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[Martin_1962]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

[Gaffers]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

lol that was my first PC!!!  I total of 4mb RAM and 30MB HD, what a beast!  

[Martin_1962]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

lol that was my first PC!!!  I total of 4mb RAM and 30MB HD, what a beast!  

First job Apricot 286 1MB 30MB HDD Hercules graphics

[cem_devecioglu]

Hi TB, dont get me wrong, vista is a very good upgrade from xp pro. my points were aimed at the initial launch of vista when there were massive compatability problems. i was one of the first wave of people to go out and buy a retail copy . but the problems i had trying to install it you would'nt believe. you could'nt get drivers for anything. i even had to use an xp emulator to fool my printer and scanner into thinking i was still running xp.
These days things are much better and most things are vista ready (plug and play). i just hope that windows 7 is launched in a more proffesioal way and Microsoft do the ground work before launch, not after.
Did'nt mean to slag off the OS just the way it was launched.
Mark

Microsoft's problem was launching Vista late.  XP was around for so long, that most programmers got lazy, and some of the programming rules they broke became the normality.  Then these apps were broken under Vista's stricter regime.

As for drivers, thats not MS's fault, hopefully vendors have learnt their lesson now, but then I said the same things shortly after XP was launched!

Agreed..

[jereboam]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

[cem_devecioglu]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

 

Thats my birth year..I though I was an old IT man here

[Kevin Wood]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

This is the problem IMHO. Too much was changed when it didn't need to be. Let's face it: an operating system is a mundane piece of software that allows users to run programs, store files and, increasingly, provide a secure environment in which to do it.

Ever since windows 95, the same basic user interface has been honed through 98, ME (shudder), NT4, W2K and XP. Changes have been made, but never on such a massive scale that users got overwhelmed.

That all changed with vista. I suspect the software engineers got carried away with the task of developing a boring operating system and started doing what comes naturally to them - adding bloatware features because they're "cool".

Granted, a lot of the boring things like security have been enhanced but that's not what the end user appreciates. The end user spends 5 minutes trying to do what he did in 5 seconds before and concludes that it's "cr@p" because nothing is where it used to be. He then loses out on all the good work that had gone into making it more secure, etc.

Kevin

[TheBoy]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

Initially, I struggled to 'get' the interface.  However, once it 'clicked' it all became clear.  Most of the interface difficulties are based around us knowing XP too well....

[TheBoy]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

This is the problem IMHO. Too much was changed when it didn't need to be. Let's face it: an operating system is a mundane piece of software that allows users to run programs, store files and, increasingly, provide a secure environment in which to do it.

Ever since windows 95, the same basic user interface has been honed through 98, ME (shudder), NT4, W2K and XP. Changes have been made, but never on such a massive scale that users got overwhelmed.

That all changed with vista. I suspect the software engineers got carried away with the task of developing a boring operating system and started doing what comes naturally to them - adding bloatware features because they're "cool".

Granted, a lot of the boring things like security have been enhanced but that's not what the end user appreciates. The end user spends 5 minutes trying to do what he did in 5 seconds before and concludes that it's "cr@p" because nothing is where it used to be. He then loses out on all the good work that had gone into making it more secure, etc.

Kevin

I think the XP interface was more radical in some ways, only most of us chose to immediately put it into Classic - things like control panel etc.  I still know many people who cannot handle change and modify their XP to look exactly like W2K...

[cem_devecioglu]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

This is the problem IMHO. Too much was changed when it didn't need to be. Let's face it: an operating system is a mundane piece of software that allows users to run programs, store files and, increasingly, provide a secure environment in which to do it.

Ever since windows 95, the same basic user interface has been honed through 98, ME (shudder), NT4, W2K and XP. Changes have been made, but never on such a massive scale that users got overwhelmed.

That all changed with vista. I suspect the software engineers got carried away with the task of developing a boring operating system and started doing what comes naturally to them - adding bloatware features because they're "cool".

Granted, a lot of the boring things like security have been enhanced but that's not what the end user appreciates. The end user spends 5 minutes trying to do what he did in 5 seconds before and concludes that it's "cr@p" because nothing is where it used to be. He then loses out on all the good work that had gone into making it more secure, etc.

Kevin

I think the XP interface was more radical in some ways, only most of us chose to immediately put it into Classic - things like control panel etc.  I still know many people who cannot handle change and modify their XP to look exactly like W2K...

another here

[TheBoy]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

This is the problem IMHO. Too much was changed when it didn't need to be. Let's face it: an operating system is a mundane piece of software that allows users to run programs, store files and, increasingly, provide a secure environment in which to do it.

Ever since windows 95, the same basic user interface has been honed through 98, ME (shudder), NT4, W2K and XP. Changes have been made, but never on such a massive scale that users got overwhelmed.

That all changed with vista. I suspect the software engineers got carried away with the task of developing a boring operating system and started doing what comes naturally to them - adding bloatware features because they're "cool".

Granted, a lot of the boring things like security have been enhanced but that's not what the end user appreciates. The end user spends 5 minutes trying to do what he did in 5 seconds before and concludes that it's "cr@p" because nothing is where it used to be. He then loses out on all the good work that had gone into making it more secure, etc.

Kevin

I think the XP interface was more radical in some ways, only most of us chose to immediately put it into Classic - things like control panel etc.  I still know many people who cannot handle change and modify their XP to look exactly like W2K...

another here

- I did too for the first couple of months

[cem_devecioglu]

I've been in IT since the 286 (nearly 20 years) and I know I don't know a lot.

However I do know CA-Clipper inside out and can develop an ISAM database extremely well.

If we're into "my dad's bigger than your dad", I've been in IT since 1966, long before micro procesors and PCs.

My only experience of Vista was the on the laptop I bought for my son before he went off to University last year.  We were unimpressed.  I'm sorry, I don't care how good it is technically, the UI is absolutely horrid!  We had problems connecting it to the home network and the internet, the help facility didn't and it just looked so garish.  

I like XP Pro, and I do run as an admin, but, believe me, the wife and brat definitely don't!

This is the problem IMHO. Too much was changed when it didn't need to be. Let's face it: an operating system is a mundane piece of software that allows users to run programs, store files and, increasingly, provide a secure environment in which to do it.

Ever since windows 95, the same basic user interface has been honed through 98, ME (shudder), NT4, W2K and XP. Changes have been made, but never on such a massive scale that users got overwhelmed.

That all changed with vista. I suspect the software engineers got carried away with the task of developing a boring operating system and started doing what comes naturally to them - adding bloatware features because they're "cool".

Granted, a lot of the boring things like security have been enhanced but that's not what the end user appreciates. The end user spends 5 minutes trying to do what he did in 5 seconds before and concludes that it's "cr@p" because nothing is where it used to be. He then loses out on all the good work that had gone into making it more secure, etc.

Kevin

I think the XP interface was more radical in some ways, only most of us chose to immediately put it into Classic - things like control panel etc.  I still know many people who cannot handle change and modify their XP to look exactly like W2K...

another here

- I did too for the first couple of months

erm still same here

[Kevin Wood]

I think the XP interface was more radical in some ways, only most of us chose to immediately put it into Classic - things like control panel etc.  I still know many people who cannot handle change and modify their XP to look exactly like W2K...

 

Yep. First thing I did.

 

That's the point though, in a way. No one tries to make people "upgrade" to cars you can steer with your feet or lawn mowers that you pull round the garden instead of push. Once a convention has been established it's best to stick with it, unless it's going to be as important as the transition from command prompt to graphical interface. If it 'ain't broke...

Kevin

[TheBoy]

I think the XP interface was more radical in some ways, only most of us chose to immediately put it into Classic - things like control panel etc.  I still know many people who cannot handle change and modify their XP to look exactly like W2K...

 

Yep. First thing I did.

 

That's the point though, in a way. No one tries to make people "upgrade" to cars you can steer with your feet or lawn mowers that you pull round the garden instead of push. Once a convention has been established it's best to stick with it, unless it's going to be as important as the transition from command prompt to graphical interface. If it 'ain't broke...

Kevin

The old XP interface was fine for us experienced with it.  But Vista's interface is easier for newcomers apparently.  Us - being good with computers - should be able to adapt better, but many IT types are old stuck-in-the-muds, myself included

[Martin_1962]

My XP has the 98 style start menus but the nice blue boxes for windows.

ALL animations are disabled - as they should always be