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Author Topic: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability  (Read 2500 times)

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TheBoy

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Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« on: 13 May 2007, 17:02:47 »
ie, raise boiling point etc?

I thought it did, but thought I would check.


Is it OK to run the tractor without antifreeze until I have down some more flushes, probably with Fernox later this week?  This heap is costing me a small fortune in antifreeze - every flush is about £15 - £25 (£5 - £15 for the flush, £10 in antifreeze).
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michael_de

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #1 on: 13 May 2007, 17:06:44 »
anti freeze does raise the boiling point , but its also a corrosion inhibitor , however i wouldn't see an issue short term provided there is no frost .

cheers
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #2 on: 13 May 2007, 17:14:00 »
Couple of weeks with low miles should be ok.. but don't run it for long without a 50 50 mix in there

I'm sure it does raise the boil point
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TheBoy

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #3 on: 13 May 2007, 17:26:54 »
Quote
anti freeze does raise the boiling point , but its also a corrosion inhibitor , however i wouldn't see an issue short term provided there is no frost .

cheers
Yes, fully aware its a corrosion inhibitor :y

I just need to try flushing through with more and more powerful chemicals until I have got the cooling issues sorted, and hence do not want to put in antifreeze each time...
« Last Edit: 13 May 2007, 17:27:32 by TheBoy »
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michael_de

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #4 on: 13 May 2007, 17:27:35 »
50/50 mix of ethylene glycol has many advantages over pure water , melting freezing boiling points , but also the pressure is greatly reduced within the system , the flow rate is increased and the weight is reduced ,

this link gives all properties in relation to mix ratio in comparrison to pure water,

hope it helps


http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ethylene-glycol-d_146.html
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TheBoy

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #5 on: 13 May 2007, 17:31:57 »
Quote
50/50 mix of ethylene glycol has many advantages over pure water , melting freezing boiling points , but also the pressure is greatly reduced within the system , the flow rate is increased and the weight is reduced ,

this link gives all properties in relation to mix ratio in comparrison to pure water,

hope it helps


http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ethylene-glycol-d_146.html
Thanks.

Trouble is, as said earlier, I am trying stronger and stronger chemicals almost on a daily basis to solve the cooling issues, and hence the cost of the antifreeze is becoming an issue....
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Markjay

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #6 on: 13 May 2007, 17:32:17 »
Ethylene Glycol does has a higher boiling point than water, but other than in extreme hot conditions this shroud not affect cooling (the water's boiling point is already somewhat raised by the pressure). However it is also oily so lubricates the water-pump, and therefore running the engine on water only is only recommended as temporary solution. As for scale prevention and rust inhibitors which are added in the antifreeze, these could be added separately to the water (sometimes sold at motor factors as 'coolant restorers'). In short, running the engine on water for a few days should not be a problem...
« Last Edit: 13 May 2007, 17:33:50 by markjay »
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Dave-C

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #7 on: 13 May 2007, 18:22:05 »
Quote
Ethylene Glycol does has a higher boiling point than water, but other than in extreme hot conditions this shroud not affect cooling (the water's boiling point is already somewhat raised by the pressure). However it is also oily so lubricates the water-pump, and therefore running the engine on water only is only recommended as temporary solution. As for scale prevention and rust inhibitors which are added in the antifreeze, these could be added separately to the water (sometimes sold at motor factors as 'coolant restorers'). In short, running the engine on water for a few days should not be a problem...

TB Pop an egg cup full of brake fluid in with the water,  prtects the inners of the rubber pipes and lubricates the pump too..

DC
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TheBoy

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #8 on: 13 May 2007, 19:01:48 »
Quote
Quote
Ethylene Glycol does has a higher boiling point than water, but other than in extreme hot conditions this shroud not affect cooling (the water's boiling point is already somewhat raised by the pressure). However it is also oily so lubricates the water-pump, and therefore running the engine on water only is only recommended as temporary solution. As for scale prevention and rust inhibitors which are added in the antifreeze, these could be added separately to the water (sometimes sold at motor factors as 'coolant restorers'). In short, running the engine on water for a few days should not be a problem...

TB Pop an egg cup full of brake fluid in with the water,  prtects the inners of the rubber pipes and lubricates the pump too..

DC
Won't that make a real mess when it blows its cap (which it will)....
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Dave-C

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #9 on: 13 May 2007, 19:20:58 »
Quote
Quote
Quote
Ethylene Glycol does has a higher boiling point than water, but other than in extreme hot conditions this shroud not affect cooling (the water's boiling point is already somewhat raised by the pressure). However it is also oily so lubricates the water-pump, and therefore running the engine on water only is only recommended as temporary solution. As for scale prevention and rust inhibitors which are added in the antifreeze, these could be added separately to the water (sometimes sold at motor factors as 'coolant restorers'). In short, running the engine on water for a few days should not be a problem...

TB Pop an egg cup full of brake fluid in with the water,  prtects the inners of the rubber pipes and lubricates the pump too..

DC
Won't that make a real mess when it blows its cap (which it will)....


There's always Nitromorse!!!!!   ;D ;D ;D  Sorry TB, just being flippant.........

DC :-*
« Last Edit: 13 May 2007, 19:21:36 by dave_c »
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Markie

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #10 on: 13 May 2007, 19:58:40 »
obviously alredy answered but todays coolant flush got me thinking this would be the case.

My new 50-50 mix of red today and i could swear the car temperature raised slower ( not that there was ever an issue)
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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #11 on: 13 May 2007, 22:38:48 »
Quote
....
TB Pop an egg cup full of brake fluid in with the water,  prtects the inners of the rubber pipes and lubricates the pump too..

DC

I'm not on my own then in having heard of this - I've used it in tha past as a short term 'cure' for a squeaking water pump.
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Kevin Wood

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #12 on: 13 May 2007, 23:02:51 »
Antifreeze actually slightly reduces the ability of the water to absorb heat since it reduces its' density (this is why many people with marginal cooling in tuned engines ditch the antifreeze and use water wetter to prevent corrosion), but it also raises the boiling point and prevents corrosion as others have said.

Long term it would cause corrosion inside the water jacket of a mixed metal engine but given that you'll be flushing it wilth chemicals that will hopefully break that down I can't see a problem with running around on it temporarily.

It certainly doesn't make sense to keep having to pour new antifreeze down the drain so I'd go for it until it's behaving.

Kevin
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Markjay

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #13 on: 13 May 2007, 23:37:44 »
Quote
Antifreeze actually slightly reduces the ability of the water to absorb heat since it reduces its' density (this is why many people with marginal cooling in tuned engines ditch the antifreeze and use water wetter to prevent corrosion), but it also raises the boiling point and prevents corrosion as others have said...

The reduction in density and increase in boiling point actually work against each other. Apparently some boffins tested it and the best cooling is achieved with around 60% MEG and 40% water - if you go for a richer antifreeze solution the cooling ability actually starts going down again... so 100% MEG for example is not a good coolant.


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Dave-C

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Re: Does antifreeze affect cooling ability
« Reply #14 on: 14 May 2007, 19:23:29 »
Any progress?

Dave C
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