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[Nickbat]

BJ,
For the sake of maintaining civility on the forum, I shall ignore the comments you made about me being paranoid.

Perhaps you would care to comment on the following:

1. "Personal carbon rations would have to be mandatory, imposed by Government in the same way that food rationing was introduced in the UK in 1939"

Source of PDF from which above was taken: House of Commons Environmental Audit Committee.
See http://circa.europa.eu/Public/irc/env/action_climat/library?l=/european_council/_EN_1.0_&a=d


2. "The quasi-religious nature of AGW is evidenced by the rancour which is generated when people like me express scepticism about the theory. Scepticism is an essential part of science which has, until recently, been a “small-l liberal” pursuit in which the opinions of doubters were respected. Now we sceptics are called “deniers” and, by implication, lumped in with neo-Nazis who question the Holocaust. The accusation that we are somehow in the sway of the oil companies and similar big business interests is commonplace and indeed is the chief argument of non-scientist supporters of the AGW theory. This echoes the “work of the Devil” argument of fundamentalist Christians; it is a mental trick by which the faithful avoid facing the real issues."

– Scientist John Reid, PhD in Upper Atmospheric Physics and former employee of CSIRO’s Division of Oceanography (Australia), i.e. someone who knows about the science.

http://www.quadrant.org.au/magazine/issue/2009/10/climate-modelling-nonsense

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

So angry ......yet again Nickbat.. .......is it any wonder that Bannjaxx and I .....yank your chain(in jest ).......every now and again.
You seem to take it very personally ......when another person takes a different view from your own entrenched position.
With regard to global warming.....could I be wrong?..........YES OF COURSE I COULD.......is it likely?. .....................Well...... with the PROFESSIONAL evidence available at the moment....I think not.
Is it just possible that you could be wrong Nickbat?.

Yes, I am angry. And I will continue to be angry because I have two young children who deserve to live in a free world. There is nothing free about the world envisaged by the environmentalists. Why, they even suggest we should have carbon ration cards, so that every time we buy fuel or travel, it would be limited to our budget (and recorded by the government).

No, after all I have read, I do not believe in the climate scam. My doubts are reinforced by the refusal to hand over data for independent scrutiny, by the bizarre "loss" of data by the Hadley Centre, by the censoring of all sceptical comments by The Guardian and others. The list goes on.

Furthermore, even if global warming were true, the catastrophes suggested by the warmists are many decades off and only technological advances, paid for by the Western industrialised nations, will provide alternatives to fossil fuel use.

I am angry when it seems this country is so absorbed by Corrie and Boyzone that they fail to lift their eyes and notice the elephant in the room.      

I fully agree with both yourself ....and Zulu on this point.
During the era of the Moon landings 1969-72.....obese.....Trailer trash  Americans would regularly contact the TV networks......and angrily ask why their favourite soap opera.....I Love Lucy...( with the excretable Lucille Ball )....had been delayed by 30 minutes ......just because "Man".....had landed on another world :-/ :-/ :-/
Here in Britain ................more people will vote on "The X factor".....than at a general election......Very sad.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

theres seems to be some confusion here Nickbat - i'm interested in how you go about your day to day life, trusting nothing that "they" tell you - if your watch says its 4pm how can you be sure that isn't just what they want you to think? you're displaying classic paranoid symptoms - let me ask you some multiple choice questions:

1) do you wear a tin foil hat incase the government try to steal your thoughts?
a) don't be ridiculous
b) i used to, but not anymore
c) who told you about the tin foil hat?

2) you're happy to pay tax to fund banker bonuses, yet you foam at the mouth at the very idea a smidgeon of tax goes to help poorer, developing countries. Why is this?
a) i am a banker
b) i'm livid at the thought of helping anyone other than myself
c) seriously, who told you about the tin foil hat?

3) I refuse to believe in man-made climate change - it's all one big con and I protest. Is this statement true or false?
a) True - I am a climate change protestor
b) False - I am not a climate change protestor

Are you teasing Mr Nickbat again Bannjaxx.......shame on you.

[Dishevelled Den]

theres seems to be some confusion here Nickbat - i'm interested in how you go about your day to day life, trusting nothing that "they" tell you - if your watch says its 4pm how can you be sure that isn't just what they want you to think? you're displaying classic paranoid symptoms - let me ask you some multiple choice questions:

1) do you wear a tin foil hat incase the government try to steal your thoughts?
a) don't be ridiculous
b) i used to, but not anymore
c) who told you about the tin foil hat?

2) you're happy to pay tax to fund banker bonuses, yet you foam at the mouth at the very idea a smidgeon of tax goes to help poorer, developing countries. Why is this?
a) i am a banker
b) i'm livid at the thought of helping anyone other than myself
c) seriously, who told you about the tin foil hat?

3) I refuse to believe in man-made climate change - it's all one big con and I protest. Is this statement true or false?
a) True - I am a climate change protestor
b) False - I am not a climate change protestor

Are you teasing Mr Nickbat again Bannjaxx.......shame on you.

...Very naughty indeed Optio when one considers this posting in his Super Dario thread

Top bloke - can't help thinking that if he was English rather than Scottish he'd be a household name tho 

.....Oh I say!!!  :-? :-? :-? :-?

You'll be posting this next



[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJ5fLBEpKo8&feature=related[/media]

[PhilRich]

Sex, Politics, Religion, and now Climate Change etc, etc. You can all argue the toss from now until doomsday and you wont change a bloody thing, because the majority of mankind dont give a flying f*ck about any of it, they are only interested in No. 1 and their immediate nearest & dearest. We are all just Pi**ing against the wind!

[Banjax]

Sex, Politics, Religion, and now Climate Change etc, etc. You can all argue the toss from now until doomsday and you wont change a bloody thing, because the majority of mankind dont give a flying f*ck about any of it, they are only interested in No. 1 and their immediate nearest & dearest. We are all just Pi**ing against the wind!

thats almost exactly what i think - mankind is completely incapable solving this issue - some brave souls rail against change, but really, why bother? you can have all the hurricanes, tsunamis, storms, floods and bush fires setting unprecedented records year on year and some loonies will claim it's all the plan of some invisible super-being, others that it's completely natural, some will argue that maybe we've got a hand in this and maybe...just maybe we should try to reduce our emissions - if they're wrong whats the worst that could happen? a few industries are a bit cleaner and more efficient? if they're right tho....we're completely stuffed.

then theres people like me who know we won't do a damn thing but love a good argument 


the reason we'll fail - and we will fail - is precisely as Nickbat has demonstrated, people hate facing up to responsibility and latch onto whoever tells them its all a big lie - you'll never lose money betting that humans are greedy, self serving parasites - i include myself in this too 

[waspy]

Sex, Politics, Religion, and now Climate Change etc, etc. You can all argue the toss from now until doomsday and you wont change a bloody thing, because the majority of mankind dont give a flying f*ck about any of it, they are only interested in No. 1 and their immediate nearest & dearest. We are all just Pi**ing against the wind!

I give a f*ck about sex & i do regulary (not sure about the flying part though), but you're bang (no pun) on about the others

[Nickbat]

Sex, Politics, Religion, and now Climate Change etc, etc. You can all argue the toss from now until doomsday and you wont change a bloody thing, because the majority of mankind dont give a flying f*ck about any of it, they are only interested in No. 1 and their immediate nearest & dearest. We are all just Pi**ing against the wind!

thats almost exactly what i think - mankind is completely incapable solving this issue - some brave souls rail against change, but really, why bother? you can have all the hurricanes, tsunamis, storms, floods and bush fires setting unprecedented records year on year and some loonies will claim it's all the plan of some invisible super-being, others that it's completely natural, some will argue that maybe we've got a hand in this and maybe...just maybe we should try to reduce our emissions - if they're wrong whats the worst that could happen? a few industries are a bit cleaner and more efficient? if they're right tho....we're completely stuffed.

then theres people like me who know we won't do a damn thing but love a good argument 


the reason we'll fail - and we will fail - is precisely as Nickbat has demonstrated, people hate facing up to responsibility and latch onto whoever tells them its all a big lie - you'll never lose money betting that humans are greedy, self serving parasites - i include myself in this too 

Now you're being very objectionable.

[Nickbat]

"The accelerating moral panic about alleged global warming and its projected catastrophic effects is a fundamentally religious phenomenon. Despite its pretensions, it is not primarily about science. Rather, it represents the emergence of a new religious movement (an NRM, or what used to be called a ‘cult’). This new form of eco-fundamentalism is characterized by a widely excessive faith in science, a hatred and despair at Humanity, an intolerance of opposition or even skepticism, and a near hysterical form of secular Apocalypticism."

Merv Bendle, Senior lecturer in History & Communications at James Cook University

http://climaterealists.com/index.php?id=4195

[Dishevelled Den]

Sex, Politics, Religion, and now Climate Change etc, etc. You can all argue the toss from now until doomsday and you wont change a bloody thing, because the majority of mankind dont give a flying f*ck about any of it, they are only interested in No. 1 and their immediate nearest & dearest. We are all just Pi**ing against the wind!

thats almost exactly what i think - mankind is completely incapable solving this issue - some brave souls rail against change, but really, why bother? you can have all the hurricanes, tsunamis, storms, floods and bush fires setting unprecedented records year on year and some loonies will claim it's all the plan of some invisible super-being, others that it's completely natural, some will argue that maybe we've got a hand in this and maybe...just maybe we should try to reduce our emissions - if they're wrong whats the worst that could happen? a few industries are a bit cleaner and more efficient? if they're right tho....we're completely stuffed.

then theres people like me who know we won't do a damn thing but love a good argument 


the reason we'll fail - and we will fail - is precisely as Nickbat has demonstrated, people hate facing up to responsibility and latch onto whoever tells them its all a big lie - you'll never lose money betting that humans are greedy, self serving parasites - i include myself in this too 

......that's such a negative generalisation bj.

It seems to border on the voyeuristic tendency some people adopt when they take pleasure in denigrating the attempts made by some others in establishing the veracity - or otherwise - of material presented, the consequences of which, will quite possibly have a dramatic result in how each and everyone of us lives our lives from this point forward.

Furthermore it’s very unhelpful to suggest that this is a binary matter, it’s far from it – there’s plenty can be done in a constructive and responsible way to lighten our collective footprint.


I certainly don’t consider myself a greedy self-serving parasite. 

[Banjax]

Sex, Politics, Religion, and now Climate Change etc, etc. You can all argue the toss from now until doomsday and you wont change a bloody thing, because the majority of mankind dont give a flying f*ck about any of it, they are only interested in No. 1 and their immediate nearest & dearest. We are all just Pi**ing against the wind!

thats almost exactly what i think - mankind is completely incapable solving this issue - some brave souls rail against change, but really, why bother? you can have all the hurricanes, tsunamis, storms, floods and bush fires setting unprecedented records year on year and some loonies will claim it's all the plan of some invisible super-being, others that it's completely natural, some will argue that maybe we've got a hand in this and maybe...just maybe we should try to reduce our emissions - if they're wrong whats the worst that could happen? a few industries are a bit cleaner and more efficient? if they're right tho....we're completely stuffed.

then theres people like me who know we won't do a damn thing but love a good argument 


the reason we'll fail - and we will fail - is precisely as Nickbat has demonstrated, people hate facing up to responsibility and latch onto whoever tells them its all a big lie - you'll never lose money betting that humans are greedy, self serving parasites - i include myself in this too 

......that's such a negative generalisation bj.

It seems to border on the voyeuristic tendency some people adopt when they take pleasure in denigrating the attempts made by some others in establishing the veracity - or otherwise - of material presented, the consequences of which, will quite possibly have a dramatic result in how each and everyone of us lives our lives from this point forward.

Furthermore it’s very unhelpful to suggest that this is a binary matter, it’s far from it – there’s plenty can be done in a constructive and responsible way to lighten our collective footprint.


I certainly don’t consider myself a greedy self-serving parasite. 

the ones who pull the strings are zulu - thats ultimately what determines our fate, a cabal of powerful nations making decisions on the planet based on being re-elected by a largely gullible and apathetic populous. if it starts hitting the sheep in the pocket they'll feel it at the ballot box, ergo we, as a race of beings will do nothing, zip, nada, bupkiss to save ourselves 

and i'm the last person to swallow any line given by the government, my default position is cynic 

in this whole debate tho, at first, politicians didn't want to know - the ravings of a few mad greenies, nothing to worry about....time passed and slowly scientific evidence became available, studies were done (at first suppressed by industry and governments) when the tide turned and most people think - hang on - maybe there is something to this...thats when politicians began to clamber over each other to jump on the green bandwagon. now, in their quest to retain power, they've stumbled on a truth. when the general populous discovers how much repairing the damage (actually not even that, simply slowing down the rate) will cost and don't have the stomach for it, then our great leaders will ditch it as its no longer the popular line.

[Nickbat]

[quote author=393A3535313A23235B0

the ones who pull the strings are zulu - thats ultimately what determines our fate, a cabal of powerful nations making decisions on the planet based on being re-elected by a largely gullible and apathetic populous. if it starts hitting the sheep in the pocket they'll feel it at the ballot box, ergo we, as a race of beings will do nothing, zip, nada, bupkiss to save ourselves 

and i'm the last person to swallow any line given by the government, my default position is cynic 

in this whole debate tho, at first, politicians didn't want to know - the ravings of a few mad greenies, nothing to worry about....time passed and slowly scientific evidence became available, studies were done (at first suppressed by industry and governments) when the tide turned and most people think - hang on - maybe there is something to this...thats when politicians began to clamber over each other to jump on the green bandwagon. now, in their quest to retain power, they've stumbled on a truth. when the general populous discovers how much repairing the damage (actually not even that, simply slowing down the rate) will cost and don't have the stomach for it, then our great leaders will ditch it as its no longer the popular line. [/quote]


 

[Dishevelled Den]

the ones who pull the strings are zulu - thats ultimately what determines our fate, a cabal of powerful nations making decisions on the planet based on being re-elected by a largely gullible and apathetic populous. if it starts hitting the sheep in the pocket they'll feel it at the ballot box, ergo we, as a race of beings will do nothing, zip, nada, bupkiss to save ourselves 

and i'm the last person to swallow any line given by the government, my default position is cynic 

in this whole debate tho, at first, politicians didn't want to know - the ravings of a few mad greenies, nothing to worry about....time passed and slowly scientific evidence became available, studies were done (at first suppressed by industry and governments) when the tide turned and most people think - hang on - maybe there is something to this...thats when politicians began to clamber over each other to jump on the green bandwagon. now, in their quest to retain power, they've stumbled on a truth. when the general populous discovers how much repairing the damage (actually not even that, simply slowing down the rate) will cost and don't have the stomach for it, then our great leaders will ditch it as its no longer the popular line.

the ones who pull the strings are zulu - thats ultimately what determines our fate, a cabal of powerful nations making decisions on the planet based on being re-elected by a largely gullible and apathetic populous.


...and that's precisely why the alternative case must be argued with clarity and vigour as the ones pulling the strings at the moment seem to recognize an opportunity to tighten those strings on the back of this ‘crisis’ concerning the environment.


as a race of beings will do nothing, zip, nada, bupkiss to save ourselves.

...I try to limit my impact as much as possible be being as sensible as I can with energy use across the board, and I'm sure that many do likewise - it isn't difficult to do and on a cumulative basis it must contribute to some degree, I would have thought.


in their quest to retain power, they've stumbled on a truth. when the general populous discovers how much repairing the damage (actually not even that, simply slowing down the rate) will cost and don't have the stomach for it, then our great leaders will ditch it as its no longer the popular line


....I feel the problem here is that measures to control emissions and energy use have already been formulated by groups unelected by the citizens of this country, so the practical and financial impact of these measures will have little bearing on the standing of the ruling administration.

We have signed away - or will do shortly - much of our ability to have control over our independent decision making process concerning matters such as these, so in reality we as a nation - subsumed by Brussels - will have to do what we're told in relation to energy and other policies.

The government in power therefore can absolve their responsibility by referring to European legislation as being the motivator for issues that cause dissatisfaction with the voters.  Witness the surrender to such legislation governing the disposal of waste.

[albitz]

On a lighter note...........
http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/environment/arctic-to-be-just-lovely-200910162145/

[Banjax]

On a lighter note...........
http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/environment/arctic-to-be-just-lovely-200910162145/

nice one albs