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[feeutfo]

I'd ban 4x4s altogether meself. Unless a farm owner or some legitimate use can be proved. And living up a gravel track does not count.

4x4s being very different from 4wheel drives like Subaru's audi's and ir32's etc.

[Lizzie_Zoom]

I'd ban 4x4s altogether meself. Unless a farm owner or some legitimate use can be proved. And living up a gravel track does not count.

4x4s being very different from 4wheel drives like Subaru's audi's and ir32's etc.

Indeed Chris.  I was thinking of the classic Chelsea Tractors, that only ever see tarmac!!

[Kevin Wood]

I'd ban 4x4s altogether meself. Unless a farm owner or some legitimate use can be proved. And living up a gravel track does not count.

4x4s being very different from 4wheel drives like Subaru's audi's and ir32's etc.

Indeed Chris.  I was thinking of the classic Chelsea Tractors, that only ever see tarmac!!

I used to have pretty liberal views on 4x4s, figuring they are petrol heads like the rest of us, after all. First they came for the Communists, etc...

However, my views have changed since I've been doing a bit of mountain biking. I really don't understand the attraction fat forty-something blokes get from winching a rusty old Disco TDi that reeks of vegetable oil, inch by inch, down a byway with wheels spinning, up to their axles in mud. It certainly breaks up the path for any ramblers, cyclists or horse riders who would otherwise enjoy getting away from the traffic and god knows what the few individuals who rely on it for access to their homes do.

As if that's not bad enough they then dump half a tonne of mud in front of the jetwash at the first garage they come across, blocking the drains and rendering it unavailable to those who drive something actually worth washing.

If you want to gratuitously burn some fuel for entertainment, get an old nail that actually moves and book a track day.

[scimmy_man]

about one percent of the paths available to walk have vehicular access, I live down an unmade road and the number of redsock wearing ramblers who get lost down here would shock you.

the local Landrover club have organised days out on greenlanes, probably half the people in the cars would never see the tops of the high roads without a 4x4, wheelchair bound or disabled in some way.

if the lane is so bad it needs a winch it shouldnt be driven,
anyway have you seen the scars up most of the popular mountains? they have to airlift paving slabs in to stop the erosion.

[Kevin Wood]

I don't dispute that organised, responsible 4x4 owners put a lot back into the community. I have friends among them, and live in a village which is cut off by snow from time to time, and they are normally out helping the needy out, against the advice of the Police and Council, normally.

It's the element who ignore the signs stating that byways are closed except for access due to rain and proceed to carve deep ruts in them who annoy me. Yes, there are plenty of footpaths, but I prefer to use wider paths if tearing along on a mountain bike out of courtesy to other users. Every path here where you are not physically prevented from getting a 4x4 down it is churned up so badly that it's useless to anybody else.

[D]

sorry lizzie but if women want equality this is one of the things they have to put up with
got to admit though some of the changes bafel me and i bet male insurance dosnot come down to meet it just another way the insurance companys can rip off everybody some more

But it is not about equality!  Fair insurance calculations are based on level of risk, and the odds of an individual having an accident.  It has nothing to do with gender equality.  So many insurance experts have said that if based on accident probability risk then woman should still benefit from cheaper premiums as they do have less accidents, and when they do, they are often more minor than those of say, 18-25 year of men.

As I cannot see male premiums coming down, it is just an excuse for insurance companies to make more money at the expense of us women.  The EU have just rubber stamped, yet again, a completely illogical change!!

Playing devil's advocate. As an employer, you know that most women will take time off due to pregnancy. Does that give them the right to calculate poor efficiency/value and hence not employ women? Equality means not discriminating against men as well. It works both ways.

[feeutfo]

Gaaaaw don't get me started on ramblers. Jeez... Ok ok, probably not all bad, but cutting down saplings and bows to block footpaths to cyclists..!

No, i'll leave it there...

[ozzycat]

Gaaaaw don't get me started on ramblers. Jeez... Ok ok, probably not all bad, but cutting down saplings and bows to block footpaths to cyclists..!

No, i'll leave it there...

chris ramblers caurse more damage to the country side than biles ever do i speak from expireance when one who could not read a map garage door bcause he said that that was where the path went when the bobbys pionted out to him that he was 1/3 amile of the path he said they can afford to put the damage right and tried to walk off £299 fine and £600 for the damage made him think the majestrait gave him 48 hrs to pay and he did