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[Lizzie_Zoom]

Don't worry this thread is NOT all to do with steam engines

Under a different thread I answered a members querry over the Southern Railways Chief Mechanical Engineer O.V.S Bullied's great creation, the "Coffee Pot" Q1 Class 0-6-0 Austerity locomotive of 1942, of which one C1 or BR No. 33001 is preserved on the Bluebell Railway in Sussex.



This locomotive was Bullied's design for the war (WWII) effort, with so much steel saved by dramatically trimming the cosmetic finish of these powerful frieght loco's, coming in at 54 tons 18 cwt, with the tender at just 16 tons, that each one came in some 14 tons lighter than 'standard' designs of frieght engine's.    

Thus resulted a tremendous overall saving of 560 tons of steel over the class of 40 engines, at a time (1942) when Britain was desparate for every ton of metal it could lay its hands on*, plus significant reductions in maintenance / labour / costs. 8-) 8-) 8-)      

*Some members may remember those days, but just for once I am NOT old enough to do so!!  

I believe, although I could be wrong, that Bullied was the first to create such dramatic savings in steel (and maintenance costs) in such a radicule way for one design of mechanical engineering.

This got me thinking about the dramatic reduction in steel used in cars from those built in the 1950s and those built today in 2008, from an average weight of 2.5 tons to 1.5 tons (?? I believe).

With the automobile when do you think the 'revloution' really started in weight savings; what model / designer in particular created this move, and was it due to the use of alluminium, fibre glass or some other material used in construction? :-/ :-/ :-/ :-/

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

Don't worry this thread is NOT all to do with steam engines

Under a different thread I answered a members querry over the Southern Railways Chief Mechanical Engineer OVS Bullied's great creation, the "Coffee Pot" Q1 Class 0-6-0 Austerity locomotive of 1942, of which one C1 0r BR No. 33001 is preserved on the Bluebell Railway in Sussex.

[img][/imghttp://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/BulliedQ1.jpg]

This locomotive was Bullied's design for the war (WWII) effort, with so much steel saved by dramatically trimming the cosmetic finish of these powerful frieght loco's, coming in at 54 tons 18 cwt, with the tender at just 16 tons, that each one came in some 14 tons lighter than 'standard' designs of frieght engine's.    

Thus resulted a tremendous overall saving of 560 tons of steel over the class of 40 engines, at a time (1942) when Britain was desparate for every ton of metal it could lay its hands on*, plus significant reductions in maintenance / labour / costs. 8-) 8-) 8-)      

N*Some members may remember those days, but just for once I am OT old enough to do so!!  
I believe, although I could be wrong, that Bullied was the first to create such dramatic savings in steel (and maintenance costs) in such a radicule way for one design of mechanical engineering.

This got me thinking about the dramatic reduction in steel used in cars from those built in the 1950s and those built today in 2008, from an average weight of 2.5 tons to 1.5 tons (?? I believe).

With the automobile when do you think the 'revloution' really started in weight savings; what model / designer in particular created this move, and was it due to the use of alluminium, fibre glass or some other material used in construction? :-/ :-/ :-/ :-/

Just barely Lizzie.

[LaserLance]

i would think something like Ford Seirra with its plastic bumpers and plastic dash was one off fist weight saving cars but i could be wrong .

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I could be wrong , but I think that cars from the fifties were lighter than 2008 cars.
No heavy luxury items in the post war austere fifties.

[Lizzie_Zoom]

i would think something like Ford Seirra with its plastic bumpers and plastic dash was one off fist weight saving cars but i could be wrong .

I don't really know Lance, thus my question, but I have this mental image of a man holding aloft the body of a car in the 1960s with one hand!!

[LaserLance]

Only car i could just about pick up in the 60's would be a corgi or dinky toy or me triang pedal car  

[Lizzie_Zoom]

I could be wrong , but I think that cars from the fifties were lighter than 2008 cars.
No heavy luxury items in the post war austere fifties.

I seem to think the opposite, due to separate box chassis designs being then common and not the integral body / chassis we witness today, plus the body work was not wafer thin in the 1950s! .  Thus another reason why the British steel industry collasped as it did.  Is this right or wrong? :-/ :-/ :-/ :-/

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Only car i could just about pick up in the 60's would be a corgi or dinky toy or me triang pedal car  

 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I could be wrong , but I think that cars from the fifties were lighter than 2008 cars.
No heavy luxury items in the post war austere fifties.

I seem to think the opposite, due to separate box chassis designs being then common and not the integral body / chassis we witness today, plus the body work was not wafer thin in the 1950s! .  Thus another reason why the British steel industry collasped as it did.  Is this right or wrong? :-/ :-/ :-/ :-/

I think you are right in saying that the average car today is about 1.5 tonnes, Lizzie. But, I think an average family saloon car from the fifties would probably have weighed well under 1 tonne.......But as I say I could be wrong

[LaserLance]

i suppose the ultimate weight saving body would be a resin rocket or a scimitar both being fibreglass they certainly were the 1st cars with crumpple zones

[Kevin Wood]

I think cars are getting more lardy again. I'm sure the introduction of monococue construction methods made a huge difference but since then cars have been sprouting more toys and safety devices along with more interior padding, sound deadening material, etc. and as engines have got more powerful and more efficient weight isn't such an issue any more.

The classic comparison of the Mk 1 Golf (790 kg-970 kg) with the Mk 5 Golf (1,323 kg-1,617 kg) demonstrates this. OK, the car may have got a little roomier along the way but both remain small family cars from the same category in different eras. Look how much extra weight we're now carrying!

Makes me wonder what a Mk.1 with a modern fuel efficient engine would be like? Best of both worlds?

I noted they are still selling them in South Africa after I kept marvelling at the lovely condition of the Mk.1s running around Cape Town. I guess the market can't stomach as many superfuous features as it does here.

Kevin

[Martin_1962]

Avenger was first with plastic grill

Actually I think light cars hit their peak in the 70s

[cem_devecioglu]

I think cars are getting more lardy again. I'm sure the introduction of monococue construction methods made a huge difference but since then cars have been sprouting more toys and safety devices along with more interior padding, sound deadening material, etc. and as engines have got more powerful and more efficient weight isn't such an issue any more.

The classic comparison of the Mk 1 Golf (790 kg-970 kg) with the Mk 5 Golf (1,323 kg-1,617 kg) demonstrates this. OK, the car may have got a little roomier along the way but both remain small family cars from the same category in different eras. Look how much extra weight we're now carrying!

Makes me wonder what a Mk.1 with a modern fuel efficient engine would be like? Best of both worlds?

I noted they are still selling them in South Africa after I kept marvelling at the lovely condition of the Mk.1s running around Cape Town. I guess the market can't stomach as many superfuous features as it does here.

Kevin

For those with 1.5 £ /liter fuel price its a big issue

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

Just looked on the internet.
Ford zodiac 1951-1956 ...weight2660lbs...which is ..let me see...counting fingers and thumbs....2660 divided by 2.2 for kilos equals...1209kilos..less than a Golf I think.
Top speed was a scorching 84 mph....and all on just 2.6 litres.

[Martin_1962]

Carlton 2.0 Gli 1210kg