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[tunnie]

2005's are coded to the car when fitted, don't try fitting it in another car though as it will lock it solid!

You can fit them in other cars, just enter the code. Its the NCDC 2013/2015's which are paired to the cars immobilisers and useless in other cars....

NCDC not paired to the immobiliser but generally uses the same security code 

Correct, its a bit of a hybrid system - whilst the later CAN stereos are indeed paired to the actual car itself, the NCXX stereos are simply paired to each of its own components, head, changer, telematics etc, all of which are paired together using the same pairing code from the original vehicle

 

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70

They are paired to the Display, Bluetooth (if fitted), DAB (if fitted) and thats about it.

They do have the chassis number entered into them but, this can be changed with Tech2 easily (and is also a method for getting the security code from a friendly dealer !  ) and none of the other body systems check this.

Which reminds me, Mr DTM, I have that CD70 for you to test, and ensure is in delivery mode for me

Made that loom yet? 

[Dave DND]

2005's are coded to the car when fitted, don't try fitting it in another car though as it will lock it solid!

You can fit them in other cars, just enter the code. Its the NCDC 2013/2015's which are paired to the cars immobilisers and useless in other cars....

NCDC not paired to the immobiliser but generally uses the same security code 

Correct, its a bit of a hybrid system - whilst the later CAN stereos are indeed paired to the actual car itself, the NCXX stereos are simply paired to each of its own components, head, changer, telematics etc, all of which are paired together using the same pairing code from the original vehicle

 

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70

They are paired to the Display, Bluetooth (if fitted), DAB (if fitted) and thats about it.

They do have the chassis number entered into them but, this can be changed with Tech2 easily (and is also a method for getting the security code from a friendly dealer !  ) and none of the other body systems check this.

So if the head unit has the chassis number of the car programmed into it . .

. . . . . That makes it paired to the car, doesn`t it ?

 

Agreed its not the most secure pairing, but it still pairing, and if the chassis number in the stereo is different, it won`t work.
 

[TheBoy]

2005's are coded to the car when fitted, don't try fitting it in another car though as it will lock it solid!

You can fit them in other cars, just enter the code. Its the NCDC 2013/2015's which are paired to the cars immobilisers and useless in other cars....

NCDC not paired to the immobiliser but generally uses the same security code 

Correct, its a bit of a hybrid system - whilst the later CAN stereos are indeed paired to the actual car itself, the NCXX stereos are simply paired to each of its own components, head, changer, telematics etc, all of which are paired together using the same pairing code from the original vehicle

 

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70

They are paired to the Display, Bluetooth (if fitted), DAB (if fitted) and thats about it.

They do have the chassis number entered into them but, this can be changed with Tech2 easily (and is also a method for getting the security code from a friendly dealer !  ) and none of the other body systems check this.

Which reminds me, Mr DTM, I have that CD70 for you to test, and ensure is in delivery mode for me

Made that loom yet? 

Can't get the CD70 to work with an Omega display.

[TheBoy]

2005's are coded to the car when fitted, don't try fitting it in another car though as it will lock it solid!

You can fit them in other cars, just enter the code. Its the NCDC 2013/2015's which are paired to the cars immobilisers and useless in other cars....

NCDC not paired to the immobiliser but generally uses the same security code 

Correct, its a bit of a hybrid system - whilst the later CAN stereos are indeed paired to the actual car itself, the NCXX stereos are simply paired to each of its own components, head, changer, telematics etc, all of which are paired together using the same pairing code from the original vehicle

 

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70

They are paired to the Display, Bluetooth (if fitted), DAB (if fitted) and thats about it.

They do have the chassis number entered into them but, this can be changed with Tech2 easily (and is also a method for getting the security code from a friendly dealer !  ) and none of the other body systems check this.

So if the head unit has the chassis number of the car programmed into it . .

. . . . . That makes it paired to the car, doesn`t it ?

 

Agreed its not the most secure pairing, but it still pairing, and if the chassis number in the stereo is different, it won`t work.
 

I'm guessing MDTM means that it doesn't actually check the VINs as part of security coding...

[tunnie]

2005's are coded to the car when fitted, don't try fitting it in another car though as it will lock it solid!

You can fit them in other cars, just enter the code. Its the NCDC 2013/2015's which are paired to the cars immobilisers and useless in other cars....

NCDC not paired to the immobiliser but generally uses the same security code 

Correct, its a bit of a hybrid system - whilst the later CAN stereos are indeed paired to the actual car itself, the NCXX stereos are simply paired to each of its own components, head, changer, telematics etc, all of which are paired together using the same pairing code from the original vehicle

 

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70

They are paired to the Display, Bluetooth (if fitted), DAB (if fitted) and thats about it.

They do have the chassis number entered into them but, this can be changed with Tech2 easily (and is also a method for getting the security code from a friendly dealer !  ) and none of the other body systems check this.

Which reminds me, Mr DTM, I have that CD70 for you to test, and ensure is in delivery mode for me

Made that loom yet? 

Can't get the CD70 to work with an Omega display.

Thought the loom was for that spare NCDCxx you wanted to test?  :-/

[TheBoy]

2005's are coded to the car when fitted, don't try fitting it in another car though as it will lock it solid!

You can fit them in other cars, just enter the code. Its the NCDC 2013/2015's which are paired to the cars immobilisers and useless in other cars....

NCDC not paired to the immobiliser but generally uses the same security code 

Correct, its a bit of a hybrid system - whilst the later CAN stereos are indeed paired to the actual car itself, the NCXX stereos are simply paired to each of its own components, head, changer, telematics etc, all of which are paired together using the same pairing code from the original vehicle

 

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70

They are paired to the Display, Bluetooth (if fitted), DAB (if fitted) and thats about it.

They do have the chassis number entered into them but, this can be changed with Tech2 easily (and is also a method for getting the security code from a friendly dealer !  ) and none of the other body systems check this.

Which reminds me, Mr DTM, I have that CD70 for you to test, and ensure is in delivery mode for me

Made that loom yet? 

Can't get the CD70 to work with an Omega display.

Thought the loom was for that spare NCDCxx you wanted to test?  :-/

Whats that got to do with the CD70 I was referring to in this thread?

[tunnie]

nothing... just asking if you made that loom yet   

[Marks DTM Calib]

2005's are coded to the car when fitted, don't try fitting it in another car though as it will lock it solid!

You can fit them in other cars, just enter the code. Its the NCDC 2013/2015's which are paired to the cars immobilisers and useless in other cars....

NCDC not paired to the immobiliser but generally uses the same security code 

Correct, its a bit of a hybrid system - whilst the later CAN stereos are indeed paired to the actual car itself, the NCXX stereos are simply paired to each of its own components, head, changer, telematics etc, all of which are paired together using the same pairing code from the original vehicle

 

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70

They are paired to the Display, Bluetooth (if fitted), DAB (if fitted) and thats about it.

They do have the chassis number entered into them but, this can be changed with Tech2 easily (and is also a method for getting the security code from a friendly dealer !  ) and none of the other body systems check this.

So if the head unit has the chassis number of the car programmed into it . .

. . . . . That makes it paired to the car, doesn`t it ?

 

Agreed its not the most secure pairing, but it still pairing, and if the chassis number in the stereo is different, it won`t work.
 

No, chassis number is only in the display or maybe it was the headunit but (cant recall), its only in one of them. The software on any of the units or even the vehicle does nothing with respect to checking chassis numbers (I ran mine for a few weeks with the wrong chassis number as a check)

The only thing they do is the same as the NCDC's...they check the pin number (or at least an encoded version of it) when turned on.

[Dave DND]

Nope, disagree completely

Chassis number is in both display and head unit, as is the PUK code, but is often encrypted, and not always shown as a straight 17 digit VIN. - depends on software version of head unit.

Some of the Delco head unts can have VIN number stored in up to three locations also, and one of these will always be encrypted.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Nope, disagree completely

Chassis number is in both display and head unit, as is the PUK code, but is often encrypted, and not always shown as a straight 17 digit VIN. - depends on software version of head unit.

Some of the Delco head unts can have VIN number stored in up to three locations also, and one of these will always be encrypted.

Ok, well thats put some T2 facts in here then to get the in car findings (and clearly, when doing some of the programming, the unit firmware may well place some of the info in multiple places).

T2 only gives access to programming (and re-programming) VIN number on one of the units. This is how I un-paired my second hand set as I read the VIN number with T2 and then ordered the PIN number from Vx based on this info.

I ran my setup, having not un-paired or changed the VIN number on it for 2 months and hence it was effectively 'alien' to the car but, no faults were reported on any other systems and it functioned perfectly.

Once I got round to getting the PIN number I simply went in and unpaired the setup (whilst fitted in the car), then re-paired it using my vehicle PIN and then changed the VIN using T2.

The only change is it now has the correct PIN for the vehicle and VIN is updated to match the chassis.

Job done. 

[Dave DND]

Nope, disagree completely

Chassis number is in both display and head unit, as is the PUK code, but is often encrypted, and not always shown as a straight 17 digit VIN. - depends on software version of head unit.

Some of the Delco head unts can have VIN number stored in up to three locations also, and one of these will always be encrypted.

Ok, well thats put some T2 facts in here then to get the in car findings (and clearly, when doing some of the programming, the unit firmware may well place some of the info in multiple places).

T2 only gives access to programming (and re-programming) VIN number on one of the units. This is how I un-paired my second hand set as I read the VIN number with T2 and then ordered the PIN number from Vx based on this info.

I ran my setup, having not un-paired or changed the VIN number on it for 2 months and hence it was effectively 'alien' to the car but, no faults were reported on any other systems and it functioned perfectly.

Once I got round to getting the PIN number I simply went in and unpaired the setup (whilst fitted in the car), then re-paired it using my vehicle PIN and then changed the VIN using T2.

The only change is it now has the correct PIN for the vehicle and VIN is updated to match the chassis.

Job done. 

From your descriptions, I`m guessing that you are using a very early Blaupunkt CD30 ? It has virtually zero encryption and the data can easily be viewed.

Some of the later ones will require you to monitor the CAN data communications as well, and you will find that the Tech2 is exceptionally limited in what it can analyse.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Nope, disagree completely

Chassis number is in both display and head unit, as is the PUK code, but is often encrypted, and not always shown as a straight 17 digit VIN. - depends on software version of head unit.

Some of the Delco head unts can have VIN number stored in up to three locations also, and one of these will always be encrypted.

Ok, well thats put some T2 facts in here then to get the in car findings (and clearly, when doing some of the programming, the unit firmware may well place some of the info in multiple places).

T2 only gives access to programming (and re-programming) VIN number on one of the units. This is how I un-paired my second hand set as I read the VIN number with T2 and then ordered the PIN number from Vx based on this info.

I ran my setup, having not un-paired or changed the VIN number on it for 2 months and hence it was effectively 'alien' to the car but, no faults were reported on any other systems and it functioned perfectly.

Once I got round to getting the PIN number I simply went in and unpaired the setup (whilst fitted in the car), then re-paired it using my vehicle PIN and then changed the VIN using T2.

The only change is it now has the correct PIN for the vehicle and VIN is updated to match the chassis.

Job done. 

From your descriptions, I`m guessing that you are using a very early Blaupunkt CD30 ? It has virtually zero encryption and the data can easily be viewed.

Some of the later ones will require you to monitor the CAN data communications as well, and you will find that the Tech2 is exceptionally limited in what it can analyse.

Nope, tested using a 2007 CD30 MP3 and a 2007 CD70 (dates taken from radio label).

Both used with a CID and GID 

[Dave DND]

Actualy, the later CAN bus setups arnt paried to the car either. I have done loads of testing for that on my mum bus with a CD30MP3 and CD70 . . . .

. . . . Once I got round to getting the PIN number I simply went in and unpaired the setup (whilst fitted in the car), then re-paired it using my vehicle PIN and then changed the VIN using T2.

Not disputing how they are programmed using the vehicle pin number, I`m disputing the fact that you said that they are not programmed to the car.

So why do you need the vehicle PIN number to be entered then before it will work in the car?

To me, thats a paired unit !!   

I ran my setup, having not un-paired or changed the VIN number on it for 2 months and hence it was effectively 'alien' to the car but, no faults were reported on any other systems and it functioned perfectly.

In the early days of swapping these around, the heads and displays were sold as matched pairs, and it was found that they worked fine together, and in a vehicle without the need for any PIN codes to be entered. However, there is a very dark and expensive downside to this - when connected to Tech2, and a particular application performed, the unknown pin and radio details from the new radio could actually be irreversibly transferred to the rest of the vehicle meaning that future interrogation of Tech2 could no longer be performed as the vehicle PIN code had been altered and is now effectively unknown. It can be a four figure job to put right -

Should you be amongst the many in this situation, we can now rewrite many of the ECU`s affected, but not all.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Not disputing how they are programmed using the vehicle pin number, I`m disputing the fact that you said that they are not programmed to the car.

There not though, if they were then the BCM, REC, UEC, ECU etc etc would be looking at the radio or display PIN (or the VIN) during power up (e.g. ignition on) and blocking the functions off. It does not do this outside of the radio/display (plus ancillaries e.g. DAB and Bluetooth) and hence from a security perspective, sits as a standalone setup.

Hence its not coded to the car.

And if somebody was insanely incompitent with Tech2 and did blow the pin through (I will double check but not seen a function for VIN/PIN alignment) then again, its simply a case of getting the PIN from Vx using the (in-correct for the vehicle) VIN number and reversing the damage.

Simples! 

[Dave DND]

Not disputing how they are programmed using the vehicle pin number, I`m disputing the fact that you said that they are not programmed to the car.

There not though, if they were then the BCM, REC, UEC, ECU etc etc would be looking at the radio or display PIN (or the VIN) during power up (e.g. ignition on) and blocking the functions off. It does not do this outside of the radio/display (plus ancillaries e.g. DAB and Bluetooth) and hence from a security perspective, sits as a standalone setup.

Hence its not coded to the car.

And if somebody was insanely incompitent with Tech2 and did blow the pin through (I will double check but not seen a function for VIN/PIN alignment) then again, its simply a case of getting the PIN from Vx using the (in-correct for the vehicle) VIN number and reversing the damage.

Simples! 

I think we`ll agree to differ on this one.