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[Lizzie Zoom]

The Americans have form for rebuilding planes in the name of development.

Several variations of the 707/720 have been rebuilt a few times over the years.

And Britain made the Nimrod out of the Comet

Is that proof that you can't polish a turd?

Only we could take an obselete-before-its-second-flight design, take three goes at redesigning it before finally scrapping the whole project and buying airliners that were readily available when the initial project started and call it ingenuity

That's the British Government, and all our governments, certainly since 1945 with the Defence Budget always being wasted by a fair percentage!!

[Raeturbo]

Not absolutely related to the thread but I think it’s worth a look if you’ve not seen it before and I’m sure you’ll know what they are


https://youtu.be/Gv9iIpeU4TE

[Kevin Wood]

Not absolutely related to the thread but I think it’s worth a look if you’ve not seen it before and I’m sure you’ll know what they are


https://youtu.be/Gv9iIpeU4TE

In the Q and A session after we asked what level they typically transit cross country.

"Don't worry. MUCH lower than you guys"
"Oh, how low's that?"
"It's good to practice low level flying whenever we can get the opportunity"
"Got a number?"
"Well under 500 feet"
"<Smirk>"
"Well, you would too<smirk>"
 

[Raeturbo]

Ha ha, as they say, them were the days

[aaronjb]

Not absolutely related to the thread but I think it’s worth a look if you’ve not seen it before and I’m sure you’ll know what they are


https://youtu.be/Gv9iIpeU4TE

Doing that speed at all of about 6' off the deck must have been such a rush 

[Lizzie Zoom]

Not absolutely related to the thread but I think it’s worth a look if you’ve not seen it before and I’m sure you’ll know what they are


https://youtu.be/Gv9iIpeU4TE

Doing that speed at all of about 6' off the deck must have been such a rush 

Low level ground attack and general flying was the mark of some of the RAF crack squadrons.  Is that still the case?

Great to witness!!

[Rods2]

Not absolutely related to the thread but I think it’s worth a look if you’ve not seen it before and I’m sure you’ll know what they are


https://youtu.be/Gv9iIpeU4TE

Doing that speed at all of about 6' off the deck must have been such a rush 

Low level ground attack and general flying was the mark of some of the RAF crack squadrons.  Is that still the case?

Great to witness!!

1991 Gulf War showed the vulnerability of flying low, especially using JP233 runway denial munitions, ask John Nichols. Tornado with its terrain following was optimized for this role where it could terrain follow at 50', but it was very vulnerable to small arms ground fire.

The US approach with their much bigger air force could fly above small arms ground fire at medium level & suppress SAMs and radars, through a combination of ECM and anti-radiation missiles like the AGM-88 HARM. The Gulf War vindicated the US approach.

5th generation stealth aircraft are designed to operate in modern A2D hostile environments, how well they will work in S400 defended areas remains to be seen with their range of radars frequencies & IR detection systems. Stealth technology has in the past concentrated on long range radar systems, where the current technology is at will obviously be classified.

The start of the 1991 air war was with AH64 Apaches taking out Iraqi air defence radars to create an air corridor with this article providing the best description to date I've seen http://www.airforcemag.com/MagazineArchive/Pages/1991/October%201991/1091apache.aspx on the operation, which also illustrates the high standards to which Western forces train & operate at, which is a major asset for NATO.

About 15 years a oo I had the opportunity to fly a Chinook simulator at RAF Benson for about 10 minutes. The avionic flight control systems made it very easy as after takeoff you could set your altitude, pitch the nose forward to gain speed without losing height. Very different from flying a basic helicopter with their 3-axis cross coupling. I'm sure TB has experienced this with his models and just to takeoff and hover and land again is a major achievement.

[Lizzie Zoom]

Ok, thanks

[LC0112G]

As Rods alludes to, the modern RAF is not setup to go low level in fast jets. Neither Typhoon nor F-35 are routinely used at low level, and low level training flights have been banned in "The Loop" for almost 6 months now. It was actually stopped before Tornado was finally retired, alledgedly because top brass didn't want any unneccessery accidents before the type finally bowed out.

All the modern ground attack munitions (Paveway, Brimstone etc) are launced/dropped from medium altitude (10-20K feet). There are currently no plans to fly F-35 at low level at all - none have been photographed low level in the usual spots (although there are only 3 in the country at the moment!) 

[DrAndyB]

Nice.  Gotta love a Chinook   

[Lizzie Zoom]

As Rods alludes to, the modern RAF is not setup to go low level in fast jets. Neither Typhoon nor F-35 are routinely used at low level, and low level training flights have been banned in "The Loop" for almost 6 months now. It was actually stopped before Tornado was finally retired, alledgedly because top brass didn't want any unneccessery accidents before the type finally bowed out.

All the modern ground attack munitions (Paveway, Brimstone etc) are launced/dropped from medium altitude (10-20K feet). There are currently no plans to fly F-35 at low level at all - none have been photographed low level in the usual spots (although there are only 3 in the country at the moment!)

I suppose with the advent of ever more sophisticated air to ground missiles, let alone drones, technology has moved on a bit since 617 Squadron did their run to the dams, and likewise the Mosquito's famed low level attacks are now allotted fully to history!

[TheBoy]

There are currently no plans to fly F-35 at low level at all

I think getting one to fly should be the first challenge

[Kevin Wood]

There are currently no plans to fly F-35 at low level at all

I think getting one to fly should be the first challenge

They flew here from the US, IIRC.

.. Unless that refuelling probe was actually a cunningly disguised aerotow rope.

[Doctor Gollum]

There are currently no plans to fly F-35 at low level at all

I think getting one to fly should be the first challenge

They flew here from the US, IIRC.

.. Unless that refuelling probe was actually a cunningly disguised aerotow rope.

I'm not sure that folding the wings and stuffing it into the back of a C17 counts as flying

[Kevin Wood]

There are currently no plans to fly F-35 at low level at all

I think getting one to fly should be the first challenge

They flew here from the US, IIRC.

.. Unless that refuelling probe was actually a cunningly disguised aerotow rope.

I'm not sure that folding the wings and stuffing it into the back of a C17 counts as flying

It dosn't, but my recollection is that the first 3 flew the journey under their own power.