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[Dishevelled Den]

Aah but Jerry this is the stock in trade of any politician.

International politics (particularly) embraces to art of saying many things - often with great gravitas or sincerity -  but when those words are examined they bear (in most cases) no relation to the true intentions of the speaker.

I think this intervention is a mistake.

I have to agree, Zulu. I thought it would be just enforcing a no-fly zone, but it seems to have a wider agenda and we appear to be wading into the midst of a civil war. Plus the fact that I have never trusted Cameron...

I would agree with that Nick - it's only a matter of time as far as I can see.

Insofar as David Cameron is concerned I've often wondered what lies behind the façade - but whatever it is, its more apparent to me now that he is indeed the natural heir to Tony Blair. (Ooh that had a nice wee ring to it)

[Webby the Bear]

its been said time and again but its about resources. oil in this case.

but as long as we look after our interests then thats fine with me.

[Mysteryman]

its been said time and again but its about resources. oil in this case.

but as long as we look after our interests then thats fine with me.

Look Webby, you don't know nothin see. So shaddupayerface.

[Webby the Bear]

hahahaha dont you havde some washing up to do? hahaha 

[Mysteryman]

hahahaha dont you havde some washing up to do? hahaha 

Loads! Been watching cricket and football al day so breakfast, dinner and tea dishes to do. Might leave them 'soaking' till the morning.

[Webby the Bear]

haahaha i do that. i tell the wife ''ive done the washing up and a few things are in soak'' (basically everything.

then i get the brownie points and the possibility of oral

[Mysteryman]

haahaha i do that. i tell the wife ''ive done the washing up and a few things are in soak'' (basically everything.

then i get the brownie points and the possibility of oral

Your missus is easily pleased


And has a strong stomach by the sound of things. 

[Webby the Bear]

hahaha if only i was being serious 

 

[Banjax]

Aah but Jerry this is the stock in trade of any politician.

International politics (particularly) embraces to art of saying many things - often with great gravitas or sincerity -  but when those words are examined they bear (in most cases) no relation to the true intentions of the speaker.

I think this intervention is a mistake.

I have to agree, Zulu. I thought it would be just enforcing a no-fly zone, but it seems to have a wider agenda and we appear to be wading into the midst of a civil war. Plus the fact that I have never trusted Cameron...

No, at the last minute, the USA inserted into the UN resolution authorization to take on and destroy land targets that were threatening and destroying the civilian or rebel populations.  No 'boots' will be allowed to fight on the ground however

take on and destroy land targets that were threatening and destroying the civilian or rebel populations

Which, in the case of the regime using heavy military equipment against a less well armed opposition or civilians, is a logical step - however - the very great danger is that when action from stand-off positions does not render the intended targets void (the regime in this case) the next logical step is to have land forces deployed - as fighting from afar is never really successful.

There is no substitute for land warfare unfortunately and despite all the assurances and declared intentions to the contrary, it is more than possible that such interdiction (as presently envisaged) will escalate into a full commitment to theatre.

If we cast our minds back to the fragrant Dr Reid’s rather infamous statement that our forces could deploy to Afghanistan and achieve the stated aim 'without a shot being fired' we can judge whether or not assurances about the proposed operations in Libya have any real substance.

Mission creep in situations such as Libya is the rule rather than the exception sadly.

everyone knew the US wouldn't fly over hostile territory without destroying Libyas anti-aircraft capability.
Everyone also knew that Gaddaffi would use the necessary missile attacks to his own ends showing "concerned" government officials visiting the wounded in hospital, same dismal, laughable and childish tactics Saddam used - no one believes him, least of all his own people, thats the trouble when you're surrounded by yes men - every idea you have, no matter how garbage is put into operation, no one close to the mad Colonel is going to say "'scuse me sir, isnt that idea a bit.....obvious? i really don't think anyone is serioBLAM!!!" thud.
"anyone else think this is a bad idea?"
"we'll get right on it sir - its pure genius!" 

[Dishevelled Den]

everyone knew the US wouldn't fly over hostile territory without destroying Libyas anti-aircraft capability.
Everyone also knew that Gaddaffi would use the necessary missile attacks to his own ends showing "concerned" government officials visiting the wounded in hospital, same dismal, laughable and childish tactics Saddam used - no one believes him, least of all his own people, thats the trouble when you're surrounded by yes men - every idea you have, no matter how garbage is put into operation, no one close to the mad Colonel is going to say "'scuse me sir, isnt that idea a bit.....obvious? i really don't think anyone is serioBLAM!!!" thud.
"anyone else think this is a bad idea?"
"we'll get right on it sir - its pure genius!" 

Yep - whatever way you look at it BJ it'll simply end up one massive cluster opps to the poorhouse.

[Banjax]

I dunno Z, I mean it hasn't always ended badly when we go into the middle east to sort out their problems has it? I mean there was the....no that was bad.....erm, what about the time..........jeesus no that was a $@!£ storm, or how about the one where......no we're still paying for that.........

[cem_devecioglu]

I dunno Z, I mean it hasn't always ended badly when we go into the middle east to sort out their problems has it? I mean there was the....no that was bad.....erm, what about the time..........jeesus no that was a $@!£ storm, or how about the one where......no we're still paying for that.........

 

[Dishevelled Den]

I dunno Z, I mean it hasn't always ended badly when we go into the middle east to sort out their problems has it? I mean there was the....no that was bad.....erm, what about the time..........jeesus no that was a $@!£ storm, or how about the one where......no we're still paying for that.........

Yes it puzzles me that in the current financial climate within Europe – and this country in particular - money as always found to facilitate warfare (or regime chance/liberation howsoever it's tarted up)

There's no doubt that the last 'Labour' government left quite a mess to clear up, but with the scale of fiscal rebalance proposed by the present government (much of it necessary) are there really sufficient funds remaining to permit us to continue to believe that we can actively play an important part in world affairs?

I hope the legions of those in this country who will be directly affected (in their pockets mostly)  by the attempts of this government to address the nation’s financial woes will be sensitive to the government’s plight in its concern for international matters as they wait for medical treatment, or in the line to the ‘Job’s Plus Centre’, or for an overcrowded bus or train (as they will have been priced out of private car ownership) or as they shiver with cold at home as many will be obliged to ration their energy use by virtue of the exorbitant cost of using it, destabilisation by this military action of the region we depend upon on so much as an important energy source, or the twisted thinking on climate change.

I’m not suggesting that we should abandon strategic planning all together, but if this country in such a parlous financial state I think we should be more concerned with trying to rectify this – ensuring that our own people are not disadvantaged in the process - rather than empire building in a part of the world that will perhaps never accept our right to exist in the way we presently do - never mind the legitimacy of our attempts to ‘free’ them from tyranny.

It's also quite possible that we're not fully on our financial arses after all, perhaps there's half an arse still hovering above the hopelessness that is absolute destitution – should that be the case, we can still play with the big boys with hope and a clear conscience.

[Banjax]

that is a good point Z, we always seem to find money to go to war for oil or bail out banks 

[Mysteryman]

that is a good point Z, we always seem to find money to go to war for oil or bail out banks 

We don't 'find' it, we borrow it, and usually at exhorbitant rates of interest.