... and it has. :y (upgraded before OOF ;))
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.....
The ECU, under most circumstances below cruising speed, completely unlocks the TC, leaving minimal engine braking (there is still a drag through the TC fluid).
Mini facelifts and the first of the facelifts, having the GS820 ECU is probably the best for engine braking, but still more often than not, TC is disconnected.
I agree there's little engine braking ......... but little isn't 'no engine braking whatsoever' ;) ;) gear box will change down one itself too to help compensate :y
Its as near as makes no difference as no engine braking - see the difference when coasting to a halt from 50mph when you slip it in neutral.
As said, IIRC, yours is a 99 model, GS820 ECU, if it has the latest firmware, thats about the best map for any Omega.
Have I missed something, engine braking is or can be as good as manual by manually overriding the auto, an example might be for a steep decent....for spirited driving put it in 3rd sport and enjoy on any country road :) :)
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you sure about your last paragraph kev? When I go down birdlip hill, i seem to get quite a bit of engine braking in my auto. Especially if i hit sport mode? :y
I'm guessing that'll be at higher speeds than I was thinking about. At manoeuvring speeds around bends, roundabouts, etc. there is next to none because the revs are too low for any coupling through the torque converter and the road speed too low for torque converter lockup.
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If God had wanted us to drive a manual, he would have given us three arms and three legs ::)
Seriously though, only an idiot drives with one hand on the steering wheel, except, of course, when changing gear.
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If God had wanted us to drive a manual, he would have given us three arms and three legs ::)
Seriously though, only an idiot drives with one hand on the steering wheel, except, of course, when changing gear.
Or.. In this day and age, making a phone call, sending a text message, changing a CD, preening themselves in the rear-view mirror... ::)
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If God had wanted us to drive a manual, he would have given us three arms and three legs ::)
Seriously though, only an idiot drives with one hand on the steering wheel, except, of course, when changing gear.
Or.. In this day and age, making a phone call, sending a text message, changing a CD, preening themselves in the rear-view mirror... ::)
agreed! ::)
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If God had wanted us to drive a manual, he would have given us three arms and three legs ::)
Seriously though, only an idiot drives with one hand on the steering wheel, except, of course, when changing gear.
Or.. In this day and age, making a phone call, sending a text message, changing a CD, preening themselves in the rear-view mirror... ::)
Or, for customer's using the local BP, drinking their coffee and stuffing their bagel that took so long for the retarded till staff to prepare, whilst trying to join a busy dual carriageway.
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In fact, all these retarded petrol stations selling coffee and other pointless wank, they should be forced to police that said drinks/snacks are consumed before the retarded driver is allowed to leave the building.
Smoking whilst driving is another pet hate that should be banned
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If God had wanted us to drive a manual, he would have given us three arms and three legs ::)
Seriously though, only an idiot drives with one hand on the steering wheel, except, of course, when changing gear.
Or.. In this day and age, making a phone call, sending a text message, changing a CD, preening themselves in the rear-view mirror... ::)
Or, for customer's using the local BP, drinking their coffee and stuffing their bagel that took so long for the retarded till staff to prepare, whilst trying to join a busy dual carriageway.
EWW! The staff must have significantly better personal hygiene than at my local BP if people actually eat stuff they prepare! :o
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Smoking whilst driving is another pet hate that should be banned
(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRItO2a30qGMfsuOpXgblL21kyn2xb_J0vPOiSsIOAwQIDxka8icw) ::)
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Have I missed anything or do I need to go back and read what I have missed since last night?
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::)......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::)......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
Right, so you are an idiot, I can live with that...... :D :D :D
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::)......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
Right, so you are an idiot, I can live with that...... :D :D :D
I must be an idiot too ::) ::)
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::)......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
Right, so you are an idiot, I can live with that...... :D :D :D
I must be an idiot too ::) ::)
Are you expecting me to be surprised by that?...... :D :D :D
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::)......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
Right, so you are an idiot, I can live with that...... :D :D :D
Ive lived with it for over 50 years.Hasnt done me any harm ;) :P ;D
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::)......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
Right, so you are an idiot, I can live with that...... :D :D :D
Ive lived with it for over 50 years.Hasnt done me any harm ;) :P ;D
Exactly........ :y :y :y
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Are you expecting me to be surprised by that?...... :D :D :D
:P :P :P :P ;)
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Are you expecting me to be surprised by that?...... :D :D :D
:P :P :P :P ;)
Didn't think you partook in the demon weed??
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No car that is roadworthy is unsafe, the unsafe bit is the person behind the wheel. Another thing is, to the OP, the driver who coasted up to the roundabout was unsafe, not the car. You should already be in the right gear when coming up to any corner in a manual. Some autos I find unsafe to be honest, the thing is with an Auto it decides what gear it wants to be in, but the auto can't see the cars coming at a roundabout so if it decides it wants to be in second and you want to come out of the roundabout fast, second is wrong.
My 7 series for example, Jags with the 6 speed auto suffer the same issue, unless you come to a complete stop it stays in second gear, now if you accelerate hard without stopping, it starts to drive in second at full power but it can't do it, so it thinks right you're asking for full power here, now I need to change into first, that second it takes to do that, a manual car would've been and gone.
In a manual any good driver should always be in the right gear and ready to go. Autos just cannot do that like you can in a manual, unless you change it manually which defeats the point of an auto. I find autos much nicer to drive and I wouldn't really want another manual car, unless I get something stupidly fast again. But in my opinion manuals are safer if you're any sort of half decent driver.
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Yeah, as Del and others have said - the only unsafe thing is the loose nut behind the wheel.. :)
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::) ......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
I'm curious how you shift with left hand ???
my left is very good for steering but dont think will shift quickly.. seems I cant drive there ;D
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i'd be interested to see stats on crashes of auto cars vs manual ones. relative to the amount of manual / auto cars on the road of course
Bound to be more auto crashes due to them being driven by the old and infirm ;D ;D ;) :y
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just back from outside lunch, on the road back I have given it some nuts.. god, I love this manual :) :) :)
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::) ......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
I'm curious how you shift with left hand ???
my left is very good for steering but dont think will shift quickly.. seems I cant drive there ;D
Its amazing how quick you adapt cem, when I travel to europe and get a hire car its a very quick learning curve.
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::) ......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
I'm curious how you shift with left hand ???
my left is very good for steering but dont think will shift quickly.. seems I cant drive there ;D
Its amazing how quick you adapt cem, when I travel to europe and get a hire car its a very quick learning curve.
I find that driving abroad the gearchange is picked up quickly but I still tend to look out of the window looking for the interior mirror :D ;D
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I'm curious how you shift with left hand ???
my left is very good for steering but dont think will shift quickly.. seems I cant drive there ;D
Its amazing how quick you adapt cem, when I travel to europe and get a hire car its a very quick learning curve.
Agreed. I find it's only when I get back home I have problems. ;D
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Although mine's an auto, I still prefer manual for complete control. I get hacked off with the auto box dropping down or going up a gear unecessarily due to a slight incline or decline in the road, particularly between 30 - 45mph. >:( No wonder petrol consumption is worse for auto's.
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Although mine's an auto, I still prefer manual for complete control. I get hacked off with the auto box dropping down or going up a gear unecessarily due to a slight incline or decline in the road, particularly between 30 - 45mph. >:( No wonder petrol consumption is worse for auto's.
That's more to do with the hideously lossy connection between engine & box - the big swirling mass of oil, rather than a nice directly coupled clutch ;)
I agree on the rest, though.. mine never seems to be in the gear I want it to be, and when I get off the throttle a bit of engine braking would be nice!
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Just that we have become very PC apparently. ::) ......and that Im a complete idiot. ;D
I have a habit of driving with just one hand on the wheel,when Im driving quite slowly.Not the best of habits granted,but doesnt really do any harm either imo,when ambling along at 30mph.Probably comes from having been a smoking driver for years (in the past),and years of driving manuals,which led to the habit of driving with left hand on the gearstick. :)
I'm curious how you shift with left hand ???
my left is very good for steering but dont think will shift quickly.. seems I cant drive there ;D
Its amazing how quick you adapt cem, when I travel to europe and get a hire car its a very quick learning curve.
driving in UK with Turkish habits .. ;D no thanks, not long after I'll be arrested ;D :-[ :y
at least those road signs and roundabouts will shoot me down ;D
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i'd be interested to see stats on crashes of auto cars vs manual ones. relative to the amount of manual / auto cars on the road of course
Bound to be more auto crashes due to them being driven by the old and infirm ;D ;D ;) :y
I've recovered lots of cars embedded in parked cars/walls/conservatories/road signs/gates etc, or off low walls and on one memorable occasion out of a swimming pool. All have 4 things in common: low speeds, OAP drivers, auto gearboxes and "I don't know what happened" statements.
Anyone who is confused enough not to back off the throttle when something 'unexpected' happens is unlikely to be managing a clutch and gearshift effectively, and will tend to stall the car.
This does not make either more dangerous, but autos increase the chances of operator error.
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i'd be interested to see stats on crashes of auto cars vs manual ones. relative to the amount of manual / auto cars on the road of course
Bound to be more auto crashes due to them being driven by the old and infirm ;D ;D ;) :y
I've recovered lots of cars embedded in parked cars/walls/conservatories/road signs/gates etc, or off low walls and on one memorable occasion out of a swimming pool. All have 4 things in common: low speeds, OAP drivers, auto gearboxes and "I don't know what happened" statements.
Anyone who is confused enough not to back off the throttle when something 'unexpected' happens is unlikely to be managing a clutch and gearshift effectively, and will tend to stall the car.
This does not make either more dangerous, but autos increase the chances of operator error.
At least with an auto there's a 50/50 chance of hitting the right pedal :D ;D
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I've recovered lots of cars embedded in parked cars/walls/conservatories/road signs/gates etc, or off low walls and on one memorable occasion out of a swimming pool. All have 4 things in common: low speeds, OAP drivers, auto gearboxes and "I don't know what happened" statements.
Anyone who is confused enough not to back off the throttle when something 'unexpected' happens is unlikely to be managing a clutch and gearshift effectively, and will tend to stall the car.
This does not make either more dangerous, but autos increase the chances of operator error.
At least with an auto there's a 50/50 chance of hitting the right pedal :D ;D[/quote]
When you've already floored the wrong pedal, and fear keeps it pinned there, that isn't going to help very much!
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I've recovered lots of cars embedded in parked cars/walls/conservatories/road signs/gates etc, or off low walls and on one memorable occasion out of a swimming pool. All have 4 things in common: low speeds, OAP drivers, auto gearboxes and "I don't know what happened" statements.
Anyone who is confused enough not to back off the throttle when something 'unexpected' happens is unlikely to be managing a clutch and gearshift effectively, and will tend to stall the car.
This does not make either more dangerous, but autos increase the chances of operator error.
At least with an auto there's a 50/50 chance of hitting the right pedal :D ;D
When you've already floored the wrong pedal, and fear keeps it pinned there, that isn't going to help very much!
[/quote]
.. and, at least, with a manual, if you're that infirm you're more likely to be travelling by bus. ;)
TBH, I think that if you lack the mental faculties to drive a manual, an auto isn't the answer. :-\
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I've recovered lots of cars embedded in parked cars/walls/conservatories/road signs/gates etc, or off low walls and on one memorable occasion out of a swimming pool. All have 4 things in common: low speeds, OAP drivers, auto gearboxes and "I don't know what happened" statements.
Anyone who is confused enough not to back off the throttle when something 'unexpected' happens is unlikely to be managing a clutch and gearshift effectively, and will tend to stall the car.
This does not make either more dangerous, but autos increase the chances of operator error.
At least with an auto there's a 50/50 chance of hitting the right pedal :D ;D
When you've already floored the wrong pedal, and fear keeps it pinned there, that isn't going to help very much!
.. and, at least, with a manual, if you're that infirm you're more likely to be travelling by bus. ;)
TBH, I think that if you lack the mental faculties to drive a manual, an auto isn't the answer. :-\
[/quote]
I could not agree anymore with that statement you put :y :y