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[OhmyOmega]

Thanks Kevin
I have tried to get some adjustment between 3 & 4 but without success and any success I did have just put everything else out.  I am prety sure I had the plugs back in the right place but that is just the sort of problem I was looking for - great way to bring up a post of codes.  Will give it a try and post the result.

Thanks

[OhmyOmega]

Me again Kevin.
I have checked the connectors - all in the right place and firmly connected.  Tried turning on the ignition and waiting for all lights go out and then turning off and removing the key.  Tried 25 times then check the fault codes - unchanged.

I think I am going to have to strip it down again and get the photos - if nothing else to eliminate any possibility of the timing being out.  Will start tonight but it may be Friday before I can get it all undone again  

I'll be back

[OhmyOmega]

Eureka I think [smiley=thumbsup.gif].

I can't work out how to post a picture on here but I think it all rests on the cams for 3 & 4.  The cam is marked 3 4.  The numbers are stamped slightly to the right of the left hand timing mark 3 and is in the same place on both cams.  I have mine set to the same timing mark and I think this is where I cam going wrong.  

Methinks that cam 3 should be on the mark to the left of the 3 and cam 4 should be to the right of the 4.  

Could someone confirm.  This seems to be how it is in the Haynes manual but as usual the photos are of such poor quality it is difficult to be sure.

OTOH it cams 3 and 4 are to be on different timing marks then this would explain the problem.

Can't wait for a reply to this one.  

[jonathanh]

let me study Mr Haynes and the DVD - I'll edit the post in a few minutes to confirm

Edit: look at picture3.5b in section 2C.4.  

you need the mark to the left of 3 on cam 3 and the right of 4 on cam 4

I think you have bank 4 out.  fingers crossed the values have not met with pistons

try here for posting pics - I'll pm you with my email address and you can send direct to me if you want
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1177515338

[OhmyOmega]

Hi Jonathan.

Eureka! [smiley=grin.gif].  At last feeling really chuffed.  The job is done and running very sweetly - the roar is back.

Past mistakes apart I think I have done well.  I started about 6:30 and finished about 9:50.  Not bad for what in effect was a complete cam-belt change from scratch - and that includes stopping to take pictures.

It just goes to show that a mistake made early on can persist for a long time.

Happy that the valves have not been damaged - did a compression check at the weekend.  1 and 3 were about 150 - 160 and the rest about 170 - 180.  A drop of oil and 1 & 3 went up to 190 so happy they are OK.

I just feel so good now that it is done

[Entwood]

Glad to hear its fixed ... now if you had bought the DVD first .....  

On a serious note ... if anyone is contemplating this for the first timeI would strongly suggest buying the DVD ... it might just save a lot of worry .. its a tiny investment compared to the cost of a replacement engine .....

(plug over ...    )

[jonathanh]

Great news.  Glad to hear everything is o.k.

Yes the DVD is invaluable: a brilliant guide

[feeutfo]

Er, what do you guys think of this tip?
2 pairs of mole grips(cringe, i know, but hear me out) before you take the belt off and the cams fly out of position due to value spring pressure. Take a mole grip and pinch or nip the two cam wheels together at the 3 and 9 clock position, there they meat at the nearest position.
  Do both banks then remove belt. Fit new belt and tensioners re tension roughly, hand crank a rev. re tension to last fraction. Etc etc. Job done.
Now, mole grips will scratch your cam wheels and will put side pressure on the cam wheel bearings, but if you got no locking kit What you think?
 Obviously, buying dvd and locking kit is the way to go but if your desperate.
To late to help the guy in this thread tho
.
  

[Elite Pete]

Er, what do you guys think of this tip?
2 pairs of mole grips(cringe, i know, but hear me out) before you take the belt off and the cams fly out of position due to value spring pressure. Take a mole grip and pinch or nip the two cam wheels together at the 3 and 9 clock position, there they meat at the nearest position.
  Do both banks then remove belt. Fit new belt and tensioners re tension roughly, hand crank a rev. re tension to last fraction. Etc etc. Job done.
Now, mole grips will scratch your cam wheels and will put side pressure on the cam wheel bearings, but if you got no locking kit What you think?
 Obviously, buying dvd and locking kit is the way to go but if your desperate.
To late to help the guy in this thread tho
.
  

A recipe for disaster, the tensioners dont just tension, they have adjustment to time the cams as well.

[feeutfo]

 maybe have another read? Or maybe i have not explained it correctly. The idea is only to stop the cams flying off to their easyest position. There by completely losing your cam marks and then re timing to the wrong mark, as happened here as i understand it? You will obviously need to adjust the tensioners to give you the perfect line up but you should be no more than half a tooth out once you crank a revolution.
 Its how we did my old cdx worked a treat. Honest.

 Ar, sorry. I have used wrong terminology. When i say re tension i mean adjust.

[Kevin Wood]

Er, what do you guys think of this tip?
2 pairs of mole grips(cringe, i know, but hear me out) before you take the belt off and the cams fly out of position due to value spring pressure. Take a mole grip and pinch or nip the two cam wheels together at the 3 and 9 clock position, there they meat at the nearest position.
  Do both banks then remove belt. Fit new belt and tensioners re tension roughly, hand crank a rev. re tension to last fraction. Etc etc. Job done.
Now, mole grips will scratch your cam wheels and will put side pressure on the cam wheel bearings, but if you got no locking kit What you think?
 Obviously, buying dvd and locking kit is the way to go but if your desperate.
To late to help the guy in this thread tho
.
  

A recipe for disaster, the tensioners dont just tension, they have adjustment to time the cams as well.

.. and mole grips can easily crack the sintered steel sprockets, as well as put a lot of strain on the cam journals.

It really isn't worth messing about without the proper timing kit.

Kevin

[feeutfo]

ok ok. Let me add another tip then. NEVER use mole grips to lock your cams in place. Its a recipe for disaster and you could crack yous cam wheels. Is that a good tip? :-)

[Kevin Wood]

ok ok. Let me add another tip then. NEVER use mole grips to lock your cams in place. Its a recipe for disaster and you could crack yous cam wheels. Is that a good tip? :-)

Yep.  

I suspect if the locking tool had been used from the start the mistake wouldn't have occurred. If you insert the locking tool between the cam sprockets before the old belt comes off and remove it only once the new belt is in place the position of the cams is maintained, which is exactly what you were suggesting with the mole wrenches, so in that respect it was a good tip.

Kevin

[feeutfo]

It was my mates idea. Blame him. Still live and learn.

[jonathanh]

I guess it could work if you packed the mole grips with lots of rubber to keep the pressure on the cam sprokets down and make sure they gripped well.

Would I do it?  Would I recommend it to anyone?  Absolutely no way, ever at all.  cam timing would be way off and if you were using a VX belt without timing marks there is no way of making sure you are not a tooth out on the crank