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[TheBoy]

We must stop using Tunnie as a benchmark it really isn't fair. (snigger)

I shouldn't embarrass him and publically post that Mrs TB, a girl, has more feel for the chassis than he does 

[05omegav6]

It must have been dry when T drove it then Currently have them fitted to the front of mine, (emergency purchase and it was either them or Duruns). Show them a drop of moisture and the car instantly understeers like a deer on ice

[TheBoy]

It must have been dry when T drove it then Currently have them fitted to the front of mine, (emergency purchase and it was either them or Duruns). Show them a drop of moisture and the car instantly understeers like a deer on ice

Indeed, a truely lethal tyre, impossible to control with even the slightest amount of moisture on the road.

Some may think I drove it too hard, but I lost the back in the summer, on a day where it had rained early (roads not wet, just damp), on a roundabout, at about 15mph.

[05omegav6]

It must have been dry when T drove it then Currently have them fitted to the front of mine, (emergency purchase and it was either them or Duruns). Show them a drop of moisture and the car instantly understeers like a deer on ice

Indeed, a truely lethal tyre, impossible to control with even the slightest amount of moisture on the road.

Some may think I drove it too hard, but I lost the back in the summer, on a day where it had rained early (roads not wet, just damp), on a roundabout, at about 15mph.

Quite entertaining when you expect/instigate it, downright terrifying when you don't 

[cem_devecioglu]

1.you will demand acceleration, braking and cornering..  everyone wants the same..

But my idea of those clearly is different to a PS3 driver's idea of the same. OK, I'll concede the PS3 has a stunning stopping ability in the dry.

Additionally, tunnie for example, wants none of those, he wants something that lasts a million miles, and doesn't care about grip.
 

2.Tyre tests are done by serious organizaions like TUV or others.. physical measurements are done with different tyre brands .. can you claim you will run 100 metres faster than Usain bolt under different conditions 

It matters not who do them. Unless the comparison is done on the same car, by the same driver, its invalid. Has no meaning. Pointless.

I can assure you, Pirelli P6000 (a rather mediocre tyre IMHO) is not a good tyre on the Omega. Its 'OK', but not good. On my previous Astras, it was quite poor. On my little Rover, its stunning. Brilliant. Can't praise it enough. I would also say, on the Rover, there was a marked difference in handling between the H and V rated ones.

So even with the same sized car, same driver, tthe same tyre can swing both ends of the scale with different cars.
 

3. cant agree

Understandable if we can't agree on first 2 points

I will never listen to any review unless its done by someone who makes the same compromises as me, drives a similar style to me, and is done on the same car, set up similar to mine. Otherwise its a waste of time. IMHO.

1.. you can also add longevity.. this is also something desired in common..
 
2. tyres are physical and chemical structures.. so do the road asphalt.. and tire grip is a function of tire compound , thread shape and road surface .. its called friction coefficient..and its independant from mass or any other forces..  its obvious you give more importance to cars suspension setup and driver than they deserve .. of course they do effect, but in science when measuring factors you keep some parameters fix to solve the problem..besides with respect to phsysic laws the manin component that keeps you on the road is this fricition coefficient.. you can not change that by changing car or the driver..
 
if measurements was useless we would still live  in stone age..
 
and finally the measured braking distances, acceleration and lateral grip will be proportional with respect to brand in any other car.. but claiming a tire will have a better lateral grip or stopping distance than the test measurement and beating other better rivals is simply against science.. Like the Usain Bolt example..
 
tyre companies spend serious money during development phase and they advance .. how ? because they measure.. if tyres behave absolutely different in other cars, they would be happy and stop spending money..
 
if you have time, please take a glance at this link..
 
http://www.motortrend.com/features/consumer/1103_goodyear_eagle_f1_asymmetric_2_tire_test/viewall.html
 
you will see how much effort is spent..  From my point of view neglecting all this work is emotional than being logical..

[feeutfo]

Tyre companys dont run tests by journalists cem. And nobody runs tests on omegas!

[cem_devecioglu]

1.you will demand acceleration, braking and cornering..  everyone wants the same..

But my idea of those clearly is different to a PS3 driver's idea of the same. OK, I'll concede the PS3 has a stunning stopping ability in the dry.

Additionally, tunnie for example, wants none of those, he wants something that lasts a million miles, and doesn't care about grip.
 

2.Tyre tests are done by serious organizaions like TUV or others.. physical measurements are done with different tyre brands .. can you claim you will run 100 metres faster than Usain bolt under different conditions 

It matters not who do them. Unless the comparison is done on the same car, by the same driver, its invalid. Has no meaning. Pointless.

I can assure you, Pirelli P6000 (a rather mediocre tyre IMHO) is not a good tyre on the Omega. Its 'OK', but not good. On my previous Astras, it was quite poor. On my little Rover, its stunning. Brilliant. Can't praise it enough. I would also say, on the Rover, there was a marked difference in handling between the H and V rated ones.

So even with the same sized car, same driver, tthe same tyre can swing both ends of the scale with different cars.
 

3. cant agree

Understandable if we can't agree on first 2 points

I will never listen to any review unless its done by someone who makes the same compromises as me, drives a similar style to me, and is done on the same car, set up similar to mine. Otherwise its a waste of time. IMHO.

1.. you can also add longevity.. this is also something desired in common..
 
2. tyres are physical and chemical structures.. so do the road asphalt.. and tire grip is a function of tire compound , thread shape and road surface .. its called friction coefficient..and its independant from mass or any other forces..  its obvious you give more importance to cars suspension setup and driver than they deserve .. of course they do effect, but in science when measuring factors you keep some parameters fix to solve the problem..besides with respect to physic laws the main component that keeps you on the road is this friction coefficient.. you can not change that by changing car or the driver..
 
if measurements was useless we would still live  in stone age..
 
and finally the measured braking distances, acceleration and lateral grip will be proportional with respect to brand in any other car.. but claiming a tire will have a better lateral grip or stopping distance than the test measurement and beating other better rivals is simply against science.. Like the Usain Bolt example..
 
tyre companies spend serious money during development phase and they advance .. how ? because they measure.. if tyres behave absolutely different in other cars, they would be happy and stop spending money..
 
if you have time, please take a glance at this link..
 
http://www.motortrend.com/features/consumer/1103_goodyear_eagle_f1_asymmetric_2_tire_test/viewall.html
 
you will see how much effort is spent..  From my point of view neglecting all this work is emotional than being logical..

[cem_devecioglu]

Tyre companys dont run tests by journalists cem. And nobody runs tests on omegas!

journalists reflect what tests and trials are done for that specific tire Chris.. Omega is an ordinary German car similiar size length like others.. similiar suspension setups are also used on other cars..  so dont change the equation..
 
 

[feeutfo]

Tyre companys dont run tests by journalists cem. And nobody runs tests on omegas!

journalists reflect what tests and trials are done for that specific tire Chris.. Omega is an ordinary German car similiar size length like others.. similiar suspension setups are also used on other cars..  so dont change the equation..
 
 

I haven't changed the equation, the tyre manufacturers do, by making tyres to suit specific cars. And I can tell you catagorcally that an sc3 for an Audi handles differently to an sc3 for a Merc when fitted to an omega.

Now if we're to follow an open minded view, I'm expecting you to ask me what exactly I mean by handling.

[TheBoy]

2. tyres are physical and chemical structures.. so do the road asphalt.. and tire grip is a function of tire compound , thread shape and road surface .. its called friction coefficient..and its independant from mass or any other forces..  its obvious you give more importance to cars suspension setup and driver than they deserve .. of course they do effect, but in science when measuring factors you keep some parameters fix to solve the problem..besides with respect to phsysic laws the manin component that keeps you on the road is this fricition coefficient.. you can not change that by changing car or the driver..

You are forgetting all about the forces applied, and how that affects grip. This is also a key part of the jigsaw, and something every car will do differently, as they have different ways of forcing the tyre into the tarmac.

So car has a huge difference in how a tyre will react, as I have shown in an earlier post with my experience of P6000.

[feeutfo]

That being, geometry! Every car is different, even the next one off the production line. Or even the next one off WIM's ramp. ( ok, being fussy now, but it does happen )

[TheBoy]

That being, geometry! Every car is different, even the next one off the production line. Or even the next one off WIM's ramp. ( ok, being fussy now, but it does happen )

Not just geometry, but suspension design as well. Double wishbone cars put different forces across the tyre width than, for example, McPherson.

[feeutfo]

That being, geometry! Every car is different, even the next one off the production line. Or even the next one off WIM's ramp. ( ok, being fussy now, but it does happen )

Not just geometry, but suspension design as well. Double wishbone cars put different forces across the tyre width than, for example, McPherson.

quite so.

[cem_devecioglu]

I'll recommend to read some more physics.. end of 

[TheBoy]

I'll recommend to read some more physics.. end of 

Gave that up after A levels...