Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Big_Al]

Would deffo gather more info before you bounce into vx.
As stated already there could be a wiring issue underlying. Faulty new sensors do exist ofcourse, but its uncommon - doesn't mean you haven't got one, doesn't mean you have either.

Fair comment. This morning the car would not start, so I got it into the garage. I tried again to start it, again it just whirred away. I then changed the crank sensor, turned the key, and it started. I suppose I could put back the other sensor and try again. I shall not be in Wantage till next Friday, so there is plenty of time to make checks. I am open to suggestions.

hi Terry,
               am having very similar problems with my FL 2.6 MV6 .  .( see thread in electrical section)

Leaning towards some sort of connection breakdown to the ECU in my book . If the ECU tells the fuel pump relay not to kick in that would cause a non start & is something I had not thought of . but as said am now leaning away from crank sensor to an ECU or ecu not getting the crank sensor info pulses . Have a read of my thread in "electricals".

regards, Al

[Andy H]

Did you notice whether the tacho needle moved when the engine was cranking but not starting?

If no movement then it points to crank sensor (or wiring, or connectors or input to the ECU)

If it moved then I would take a closer look at the fuel pump (and relay if there is one)

[terry paget]

Would deffo gather more info before you bounce into vx.
As stated already there could be a wiring issue underlying. Faulty new sensors do exist ofcourse, but its uncommon - doesn't mean you haven't got one, doesn't mean you have either.

Fair comment. This morning the car would not start, so I got it into the garage. I tried again to start it, again it just whirred away. I then changed the crank sensor, turned the key, and it started. I suppose I could put back the other sensor and try again. I shall not be in Wantage till next Friday, so there is plenty of time to make checks. I am open to suggestions.Hi Essex Big Al. Thanks for your tip. I have read your thread in Electricals. It has me worried and intrigued. It certainly gives me doubts. I shall continue to experiment.  Will report back when I have anything new.quote]

hi Terry,
               am having very similar problems with my FL 2.6 MV6 .  .( see thread in electrical section)

Leaning towards some sort of connection breakdown to the ECU in my book . If the ECU tells the fuel pump relay not to kick in that would cause a non start & is something I had not thought of . but as said am now leaning away from crank sensor to an ECU or ecu not getting the crank sensor info pulses . Have a read of my thread in "electricals".

regards, Al

[terry paget]

Did you notice whether the tacho needle moved when the engine was cranking but not starting?

If no movement then it points to crank sensor (or wiring, or connectors or input to the ECU)

If it moved then I would take a closer look at the fuel pump (and relay if there is one)

No, I did not notice the tacho needle move, and I
 think I would have had it done so. The fact that changing the crank sensor cured the fault strongly suggests the fault lies there. On Friday the car died after two stalls 10 miles from home. After half an hour it restarted, and got me home, though tried to stall once. This morning car would not start, or show any sign of doing so. I changed the crank sensor and it started straight away. I tried a couple of restarts, OK. I drove it to Bristol, parked, shopped, restarted car and drove home. 30 miles in all, no failures to start, no stalling.

Failure of the new Vx sensor seems most likely explanation. How do I prove it?

I may still have the original failed sensor. I could compare it electrically with my new Vx sensor and the pattern sensor. That might be enlightening.

I could replace the pattern with the Vx and see if it runs. If it does, then car wiring is suspect. If not, Vx sensor must be guilty party.

Do you agree? Have you any other suggestions? If it runs all week on pattern sensor, but will not run on Vx sensor, I could invite the dealer to change it and witness the failure.

Are not these Omegas bundles of fun? Meanwhile wife's 2.0 estate needs new lambda sensor and the 3.2 needs a new clutch. I shall never get bored,

[AndyStobbs]

Unless your vx sensor is dead comparrison with a multimeter won't yield much info. Putting it back in and seeing if the car starts is a good way to test, though you might be disturbing some wiring in the process which would skew the results of any substitution.

I as a trade customer often get stonewalled by dealers with dodgey electrical bits, one job alone ended up costing me £300 to replace a part that failed one month after purchase from a dealership. Yes they offer a warranty process but its so complex that its more hassle than reward, especially with an intermittent failure.

[dbug]

Yep I replaced a "dodgy" crank sensor with a genuine Vx one on the old Elite and it packed up within the month (swapped the "dodgy" one back on and car started ok, tried again with the "new" one no start).  Took the new one back to Vx who said i should have got the car to them for testing (ie get it shipped/trailered 11 miles for a £45 refund!!) - not worth the effort at the end of the day, although did consider driving car to them, parking car blocking their access and swapping the new one back on!

New genuine Vx crank sensors can and do fail

[Kevin Wood]

I have a vague recollection of there being multiple crank sensors for the 2.5, some of which have a shorter reach than others with the upshot that some don't result in reliable running. Could it be that the wrong sensor has been supplied? Note that dealers don't always get ti right, as it isn't always correct in TIS.

[terry paget]

Yep I replaced a "dodgy" crank sensor with a genuine Vx one on the old Elite and it packed up within the month (swapped the "dodgy" one back on and car started ok, tried again with the "new" one no start).  Took the new one back to Vx who said i should have got the car to them for testing (ie get it shipped/trailered 11 miles for a £45 refund!!) - not worth the effort at the end of the day, although did consider driving car to them, parking car blocking their access and swapping the new one back on!

New genuine Vx crank sensors can and do fail

Thanks for your support, dbug. I reckon it is the Vx sensor, but time may prove me wrong.

[AndyStobbs]

Yep I replaced a "dodgy" crank sensor with a genuine Vx one on the old Elite and it packed up within the month (swapped the "dodgy" one back on and car started ok, tried again with the "new" one no start).  Took the new one back to Vx who said i should have got the car to them for testing (ie get it shipped/trailered 11 miles for a £45 refund!!) - not worth the effort at the end of the day, although did consider driving car to them, parking car blocking their access and swapping the new one back on!

New genuine Vx crank sensors can and do fail

I blocked a certain local dealership's main drag with an elwb van until their manager came back from dinner. Fight fire with fire where dealerships are concerned.

[terry paget]

I have a vague recollection of there being multiple crank sensors for the 2.5, some of which have a shorter reach than others with the upshot that some don't result in reliable running. Could it be that the wrong sensor has been supplied? Note that dealers don't always get ti right, as it isn't always correct in TIS.

In the maintenance guide, it makes the point that on the 2.5 it is important to replace the sensor with identical. There is a Bosch and a Siemens. My old was a Siemens, so I bought a Siemens from Vx.

[Kevin Wood]

I have a vague recollection of there being multiple crank sensors for the 2.5, some of which have a shorter reach than others with the upshot that some don't result in reliable running. Could it be that the wrong sensor has been supplied? Note that dealers don't always get ti right, as it isn't always correct in TIS.

In the maintenance guide, it makes the point that on the 2.5 it is important to replace the sensor with identical. There is a Bosch and a Siemens. My old was a Siemens, so I bought a Siemens from Vx.

OK but is the part number the same?

[terry paget]

I have a vague recollection of there being multiple crank sensors for the 2.5, some of which have a shorter reach than others with the upshot that some don't result in reliable running. Could it be that the wrong sensor has been supplied? Note that dealers don't always get ti right, as it isn't always correct in TIS.

In the maintenance guide, it makes the point that on the 2.5 it is important to replace the sensor with identical. There is a Bosch and a Siemens. My old was a Siemens, so I bought a Siemens from Vx.

OK but is the part number the same?

Yes

[terry paget]

Yep I replaced a "dodgy" crank sensor with a genuine Vx one on the old Elite and it packed up within the month (swapped the "dodgy" one back on and car started ok, tried again with the "new" one no start).  Took the new one back to Vx who said i should have got the car to them for testing (ie get it shipped/trailered 11 miles for a £45 refund!!) - not worth the effort at the end of the day, although did consider driving car to them, parking car blocking their access and swapping the new one back on!

New genuine Vx crank sensors can and do fail

I blocked a certain local dealership's main drag with an elwb van until their manager came back from dinner. Fight fire with fire where dealerships are concerned.

I rang Bellinger Grove, supplying main dealer, demanding a replacement crank sensor. I was told I would have to return the sensor with the car, and let them replace the sensor in the car and find it did not work. They needed job cards and TechII readings for a warranty claim.
Rubbish, I said. I am making a Sale of Goods Act claim, not a warranty claim. You have sold me a defective item, I am entitled to my money back or a replacement. Oblige me or await my small claims court summons.

Stores manager said he would ring me back. He rang back after half an hour  saying in this case they would manage it somehow and I could have a replacement sensor on Friday (the day I am in Grove). I called in yesterday by appointment, to face all 3 stores staff and a manager. I got my replacement sensor. They were not very happy. 

[Sir Tigger KC]

Nice! 

[Big_Al]

Would deffo gather more info before you bounce into vx.
As stated already there could be a wiring issue underlying. Faulty new sensors do exist ofcourse, but its uncommon - doesn't mean you haven't got one, doesn't mean you have either.

Fair comment. This morning the car would not start, so I got it into the garage. I tried again to start it, again it just whirred away. I then changed the crank sensor, turned the key, and it started. I suppose I could put back the other sensor and try again. I shall not be in Wantage till next Friday, so there is plenty of time to make checks. I am open to suggestions.

hi Terry,
               am having very similar problems with my FL 2.6 MV6 .  .( see thread in electrical section)

Leaning towards some sort of connection breakdown to the ECU in my book . If the ECU tells the fuel pump relay not to kick in that would cause a non start & is something I had not thought of . but as said am now leaning away from crank sensor to an ECU or ecu not getting the crank sensor info pulses . Have a read of my thread in "electricals".

regards, Al

just a quick update Terry  . . .  .  after  new CS fitted etc. I removed both engine ECU multi connectors & the main loom connectors under the battery  & used electrical contact cleaner spray on all .  Unbelievable difference  . . .   car starts perfect , no sign of any cut out (as yet  . .a week now) but the biggest thing is how much smoother & more powerful the car is  . . .feels like a different car .

I always thought that this 2.6 was down on power since I've had it . . my last 2.5 seemed so much quicker but i put it down to it just being a 2.6 & that they were the least powerful of all the V6's.

seems like my problem is sorted  . . .hope your is soon as well        Regards  Al