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[tigers_gonads]

As above

I know there are a few ex and serving coppers on here and also a few who in a past life have been involved in the protection of others whether it be armed forces or "other branches"

The question is ................... Taking into account of the way society in general has become and the apperent total disregard for right and wrong, law and order or even life as a whole by some of the inhabitants of the United Kingdom, is it now time for our bobbies to carry a sidearm for self protection and the protection of those who they have sworn to protect ?

Yes or no please and the reasons behind your choice please 

[albitz]

No.Incidents such as yesterdays are quite rare,and carrying a handgun may well not have saved the two WPC,s anyway.
The police in this country have to a certain extent become detached & remote from those they "serve" and to arm them would imo make them much more remote.It would also up the ante with the crims. The ones who are inclined to carry a handgun now would be inclined to arm themselves with machine guns or whatever,so they could still feel they had the upper hand.

[Varche]

+1. Well said.

[cem_devecioglu]

Well said Albs.. I always admired that the UK police dont carry guns.. and must admit I was shocked when I first see them 
 
however, times are drastically changed ..  and imo security forces without weapon is a #1 target..
 
something like this would be adquate (made in my country)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-d-X4-fZE0
 
so my vote is yes if it is counted

[tigers_gonads]

No.Incidents such as yesterdays are quite rare,and carrying a handgun may well not have saved the two WPC,s anyway.
The police in this country have to a certain extent become detached & remote from those they "serve" and to arm them would imo make them much more remote.It would also up the ante with the crims. The ones who are inclined to carry a handgun now would be inclined to arm themselves with machine guns or whatever,so they could still feel they had the upper hand.

At the moment thats true BUT in some circles, the scum are carrying firearms because it gives them some sort of respect with the people that they mix with.
They know that if they are challenged and produce a weapon (whether its a knife or a mac 10) they have the upper hand and can get away with pretty much anything they want.



That imo is down to the succesive goverments who have eroded the traditional role of a copper.
Gone are the days when if you stepped out of line, you got a clip round the ear by the copper and a good kicking by your mam or dad.
Nowdays, its about human rights, aportioning the blame for example, he has had a poor upbringing so he must be a victim of society and should be treat accordingly and last but not least .............. meeting the goverment target of the day 



There are places in all citys that if you are known to said people and have the money you can get your hands on a machine pistol 

[tigers_gonads]

Well said Albs.. I always admired that the UK police dont carry guns.. and must admit I was shocked when I first see them 
 
however, times are drastically changed ..  and imo security forces without weapon is a #1 target..
 
something like this would be adquate (made in my country)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-d-X4-fZE0
 
so my vote is yes if it is counted

And that is the problem over here cem, this country HAS changed and not for the better 

[cem_devecioglu]

Well said Albs.. I always admired that the UK police dont carry guns.. and must admit I was shocked when I first see them 
 
however, times are drastically changed ..  and imo security forces without weapon is a #1 target..
 
something like this would be adquate (made in my country)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-d-X4-fZE0
 
so my vote is yes if it is counted

And that is the problem over here cem, this country HAS changed and not for the better 

I understand the reasons why UK police dont carry guns.. And I'm also against guns and they must not be sold to public.. however, security forces cant protect community , even themselves in case such a maniac start to shoot around.. you need to call armed police which will take time costing lifes.. 

[the alarming man]

and following on from what albs says IF we were to arm our police force it would go from policeing by consent (i.e we allow ourselves to be policed) to policing by force

and i don't subscribe too the poor upbringing line...as adults we all have choices

[tigers_gonads]

and following on from what albs says IF we were to arm our police force it would go from policeing by consent (i.e we allow ourselves to be policed) to policing by force

and i don't subscribe too the poor upbringing line...as adults we all have choices

At the end of the day, the law is the law.
We (should) uphold the law regarless of whether we agree with that law or not.
Thats why we elected those tossers in goverment.

At the end of the day, if you are stopped by a copper and asked to pick up a piece of litter that fell out of your pocket would a sidearm make any difference to your answer ?

IF and only if the police are ever armed as par the course, it would be as I said earlier for the protection of themselfs and the people that they are sworn to protect.
At the end of the day the police are bound by the same laws as the rest of the population.

[albitz]

The British police arent meant to be security forces.The problem imo is the weak criminal justice system,which should serve & protect the citizens,but it has in many ways disconnected itself from that role.As TG said there is far too much emphasis put on the human rights of the offender these days.We have had a social experiment taking place since the 60,s in justice,education and many other areas and it has led us to the point we are now.
Its time we had a govt. which admitted that the experiment has failed and announces that we are returning to punishment fitting the crime,life means life and possibly even the return of the death penalty,although Im still uncomfortable with that personally.
There always has been and always will be nutters who will murder innocent people,but logic tells me that if there is a really strong deterrent,the number of this type of incident will be reduced. Its possible to murder someone these days and serve less than 10 years in prison.
A workmate of mine did 3 years for GBH a while back and he said prison is not really a punishment these days.The worst part of it is that it gets boring after a while and you cant go down the pub,but theres nothing to deter anyone from returning to a life of crime.
By all means try to discover why people do these things,so that it may be possible to steer people away from doing it in future.But once an indiviual has cold bloodedly murdered someone they should never taste freedom again imo.
This is all purely hypothetical of course becaue even if we have a govt. which wants to go back down this route,the EU wouldnt let them.
I grew up in a place where all police carried firearms all the time,my Dad was one of them in his younger days.In the circumstances it really was necessary for them to do so but it didnt stop police officers getting murdered. There were hundreds of them murdered during that time. Often in their own homes or cars,where they had their firearm to hand,but a surprise attackby an armed gunman is usually over within 2 or seconds,so not much time to react unfortunately.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Nope.

Armed response units are available and it would only start an 'arms race' with the hardened criminals out there which would be worse for the general populous.

[ozzycat]

 in certain situations i would say yes   but for general policing noif they cary firearms this would alianate them morplus you would always get some dick head trying to push thepolice to see if hewill draw his wepon then run crying to mama

[omegod]

I don't think they should be armed and if they were, can only see the end of their careers/imprisonment should they ever choose to discharge their weapon given the nanny state we live in.

[bored bigyin54]

i say yes to police carrying guns 

[PhilRich]

No from me, as already said we have well armed and well trained units ready to be called upon when/if the occassion arises.