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[sierrapaul]

the reason vauxhall and outher makers dont fit an inline fuse is if they did the alarm wouldnt meet thatham cat1 or cat2.most alarms that are cat1 or 2 are the same

[Kevin Wood]

the reason vauxhall and outher makers dont fit an inline fuse is if they did the alarm wouldnt meet thatham cat1 or cat2.most alarms that are cat1 or 2 are the same

There's clearly a shortage of electrical engineers at Thatcham then.

Kevin

[aaronjb]

I wonder if some alarm sounders have fuses inside the casing? Obviously you'd never be able to change the fuse, but that way it would meet Cat1/2 and be incapable of shorting out the rest of the car wiring..

[sierrapaul]

was told that if its got an inline fuse then if sum toerag takes a fangy to your car if they know wht there doing they can just pull the fuse.i think alot of it is down to theveing ins companys

[Kevin Wood]

I wonder if some alarm sounders have fuses inside the casing? Obviously you'd never be able to change the fuse, but that way it would meet Cat1/2 and be incapable of shorting out the rest of the car wiring..

That would have been the obvious way to do it, and if I were to replace the batteries in one from now on I'd probably add a little PCB mounted fuse in there..

Sill, even an inline fuse is no less secure than a unit you can simply unplug, so why would it be outlawed by Thatcham approval if, like the whole sounder, it were fitted in a suitable location?

Kevin

[sierrapaul]

im not a 100% sure but i think its got sumthing to do with gaining acess to the car and bypassing the alarm and how easy it is to get to alarm componants.and i think they dont have a fuse becose if it blows for amy reason when the bats lose charge theres no power going to the unit to charge it.there dont realy seem a way round it.dut i can see in years to come with new cars now where there so complex with so many ecus and eletric everything that these sort of things will be more common

[Kevin Wood]

im not a 100% sure but i think its got sumthing to do with gaining acess to the car and bypassing the alarm and how easy it is to get to alarm componants.and i think they dont have a fuse becose if it blows for amy reason when the bats lose charge theres no power going to the unit to charge it.there dont realy seem a way round it.dut i can see in years to come with new cars now where there so complex with so many ecus and eletric everything that these sort of things will be more common

I can sort-of see their reasoning but it's flawed. The fuse would only blow if there was a fault in the sounder, in which case it's unlikely to be providing any protection. If the fuse is not easily accessible to a potential thief I cannot see what harm it could do.

Kevin

[sierrapaul]

it would make sence to you and me.but when do car makers ao anything that makes sence

[Kevin Wood]

it would make sence to you and me.but when do car makers ao anything that makes sence

Fair comment.

[Chris_H]

im not a 100% sure but i think its got sumthing to do with gaining acess to the car and bypassing the alarm and how easy it is to get to alarm componants.and i think they dont have a fuse becose if it blows for amy reason when the bats lose charge theres no power going to the unit to charge it.there dont realy seem a way round it.dut i can see in years to come with new cars now where there so complex with so many ecus and eletric everything that these sort of things will be more common

The answer is you put in the fuse and get the PS to talk to the diagnostics to let you know the fuse has gone.

[Kevin Wood]

The answer is you put in the fuse and get the PS to talk to the diagnostics to let you know the fuse has gone.

Yep, also not rocket science.

I think the power sounder install was a kludge to satisfy a requirement unique to the UK market so it probably didn't benefit from as much attention to detail as the design of the rest of the vehicle.

Kevin

[Shackeng]

That's why we need more information from cars that have just started to go, and then been stopped, exactly what was the problem.

I personally think having an unfused supply is asking for trouble, a potential time bomb, as cables will eventually break down, esp in the car environment, which can go from - 10 to +50 deg C very quickly, which will harden cables and make them crack. An unfused line is asking for trouble, and its only to GM's credit that it appears to last about 10 years before going bad.

A last thought, to those who have disconnected the power sounder, did you insulate the plug ?. I'd hate it to short against some metal, and .........

Ken

I sealed mine in the cut-off thumb of a latex glove (I don't carry condoms any more!)

[Danny]

if the powersounder battery combustion is a result of it shorting out while still receiving power from the car's battery, doesn't this mean there's actually no chance of it self-combusting if i removed mine and left it in the shed??

by the way, the car's +ve battery terminal, is this the one hampered by the fuse box or the one i can see?

[Jimbob]

1998
3.0 MV6 Estate
about 105K miles
Virtually no damage as we heard it 'calling for help' and I had put it out and stripped it down before the fire brigade arrived

Could I ask what was the actual cause of this, was it the power sounder on fire ?.

Sorry, my brain can't see how it can go on fire, NICAD's tend to just get hot, then the vent opens, hydorgen and water come out and that's it. Plus the battery is only about 100mAH when new, so not much capacity, plus its about 10 years old, so will be fairly worn out.
 I got the feeling it might be the powersounder going short, poss the battery leaking and corroding something, and taking the 12V unfused feed from the battery to deck, so this will get very hot, prob melt the wire insulation, which will short all over the place. Hence my earlier suggestion that a fuse in the line should stop this happening again.

This is my theory, I may be totally wrong, but I'd like to get to the bottom of this so no-one elses car goes up.

Ken

certainly, was definately the power sounder on fire and nothing else at all. Evidence at http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1259433462

[Ken T]

1998
3.0 MV6 Estate
about 105K miles
Virtually no damage as we heard it 'calling for help' and I had put it out and stripped it down before the fire brigade arrived

Could I ask what was the actual cause of this, was it the power sounder on fire ?.

Sorry, my brain can't see how it can go on fire, NICAD's tend to just get hot, then the vent opens, hydorgen and water come out and that's it. Plus the battery is only about 100mAH when new, so not much capacity, plus its about 10 years old, so will be fairly worn out.
 I got the feeling it might be the powersounder going short, poss the battery leaking and corroding something, and taking the 12V unfused feed from the battery to deck, so this will get very hot, prob melt the wire insulation, which will short all over the place. Hence my earlier suggestion that a fuse in the line should stop this happening again.

This is my theory, I may be totally wrong, but I'd like to get to the bottom of this so no-one elses car goes up.

Ken

certainly, was definately the power sounder on fire and nothing else at all. Evidence at http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1259433462

Thanks Jimbob,
That looks like an internal short, dragging many amps thro the connector, which is poss a bit corroded so its acts like a resistance, and will get very hot, melting and setting fire to the casing. I still think it will melt the wire insulation causing most of the damage. So an inline fuse it is, I would prefer to fit it next to the source, eg the car battery, so it protects against any damage to the wire feeding the sounder. Any ideas as to the best position ?.

Ken